Eucharist - Please help me understand

[2nd_Adam]

***2 nd… Adam

Here friend is how to get your answer.

With a sincere heart, pray to God for Wisdom, Knowledge, Understanding and courage for fourty consecutive days. Then reread out loud to yourself John chapter 6. Before reading once again ask God to help you. When you are done ask yourself what you heard yourself read.

Your in our thoughts and prayers,

Pat Then***

I’m always up for more prayer. However, God also answers within the context of His written revelation. He answers to our prayers are never in contradiction to His written revelation (Holy Bible). What you asked me to do is very similar to what Mormon missionaries request… to pray to God to see if the Mormon gospel is true. Well, I never got a burning of the bosom like Mormons, because God’s written revelation kept my emotions within in-line with His Word. We can all claim that the Holy Spirit is guiding our respective Christian communities, but the Word of God stands forever. Therefore, the Holy Spirit guides the church according to written revelation. Even within the Catholic Faith, the Holy Scriptures is a higher form of revelation than other sources of sacred tradition, correct? IMO, if you read John chapter 6 for forty days, you will start to question other Catholic doctrine such as free will as well as the work that Christians are called to do first and foremost.

 

[PJM]

=2nd Adam;5694481]I’m always up for more prayer. However, God also answers within the context of His written revelation. He answers to our prayers are never in contradiction to His written revelation (Holy Bible). What you asked me to do is very similar to what Mormon missionaries request… to pray to God to see if the Mormon gospel is true. Well, I never got a burning of the bosom like Mormons, because God’s written revelation kept my emotions within in-line with His Word. We can all claim that the Holy Spirit is guiding our respective Christian communities, but the Word of God stands forever. Therefore, the Holy Spirit guides the church according to written revelation. Even within the Catholic Faith, the Holy Scriptures is a higher form of revelation than other sources of sacred tradition, correct? IMO, if you read John chapter 6 for forty days, you will start to question other Catholic doctrine such as free will as well as the work that Christians are called to do first and foremost.

***So Adam it comes to your subjective opinion verses God’s Inspired Word? And somehow how you think your opinion is more valid:shrug:

Love and prayers friend, ***

 

[PJM]

*** John 20: 26 Eight days later, his disciples were again in the house, and Thomas was with them. The doors were shut, but Jesus came and stood among them, and said, “Peace be with you.” Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side; do not be faithless, but believing.” Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!” Jesus said to him, “Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe.” ***

Do you know that “Bethlem” means; 3433 Yashubiy Lechem yaw-shoo-bee’ leh’-khem from 7725 and 3899; returner of bread; Jashubi-Lechem, an Israelite:–Jashubi-lehem). Strongs Comentary. Add to this fact that Jesus was laid in a manger [a place for food.] [Lk.2:7]

***Eucharist: 2 Cor. 4: 7 ***“But we have this treasure in earthen ******vessels, to show that the transcendent power belongs to God and not to us.”

I Tim.3: 15 if I am delayed, you may know how one ought to behave in the household of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and bulwark of the truth. 16 Great indeed, we confess, is the mystery of our religion: He was manifested in the flesh, vindicated in the Spirit, seen by angels, preached among the nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory.

Rev. 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if any one hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.

***“Heb 9:11-15 “Brothers and sisters: When Christ came as high priest of the good things that have come to be, passing through the greater and more perfect tabernacle not made by hands, that is, not belonging to this creation, he entered once for all into the sanctuary, not with the blood of goats and calves but with his own blood, thus obtaining eternal redemption”

1 Cor, 11: 27 “Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. 28 Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. 29 For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself. 30 That is why many of you are weak and ill, and some have died.”***

***Friend, FAITH is a gift from God. Everyone is offered it some accept some don’t. Is a gift to be sought [like Wisdom] and prayed for.

Catholic Eucharist is where heaven touches earth. Where God confronts, consoles, strengthens, and guides His “Chosen People” [those like the Jews of old actually chosen by God, blessed in special ways and afforded special protection, blessings, gifts and graces, not available outside His very Real personal embrace.

Through faith we do see Him, through Hope we receive Him, and in Love we thank Him.**

***Have you ever “Goggled” “Eucharistic Miracles?” If not do it. A former mentor and priest friend of mine, Father John A. Hardon S.J. was saying Mass for some members of the Marian Catecheist Apostolate at “Assumption Grotto” in Detroit a few years before his death in December of 2000, and Christ face appeared on the large host at the consecration. I have a picture of it. Divine providence had one of the ladies bring a camera fro after Mass photos of her and Father. Simply awesome!

But it did not take this extraordinary even for me to believe. Mt. 28:20 Jesus promises “I will be with you always” and Jesus wasn’t kidding and God does not lie***:thumbsup. :

** The reality of Christ in Catholic Eucharist is motivated both by Love only a PERFECT God can give [be coming Incarnate, dying the most public humiliating and painful death known at the time, while knowing that He had failed to complete His mission of Salvation for every man, women and child, past, present and further. Yes Christ said "It is finished” but He was speaking of humanities Redemption, which had and is complete. But Salvation is necessary in order for Redemption to be of use for humanity.*

***By staying REALY and Physically with us God affords many a second, a third, unlimited chances to return to God grace filled side, to avoid sin, to take up one cross and “come after me.” Salvation is far more likely for Informed Practicing Catholics than any and all other Christian denominations. And such is His Will, and such is the Divine Justice and Fairness of God.

Because of Eucharist Catholics are far more able to pray with Jesus. “Father not my will, but thy will be done!” It is because Christ only founded ONE Church that His Church, The CC has special blessings, graces and a multitude of Gifts not offered to others, no matter how faith-filled or faithful they are. Amen!***

But adam, no matter the evidence in God’s Inspired Word, you have already made up your mind.

Love and prayers,**

 

[2nd_Adam]

***So Adam it comes to your subjective opinion verses God’s Inspired Word? And somehow how you think your opinion is more valid:shrug:

Love and prayers friend, ***

The Catholic churches interpertation is not objective in all of Christendom. Even before the Protestant Reformation, we had the big schism. Therefore, your claim that Protestants have a subjective opinion, I return the same argument back to you. IMO, official Catholic interpertation of the Scirpture is not infallible, but a mix of truth and error… just like all other branches of Christendom. Jesus Christ is full of grace and truth, and the Spirit of God reveals truth, and the Word of God is truth. Everyone else looks dimly and knows in part. We know Peter also errored in life and in essential doctrine.

For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I have been fully known. - Paul

 

[PJM]

***Catholic Eucharist / Holy Communion is the transformation of what appears to be ordinary bread, and ordinary wine, into the very Real Presence of Jesus Himself. It is the Glorified Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus .

The process is called Transubstantiation, and it is a dual miracle. Because it is God Himself who performs this wondrous deed. The Priest acting on behalf of God and by God’s Powers, himself is for a brief instant, made into “another Christ” [alter Christi], this is the first miracle.

John Ch. 6:47 “Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life. I am the bread of life. … This is the bread, which comes, down from heaven, that a man may eat of it and not die. I am the living bread which came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever; and the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh." … 55 For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.

When deciples deserted Him Jesus did not call them back; didn’t say “you don’t understand” or “I didn’t mean my real flesh, my real blood.” No, Jesus let them leave and then turned to His Apostles and asked: Jn. 6: 67 Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you also wish to go away?”

1 Cor. 11:. 27 Whoever therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup.

Applying the most basic logic to this passage leads us to conclude that Paul could not have been speaking about ordinary bread and wine! How could that make one guilty of PROFANING the Body and Blood of the Lord? It could not! Paul had to be speaking of the Eucharist .

Numbers 11: Moses heard the people weeping throughout their families’ 13 Where am I to get meat to give to all- this people? For they weep before me and say, 'Give us meat, that we may eat.”

Exodus 9 “11 And the LORD said to Moses, “I have heard the murmurings of the people of Israel; say to them, ‘At twilight you shall eat flesh, and in the morning you shall be filled with bread; then you shall know that I am the LORD your God.’”

This “manna” the “food from heaven,” literally the Salvation of the chosen Jewish Peoples, who would have died without it, foretold another salvation of the “new chosen people.” Our own Spiritual Salvation.

Exodus 12: 5 “Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male a year old; you shall take it from the sheep or from the goats;”

“Behold the Lamb of God!” (Jn.1). John The Baptist Proclaiming Jesus Christ, the unblemished male, as “Lamb of God” meaning specifically “the sacrificial Lamb”! Jn. 1: 29 “The next day he saw Jesus coming toward him, and said, "Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world! “

1 Cor. 11: 23 “For I received from the Lord after he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, "This is my body which is for you. Do this in remembrance of Me. "In the same way also the cup, after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.”

Jesus tells us that He will be with us always. (Mt. 28:20). He tells us that His Paternal Care is ungoing and that He Jesus will provide for our every need. Christ cannot lie.

Ex. 25: 29 “And you shall make its plates and dishes for incense, and its flagons and bowls with which to pour libations; of pure gold you shall make them. And you shall set the bread of the
Presence also called “holy bread” ] on the table before me [God] always.”

Here is evidence of “the Divine Presence” in the form of BREAD [Protestant understanding of Spirit of God] issuing from “the House and Line of David,” from which the Holy family originate. Note it is to be a “perpetual practice.”

King, David himself, partakes of the “holy bread of presence.” 1 Sam. 21 Jesus who is the “King of Heaven and earth” Himself becomes our Bread of REAL PRESENCE.

In the New Testament the “bread of presence” REALLY becomes the Bread of the Presence of Jesus The Christ! Spoken of over a dozen times in the Bible.

Here is evidence of “The Sacrificial Lamb,” (Blood and sacrifice) cereal offering (BREAD) and wine. All of the elements of “physical matter” used in today’s Sacred Mass (now unbloody) and notice that even here God was using His Priest, who too offered up not “THE,” but “A” unblemished male lamb.

The Highpriest Melchizedek prefigures our More Perfect Highpriest, Jesus Christ. He offered bread and wine in glory and praise to Yahweh God. Today, Jesus who is God, offers the perfect gift of Himself as Bread and Wine.

From the beginning of time, God Created us, provided for us, guided us, protected us and LOVED US! We are no longer “under the law”, but now under GRACE. (Romans Ch. 6). There is no greater source of GRACE than to actually and REALLY receive the Glorified Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of our Blessed Lord.

Why did God Create only humanity “in His own image?” Because only humanity gifted with a mind, intellect, freewill and eternal soul has the ability, and therefore the GRAVE MORAL obligation, to do precisely that. To know, love and serve God in this life in order to be happy forever with God in Heaven.

Jn.6: 35 “Jesus said to them, "I am the bread of life; he who comes to me shall not hunger, and he who believes in me shall never thirst. But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe.”

Luke 22: " 19 “And he took bread, and when he had given thanks he broke it and gave it to them, saying, “This is my body which is given for you. Do this in remembrance of me.” And likewise the cup after supper, saying, "This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant in my blood.”

Do this in memory of Me!

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[2nd_Adam]

I would interpret what he’s saying this way: Catholics often define their faith around the Eucharist. They see it not only as the center of Christian faith and worship, but also a distinction between their Church and most others. Catholics cherish it, and defend it with a vigor which, to some, seems almost aggressive.

Jon

That is very accurate. For myself, I am more protective about the contents of the gospel than anything else (Gal 1). I believe if we partake in communion within the warning of the Apostle Paul, we are being obedient according to our conscience. All of the positions are valid. However, some churches who only see communion as an ordinance as compared to being a means of grace, some can partake in communion in a very , irreverent and flippant way.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Define what you mean by “aggressive?” I’m not sure what you are referring to. That is not my experience.

I believe the Catholic view of the Eucharist makes it unique, validating it to be the One True Church which makes it necessary to be a member of the Catholic Church. However, the Orthodox Churches are similar in their ability to convert the elements to actual flesh and blood, correct?

 

[2nd_Adam]

Well, Adam, because the Eucharist is quite possibly the very nucleus of Catholicism it’s self. The amount of importance that Catholicism places on the Eucharist is proportionate to how passionate the users here are about defending it. Every single mass, the main “attraction” is the Eucharist.

If you’ve ever gone to a mass, you’d know what I’m talking about. Eucharist is very fundamental in Catholicism.

I’ve been to several Messes, and have partook in the Eucharist. I wonder what percentage of Catholics believe the official Catholic position on conversion of the elements?

 

[2nd_Adam]

So, I guess my question would be, “who *wouldn’t *defend what they believe to be the Truth revealed by God-- the source of eternal life-- with ‘vigor’?” (Not to be confused with “uncharitable” methods. I am not in favor of being uncharitable.)

It’s a *strange religion *that doesn’t feel the need to proclaim and defend the Truth. It seems that in many Protestant circles/denominations/non-denominations there is this idea that “your truth” and “my truth” are OK. I’m OK, you’re OK. Truth is maleable, it’s subjective, it’s based on experience. We can all have our own mutually exclusive versions of the Truth. That’s just **bizarre **to me.

Honestly, Geore Orwell wrote about this. Doublethink.

We must defend the essential doctrines of the Christian Faith (Jude 3). However, the different views on communion does not make us less Christian than another Christian community with a different view. I don’t find it in Scripture to find a call to defend our particular view with such dogma.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Luther called Zwingli a pawn of the devil (or something along those lines) at the Marburg Colloquy because he didn’t believe in the Real physical Presence of our Lord in the Eucharist. Luther even refused to acknowledge that Zwingli was a Christian. I’d say that is pretty aggressive.

God bless you

Thanks for reminding us. If my memory is correct, Zwingli probably is the closest to a contemporary “in remembrance view”. Luther wanted to reatain as much of the Catholic Faith as possible.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Because it is in the Eucharist where we receive the very Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of our dear Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.

Also, Lutherans believe in the real presence, and also Anglicans.

Holy Mary, Mother of the Eucharist, pray for us.

Happy Feast Day!

That’s true, the Anglican Church is quite a mix of the Catholic Faith and Reformation theology.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Of course it is one of the essentials. It is THE essential.

The fact that you do not even consider it “one” of the essentials, let alone THE essential, is directly related to your inability to understand the Catholic position. It also underscores why you don’t undersatnd that Catholics stridently defend this as the most important teaching in Christianity.

You still have not defined what you mean by “aggressive.”

I appreciate your comment on the Eucharist being THE essential doctrine. However, I’m not sure that you can support that comment with the Scriptures. I believe the contents of the gospel is more important when you consider all of Scirpture. Heck, the Apostle Paul rebuked Peter publicly for not being in-line with the gospel.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Adam what part of “This is My Body; this My Bood” is vague and unclear. Read it in Mt., Mk, Lk., Jn. and Paul.

John 6: 52 "52 "The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” So Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you; he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55 For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. 56 He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him

So what is vague about this?

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And when our Lords deciple left Him, He did not change His position; in fact Jesus turned to the Apostles and asked: 67 Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you also wish to go away?” Does that sound like Jesus does not mean what He said?

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And what about Paul in 1 Cor.11: 23 23 "For I received from the Lord what I also delivered to you, that the Lord Jesus on the night when he was betrayed took bread, and when he had given thanks, he broke it, and said, “This is my body which is for you. Do this in remembrance of me.” In the same way also the cup, after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in my blood. Do this, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of me.” For as often as you eat this bread and drink the cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death until he comes. 27. Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of profaning the body and blood of the Lord. Let a man examine himself, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment upon himself

How could this be except for the FACT that it is Jesus? One is going tp profane himself by eating only a symbol. You have to be darn right pig headed not to accept God at His own words and what was the obvious undersranding of those words. Just read what God says in His Divinely inspired book.

Love and prayers,

Pat

I don’t have a memorial symbolic view. I believe the two Protestant sacraments are more than an ordiance (Baptist view). The sacraments are a means of grace.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Such is the complaint of the worldly. They cannot understood our passionate zeal for God, our love of the truth, our desire for justice, and our thirst for righteousness. They complain that Catholics are too vocal, yet if Catholics did not remind man of God, than who would? Christ has given man His Church that she might continue His mission throughout the world. Not many liked His message when He was living, and not many like His message while He lives in us.

I have a greater passion for proclaimming the gospel of God’s grace, than my position on communion. It is a sacarment for those who are in Christ. Do you see the difference in emphasis and importance? We have been given a ministry of reconcilation (2 Cor 5), in addition to the command of Jesus of the great commision.

 

[Carlan]

Hello Adam, I understood you came to the forums to discover the Catholic answers to your
difficulty in understanding the Catholic doctrine of Eucharist.
Are you forgetting this is a Catholic answers forum and that these excellent Apologists have explained to you the truth of what Jesus Christ has revealed to his church, (of which you are a part of BTW). Please excuse me if I come across too simply, or somewhat rude, however I do think it is time for you to give it all over to God for a good dose of extra faith and trust if the whole truth is what you are seeking. God help and bless us all, Carlan .

 

[FCEGM]

I’ve been to several Messes, and have partook in the Eucharist. I wonder what percentage of Catholics believe the official Catholic position on conversion of the elements?

Were you/are you aware that non-Catholics are not to partake? If you did know but proceeded to partake anyway, did you then consider that your receiving the Eucharist was an ill-mannered presumption against the teaching of the Church in which you were a visitor?

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

You see the unity with have as Christians. I think the difference between Catholics and Protestants in regards to emphasis of the Eucharist and ministry of the Word is how we receive Christ, or how we receive the merit of Christ. Communion (Eucharist) and the ministry of the Word are means of grace given to us by God which flows from the person and work of Christ on our behalf. Look at what Paul writes which I believe is related to both the ministry of the Word and the Eucharist when received in faith through the transformation in our minds.

I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. - Rom 12

We are transformed by the renewal of our minds through remembering and centering our lives around the gospel which reveals the mercies of God. The Eucharist brings us back to Christ and Him crucified which is the demonstration of God revealing His amazing grace and mercy for us (those in Christ).

Gabriel of 12;

You speak of differences of Christianity; Let me make a factual statement of Christianity here; There is no difference in the body of Jesus Christ there is only one. This Christian faith has been proclaimed, practiced and handed on from the historical record from the Apostles, Saints and Martyrs who were all practiced the Catholic faith in the breaking of bread in the True presence of Jesus Christ unchanged these last 2 millenium. This is not my opinion this is a matter of historical fact and record.

The celebration of the Eucharist (True Presence) unites every Christian in heaven and on earth and today all over the world. This Christianity is not divided among the body of believers in the Eucharist from any recorded age in history or Christendom.

The scripture you provide are not in conflict with the 2000 year old Christian (Catholic) Church Jesus built. What is in conflict with the Orginial Apostolic teachings, and Traditions handed down to us is your "late (new) interpretation of the scriptures.

Now I have posted so that you can understand this ancient Eucharistic Liturgy commanded by Jesus for the Apostles to teach and hand on to Jesus Church by "Feeding his flock, Teaching his sheep, and tending his sheep. This sheep fold of God did not disappear, she remains united in the Apostolic teaching and Traditions in the Catholic Church. Although I respect your new religious interpretation of scripture, I have not posted to debate your opininion, but to introduce to you and share why the Apostles, Saints and Martyrs died for their Catholic belief’'s in the Eucharist.

It is here where I would wish to explain one fundamental aspect of the Eucharist being the True Presence of God believed in since the Apostles walked the earth.

In the liturgy of the Eucharist God himself acts and does what is essential.
Upon hearing the Word of God in the Liturgy of the Word, the whole body of Jesus Christ becomes silence why? It is here where the Christian no longer makes an action to invent, think, or search for an enlightenment for oneself to draw a closeness to our living God. The scripture states clearly here from Psalm 46:11
Who says: “Be still and confess that I am God! I am exalted among the nations, exalted on the earth.”
12
The LORD of hosts is with us; our stronghold is the God of Jacob. Selah

This worship of Spirit and Truth allows God to act, not man. So that God makes his presence known to his Children. This is why on every Mass you will find infants in arms, the sick, the injured, young and old no one is excluded from the True presence of God. We dont send our youth to a bible study during worship, because God is presence to all his family in the Mass throughout the world.

This New Covenant established by Jesus himself has not changed since the old Covenant when God would makes himself present to his people in the form of smoke, fire, now in the species of bread and wine. Not because the Catholic church has believed this for 2000 years now, we believe this because God said “this bread is my body” which will be given up for you.

**Paul defines this faith briefly from the True presence when he records; 1Corinthians 6:17 But whoever is joined to the Lord becomes one spirit with him. **

IF worship does not allow God to make himself present to all his people, then in my opinion; Worship without the True presence of God is not and never will be True Worship of the Logos made flesh.

This is the transformation that has taken place, when we are transformed into the Logos, conformed to the Logos and so made the true body of Jesus Christ. This lived out prayer is the way into the Incarnation and the Resurrection.

The main subject matter of faith is that; no one goes to the Father except through Jesus, and it is through Jesus eternal living Sacrifice in the Eucharist that God makes himself present to all ages and peoples.

Peace be with you

 

[MrS]

Perhaps, then, you haven’t heard Lutherans defend their belief in the real and substantial presence of the body and blood in the Eucharist.

Jon

Not quite. Consubstantiation, not Transubstantiation.

The Lutheran position is that Jesus is present during their service, then not present at the end (in the host.)

However, the Lutherans also lack the Apostolic succession and valid ordination that comes from the Apostles. So no matter what the claim, it cannot be a valid Eucharist in the manner of John 6 or the Last Supper.

.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Were you/are you aware that non-Catholics are not to partake? If you did know but proceeded to partake anyway, did you then consider that your receiving the Eucharist was an ill-mannered presumption against the teaching of the Church in which you were a visitor?

Actually, I partook in the Eucharist with my college roomate over 25 years ago. He twin brother in now a Catholic Priest. I used to attend mass with him. I did not know I was not allowed to partake at the time as a non-Catholic Christian.

 

[2nd_Adam]

Hello Adam, I understood you came to the forums to discover the Catholic answers to your
difficulty in understanding the Catholic doctrine of Eucharist.
Are you forgetting this is a Catholic answers forum and that these excellent Apologists have explained to you the truth of what Jesus Christ has revealed to his church, (of which you are a part of BTW). Please excuse me if I come across too simply, or somewhat rude, however I do think it is time for you to give it all over to God for a good dose of extra faith and trust if the whole truth is what you are seeking. God help and bless us all, Carlan .

I think we should all continue to dialogue and discuss issues in regards to the Christian Faith. Everybody has been so hospital and kind on this site. I cannot accept or believe in things that I personally have not come to a conclusion. Our conscience is before God alone in how we worship Him. I hope my postings will help all of us to love God more.