Europe & America prepare to prosecute Christians?

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Jedinovice said:
I ask myself, are we heading into the great persecution?
(I’ll chew on it on the flight to Indonesia to get married!)
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WIll they try and enforce these laws against “homophobia” in Mosques? Telling Moslems not to preach against the homosexual lifestyle? Oh, brother! I’d like to see that. There may be some divine justice in the fact that Europe is becoming Islamicised.
 
Ignatius2000 said:
I’m a white, anglo-saxon, republican-voting male and I feel like a foreigner in this country sometimes.

Wish the Papal State was still a nation of it’s own and allowed immigration.
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On that note, I hang around filipinos a lot these days. I feel FAR more at home with them than any number of Brits. I too, feel an alien in my own land.
 
Hate crime legislation is silly, but we have to recognize that it demands a crime be committed before it can be classified as a hate crime. Hate is not the crime. Murder, assault, etc are the crimes. The crime qualifies as a hate crime if it is carried out against an individual because the individual is a member of a group named in the legislation. So, murdering a Catholic because he is a Catholic is a hate crime. However, murdering a Catholic because he is wearing plaid pants is not a hate crime.

Murdering a gay because he is gay is also a hate crime. It is a hate crime even if the individual says he was motivated by deep Christian belief. But, again, it’s not a hate crime if the gay is murdered for wearing plaid pants.

So, there is really nothing for anyone to worry about unless someone is planning murder or assault. I suppose someone might worry that murderers and rapists are being prosecuted, but I don’t share that concern.
 
GreenJeans said:
Hate crime legislation is silly, but we have to recognize that it demands a crime be committed before it can be classified as a hate crime. Hate is not the crime. Murder, assault, etc are the crimes. The crime qualifies as a hate crime if it is carried out against an individual because the individual is a member of a group named in the legislation. So, murdering a Catholic because he is a Catholic is a hate crime. However, murdering a Catholic because he is wearing plaid pants is not a hate crime.
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I don’t support any kind of hate crime legislation because it penalizes thought.
So, there is really nothing for anyone to worry about unless someone is planning murder or assault. I suppose someone might worry that murderers and rapists are being prosecuted, but I don’t share that concern.
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It looks you did not read the articles. Let me quote it for you:
Rep. Louie Gohmert (R-TX) asked, “If a minister was giving a sermon, a Bible study or any kind of written or spoken message saying that homosexuality was a serious sin and a person in the congregation went out and committed a crime against a homosexual would the minister be charged with the crime of incitement?”
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Chairman John Conyers and Congressional Democrats kept evading the issue, providing reasons why they could not accept the amendment until Rep. Lundgren demanded, “What is your answer? Would there be incitement charges against the pastor?”
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At that point Democrat Congressman Artur Davis from Alabama candidly said, “Yes.”
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So someone preaching that homosexuality is a sin could be charged with “incitement”

Hopefully the courts will throw this law out or interpret it differently than Congressman Artur Davis.
 
Chickamauga said:
There may be some divine justice in the fact that Europe is becoming Islamicised.
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If you don’t want Europe to be Islamicised, you have to support restrictions on immigration to Europe from Islamic countries or plain old restrictions on Islamic immigration.
 
Hate crime does penalize thought, and that’s one of the reasons it is silly.

As to the sermon followed by the faithful stringing up a gay, the answer is simple. The preacher cannot be charged with incitement unless 1) He specifically encouraged the murder, and 2) There is a direct and immediate connection between the preacher’s encouragement of murder and the actual murder.

Someone preaching that homosexuality is a sin definitely cannot be charged with a crime. The congressman is wrong.

While the hate crime laws are silly, even sillier are the folks who exagerate and fabricate their effects in order to encourage a false sense of persecution.
 
GreenJeans said:
Hate crime does penalize thought, and that’s one of the reasons it is silly.

As to the sermon followed by the faithful stringing up a gay, the answer is simple. The preacher cannot be charged with incitement unless 1) He specifically encouraged the murder, and 2) There is a direct and immediate connection between the preacher’s encouragement of murder and the actual murder.

Someone preaching that homosexuality is a sin definitely cannot be charged with a crime. The congressman is wrong.

While the hate crime laws are silly, even sillier are the folks who exaggerate and fabricate their effects in order to encourage a false sense of persecution.
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The problem is extremism. Those that want the law are extreme in their definition of “hate crimes” and those that would “string up” someone because of a sermon are extreme in their reactions.
 
KathleenElsie said:
The problem is extremism. Those that want the law are extreme in their definition of “hate crimes” and those that would “string up” someone because of a sermon are extreme in their reactions.
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I agree. There are some who want speech itself to be a crime. They would criminalize criticism, intentional insult, and whatever else incurred the displeasure of various victim groups. This could range from criticism of race to religion.

On the other hand, we have ample evidence that many have marched under the banner of ideology or religion and cheerfully slaughtered those who disagreed with them.

I doubt hate crime legislation as currently enacted or proposed in legislatures will have any real effect on anyone. It will not deter the killers, and it will not punish expression by the innocent. It’s just a feel-good symbol by folks who want to address a problem, but don’t know how to really fix it.
 
This is already the law in Canada.

Once again, the EU is going to try to intimidate Poland.

How stupid the EU Parliament is.

After the Swedish Deluge, the Battle of Vienna (where Polish Hussars and King Jan Sobieski III saved Central Europe from being overrun by the Muslim Turks), 123 years of partition, the Nazis, Katyn, and 44 years of Communism, I do not think the Polish people are going to back down to a blowhard bureaucracy in Brussels.

Thread drift - Western Europe didn’t want to do a thing to oppose the Soviet influence of Eastern Europe, nor oppose martial law in Poland in the early 1980s. Western Europe wanted to buy natural gas from the USSR.

President Reagan fought it, but the gas line was built - with specifically-engineered defective parts so that it would blow up.

Thread drift over - Poland has survived a lot worse that pro-homosexual politicians.
 
JW10631 said:
This is already the law in Canada.

Once again, the EU is going to try to intimidate Poland.

How stupid the EU Parliament is.

After the Swedish Deluge, the Battle of Vienna (where Polish Hussars and King Jan Sobieski III saved Central Europe from being overrun by the Muslim Turks), 123 years of partition, the Nazis, Katyn, and 44 years of Communism, I do not think the Polish people are going to back down to a blowhard bureaucracy in Brussels.

Thread drift - Western Europe didn’t want to do a thing to oppose the Soviet influence of Eastern Europe, nor oppose martial law in Poland in the early 1980s. Western Europe wanted to buy natural gas from the USSR.

President Reagan fought it, but the gas line was built - with specifically-engineered defective parts so that it would blow up.

Thread drift over - Poland has survived a lot worse that pro-homosexual politicians.
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Has the gas line blown yet?
 
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