Evangelical preacher. You can’t be pro-life and pro-gun

[CopyBoy]

In the United States, evangelicals are among the biggest supporters of gun rights. They are the major religious group least likely to support stricter laws. Evangelical Larry Pratt, who directs Gun Owners of America, even argues that all Christians should be armed.

For most of my adult life, I agreed. I believed that we had a God-given right to defend ourselves. I also believed that the Second Amendment guarantees a right to bear arms, and that anyone should be able to obtain a gun.

Then, I saw the after-effects of gun violence firsthand. In Pennsylvania, I visited the families of five murdered Amish schoolgirls, as well as the family of the shooter. And I watched as a mass shooting unfolded at the Washington Navy Yard, across from where I lived at the time. These experiences, followed by careful theological and moral reflection, left me convinced that my family of faith is wrong on guns.

newsday.com/opinion/oped/i-m-an-evangelical-preacher-you-can-t-be-pro-life-and-pro-gun-1.11279541

 

[ChaosGamma]

I thought this sounded familiar, and so it did. Since Mr. Ruse’s article from yesterday sums up my objections rather succinctly, I’ll simply quote him thus:

Schenck says he once “believed we had a God-given right to defend ourselves.” Maybe he intended to circle back and make clear that we do have such a God-given right, only not with guns, but he never does. As it is, he seems not to know that the right of self-defense is in the natural law.

Schenck sets up a nice straw man when he “disagrees with my community’s wholesale embrace of the idea that anyone should be able to buy a gun.” Of course, no one in his community or any other community believes that “anyone should be able to buy a gun”; children, felons and the crazy should not be able to buy guns.

…]

Schenck says “anyone using a gun for defense must be ready to kill” but that “such a posture” is against the Gospels. Schenk says he reached his new conclusion through “careful theological and moral reflection.” Schenk can be forgiven since his careful theological and moral reflection clearly did not include the study of what the Church teaches.

The Church and Scripture teach “thou shalt not kill” certainly, but that commandment refers to the “innocent and the righteous.” Someone coming at you with murderous intent is neither innocent nor righteous. The Church teaches it is not only your right to defend yourself and your duty to defend others, even unto his death. We shoot not to kill but rather to preserve innocent life, ours and others. If the aggressor is killed, this is not intended but still allowed.

crisismagazine.com/2016/today-i-bought-a-gun

 

[Origen52]

As a Canadian, all I can say is nice change.

 

[Convert1]

My family is made up of farmers and hunters. Hunting to feed their family, and using a firearm to protect their livestock from predators. So, are they going to be told that they cannot own guns for these purposes? They are almost all pro-life.

 

[SAVINGRACE]

As a Canadian, all I can say is nice change.

 

[Jon_S_1]

newsday.com/opinion/oped/i-m-an-evangelical-preacher-you-can-t-be-pro-life-and-pro-gun-1.11279541

self defense is not an affront to pro life.

If someone is attacking you with potentially deadly force you have a right to defend yourself. Even if that means you unintentionally kill someone while defending yourself.

Also, guns are used to fight just wars, and part of the reason this nation wasn’t invaded in WW2 was because of an armed citizenry. Same with Switzerland.

 

[esieffe]

What garbage. An unborn baby is totally innocent, created by the majesty of God. A home invader who storms you castle, is not innocent. He understands completely, that the next door he kicks in, might be his last, and is willing to take that informed chance.

 

[MaryT777]

What garbage. An unborn baby is totally innocent, created by the majesty of God. A home invader who storms you home, is not innocent. He understands completely, that the next door he kicks in, might be his last, and is willing to take that informed chance.

 

[Jeanne_S]

What garbage. An unborn baby is totally innocent, created by the majesty of God. A home invader who storms you castle, is not innocent. He understands completely, that the next door he kicks in, might be his last, and is willing to take that informed chance.

 

[SAVINGRACE]

What garbage. An unborn baby is totally innocent, created by the majesty of God. A home invader who storms you castle, is not innocent. He understands completely, that the next door he kicks in, might be his last, and is willing to take that informed chance.

You really think you will be able to protect yourself against a home invader? I seriously doubt it. How is your weapon going to help you when it’s locked away and you have someone climbing into your bedroom window?

“Just wait there, you have broken into the wrong house buddy. Now what was the combination? Where is the key? Where is the ammo”

Most burglars just want your tv and cash. They don’t want to kill you and your entire family. What kind of alternate reality do you folk live in?

I think only farmers and law enforcement authorities should be allowed legal access to weapons.

Better off spending that money on karate/self-defence lessons.

 

[Crown_of_Stars]

What garbage. An unborn baby is totally innocent, created by the majesty of God. A home invader who storms you castle, is not innocent. He understands completely, that the next door he kicks in, might be his last, and is willing to take that informed chance.

Agreed. The guns aren’t to blame. It’s the one using the gun and the state of his or her mind that is to blame. Look at all of the violent movies and video games, for instance. People defend that, truly seem to think it’s not to blame, but how can it possibly not be? I don’t have a gun, and never would, but not because I’m against them, I just don’t have one and don’t plan ever to get one. If someone were in my house, and I needed self-defense, a knife from the drawer should take care of it.

 

[Neal76]

You really think you will be able to protect yourself against a home invader? I seriously doubt it. How is your weapon going to help you when it’s locked away and you have someone climbing into your bedroom window?

“Just wait there, you have broken into the wrong house buddy. Now what was the combination? Where is the key? Where is the ammo”

Most burglars just want your tv and cash. They don’t want to kill you and your entire family. What kind of alternate reality do you folk live in?

I think only farmers and law enforcement authorities should be allowed legal access to weapons.

Better off spending that money on karate/self-defence lessons.

Tell me I’m not allowed to hunt in accordance with the laws and rights of my province, and I’ll have a couple words for you in return. You guess which two.

 

[SAVINGRACE]

Below are statistics from gun violence in the US for a single day. New Years Day - 1January 2016

46 deaths
2 children dead (0-12yo range)
4 injured in a mass shooting texas
5 teenagers injured
2 teenagers dead

(Gunviolence.org)

 

[SAVINGRACE]

Tell me I’m not allowed to hunt in accordance with the laws and rights of my province, and I’ll have a couple words for you in return. You guess which two.

Read my post again. I have no problem with farmers/hunters in regional areas owning weapons.

I have a problem with children getting murdered in their schools and people not connecting the dots to your gun obsessed culture.

 

[Jon_S_1]

You really think you will be able to protect yourself against a home invader? I seriously doubt it. How is your weapon going to help you when it’s locked away and you have someone climbing into your bedroom window?

“Just wait there, you have broken into the wrong house buddy. Now what was the combination? Where is the key? Where is the ammo”

Most burglars just want your tv and cash. They don’t want to kill you and your entire family. What kind of alternate reality do you folk live in?

I think only farmers and law enforcement authorities should be allowed legal access to weapons.

Better off spending that money on karate/self-defence lessons.

That’s a good one!

Nothing like the racking of a shotgun to get someone out of your house without a shot fired.

Good luck with your karate.

I’m in public service…there are tons of sickos out there looking for far more than your TV. half of them are on drugs that even make guns hardly stop them.

I never owned a gun till I worked with the public and saw what people are really like.

 

[Jon_S_1]

Below are statistics from gun violence in the US for a single day. New Years Day - 1January 2016

46 deaths
2 children dead (0-12yo range)
4 injured in a mass shooting texas
5 teenagers injured
2 teenagers dead

(Gunviolence.org)

Most of those are suicides or gang related. They will occur no matter what but having a good defense helps your odds.

Just ask any political figure who has a security detail. They carry more than karate lessons.

 

[SAVINGRACE]

Most of those are suicides or gang related. They will occur no matter what but having a good defense helps your odds.

Just ask any political figure who has a security detail. They carry more than karate lessons.

No they are not actually. Check out the website and read the stories.

 

[Jon_S_1]

Read my post again. I have no problem with farmers/hunters in regional areas owning weapons.

I have a problem with children getting murdered in their schools and stupid people not connecting the dots to your gun obsessed culture.

For someone that lives on the other side of the world you sure know a lot about our gun culture and its consequences.

Perhaps you should learn more about our broken home, single parent culture and our spoiled entitlement consumerism culture that breeds kids incapable of coping and being adults that throw adult sized temper tantrums when life doesn’t go their way.

That is the real cause. But keep looking at the inanimate objects to turn it around.

 

[SAVINGRACE]

For someone that lives on the other side of the world you sure know a lot about our gun culture and its consequences.

Perhaps you should learn more about our broken home, single parent culture and our spoiled entitlement consumerism culture that breeds kids incapable of coping and being adults that throw adult sized temper tantrums when life doesn’t go their way.

That is the real cause. But keep looking at the inanimate objects to turn it around.

Yes, let’s make sure those marginalised kids from broken homes, those with mental problems and single parent homes who survive the hail of bullets and grow into adulthood have access to semi automatic and automatic weapons. That will solve the problem.

 

[Jon_S_1]

Yes, let’s make sure those marginalised kids from broken homes and single parents and those with mental problems have access to semi automatic and automatic weapons. That will solve the problem.

I’m all for background checks.

You are saying. That I have no right to those weapons to protect myself from these people.

Of course Australia’s culture is far different. You guys as a penal colony have always had some heavy gun control.

Of course your not worried about foreign invasion either because you’d count on us to come save you.