Evangelicals and the Nicene Creed

[rcwitness]

What do Evangelicals believe, in regard to the Nicene Creed? In several discussions, recently, I have used this Creed to represent what Christians must accept, but do Evangelical (non-denominational) believers accept it all?

 

[twf]

The more traditional “high church” Protestant traditions would certainly recite the Nicene Creed (Lutherans, Anglicans, Methodists, etc), but Evangelicals? In my experience most wouldn’t even be familiar with the Creed. Evangelicals rarely hear, read, or discuss anything written before 1900 - other than the Bible itself. I was raised Evangelical and we certainly didn’t give any thought to creeds.

 

[wmscott]

The more traditional “high church” Protestant traditions would certainly recite the Nicene Creed (Lutherans, Anglicans, Methodists, etc), but Evangelicals? In my experience most wouldn’t even be familiar with the Creed. Evangelicals rarely hear, read, or discuss anything written before 1900 - other than the Bible itself. I was raised Evangelical and we certainly didn’t give any thought to creeds.

Aren’t evangelicals curious about the how humanity and Christianity made from Christs day to the present? There is a lot of relevant history that got us to where we are today?

 

[rcwitness]

The more traditional “high church” Protestant traditions would certainly recite the Nicene Creed (Lutherans, Anglicans, Methodists, etc), but Evangelicals? In my experience most wouldn’t even be familiar with the Creed. Evangelicals rarely hear, read, or discuss anything written before 1900 - other than the Bible itself. I was raised Evangelical and we certainly didn’t give any thought to creeds.

Right. I’m specifically concerned if they reject the Baptism reference?

 

[jane_doe]

Right. I’m specifically concerned if they reject the Baptism reference?

Depends on which evangelicals you’re talking to.

Generally speaking, evangelicals reject the idea that baptism is a requirement for salvation or necessary for forgiveness of sins. However, they do claim acknowledge the Nicene Creed, just a different interpretation of that section than Catholics.

 

[Tommy999]

Right. I’m specifically concerned if they reject the Baptism reference?

As a Methodist Christian, our congregation doesn’t recite the Nicene Creed during our church service that I am aware of, although we customarily recite the ‘Apostles’ Creed’ and the ‘Lord’s Prayer’.

Regarding the baptism reference for the remission of sins in the Nicene Creed…

As to what evangelicals would make of it, I think they would agree that baptism is something that all Christians should have done because Christ commanded that it be done in *‘The Great Commission’ *(Matthew 28:19).

"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit"

However, they would maintain that baptism should follow sincere repentance and a desire and intention to acknowledge and follow Christ as his/her Lord and Savior, and not just be done as some sort of ritual when you are too young to know what is going on. I think that is referred to in some circles as the ‘Believer’s Baptism’.

Nonetheless, babies are baptized in the Methodist faith tradition, but it is my understanding that when done as a baby, it is viewed more as claiming that child for God and a formal declaration that the parents promise to raise the child in the Christian faith since the baby is too young to decide to follow Christ on his/her own at that point.

 

[believerdoc]

What do Evangelicals believe, in regard to the Nicene Creed? In several discussions, recently, I have used this Creed to represent what Christians must accept, but do Evangelical (non-denominational) believers accept it all?

You have raised a RED FLAG for most Protestants with your statement “represent what Christians must accept”. While my church prays both the Nicene and Apostles creeds they are never and should never be used as “tests” of faith for membership or admission to Holy Communion; they are statements of historic Christian belief and nothing more. I would suspect that you will never hear any form of creed used in an evangelical church. Most Protestants require only a simple statement of belief such as “Do you believe that Jesus is the Christ, Son of the living God and do you accept him as Savior and Lord of your life”.

 

[jane_doe]

. Most Protestants require only a simple statement of belief such as “Do you believe that Jesus is the Christ, Son of the living God and do you accept him as Savior and Lord of your life”.

In my experience this is far from true.

 

[rcwitness]

You have raised a RED FLAG for most Protestants with your statement “represent what Christians must accept”. While my church prays both the Nicene and Apostles creeds they are never and should never be used as “tests” of faith for membership or admission to Holy Communion; they are statements of historic Christian belief and nothing more. I would suspect that you will never hear any form of creed used in an evangelical church. Most Protestants require only a simple statement of belief such as “Do you believe that Jesus is the Christ, Son of the living God and do you accept him as Savior and Lord of your life”.

But this Creed was actually formed with this intention, no?

And that creed you articulated is just a more narrowly defined Gospel. The question, is do Christians have the right to reject something in this Creed, and still remain Christian? If Evangelicals deny that Baptism is FOR the forgiveness of sins, and profess it as merely an “optional sign of dedicating to Jesus”, is that contradicting the Creed?

And if you, or anyone has a fundamentally different belief of Baptism, than what is professed in the Creed, what is the biblical support for that?

 

[rcwitness]

You have raised a RED FLAG for most Protestants with your statement “represent what Christians must accept”.

Why isn’t it, rather, have Evangelicals raised a red flag when they decided to reject this ancient Creed?

 

[rcwitness]

In my experience this is far from true.

I agree. Most Protestant churches believe in the necessity of Baptism and that is actually is for the remission of sins. To willfully deny Baptism is to retain one’s sins.

 

[7_Sorrows]

Are baptists familiar with the creed? What would they think of it?

 

[Tommy999]

Right. I’m specifically concerned if they reject the Baptism reference?

Hi rcwitness,
In the case of infant baptism, which sins are the being forgiven? Is it the original sin that mankind inherited from Adam and Eve? If so, I can understand, appreciate, and agree with it. My understanding is that all mankind suffers from a “bent to sin” or as I’ve heard it said on Catholic radio, “concupiscence”, if I understood the term correctly.

Otherwise, would the infant need forgiveness for crying too loudly and waking up mom and dad in the middle of the night too many times? I didn’t think that infants were held accountable for their behavior until they grew up to the point where they could discern right from wrong.

In the case of an adult or child (usually in elementary school or later) in the evangelical church that I was once part of, the person desiring baptism would need to acknowledge they are a sinner in need of a Savior, that they sincerely repent of their sins with the intention of not repeating them, and commit to following Christ as their Lord and Savior from that point on. Then they get baptized by a pastor, but the other stuff is a prerequisite, kind of modeled after a Billy Graham crusade, sort of.

They just don’t arrive at church one day and say, “I want to get baptized for the forgiveness of sins so let’s get on with it, even though I have no intention of ever changing my sinful ways”. That would be akin to going into the Catholic confessional and wanting to be absolved for sins you weren’t sorry of and don’t intend to stop. I doubt a priest would absolve such a person.

The baptism usually takes place in front of the congregation as a formal acknowledgment of a change that has already taken place inside their heart and to be “raised to walk in newness of life” through baptism like is stated in Romans 6:4.
That is how I understood the process in most evangelical churches I knew, anyway.

 

[Tommy999]

Oops. I edited a word on my previous post but instead I accidentally copied it again. Please pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

 

[rcwitness]

Hi rcwitness,
In the case of infant baptism, which sins are the being forgiven? Is it the original sin that mankind inherited from Adam and Eve? If so, I can understand, appreciate, and agree with it.

Yes. Baptism of infants is a personal reception of the grace of forgiveness of Original Sin.

In the case of an adult or child (usually in elementary school or later) in the evangelical church that I was once part of, the person desiring baptism would need to acknowledge they are a sinner in need of a Savior, that they sincerely repent of their sins with the intention of not repeating them, and commit to following Christ as their Lord and Savior from that point on. Then they get baptized by a pastor, but the other stuff is a prerequisite, kind of modeled after a Billy Graham crusade, sort of.

They just don’t arrive at church one day and say, “I want to get baptized for the forgiveness of sins so let’s get on with it, even though I have no intention of ever changing my sinful ways”. That would be akin to going into the Catholic confessional and wanting to be absolved for sins you weren’t sorry of and don’t intend to stop. I doubt a priest would absolve such a person.

The baptism usually takes place in front of the congregation as a formal acknowledgment of a change that has already taken place inside their heart and to be “raised to walk in newness of life” through baptism like is stated in Romans 6:4.
That is how I understood the process in most evangelical churches I knew, anyway.

I also have experience with Evangelical Free Protestants, who profess that Baptism is not necessary AND membership with participation in Communion is offered to those who have not been Baptized. It has been described as merely a sign of what Jesus has already done and a public profession to commit to Jesus.

The desire to follow Jesus and acknowledge Him as the Savior, is the positive (and even Catholic) belief assented to. That is not an issue. The issue, is the rejection that Baptism is “for the remission of sins” as stated in the Creed and upheld by the Traditional Faith of the Church. This also is tied to the denial of necessity to receive, or its desire in those who through no fault of their own are prevented or without proper knowledge.

 

[Tommy999]

Yes. Baptism of infants is a personal reception of the grace of forgiveness of Original Sin.

I also have experience with Evangelical Free Protestants, who profess that Baptism is not necessary AND membership with participation in Communion is offered to those who have not been Baptized. It has been described as merely a sign of what Jesus has already done and a public profession to commit to Jesus.

The desire to follow Jesus and acknowledge Him as the Savior, is the positive (and even Catholic) belief assented to. That is not an issue. The issue, is the rejection that Baptism is “for the remission of sins” as stated in the Creed and upheld by the Traditional Faith of the Church. This also is tied to the denial of necessity to receive, or its desire in those who through no fault of their own are prevented or without proper knowledge.

Thanks for sharing that. Prior to you saying that, I wasn’t aware there were Christian groups who purposely didn’t do baptisms. I’ve never encountered that before.

In the evangelical churches where I have visited, all of them had a large baptismal tank that reminded me of a large fish tank where people got baptized and it was usually in a prominent place where the whole congregation – from their pews – could view baptisms taking place.

 

[rcwitness]

Thanks for sharing that. Prior to you saying that, I wasn’t aware there were Christian groups who purposely didn’t do baptisms. I’ve never encountered that before.

In the evangelical churches where I have visited, all of them had a large baptismal tank that reminded me of a large fish tank where people got baptized and it was usually in a prominent place where the whole congregation – from their pews – could view baptisms taking place.

Well, they do perform Baptisms. But the meaning of “…for the forgiveness of sins” is removed. It then becomes a mere ritual that is more like a gesture or a public statement with a symbol (only) of water.

It is intentionally separated from personal reception of the forgiveness of sins.

So while I believe, in the case of an adult, that belief in Jesus’ forgiveness can and should be acknowledged before the Sacrament, the actual Sacrament is a reception of that grace completed in the individual. It is basically the condition set before the believer. To believe IS to seek Baptism. To refrain from Baptism IS to retain sins.

P.S. Personal culpability has its place here, of which only Jesus ultimately judges.

 

[susanlo]

What do Evangelicals believe, in regard to the Nicene Creed? In several discussions, recently, I have used this Creed to represent what Christians must accept, but do Evangelical (non-denominational) believers accept it all?

The Nicene Creed is not taught or recited at any of the Anabaptist or non-denominational churches I have been a part of over the years. My childhood Anabaptist church claims that their only creed is the New Testament. It and the other churches I have been at try to follow “1st century” and “pre-Constantine” Christianity. That being said, I don’t see anything that these churches would not agree with. In fact my mother told me that the Nicene Creed is now in their book of worship readings and can be read in church. They would not consider it a binding creed and not put it on the same level as God’s Word.

 

[Tommy999]

Well, they do perform Baptisms. But the meaning of “…for the forgiveness of sins” is removed. It then becomes a mere ritual that is more like a gesture or a public statement with a symbol (only) of water.

It is intentionally separated from personal reception of the forgiveness of sins.

So while I believe, in the case of an adult, that belief in Jesus’ forgiveness can and should be acknowledged before the Sacrament, the actual Sacrament is a reception of that grace completed in the individual. It is basically the condition set before the believer. To believe IS to seek Baptism. To refrain from Baptism IS to retain sins.

P.S. Personal culpability has its place here, of which only Jesus ultimately judges.

Thanks for clarifying, rcwitness. I apologize for being a little slow on the up-take sometimes.

 

[rcwitness]

The Nicene Creed is not taught or recited at any of the Anabaptist or non-denominational churches I have been a part of over the years. My childhood Anabaptist church claims that their only creed is the New Testament. It and the other churches I have been at try to follow “1st century” and “pre-Constantine” Christianity. That being said, I don’t see anything that these churches would not agree with. In fact my mother told me that the Nicene Creed is now in their book of worship readings and can be read in church. They would not consider it a binding creed and not put it on the same level as God’s Word.

Thanks susalo! Good to hear from you.

Is the Niceness Creed on the same “level” as Scripture? That’s an interesting question. Part of me says, no… but there is an aspect that it is, in that it is an official excerpt and summary of Scripture decreed by the Church. If being on the same level means equal in all respects, no. Scripture has a special place among all things written. It is not only inerrant, but part of Divine Revelation. A Creed is, at most, a response with authority to that Revelation.

Now, one can also say that it is not a departure from Scripture, and even an expression of the message of Scripture. And when done under the condition that it is Confirmed by the Church, this is the expression and decree of the Church’s Magisterium.

Yet, the fact that it relied on Scripture AND Tradition, means it’s both not the same as Scripture, and equally authoritive.