EVOLUTION: A Catholic Solution?

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hecd2 said:
Well it is not illegal to use private or state funds for embryonic stem cell research in the USA and such research is funded by national governments elsewhere in the world.

Now, I think that it is a thoroughly good thing that Catholic bioethics committees and organisations should make an (name removed by moderator)ut to the community’s view of the ethics of ethically sensitive research such as this. The views of other religious groups, secular groups and experts in bioethics should also be considered. It would be a disaster if scientists were left unregulated to conduct research in ethically sensitive areas. I absolutely support the concept of the right and duty for society to oversee this sort of work (of course scientists have the right to argue their case and to educate the public in what they are doing - much research is badly misrepresented), through a range of advocacy groups. We have to recognise however that these ethical issues are complex, and there are a range of opinions with many stakeholders - it would be wrong for the Catholic view to take precedence.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
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Your claim is the Catholic church lacks competence or credentials?
 
grannymh said:
The use of science (not science itself) and the application of science is already making evil possible especially in the U.S. Example FOCA
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Of course scientific knowledge can be used for evil ends. I am not American and not fully conversant with FOCA, and while I do not subscribe to the idea that all abortion is inherently immoral, some of the provisions of FOCA as I understand them, particularly the right to late-term abortion after viability, disturb me.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
 
ricmat said:
Should not all our “works” pass through some kind of moral filter before actions are taken?
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Yes, of course they should. Scientists are good at figuring out how the world works, but they are not necessarily wise or good. Ethically sensitive research needs ethical oversight.
Some people have lost their consciences, and any vestiges of the natural law that is inscribed in their hearts. So, yes, Vatican approval would be a good start for those folks.
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However the Catholic Church cannot be and should not be the sole arbiter of ethics in science. There are many other valid voices to be heard.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
 
hecd2 said:
However the Catholic Church cannot be and should not be the sole arbiter of ethics in science. There are many other valid voices to be heard.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
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It has the biggest data set, has the most experience, possesses the fullness of truth, has the most successes, the biggest library of truths and wisdom and has the best sponsor Jesus Christ.👍
 
buffalo said:
Then you will have no problem celebrating Academic Freedom Day on Darwin’s birthday Feb 12.
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I think, having obtained a fair result by fully stating and balancing the facts and arguments on both sides of the question, I will be celebrating Darwin Day on 12th February.

I notice that you didn’t acknowledge that your claim that science is slow to change is false. Par for the course. When found out, change the subject quickly.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
 
hecd2 said:
I think, having obtained a fair result by fully stating and balancing the facts and arguments on both sides of the question, I will celebrating Darwin Day on 12th February.

I notice that you didn’t acknowledge thar your claim that science is slow to change is false. Par for the course. When found out, change the subject quickly.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
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Ahh man. I wish I could keep up.

Philosophically science is slow to change. That is what I believe. But I will leave it open.
 
buffalo said:
Your claim is the Catholic church lacks competence or credentials?
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In a pluralist society, the Catholic Church’s right to determine moral questions is no greater than that of other Christian institutions, other religions, and secular groups. The Church’s views are one amongst many, and it would be wrong for her views to take precedence.

As for the Church’s philosophical or religious right to be the sole arbiter of moral and ethics, I reject that claim.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
 
buffalo said:
It has the biggest data set, has the most experience, possesses the fullness of truth, has the most successes, the biggest library of truths and wisdom and has the best sponsor Jesus Christ.
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So you say, but I, and the majority of others in society reject those claims.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
 
hecd2 said:
In a pluralist society, the Catholic Church’s right to determine moral questions is no greater than that of other Christian institutions, other religions, and secular groups. The Church’s views are one amongst many, and it would be wrong for her views to take precedence.

As for the Church’s philosophical or religious right to be the sole arbiter of moral and ethics, I reject that claim.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
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A pluralist society is the result of not acknowledging the real truth. It is a corruption, not an admirable goal.

Now I don’t claim the Church has the sole right just because of rights themselves, I claim she occupies the high moral ground and therefore she has is the most competent and most credentialed and should be recognized as such.

You are a man who respects training and competency or is all that just a sham?
 
buffalo said:
A pluralist society is the result of not acknowledging the real truth. It is a corruption, not an admirable goal.
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So you say, but the majority of people in society reject your view, and you live in a nation that was founded by those who were escaping the shackles of religious or social absolutism and dictatorship. I know what sort of society I would rather live in.
Now I don’t claim the Church has the sole right just because of rights themselves, I claim she occupies the high moral ground and therefore she has is the most competent and most credentialed and should be recognized as such.
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And I reject these claims for precedence. To claim that the Church should occupy the high moral ground because she occupies the high moral ground is circular.
You are a man who respects training and competency or is all that just a sham?
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Not at all a sham. Competence in science is objective - you either know the FRLM metric solutions of the Einstein field equations or you don’t. You either know what tandem repeats are, or you don’t.

Competence in determining ethical questions is different. There are no objective measures for determining competence - there are moral philosophers (who are not exclusively Catholic) who can provide a framework for thinking about ethics, but they cannot provide the answers themselves to individual questions. I reject the idea that Catholics are more competent than other informed and thoughtful groups and individuals.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
 
hecd2 said:
So you say, but the majority of people in society reject your view, and you live in a nation that was founded by those who were escaping the shackles of religious or social absolutism and dictatorship. I know what sort of society I would rather live in.
And I reject these claims for precedence. To claim that the Church should occupy the high moral ground because she occupies the high moral ground is circular.

Not at all a sham. Competence in science is objective - you either know the FRLM metric solutions of the Einstein field equations or you don’t. You either know what tandem repeats are, or you don’t.

Competence in determining ethical questions is different. There are no objective measures for determining competence - there are moral philosophers (who are not exclusively Catholic) who can provide a framework for thinking about ethics, but they cannot provide the answers themselves to individual questions. I reject the idea that Catholics are more competent than other informed and thoughtful groups and individuals.

Alec
evolutionpages.com
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In the US we enjoy freedom of religion not freedom from religion.

In any case the Church enjoys the high moral ground because she is the most competent.
 
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