Ex Jehovah's Witness here...

[disappointed1]

disappointed1;1801414:

I would also add a note about Jehovah’s Witnesses. I see some here who are quite zealous in giving them a bad rap. I disagree with them doing that. I have personally known and studied with JWs for many years. It is my firm belief that they are not all the same, they are not all weirdos and crazy people. I see the bad experiences of some within that denomination, no worse than the bad expereinces of some in my own denomination, or in the Catholic fellowship. Such unfortunate events do not seem to indicate official JW teachings; but rather the perversions of individuals; not the denomination as a whole.

There are some lovely people in the Jehovah’s Witness congregations I have been to, and they are nothing like some of the satisfied denigrations I have seen here.

Thank you,
I suppose the reason I first started to look at these forums is that I wondered why people seem to dislike these people so much. Why they are being so aggressively attacked in the forums. Not just this one but many of them. I know of some of them that seem normal. The are well educated, they make good incomes and drive nice cars. Most of the ones I know seem like normal people. Normal in that they are not any more disfuntional than the middle of the road person. As far as doctrine is concerned, much of what they say makes sense. Everyone says they are false prophets and they teach false hood but I am not sure I am really understanding on what. I hear the thing about 1975 for example, I cannot find that in print. In 1975 I was 6 years old and knew nothing of JW’s. I understand they say, or someone in the org was heard to say that the end will come then. I think the point for them is that this system will not continue forever at the rate it is going. I believe in that. Things are getting bad, what do the Catholics say is going to happen in the future. Alot of very fundamental issue from the bible are not being addressed. I hear people making a huge issue about the Trinity. I am working on that one, but what about things like what is right and wrong? How should you be a good person? How much wrong doing should a religious organization tolerate? I am wondering if they have the right idea and making sure it’s participants obey what the Bible whatever translation use says is wrong.

 

[disappointed1]

Protestant101;1803908:

Another attack religion heard from! Why don’t you belong to the Jehovahs Witnesses then ! So you are saying you agree with the Watchtower when it teaches Jesus was a deciever??? When it teaches you can be saved by the name Jehovah???

What a friendly response…I am not sure I have ever heard that from any of them. That Jesus was a deciever. The first time I have ever heard them accused of that is on this site. Why are you so angry…If you don’t want to help. Just read and fuss to yourself, but I don’t see the need to lash out. I did read your other post though and I feel it is fair and infact much of the point I am trying to make. I think there a few differences with the JW’s. I am just trying to figure out why some have chosen Catholicism just like I have some other sites. I think they trying to be good people. It seems that way to me. They are painted to be a bunch of devil antichrist on this site and others and I just want to see if I can figure out why, why, why. are these people so bad?

 

[Marilena]

Protestant101;1803908:

disappointed1;1801414:

I would also add a note about Jehovah’s Witnesses. I see some here who are quite zealous in giving them a bad rap. I disagree with them doing that. I have personally known and studied with JWs for many years. It is my firm belief that they are not all the same, they are not all weirdos and crazy people. I see the bad experiences of some within that denomination, no worse than the bad expereinces of some in my own denomination, or in the Catholic fellowship. Such unfortunate events do not seem to indicate official JW teachings; but rather the perversions of individuals; not the denomination as a whole.

There are some lovely people in the Jehovah’s Witness congregations I have been to, and they are nothing like some of the satisfied denigrations I have seen here.

.

let me say this,

we do not dislike jw’s. its the organization that we have a problem with, not the individual jw. the governing body controls and decieves it members, they use fear as a weapon to keep their members inline. how do i know this? i used to be one of them for years, like jeff has and carol marie.

taking blood is not wrong, and the governing body tells its members to not take blood, no where in the bible does it ever at anytime state we cannot receive blood transfusions.

thousands of witnesses have died needlessly because they believe what the falsetower teaches about the blood issue.
the governing body tells its members that if they willfully take a transfusion, that they are damned for all eternity. they will be anihilated by God for taking a transfusion, and that is a fear tactic and morally wrong.

jw’s are also taught not to have independent thinking, that they must rely solely on the governing body for their spritual food, and they are never to ask questions about the societies practices and false predictions of the past. the society states that independent thinking is “dangerous”. its only dangerous to the governing body because if its members really and truly questioned their practices, the society would fall.

the society is responsible for the thousands upon thousands of deaths from a lack of blood and in the past, a lack of a life saving transplant. jw’s are innocent sheep that follow a nasty wolf who is disguised as a sheep.

i specifically recall my friend who is still a jw telling me not to question the societies practices or doctrine. also, think of this, the watchtower has made so many false predictions, and yet they claim to speak for God. They cannot claim to speak for God when in fact they tell lies, there is NO untruth with God, therefore they do not speak for God and never have and never will. they are not God’s visible organization on earth.

witnesses are told not to read any publications that might contradict what the society teaches, and if they do read it, they are automatically branded as apostates. they are told that they will be annhilated forever by God. that is a fear tactic, and also emotional blackmail.

We have a right to question what we know is false, and we have a right as human beings to have independent thinking.
God did not make us as robots to do as we’re told or else! He gave us free will. witnesses have NO free will when it comes to the society.

they have a right to free will, and independent thinking. it is given to them by the law and not the law of the society. God gave us free will. the governing body should be ahsamed of itself for controlling its members and using fear as a tactic to keep their members inline.

they have flip flopped on doctrine, they have lied about armageddon, they have caused thousands to die without a blood transfusion, and transplant, they claim they speak for God when infact they do not, they have altered the bible to suit their belief, and what by the way, does the book of Revelation state at the very end of it about anyone who changes the Holy Scriptures?

so no, we do not hate jw’s, we are CONCERNED for them, and concerned for their spiritual well being.

 

[geraldffff]

Hi Geraldffff:

Jeff Schwehm here…I would never put the Cathechism of the Catholic Church on par with the Watchtower and Book of Mormon. The Catechism of the Catholic Church teaches the truth of Christianity in its fullness. The Watchtower and the Book of Mormon are counterfeits at best. I think our friend disappointed who is the one that placed our Catechism on par with the Watchtower and Book of Mormon. Evidently he tried to quote me from one of my posts and it was unclear who actually wrote what. As far as the creed is concerned…I believe in the Nicean Creed wholeheartedly and my wife and I run an Apostolate to assist former JWs and others into the Catholic Church. (www.catholicxjw.com)

God’s blessings to you,

Jeff S.

My apology for misunderstanding and misplaced zeal. Thank you for your fraternial correction Peace in Jesus

 

[Allweather]

That is good to know. My brother in law (true believing Elder) once told me that even if he could, he would not defend his family from violent death, with a firearm. He said he would leave it in Jehovah’s hands. JW’s do not believe in keeping firearms for self-defense…and take a pretty dim view of self-defense in general. Personally I take the defense of my family very seriously, and could not live with myself if I let something happen to them, that I could have prevented with the proper tools and training.

I have understood that we not only have a right to defend ourselves and our families, be have an obligation within Catholic teaching to do so. As your read throught the Catechism of the Catholic Church, you will see these things laid out in writing. There is also a concept of “just war” in which the circumstances that justify war between nations are laid out. It is pretty demanding, so much so that many rightwingers have criticized it for being too pacifist. For instance, under the Just War doctrine, Hiroshima and Nagasaki, as well as other bombings of strictly civilian targets in WWII, would not have passed the test.

BTW I am a gun owner, too. I don’t believe in killing over property, as some do, but there is no way I would stand by and allow anyone to harm my family, or me, without putting up one heckuva fight.

 

[Allweather]

geraldffff;1803962:

What a friendly response…I am not sure I have ever heard that from any of them. That Jesus was a deciever. The first time I have ever heard them accused of that is on this site. Why are you so angry…If you don’t want to help. Just read and fuss to yourself, but I don’t see the need to lash out. I did read your other post though and I feel it is fair and infact much of the point I am trying to make. I think there a few differences with the JW’s. I am just trying to figure out why some have chosen Catholicism just like I have some other sites. I think they trying to be good people. It seems that way to me. They are painted to be a bunch of devil antichrist on this site and others and I just want to see if I can figure out why, why, why. are these people so bad?

Most adherents to these cults, like JWs, Moonies, and Mormons, etc, are “good” and well-meaning people. Some aren’t. Some know the truth, but mislead anyway. There are Mormons, and undoubtedly some JWs in leadership positions, who know darned good and well that their religions are false, but because they are so heavily invested in so many ways in these man-made scams, they refuse to do the right thing, and they continue to mislead others. In Matthew 18, Jesus describes the faith of a little child, which is the type of faith that most pleases Him. He says that whoever causes one of those little ones to sin, it would be better for him to have a millstone tied around him and be thrown into the sea. It isn’t a stretch to apply this to cult leaders who, knowing the truth, lead people of simple and deephearted faith to follow false religion. Those leaders are in serious jeopardy of Hell.

Unfortunately, most people who leave these cults lose all their faith. Many become atheists, and many others join other false cults, and new age, or hedonistic pursuits, they having been denied a normal lifestyle for so long. A few find the truth. The fullness of God’s truth is to be found in only one Church, and that is the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church is the only one that has the historical and doctrinal claim to fame. The rest of them, including our Protestant Separated brethren, are offshoots, heretical in various ways, pretenders, wishful thinkers, disobedient, willful people who value their own opinions over the opinions of Almighty God.

 

[geraldffff]

disappointed1;1804563:

Protestant101;1803908:

let me say this,

we do not dislike jw’s. its the organization that we have a problem with, not the individual jw. the governing body controls and decieves it members, they use fear as a weapon to keep their members inline. how do i know this? i used to be one of them for years, like jeff has and carol marie.

taking blood is not wrong, and the governing body tells its members to not take blood, no where in the bible does it ever at anytime state we cannot receive blood transfusions.

thousands of witnesses have died needlessly because they believe what the falsetower teaches about the blood issue.
the governing body tells its members that if they willfully take a transfusion, that they are damned for all eternity. they will be anihilated by God for taking a transfusion, and that is a fear tactic and morally wrong.

jw’s are also taught not to have independent thinking, that they must rely solely on the governing body for their spritual food, and they are never to ask questions about the societies practices and false predictions of the past. the society states that independent thinking is “dangerous”. its only dangerous to the governing body because if its members really and truly questioned their practices, the society would fall.

the society is responsible for the thousands upon thousands of deaths from a lack of blood and in the past, a lack of a life saving transplant. jw’s are innocent sheep that follow a nasty wolf who is disguised as a sheep.

i specifically recall my friend who is still a jw telling me not to question the societies practices or doctrine. also, think of this, the watchtower has made so many false predictions, and yet they claim to speak for God. They cannot claim to speak for God when in fact they tell lies, there is NO untruth with God, therefore they do not speak for God and never have and never will. they are not God’s visible organization on earth.

witnesses are told not to read any publications that might contradict what the society teaches, and if they do read it, they are automatically branded as apostates. they are told that they will be annhilated forever by God. that is a fear tactic, and also emotional blackmail.

We have a right to question what we know is false, and we have a right as human beings to have independent thinking.
God did not make us as robots to do as we’re told or else! He gave us free will. witnesses have NO free will when it comes to the society.

they have a right to free will, and independent thinking. it is given to them by the law and not the law of the society. God gave us free will. the governing body should be ahsamed of itself for controlling its members and using fear as a tactic to keep their members inline.

they have flip flopped on doctrine, they have lied about armageddon, they have caused thousands to die without a blood transfusion, and transplant, they claim they speak for God when infact they do not, they have altered the bible to suit their belief, and what by the way, does the book of Revelation state at the very end of it about anyone who changes the Holy Scriptures?

so no, we do not hate jw’s, we are CONCERNED for them, and concerned for their spiritual well being.

You put it a lot better than I could. There some poster here who continue to stroke the back of the wolf and say ‘ooh what nice little lamb’ and 'don’t worry the title jehovah will save you when Jesus comes. KJV Acts:4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved. I apologise for any offense given if i have misstated on this fourm.

 

[Marilena]

Marilena;1804876:

disappointed1;1804563:

You put it a lot better than I could. There some poster here who continue to stroke the back of the wolf and say ‘ooh what nice little lamb’ and 'don’t worry the title jehovah will save you when Jesus comes. KJV Acts:4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

11This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

12Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

you qouted my post as someone elses

 

[geraldffff]

geraldffff;1805103:

Marilena;1804876:

you qouted my post as someone elses

Acutual I did not , it seems that we have a computer hacker plying his evil ways and putting in these forms> I apologise for any misunderstanding. Please pray for me.

 

[Marilena]

Marilena;1805121:

geraldffff;1805103:

Acutual I did not , it seems that we have a computer hacker plying his evil ways and putting in these forms> I apologise for any misunderstanding. Please pray for me.

 

[GungHo]

I’ve read about this a few times and I just wondered: if a person saved literature from JW’s, for a long time so that the old predictions “expired”, and you showed it to a JW at you door, what would they do?

I can tell you exactly what they would do…they would tell you that the light has gotten brighter, and we now believe…whatever.

Hey, if you really want to get them going, ask them whether the men of Sodom are going to be resurected or not. The Society has changed their stance on this 6 times over the years IN PRINT. This is a perfect example of the flickering light.

 

[Marilena]

I can tell you exactly what they would do…they would tell you that the light has gotten brighter, and we now believe…whatever…

 

[GungHo]

I see some here who are quite zealous in giving them a bad rap. I disagree with them doing that.

All I can say is that many (like me) have seen the dark side of this cult. This cult has over the years kicked my family in the gut. My three sisters were DF’ed, and so my Mom never talked to them. Now two of my son’s are DF’ed, and one has diassoicated himself. Then add to this all the years I subjected myself to their “micro management” of my life…no holidays, no birthdays, no voting, only JW approved sex (between hubby and wife that is), no military, no smoking, no blood (giving or getting,) the endless meetings and study, no “R” rated movies (Geez, find one that’s NOT these days.) And since all JW’s are taught to spy on other JW’s…always feeling as if I’m being watched. And then to just add a little icing on the cake…not getting to know any of my extended family…because they were in “the world.”

BTW, did I mention that the Society does not even want you to use the Internet or email? Yup…they evil Internet (where the REAL truth can be found about the Society…and they know it.) I remember being told from the platform at a recent District Convention that IF we were on the Internet, to NEVER click on a hyperlink…because it might take us to PORN. BTW, if the Society says “porn” you can be sure they mean “apostate.”

 

[GungHo]

On the issue of “walking the line” and not getting caught by the elders: That can work in the sight of humans in the Kingdom Hall, but why would anyone ever imagine that God does not know any act or thought that is hidden from the elders? If this is the message you got from the JW’s, it is a poisoned one indeed. In the end we are not admitted to heaven by the elders; God makes the call. God is everywhere (omnipresent), all-knowing/seeing (omniscient), and all-powerful (omnipotent). When we openly confess our sins and seek God in humility, we are to be welcomed home, not spurned and shamed.

Please do not misunderstand my point. I of course fully understand that nothing can be hid from God. My point was that I came to understand that I wanted to be subject to God, and NOT to the Society. So if THEY said something was wrong, and I knew it wasn’t, I felt free to go my own way. BTW, you just have no idea how good it felt to give blood for the first time just a few months ago. Now…do you think God cared if I did that? Get my point? …So many people in the JW cult think they are serving God, but they are just serving man. This is very sad.

Hey…would it be possible for me to speak to a Catholic Priest somewhere? That may sound like a stupid question, but I hope not.

 

[Marilena]

Please do not misunderstand my point. I of course fully understand that nothing can be hid from God. My point was that I came to understand that I wanted to be subject to God, and NOT to the Society. So if THEY said something was wrong, and I knew it wasn’t, I felt free to go my own way. BTW, you just have no idea how good it felt to give blood for the first time just a few months ago. Now…do you think God cared if I did that? Get my point? …So many people in the JW cult think they are serving God, but they are just serving man. This is very sad.

Hey…would it be possible for me to speak to a Catholic Priest somewhere? That may sound like a stupid question, but I hope not.

yes it would!! look in your yellow pages under Catholic Churches.

 

[GungHo]

The most painful thing I have ever read about the JWs is that the repentant sinner is cut off and cast out. This is indeed the exact opposite of what is proclaimed by God and the Holy Bible.

And that is just the half of it. Now remember that I know about about this, because of my three sisters and two sons being DF’ed…not to mention all the stories I have read online…when a person goes to the Elders to “confess” a sin - lets say fornication - a “Judicial Commitee” is formed. This consists of three Elders. Then the person is called in. Now get this…the way they try to find out if the person is truely repentant is ask them “exactly” what happened. If the person does not want to give these three men the exact details of the act, they are considered un-repentant. And I do not want to get to graphic here, but trust me, graphic is what THEY want. In the case of one of my sisters, she broke down in tears and told them she just could not tell them want they wanted to know…did you take your clothes off? What kind of sex did you have? Did you climax? Did he? (and even more graphic, but I think you get the picture)… She was DF’ed. I swear to God I am NOT making this stuff up, but I just wanted to be sure that it is understood just what goes on when one trys to do the right thing in this cult.

 

[GungHo]

If you go to the WatchTower’s official website, examine their official beliefs, or look in their official writings; you will not see as official doctrine, some of the things being posted here about them. Certain other websites are guilty of nothing short of theatrical slander of the most malicious type against this denomination; and I am just trying to urge here that we do not become like them.

I’m not trying to bash them…I’m just calling it as I have seen it. And the Society does NOT put all their rules and regs on their website. There is even a “secret” book given only to Elders that tell them how to deal with their flock. You do not know me, but I swear all I have wrote is true. I’ve been there…done that.

Now it is true that the average JW does not have horns (maybe a tail) but that does not mean that there is a dark side lying below that not all get to see.

BTW, I looked at the January issue of the wifes Watchtower last week. It had the yearly stats in it. Every devloped country in the world (like USA, Canada, Britain, France and such) had a ZERO or ONE percent growth. This dispite the hundreds of thousands of hour preaching door to door. They are getting really close to negative growth for the FIRST time in their history.

 

[GungHo]

Everyone says they are false prophets and they teach false hood but I am not sure I am really understanding on what. I hear the thing about 1975 for example, I cannot find that in print.

You won’t. But what you will find is the phrases…“within a few years,” and “within this decade” many times. (Along with many other variants.) And please remember that I and many others were there to hear themselves the talks that used the date many times. I remember hearing “stay alive 'till 75” many times.

 

[GungHo]

yes it would!! look in your yellow pages under Catholic Churches.

So, I call and make an appointment?

 

[catsrus]

originally posted by Protestant101
There are some lovely people in the Jehovah’s Witness congregations I have been to, and they are nothing like some of the satisfied denigrations I have seen here.

There ARE some lovely people that are jws. You are misunderstanding. It’s not the people, it’s the belief. The belief is so horribly corrupt. And, yes, I DO know what I’m talking about having spent (wasted) a year and a half of my life on this evil cult.

originally posted by Protestant101
so too, the Catholic Church teaches their adherents that they need several other things in addition to the Bible, in order to correctly understand it. I believe that according to John 16 and many other passages, we can understand the Bible for ourselves, by God, The Holy Spirit. He will “convict us of Truth.”

So, as your own interpreter of scripture (your own pastor so to say) you can maybe answer that if all you have to do is read and understand for yourself, why are there at least 33,000 different interpretations among you protestants?
Also, as Catholis we don’t have “several other things” we “need” outside the Bible. We NEED Tradition (capital T) since there was NO Bible untill The Holy Catholic Church put it together in the 4th century.
Up until that time, all there existed was Tradition.