Ex-Wife Is Dying

[jay29]

I’m not judgemental about how you feel. You are entitled to your feelings, but to make a blanket and public statement like “all suicides are cowards” is extremely insensitive to those who have loved ones who have killed themselves. You also don’t know what happens in someone’s life and mind to make them end their lives. Some people might see their children murdered before their very eyes and in inconsolable grief kill themselves. Some people who kill themselves are insane. Some have been raped and abused. Are they cowards?

That is exactly like saying you can’t admonish a woman who has had an abortion. “You don’t know what led to that abortion.” Doesn’t matter. A murder took place and the mother excommunicated herself because of her actions regardless of what led up to it. How culpable the woman is is up to God.

Just like those that commit suicide, except those mentally ill - who I would blame the suicide on their caretakers-- are cowards. They didn’t want to bear their cross. They chose the easy way out. That is why suicide and despair are mortal sins.

And no, Jesus didn’t run from the cross, but He is God. And to be honest, I wouldn’t have called him a coward if He did. Not wanting to be tortured either emotionally or physically does not make someone a coward. Suicides deserve our sympathy and should be prayed for, not ridiculed after their death.

Not wanting to carry your cross in life is a coward. Suicides deserve sympathy for those that remain on earth to pick up the pieces.

 

[jay29]

The family may have the following canon law in mind:Can. 1090 §1. Anyone who with a view to entering marriage with a certain person has brought about the death of that person’s spouse or of one’s own spouse invalidly attempts this marriage.

§2. Those who have brought about the death of a spouse by mutual physical or moral cooperation also invalidly attempt a marriage together.

How would the ex husband be responsible? He had every single right to say no to reconciliation. She left him. He could have forgiven her and still said go away and he would carry no guilt.

 

[SamH]

The family may have the following canon law in mind:
Can. 1090 §1. Anyone who with a view to entering marriage with a certain person has brought about the death of that person’s spouse or of one’s own spouse invalidly attempts this marriage.

§2. Those who have brought about the death of a spouse by mutual physical or moral cooperation also invalidly attempt a marriage together.

Only if they don’t know what they are reading.

 

[BlueEyedLady]

I hope that you are never in a situation of true despair where Satan tempts you to take your own life in a moment of weakness. What a horrible thing to say, especially to those of us who have lost loved ones to suicide.

And to those of us that have personally struggled. I have dealt with major depression and a debilitating anxiety disorder. I have spent the majority of my post-puberty life in therapy, and roughly half of it on anti-depressants. If I had had health insurance more of the time that fraction would be larger. I am still on anti-anxiety meds. I don’t know how I won my last battle, to be perfectly honest. I dropped out of my final semester of college and locked myself in my apartment. I wasn’t eating, sleeping all the time, and crying constantly. After a night of heaving drinking (alone) and taking Xanax and Klonopin in unknown quantities my roommate found me and called 911 saying that I was attempting suicide. I wasn’t exactly, I was just at a point where I didn’t care if I lived or died. Long story short that led to a stint in (name removed by moderator)atient treatment, a debt that I am still paying off.

Every time I hear about a suicide I know full well that that could have been me. To be honest looking back I don’t know how it wasn’t. I wasn’t scared, or a coward, I was just in a very bad, desperate place. I saw no way out and I didn’t want to live like that forever. I wasn’t me anymore. The people and things I loved didn’t matter anymore, my future didn’t matter, nothing mattered because I couldn’t see anything beyond the intense pain I was feeling.

I’m not arrogant or stupid. I know that I have a disease and that another bout could come any day, and is in fact likely to do so. I know that throughout my life I’ll have several more battles with this. I live every day knowing that I will eventually be thrown back into that dark pit and that there no one will be able to reach me. I will have to claw my way out again. If I were a coward I would end it now, knowing that that’s what I’m facing at any moment in my life.

But I’m not. I’ll keep living now, and should I not make it out of my next bout, or the one after that, or the one after that I know, and my friends and family know, that it won’t have been me who took my life. Not the real me anyway. They’ll know that I was lost to a very real, and very scary illness.

 

[mafh]

Just like those that commit suicide, except those mentally ill - who I would blame the suicide on their caretakers-- are cowards. They didn’t want to bear their cross. They chose the easy way out. That is why suicide and despair are mortal sins.

Suicidal thoughts are almost completely absent from the general population, but are extremely common among people with major depression and related psychological disorders. So, it is extremely likely that any suicide you ever hear about was due to a mental illness. So, these non-ill ‘cowards’ you speak of are virtually non-existant.

 

[SamH]

I hope that you are never in a situation of true despair where Satan tempts you to take your own life in a moment of weakness.

That’s making a wild assumption.

 

[SamH]

Suicidal thoughts are almost completely absent from the general population, but are extremely common among people with major depression and related psychological disorders. So, it is extremely likely that any suicide you ever hear about was due to a mental illness. So, these non-ill ‘cowards’ you speak of are virtually non-existant.

Source for this claim?

Suicide was the 11th leading cause of death in the United States in 2001. The number of suicide deaths that year topped 30,600. And the number of young people who commit suicide continues to increase. But despite the alarming statistics, many common misconceptions about suicide persist.

"Thoughts of suicide are not uncommon," explains Rex Cowdry, MD, medical director of the National Association for the Mentally Ill (NAMI). “Many people have them. They’re often associated with depression, which is remarkably treatable.”

valueoptions.com/suicide_prev/html%20pages/Myths%20and%20Facts%20About%20Suicide.htm

Know anyone that’s never been depressed?

 

[jay29]

Suicidal thoughts are almost completely absent from the general population, but are extremely common among people with major depression and related psychological disorders. So, it is extremely likely that any suicide you ever hear about was due to a mental illness. So, these non-ill ‘cowards’ you speak of are virtually non-existant.

Suicides happen way more than you think and are never reported in the obits as a cause of death because copycats would be pushed over the edge. I’m sure there is a good percentage of those who cant bear life’s burdens and want to end it all and reject God’s help- despair. I still think it is a cowardly and selfish act for those who are mentally intact. I can say the same for those who procure abortion as well.

I have stones thrown at me everyday and I still pick up my cross and follow Him.

 

[jay29]

Source for this claim?

Know anyone that’s never been depressed?

I know suicides happen way way way more than it is ever reported. Happens all the time.

 

[SamH]

I know suicides happen way way way more than it is ever reported. Happens all the time.

Agreed, and its not just people with “psychological disorders” that act on it. Within two miles of where I grew up 5 farmers committed suicide in the early 1980s during the farm crisis.

 

[LaSainte]

And to those of us that have personally struggled. I have dealt with major depression and a debilitating anxiety disorder. I have spent the majority of my post-puberty life in therapy, and roughly half of it on anti-depressants. If I had had health insurance more of the time that fraction would be larger. I am still on anti-anxiety meds. I don’t know how I won my last battle, to be perfectly honest. I dropped out of my final semester of college and locked myself in my apartment. I wasn’t eating, sleeping all the time, and crying constantly. After a night of heaving drinking (alone) and taking Xanax and Klonopin in unknown quantities my roommate found me and called 911 saying that I was attempting suicide. I wasn’t exactly, I was just at a point where I didn’t care if I lived or died. Long story short that led to a stint in (name removed by moderator)atient treatment, a debt that I am still paying off.

Every time I hear about a suicide I know full well that that could have been me. To be honest looking back I don’t know how it wasn’t. I wasn’t scared, or a coward, I was just in a very bad, desperate place. I saw no way out and I didn’t want to live like that forever. I wasn’t me anymore. The people and things I loved didn’t matter anymore, my future didn’t matter, nothing mattered because I couldn’t see anything beyond the intense pain I was feeling.

I’m not arrogant or stupid. I know that I have a disease and that another bout could come any day, and is in fact likely to do so. I know that throughout my life I’ll have several more battles with this. I live every day knowing that I will eventually be thrown back into that dark pit and that there no one will be able to reach me. I will have to claw my way out again. If I were a coward I would end it now, knowing that that’s what I’m facing at any moment in my life.

But I’m not. I’ll keep living now, and should I not make it out of my next bout, or the one after that, or the one after that I know, and my friends and family know, that it won’t have been me who took my life. Not the real me anyway. They’ll know that I was lost to a very real, and very scary illness.

I am really very glad that you did not take your own life. If you ever need to talk feel free to PM me. It makes me very sad that some people feel there is no way out of their pain. Thanks for sharing your story!

 

[jay29]

Agreed, and its not just people with “psychological disorders” that act on it. Within two miles of where I grew up 5 farmers committed suicide in the early 1980s during the farm crisis.

I found a guy on the job hanging in a closet after he had an argument with his mother three days before. She called the police and EMS for a check the welfare call and I saw him hanging by neckties. The kid was only 22 and a university student.

 

[LaSainte]

That is exactly like saying you can’t admonish a woman who has had an abortion. “You don’t know what led to that abortion.” Doesn’t matter. A murder took place and the mother excommunicated herself because of her actions regardless of what led up to it. How culpable the woman is is up to God.

Just like those that commit suicide, except those mentally ill - who I would blame the suicide on their caretakers-- are cowards. They didn’t want to bear their cross. They chose the easy way out. That is why suicide and despair are mortal sins.

Not wanting to carry your cross in life is a coward. Suicides deserve sympathy for those that remain on earth to pick up the pieces.

No it’s not being a coward. You are blessed in that you have faith. There are those with nothing to believe in or who haven’t been graced with the gift of faith. Those people have nothing to hold onto when their world falls apart. So basically, you are calling these people cowards when the only thing that separates THEM from YOU is the GRACE that you have been given to feel the presence of God in your life. You should be grateful, not ridiculing those who can’t feel God’s love for them.

And by the way, you pretty much HAVE to be mentally ill to commit suicide.

 

[jay29]

No it’s not being a coward. You are blessed in that you have faith. There are those with nothing to believe in or who haven’t been graced with the gift of faith. Those people have nothing to hold onto when their world falls apart. So basically, you are calling these people cowards when the only thing that separates THEM from YOU is the GRACE that you have been given to feel the presence of God in your life. You should be grateful, not ridiculing those who can’t feel God’s love for them.

Suicide is a mortal sin.

And by the way, you pretty much HAVE to be mentally ill to commit suicide.

Not at all. Are all murderers mentally ill? No. That Dorner guy in Cali. I don’t think he is mentally ill. He is just bent on revenge.

Committing suicide to escape justice is not mentally ill for example.

 

[Rence]

In the end, she will have most likely have successfully committed suicide. As I write this, she is essentially brain dead after overdosing on a prescription sleeping pills. I have become the target of quite a lot of hate and resentment from her family and friends, blaming her situation on me for not wanting to reconcile. There is even some strong resentment at me from our Church.

Her brother even Facebook messaged me that their family would see to it that I was never able to Marry in the Church again because I was “directly responsible” for her dying.

While I understand their anger and hurt, I don’t see the connection between her own choices to take this entire path, and my refusal to take back a woman that could not be serious about anything but money.

I wouldn’t take a spouse back after all that either. As to the Church and her family, only she and God know what she told them. Her version of the story will be to her benefit. If I were you, I’d just go to Church at another parish or if you’re stuck at that parish, just go at a time when you know they won’t be there. As to the brother, let him bring it. It’s not up to him to decide whether or not you’ll be married in Church again. And the news for him is that if she dies (God rest her soul), then you will be free to marry in the Church regardless of what he thinks of it.

This is all a toxic situation, I’d remove myself from it and be done with them if I were you. You have a life to lead, live it in peace. You’re not responsible for the poor choices other people make.

 

[silicasandra]

Suicide is a mortal sin.

It’s certainly grave matter. But depending on circumstances, a person who attempts or commits suicide may not be culpable for mortal sin.

And even those who persist in grave sin should receive compassion, mercy, and forgiveness. This is not the same thing as pretending their sin did not happen or have ill effects - and offering these to a person who has attempted or committed suicide does not mean that they are not also offered to those who have been hurt by the other’s sin.

I am sorry for the OP, and for his wife. And for his wife’s family. There is a lot of hurt going on here, and everyone needs healing.

 

[LaSainte]

Suicide is a mortal sin.

Not at all. Are all murderers mentally ill? No. That Dorner guy in Cali. I don’t think he is mentally ill. He is just bent on revenge.

Committing suicide to escape justice is not mentally ill for example.

No, suicide is GRAVE MATTER. Only God knows if a suicidal person has committed a mortal sin.

And I doubt that Jesus would call a suicidal person a coward. He would probably have intense empathy for them and feel great sorrow that they saw no other way out.

You’re right. There MAY be a minute percentage of suicides who are not technically mentally ill. I don’t know though. I’m not a mental health professional.

 

[LaSainte]

It’s certainly grave matter. But depending on circumstances, a person who attempts or commits suicide may not be culpable for mortal sin.

And even those who persist in grave sin should receive compassion, mercy, and forgiveness. This is not the same thing as pretending their sin did not happen or have ill effects - and offering these to a person who has attempted or committed suicide does not mean that they are not also offered to those who have been hurt by the other’s sin.

I am sorry for the OP, and for his wife. And for his wife’s family. There is a lot of hurt going on here, and everyone needs healing.

Yes.

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

Running away from your problems is cowardly. I would never call them that, but that doesn’t change the fact of what it is. You shouldn’t be so judgemental on how I feel.

You don’t realize the irony of what you state. You don’t want people judging you, yet you know the hearts of dead people you see and call them cowards.

My life hasn’t been a bowl of cherries. Life has made me tougher, especially what I witness what most people never see.

We all have our burdens. One thing we can be sure of in your case: you don’t have the perspective of any of the dead people you have come across.

Did Jesus, completely innocent, run away from the cross?

No, but then again two criminals hung on crosses next to him. And we can learn something from each, provided we don’t let our own pride get in the way.

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

The thing is her ex husband is taking the blame. He could forgive her and maybe he will. He shouldn’t feel any guilt for the situation.

This. He should not take the blame for her decisions. Her family is lashing out, and while that is understandable because pain is not a rational thing, he doesn’t have to expose himself to their accusations either.

I would advise the OP to talk to a priest from a different parish, to pray a lot, and to forgive his wife when he feels he can do that. People here should not give him lessons in forgivness because nobody is in his shoes. I’m sure he knows all about forgivness and love, but being able to take a step in that direction is another thing because he was badly hurt. We can’t just erase painful things, it takes time to get over them and to move on, which includes forgivness.Time heals and I hope that his wound will soon turn into a fading scar.