Excommunicate drug traffickers: Bertone suggests

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Excommunicate Drug Dealers? Gangs are Bad?

I couldn’t believe what I was reading:

cathnews.com/article.aspx?aeid=11092

The Catholic Church is just NOW starting to give this message to the gangs around the world?

What has the Catholic Church been teaching in their schools for all these years?

What has the Catholic Church’s position been against evil for all these years?

Or is it because the Church doesn’t want to upset the families of these animals that it soft pedals morality?

Since excommunication would only effect a Catholic, the Church must have finally acknowledged its role as a failed moral leader in the world. By remaining silent on these matters for all these years, they have given these people the impression that their drug culture is OK with the Lord.

We Catholics must put a stop to this by showing our outrage to our “moral authorities”!
 
jbrown0059 said:
Excommunicate Drug Dealers? Gangs are Bad?

I couldn’t believe what I was reading:

cathnews.com/article.aspx?aeid=11092

The Catholic Church is just NOW starting to give this message to the gangs around the world?

What has the Catholic Church been teaching in their schools for all these years?

What has the Catholic Church’s position been against evil for all these years?

Or is it because the Church doesn’t want to upset the families of these animals that it soft pedals morality?

Since excommunication would only effect a Catholic, the Church must have finally acknowledged its role as a failed moral leader in the world. By remaining silent on these matters for all these years, they have given these people the impression that their drug culture is OK with the Lord.

We Catholics must put a stop to this by showing our outrage to our “moral authorities”!
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Your profile does not state any religion!
 
In this area we have an American Catholic church which consists of former priests who minister chiefly to Catholics who have remarried outside the Church. If this doesn’t apply to you, I would suggest caution in using the term.
 
As to the original topic:

It’s hardly a “new” idea. It’s just that, after decades of “ecumenism” instead of “excommunication,” the Church is finally tightening up a bit.

Also, remember the Church has a long history of dealing with “gangs” right in her own backyard (i.e., the Mafia). I think the main reason this has never been prominently suggested before is the reason Cardinal Bertone says it probably wouldn’t work, anyway: those involved with drugs and gangs have gone so far into a life of sin that it would seem a moot point.

Excommunication has several purposes. One (the least important) is to 'Make an example" of someone who engages in an act of severe sacrilege, heresy or apostasy. Another (most important) is to send a clear message to the sinner: “What you’re doing is very, very bad.” However, formal excommunication pertains about equally to both, since it involves a public statement and all that. Arguably, most people involved with ganges have already committed acts that incur latae sententiae excommunication (e.g., abortions).

Cardinal Bertone suggests that they wouldn’t care, but I think they would. There are many Catholic ethnic groups: Iberians, Italians, Caribbean islanders, etc. Even if the gang-bangers themselves say 'Big deal," one of the major things about gang culture is the support of the sub-culture as an existing unit.

The mafia was so big in America because it provided an internal policing and government system to the Italian ghettos. The Church and the Mafia were treated equally as important aspects of Italian-American cultural cohesion.

Imagine being some teenager whose family came here from Mexico, and you’re thinking of getting involved with a gang. Your mother may look the other way for a lot of things. But imagine what would Mama say if the Church says, “members of gangs will be excommunicated”?

As for the sub-topic: Joe Kelley, the term is “attempted marriage,” not “remarried.” They cannot be “remarried” since they are already married to their “first” spouses.
 
thistle said:
What does American Catholic mean? Do you mean you are American and a Catholic in union with Rome or one of the so-called Catholic Churches which are not?
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Those are my 2 loyalties. America and the Roman Catholic Church. I do not support the Mexican Church (The church that hides under the label “Roman Catholic”) which is supporting the current invasion of the United States by Latin Americans.
 
GodsGadfly said:
As to the original topic:

It’s hardly a “new” idea. It’s just that, after decades of “ecumenism” instead of “excommunication,” the Church is finally tightening up a bit.

Also, remember the Church has a long history of dealing with “gangs” right in her own backyard (i.e., the Mafia). I think the main reason this has never been prominently suggested before is the reason Cardinal Bertone says it probably wouldn’t work, anyway: those involved with drugs and gangs have gone so far into a life of sin that it would seem a moot point.

Excommunication has several purposes. One (the least important) is to 'Make an example" of someone who engages in an act of severe sacrilege, heresy or apostasy. Another (most important) is to send a clear message to the sinner: “What you’re doing is very, very bad.” However, formal excommunication pertains about equally to both, since it involves a public statement and all that. Arguably, most people involved with ganges have already committed acts that incur latae sententiae excommunication (e.g., abortions).

Cardinal Bertone suggests that they wouldn’t care, but I think they would. There are many Catholic ethnic groups: Iberians, Italians, Caribbean islanders, etc. Even if the gang-bangers themselves say 'Big deal," one of the major things about gang culture is the support of the sub-culture as an existing unit.

The mafia was so big in America because it provided an internal policing and government system to the Italian ghettos. The Church and the Mafia were treated equally as important aspects of Italian-American cultural cohesion.

Imagine being some teenager whose family came here from Mexico, and you’re thinking of getting involved with a gang. Your mother may look the other way for a lot of things. But imagine what would Mama say if the Church says, “members of gangs will be excommunicated”?

As for the sub-topic: Joe Kelley, the term is “attempted marriage,” not “remarried.” They cannot be “remarried” since they are already married to their “first” spouses.
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I know the Mafia goes way back as a gang itself. It used to be called the “Black Hand” along with other names. But the connection to the Church is to disgrace what the Church represents. The same in Latin America. The Church should not hold hands with evil. It should do all it can to destroy it.

This is why the Church has lost so many people. Hypocrisy!

If the Church is ever to be trusted again, it must teach ALL its people the difference between good and evil, and start by holding those evil groups it had once turned the “blind eye” to accountable in this life as well as the next.

The Roman Catholic Church is not just Rome’s Church, it is OUR Church.
 
I hardly think that it would matter much to a person who makes a living through violence, murder and human misery if they were excommunicated. Even if they call themselves “catholic” it doesn’t make them a member in good standing with the Church. To suggest that gang members will change their ways if they are excommunicated is silly. They certainly know that murder and violence are considered serious sins.

This reminds me of the discussion of how some Jewish leaders criticized Pope Pius XII because he didn’t excommunicate Hitler and the other leading nazi officials. Do you seriously think it would have made a difference in their actions? Indeed, past actions showed that whenever the Holy See used excommunication as a political tool things tended to turn out the worst for it.

Drug traffickers excommunicate themselves by their very own actions. The Church does not have the time or the resources to start personalizing excommunications of everyone in the world who puts themselves outside of the Church.
 
Timothysis said:
I hardly think that it would matter much to a person who makes a living through violence, murder and human misery if they were excommunicated. Even if they call themselves “catholic” it doesn’t make them a member in good standing with the Church. To suggest that gang members will change their ways if they are excommunicated is silly. They certainly know that murder and violence are considered serious sins.

This reminds me of the discussion of how some Jewish leaders criticized Pope Pius XII because he didn’t excommunicate Hitler and the other leading nazi officials. Do you seriously think it would have made a difference in their actions? Indeed, past actions showed that whenever the Holy See used excommunication as a political tool things tended to turn out the worst for it.

Drug traffickers excommunicate themselves by their very own actions. The Church does not have the time or the resources to start personalizing excommunications of everyone in the world who puts themselves outside of the Church.
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Everything you say is probably true however if they were publically declared “persona non grata” maybe this action would sink in to the minds of the soon to be drug dealers who are still children. Maybe their parents would also see this as a warning to them about raising their children correctly.
 
I recall hearing of Mafiosi being denied a public funeral from time to time.
 
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