Explanation of breaks in the Muslim religion

[aball1035]

1. Can somebody explain to me (or refer a website) on the different sects or breaks in the Muslim religion? I’m wanting to go further than the Shiites and Sunnis. For example, Christianity has Catholics, Protestants, and possibly Eastern Orthodox as well. But then you’ll have thousands of Protestant sects. Is it the same way with Islam?
2. Which “sect”, or break are the radical Muslims on, and which are the more peaceful Muslims on?

 

[aspirant]

1. Can somebody explain to me (or refer a website) on the different sects or breaks in the Muslim religion? I’m wanting to go further than the Shiites and Sunnis.

Wikipedia is not the best resource in the world, but it’s not always a bad one, either. I think this article could be a helpful start, and you might move on from there.

 

[Sam_777]

Which “sect”, or break are the radical Muslims on, and which are the more peaceful Muslims on?

The Islamic dogma by itself is radical, now those who follow it 100% called “radical Muslims”, and those who follow part of it called “peaceful Muslims”.

 

[Cojuanco]

1. Can somebody explain to me (or refer a website) on the different sects or breaks in the Muslim religion? I’m wanting to go further than the Shiites and Sunnis. For example, Christianity has Catholics, Protestants, and possibly Eastern Orthodox as well. But then you’ll have thousands of Protestant sects. Is it the same way with Islam?
2. Which “sect”, or break are the radical Muslims on, and which are the more peaceful Muslims on?

Well, the short version is there is more than just the Sunnis and the Shia, especially with differing schools of interpretation of Islamic law among the Sunnis particularly, various movements like the Deobandis in India and the Wahabbis in Saudi Arabia. In that way Sunni Islam is similar to Orthodox Judaism. Among the Shia, the main divisions are between the Ismaili and the majority Twelvers (the latter called because they think the current successor of Ali is in reality in hiding, in a state of suspended animation before Judgment Day, where he will come in glory with Jesus at his side.

If you mean those that commit terrorism, well there are elements in all the sects and movements that are like that, though in most cases not the majority of the adherents or leaders, with the exception of movements like the Wahabbi. Salafism is arguably radical, but until recently, by which I mean in the past few years, they have tended to eschew secular politics (this is different now in post-Revolution Egypt, where they are the loyal opposition. The governing party, linked to the Muslim Brotherhood, is of a different politico-religious tradition, and is nominally conceptually ‘Muslim-Democratic’ - in practice Morsi’s bunch seem to be more about keeping Egypt safe for their business allies and the IMF).

 

[Sam_777]

the majority Twelvers (the latter called because they think the current successor of Ali is in reality in hiding, in a state of suspended animation before Judgment Day, where** he will come in glory with Jesus at his side.**

How irony is that!!!, denying JESUS crucifixion then coming beside Him.

 

[MartinJordan]

How irony is that!!!, denying JESUS crucifixion then coming beside Him.

Doesn’t compute!

Although I understand the Ahmadi believe Jesus was crucified but later died in India:hypno: Actually I don’t understand

MJ

 

[Sam_777]

Doesn’t compute!

Although I understand the Ahmadi believe Jesus was crucified but later died in India:hypno: Actually I don’t understand

MJ

Orthodox Muslims classifies Ahmadiyya as a "heretic movement".

So I don’t see a point arguing with them…

 

[aspirant]

Orthodox Muslims classifies Ahmadiyya as a "heretic movement".

Without a common measuring stick-- and there’s not one-- there’s really no such thing as orthodox/heterodox among Muslims. Every group considers the others “heretical” simply on the basis of being different. The Ahmadi are a relative minority.

 

[Monergistic]

Without a common measuring stick-- and there’s not one-- there’s really no such thing as orthodox/heterodox among Muslims. Every group considers the others “heretical” simply on the basis of being different. The Ahmadi are a relative minority.

Authority does exist in other religions, you just have to access a way of understanding it that isn’t self-referential.

 

[Sam_777]

The Ahmadi are a relative minority.

Probably 0.0005% (if not less) of Muslims population…

 

[famdigy]

1. Can somebody explain to me (or refer a website) on the different sects or breaks in the Muslim religion? I’m wanting to go further than the Shiites and Sunnis. For example, Christianity has Catholics, Protestants, and possibly Eastern Orthodox as well. But then you’ll have thousands of Protestant sects. Is it the same way with Islam?
2. Which “sect”, or break are the radical Muslims on, and which are the more peaceful Muslims on?

1. Yes, it’s the same way. Among the Shiites we have the 12ers, Isma’ilis, Zaidis. I can’t speak for the later sects but the 12ers have a further division among them. Sunnis have a lot of divisions among them. The major ones are Hanafi, Shafi’i, Maliki, Hanbali. The Hanbali school has another division called the Salafis and within the salafis you have a further division between the moderate salafis and the extremist salafis.
2. In my opinion salafis are the most radical group. On the other hand Sufis, and shias are more peaceful.

 

[MartinJordan]

1. Yes, it’s the same way. Among the Shiites we have the 12ers, Isma’ilis, Zaidis. I can’t speak for the later sects but the 12ers have a further division among them. Sunnis have a lot of divisions among them. The major ones are Hanafi, Shafi’i, Maliki, Hanbali. The Hanbali school has another division called the Salafis and within the salafis you have a further division between the moderate salafis and the extremist salafis.
2. In my opinion salafis are the most radical group. On the other hand Sufis, and shias are more peaceful.

Famdigy. In your estimation how many breakaway Muslim groups are there? Say more than 50?

MJ

 

[famdigy]

Famdigy. In your estimation how many breakaway Muslim groups are there? Say more than 50?

MJ

I don’t have an exact number and I’ve never done the analysis to say for sure one way or another. But there are many many sects. Through time a lot of them disappeared and some others sprang up in their place.

There is a hadith of the prophet (p) in which he says something to the effect of “my nation will be divided into over 70 different sects. All of them will go to hell except for One”

I don’t know if the number 70 is to be taken literal or if it just means many sects. Just as you may say to someone “I told you a 100 times already” The arabs used to use this kind of language to signify many.

 

[MartinJordan]

I don’t have an exact number and I’ve never done the analysis to say for sure one way or another. But there are many many sects. Through time a lot of them disappeared and some others sprang up in their place.

There is a hadith of the prophet (p) in which he says something to the effect of “my nation will be divided into over 70 different sects. All of them will go to hell except for One”

I don’t know if the number 70 is to be taken literal or if it just means many sects. Just as you may say to someone “I told you a 100 times already” The arabs used to use this kind of language to signify many.

Tks. Interesting… I’ve heard something like this.A Muslim of mine mentioned to me Mohammed prophesied there will be 72 sects (must be one of the Hadiths?) I’m puzzled by the words “my nation” though. His nation? Clarify pls

MJ

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

There is a hadith of the prophet (p) in which he says something to the effect of “my nation will be divided into over 70 different sects. All of them will go to hell except for One”

How does the modern Muslim determine for him/herself which of all the sects od Islam is the “One”?

 

[GaryTaylor]

All of them will go to hell except for One"

Which one?

 

[jakasaki]

This is what I found in Abudawud’s translation:

Narrated AbuHurayrah:

The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The Jews were split up into seventy-one or seventy-two sects; and the Christians were split up into seventy one or seventy-two sects; and my community will be split up into seventy-three sects.

(Book #40, Hadith #4579)

And this:

"Abdullah b-Amr reported that the Messenger of Allah said:

There will certainly come over my people what came to the children of Israil [sic] as closely as one sandal resembles another, so that if there was any of them who committed fornication with his mother openly, there will appear someone among my people who will commit that.

**The Israilites were divided into 72 sects and my people will be divided into 73 sects. Each of them will remain in the fire except one sect.

They enquired: O Messenger of Allah! which is that? He said, That one on which I and my companions stand".**

Source: Mishkat I, pp. 169+170

And from the Dictionary of Islam:

"The number has, however, far exceeded the Prophet’s predictions, for the sects of Islam even exceed in number and variety those of the Christian religion.

In order to fulfil the prophecies of Muhammad, the Ghyasu’l-Lughat divides the 73 into six groups of twelve sects (= 72) and adds a number 73, the “najiya” (those being saved), i.e. the Sunnis".

“Dictionary of Islam”, pp. 567-569

 

[MartinJordan]

This is what I found in Abudawud’s translation:

And this:

And from the Dictionary of Islam:

Thanks for this. So my Muslim friend was quite sincere in stating that it was 72 sects. But as you note by the Islam dictionary Mohammed was not correct of that total.

Now can tell me what Mohammed meant by “My Nation”? His Nation?

MJ

 

[jakasaki]

Hi ya there Martin ~

I don’t believe the word of “nation” is mentioned on any of the Islamic quotes I posted.

This quote is states “community”

Narrated AbuHurayrah:

The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The Jews were split up into seventy-one or seventy-two sects; and the Christians were split up into seventy one or seventy-two sects; **and my community **will be split up into seventy-three sects.

(Book #40, Hadith #4579)

And the other one states:

The Israilites were divided into 72 sects and my people will be divided into 73 sects. Each of them will remain in the fire except one sect.

They enquired: O Messenger of Allah! which is that? He said, That one on which I and my companions stand".

Source: Mishkat I, pp. 169+170

 

[Transalosania]

The Definitive Definition is Thus:
From Sect to Sect each varies on the principal of tolerance toward violence, therefore the more violent a society the more liberal the law.