L
lak611
Guest
Yes, formal defection is possible.
Fallen away Catholics are still Catholic Whether the know it or not?
- Status
P
panoikei
Guest
That’s worst than being confused. The fact is that the bishop can refuse it if he beleives you are not doing this knowingly, just a suspicion could cause him to not do so. In 1982 there was supposedly a way that one coudl formaly defect from the Catholic Church…by a public act to rejecting the Church…well. I did that…guess what? It didn’t count. I was still considered Catholic all the years I was away. It didn’t matter how confused I was or that I was Protestant most of my life. from infancy to teens and then from young adult to last year. THANK GOD. It made my family’s journey back with me to the Church much easier. We’re all Catholic now and vocations popping up. PRAISE GOD. He had mercy on me and opened my eyes to what I never saw before last year.
P
panoikei
Guest
Read my previous post. It’s called apostacy.
And the Church has the right … but our culpability may be low…we hope. I get the feeling all my life that many Catholics are trying to act like they’re not culpable because they know this. That’s why we have Catholics that won’t read the scriptures or the Catechisim or attend any classes to clear up confusion. I’d bet that if we took a pole we’d find a very large percentage of Catholics professing to be something else other than Catholic on this forum.
S
Scanner
Guest
This thread was linked as a related thread so I “resurrected it” to answer (“no pun intended” - ba dump dump
)To answer your question, no I didn’t know that but I guess I kind of suspected that.
I am not totally sure what you mean by the word “claim.” If we don’t beleive in the teachings. . .then we are no longer Catholic, no?
This isn’t necessarily some “mark” I am trying to escape. . .it’s a matter of defining oneself. Truthfully, it seems from my visits here that many here are rather annoyed if one calls themself a Catholic (let’s say filling out a hospital form) when really one hasn’t practiced it for years.
Darned if you do claim to be a Catholic. . .darned if you don’t claim to be.
I have taken baptism at birth, communion, confession, and confirmation. I have also taken matrimony but that may or may not be recognized as legitimate by Catholics it was not in a Catholic Church. . . not sure on that one.
Complex question for sure. It’s a combination of factors vs. just one factor. There’s some matters of conscience (absolutely beleiving the Bible is the word of God vs. a collection of tribal law). . .but there’s also just plain laziness too if I am to be 100% honest. I’ll admit the last thing I want to do on a Sun. a.m. is to get the kids out of bed, crack the whip getting them dressed, and go sit in Church for an hour while they fidget after a long week of work at odd hours during the week.
I work Sat. nights into Sun. morning overnight at a hospital every other week often from 7 p.m. to 7 a.m. Church life, at least regular church life, doesn’t seem to practical for me.
I think by being here the last 3-6 months, I have learned a lot. I am currently deciding if this is doable or not.
Well. . .I don’t know if that was with “love and understanding” but I responded so I guess I answered your prayer.
T
thecoach
Guest
Funny, I thought I was baptised into the Mystical Body of Christ, not the Pope’s mystical body. Another interesting example of putting the Church before Christ Himself.
G
Gottle_of_Geer
Guest
They are Catholic unless they are formal heretics, formal schismatics, or formal apostates. Denying dogmas X & Y & Z is not formal heresy - it may not even be material heresy. Even if it is always materially heretical to deny a dogma, it is certainly not always formally heretical, because dogmas are denied for many reasons. Where there is no intention to deny a revealed truth recognised as a revealed truth, there can be no formal heresy.
A lot of what is called heresy may really be one of the following:- disobedience
- nescience
- ignorance
- bad practice
- misunderstanding
- poor catechesis
- one-sided emphasis
- lack of insight
- doctrinal error less than heresy
etc. And there is also the possibility of the same faults in the heresy-spotter: a Catholic who loves the Church & everything it teaches is not thereby freed from mistakes about the attitudes of his fellow-Catholics - if his understanding of theology is non-existent, he is in some danger of spotting heresy in sermons or books where it doesn’t exist. He may even believe what, unbeknownst to him, is in fact a condemned belief; that does not make him a heretic. No one can possibly know, still less understand, the whole Faith - so people should be dealt with gently, not treated as pariahs; for all of us fall short in many ways.
M
Madaglan
Guest
I was baptized and raised Latin Rite Catholic. I received confirmation as a Latin Rite Catholic at about 13. I stopped attending church altogether throughout high school. I didn’t really care much about my faith, and I didn’t really understand the Catholic faith. I didn’t know that Jesus was God (I thought he was simply a great man) and I had no clue that the Mass actually was the Sacrifice of Jesus Christ (I thought we were just offering up bread and wine). I’m not sure how much I understood the Eucharist to be special. I remember having a game in which I would try to keep the host from completely dissolving in my mouth before the priest said “The Mass has ended.”
When I started becoming more interested in the Christian faith it was through reading the Bible and the early Church Fathers. I didn’t understand the differences between churches, but I knew that the Catholic Church was a historic church (unlike the Protestant churches, which I understood to be created in the 16th century). I started attending Mass again, although more just to get back in the Christian game. I started reading books on the Catholic faith, as well as apologetic works (e.g. Karl Keating’s book on Catholics versus Fundamentalist
–that is a fun book to read btw. It’s where I first learned that the Mass is the same Sacrifice as Christ on the Cross.) I kept on reading on the Catholic faith, attending Mass, started to lector, etc. I started to see differences, between traditional Catholicism and the new Catholicism. At this point, I didn’t know where to go next. I had a strong feeling that something was deeply wrong with the new Catholicism, however many the arguments were created in its support. I started reading about the Eastern Churches. I forget when exactly or why. But I started seeing great beauty and truth in the Eastern Churches. I started attending a Ruthenian Catholic church and felt spiritually at home in it, except for the Latinizations and the submission to Rome. Yes, in many ways it was spiritually good, but there was something ill with it as well.Even as I started attending the Ruthenian Catholic church, I was thinking of becoming Orthodox, but in my mind I thought that the more reasonable thing to do would be simply to become Eastern Catholic. That wouldn’t be so risky, and I wouldn’t have to go through “converting” to another faith. Eventually, I started attending an Orthodox church on a regular basis and then asked to be received into the Orthodox Church.
I never felt that I “left” the Catholic Church. The hardest thing for me is to deal with the transition, since most of my friends are Catholic (or Protestant), and I often feel somewhat alone in my faith, even though I realize this is not the case. Orthodoxy, contrary to my own wishes, is not nearly as enjoyable as I thought it would be. It’s not as experientially “dazzling” as I thought it would be. I haven’t felt swept up to the heavens yet. Oh well.
Oh yeah, I’ve been posting on these forums the past six years or so. I feel that I’m fairly well-informed.
D
dessert
Guest
You could always come back to the Eastern Catholic or Latin rite.I was baptized and raised Latin Rite Catholic. I received confirmation as a Latin Rite Catholic at about 13. I stopped attending church altogether throughout high school. I didn’t really care much about my faith, and I didn’t really understand the Catholic faith. I didn’t know that Jesus was God (I thought he was simply a great man) and I had no clue that the Mass actually was the Sacrifice of Jesus Christ (I thought we were just offering up bread and wine). I’m not sure how much I understood the Eucharist to be special. I remember having a game in which I would try to keep the host from completely dissolving in my mouth before the priest said “The Mass has ended.”
When I started becoming more interested in the Christian faith it was through reading the Bible and the early Church Fathers. I didn’t understand the differences between churches, but I knew that the Catholic Church was a historic church (unlike the Protestant churches, which I understood to be created in the 16th century). I started attending Mass again, although more just to get back in the Christian game. I started reading books on the Catholic faith, as well as apologetic works (e.g. Karl Keating’s book on Catholics versus Fundamentalist
**What do you think was ill with it? **
Even as I started attending the Ruthenian Catholic church, I was thinking of becoming Orthodox, but in my mind I thought that the more reasonable thing to do would be simply to become Eastern Catholic. That wouldn’t be so risky, and I wouldn’t have to go through “converting” to another faith. Eventually, I started attending an Orthodox church on a regular basis and then asked to be received into the Orthodox Church.
I never felt that I “left” the Catholic Church. The hardest thing for me is to deal with the transition, since most of my friends are Catholic (or Protestant), and I often feel somewhat alone in my faith, even though I realize this is not the case. Orthodoxy, contrary to my own wishes, is not nearly as enjoyable as I thought it would be. It’s not as experientially “dazzling” as I thought it would be. I haven’t felt swept up to the heavens yet. Oh well.
Oh yeah, I’ve been posting on these forums the past six years or so. I feel that I’m fairly well-informed.
B
Bridget85
Guest
I also left the Roman Catholic Church for the Eastern Orthodox church. I never said anything to the RC churches except to explain to the lady on the phone (when I called to get a copy of relevant documentation) that I’d been attending an Eastern Orthodox church.
Of course, my reception ceremony into the Eastern Orthodox church involved renouncing my past confessions and false doctrines, so I think that probably would be considered a formal defection by most. The RCC doesn’t have the paperwork on it,but the EOC does.
Bridget
Of course, my reception ceremony into the Eastern Orthodox church involved renouncing my past confessions and false doctrines, so I think that probably would be considered a formal defection by most. The RCC doesn’t have the paperwork on it,but the EOC does.
Bridget
R
rick43235
Guest
What does practicing yoga or meditating have to do with being a Christian?
P
Pong
Guest
Duck! Red thing, fish variety, coming our way!
D
dessert
Guest
Some consider Yoga a religion, and what you would be meditating?What does practicing yoga or meditating have to do with being a Christian?
D
dessert
Guest
The RCC is very forgiving and would welcome you back because it is not for keeping account of your sins but if you were to preach heresy that would be a different story, do you think going orthodox is such a great sin? It would maybe be hard to come back and then want to go back to the orthodox, I wonder how they would receive this? So they would have a record of this and send you back return postage
B
Bridget85
Guest
Sorry if I wasn’t clear- I’m not seeking to return to the RCC. I meant that I am Orthodox despite having been Catholic at one time.
D
dessert
Guest
I’m sorry too didn’t mean to encroach on you and I’m not writing anything down for a record or anything. Blessings
B
Bridget85
Guest
You didn’t encroach, I just wasn’t sure if I was being clear and didn’t want to give the wrong impression.
S
SIA
Guest
I must beg to differ. This is absolutely untrue by my very own desires and actions. I did not fall away from the Roman church, I left it in good conscience to do so. I was Baptised yes but it doesn’t matter from what denomination. Even Catholics accept Baptism from any denomination. It doesn’t automatically make you Catholic I don’t care what anyone says about it. It is rather absurd to try and explain how one remains Catholic even when they choose not to be anymore.
A
AlessandraRose
Guest
What if a catholic man leaves and turns into a Muslim?
Is he still catholic in the end?
Is he still catholic in the end?
I suppose one could, although it wouldn’t do anything except maybe fly into the bin. The Church has no procedure for leaving it; fallen away Catholics can call themselves whatever they like- they’re still Catholic though. The Catholic Church is a bit like the Hotel California…
V
vocatio
Guest
Islam teaches that there is only one God… It does not teach that God is 3 persons… and a few other things.
Protestants do not accept the Catholic Church as being the one true church. They typically accept the bible only. and a few other things too.
The Catholic Church teaches that once you are baptized, even if you are not raised in Catholicism / the Church, you are always Catholic. That never has changed and never will. It’s the same as being baptized. Once you are baptized you soul is permanently marked for ever. Confirmation is the same, Holy Matrimony and Holy Orders are the same. You can never do away with it.
My mother took my little brother and I’m not sure if I was included in that. But she took him at least to wash off that “dirty papist” baptism by giving him a good old fashioned Protestant baptism. True story. My brother told it to me again this past year. I’ve heard it by several people in my family. He does not practice any faith. But whether he or my older brother that went to the Episcapol Church [not committed there either] are and forever will be Catholic. My older brother is no longer with us and chose his path forever. I only hope that upon his hanging there as he strangled to death he had enough time to repent for such a selfish action…
So Stop being offended so much as to hope that you are truly following what you beleive, because if you do really know better then you will have to answer for your actions. We can only hope that God will not spew you out as scripture puts it. I hope not. I have much of my family to pray for that have rejected the Catholic faith. The irony is that I returned with my once very fundamentalist evangelical anti-Catholic wife. Fortunately I never hurled too many insults towards Catholicism.
Protestants do not accept the Catholic Church as being the one true church. They typically accept the bible only. and a few other things too.
The Catholic Church teaches that once you are baptized, even if you are not raised in Catholicism / the Church, you are always Catholic. That never has changed and never will. It’s the same as being baptized. Once you are baptized you soul is permanently marked for ever. Confirmation is the same, Holy Matrimony and Holy Orders are the same. You can never do away with it.
My mother took my little brother and I’m not sure if I was included in that. But she took him at least to wash off that “dirty papist” baptism by giving him a good old fashioned Protestant baptism. True story. My brother told it to me again this past year. I’ve heard it by several people in my family. He does not practice any faith. But whether he or my older brother that went to the Episcapol Church [not committed there either] are and forever will be Catholic. My older brother is no longer with us and chose his path forever. I only hope that upon his hanging there as he strangled to death he had enough time to repent for such a selfish action…
So Stop being offended so much as to hope that you are truly following what you beleive, because if you do really know better then you will have to answer for your actions. We can only hope that God will not spew you out as scripture puts it. I hope not. I have much of my family to pray for that have rejected the Catholic faith. The irony is that I returned with my once very fundamentalist evangelical anti-Catholic wife. Fortunately I never hurled too many insults towards Catholicism.
- Status