Fallen away Catholics must return in order to reach heaven

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I understand that the question of a non-Catholic who in their heart seeks the true faith may reach heaven without becoming Catholic, but I have a relative (sister) who left the Church many years ago and says she now believes that she can get to heaven as a converted protestant who has “Found Christ.” It seems to me the Church had a strong position on this situation and I need some information about it. A:shrug:nyone know where to direct me?
 
What exactly is the definition of apostasy? I have a hard time with this idea because my dad is now an Episcopal. He didn’t want to go through an annulment process with my mom and at the same time wanted to re-marry. I don’t like it, but at the same time, I’m not God and I have a hard time believing that my Dad will go to Hell for this. There are much worse sins like murder associated with organized crime, grand theft auto with vehicular homicide in the process, and sex with animals to name some examples. I mean, really. If somebody (like me) wants to be a good person and go along with the church’s teachings to a T, then that’s great. But for those who “can’t hang,” it looks to me like God would understand.

Tracy
 
but I have a relative (sister) who left the Church many years ago and says she now believes that she can get to heaven as a converted protestant who has “Found Christ.” It seems to me the Church had a strong position on this situation and I need some information about it. A:shrug:nyone know where to direct me?
I think people really need to be careful when they have no idea what is in a person’s heart.
She may very well have “found Christ” in this other church. She may have been converted. While I was raised Catholic, the only Catholics I knew, were NOT converted. They did not live their lives for Christ. I knew alcoholic, abusive, pro-abort, homosexual, adulterous, agnostic Catholics, and some of these were priests. And they were shameless.

When I left the Catholic Church as a teenager I did it because I loved the Lord. The priests at my university were not holy or leading students to live holy lives. I wanted to love God and seek Him in spirit and in truth. The Catholic Church in America (the people who represent it) in many places — has been in shambles.

I left the Church to be with holy people and to worship God and learn more about Him. Before the internet I didn’t know that there were real Catholics.

Only God knows the state of her soul. That’s all I’m trying to say.
 
I understand that the question of a non-Catholic who in their heart seeks the true faith may reach heaven without becoming Catholic, but I have a relative (sister) who left the Church many years ago and says she now believes that she can get to heaven as a converted protestant who has “Found Christ.” It seems to me the Church had a strong position on this situation and I need some information about it. A:shrug:nyone know where to direct me?
From the document, Lumen Gentium, 14,
“Whosoever, therefore,knowing that the Catholic Church was made necessary by Christ, would refuse to enter or to remain in it, could not be saved.”

I think the key word in this sentence is ‘knowing’.
 
What exactly is the definition of apostasy?
The complete renunciation of the Catholic Faith by a baptized person who had professed it. An apostate incurs excommunication, ipso facto, from the Church, and is refused Christian burial unless he repents. [according to the NAB dictionary]
I have a hard time with this idea because my dad is now an Episcopal. He didn’t want to go through an annulment process with my mom and at the same time wanted to re-marry. I don’t like it, but at the same time, I’m not God and I have a hard time believing that my Dad will go to Hell for this. There are much worse sins like murder associated with organized crime, grand theft auto with vehicular homicide in the process, and sex with animals to name some examples. I mean, really. If somebody (like me) wants to be a good person and go along with the church’s teachings to a T, then that’s great. But for those who “can’t hang,” it looks to me like God would understand.
I would argue that there are worse things than murder, like torture and child abuse, especially by mothers. But that’s just me. The thing with your dad is that he turned his back on God by refusing to submit to Him. Mortal sin. He has not repented of it, chose an “church” that is more convenient, that tells him what he wants to hear. You have to pray for his conversion. I understand, my dad’s in the same boat (only not in the Episcopalian group). I don’t like the truth of it either, but denying the truth will only guarantee that he doesn’t convert and that I may damn myself for putting my likes over God’s law. We have to pray for their conversion, that they confess and repent before death.

Anyway, Don:

God knows the soul, we cannot know for sure where she is going because we do not know what her relationship with Him was like before and now, her reasons for leaving, her reasons for not coming back, etc. There are a lot of factors, but you still have to do your part to bring her back, to let her know that it’s not okay to remain where she is, that Christ established a Church, and that is the Catholic Church. How you evangelize to her will have to be taken up with prayer, as we all do not respond to the same converting technique, so to speak. Pray for her conversion and salvation, and speak to her as the Holy Ghost inspires you. Oh, and don’t scandelize His Church by being a bad example, this is a big one! You’ll both be in my prayers, God Bless.

Tracy, you and your dad will also be in my prayers.
 
I understand that the question of a non-Catholic who in their heart seeks the true faith may reach heaven without becoming Catholic, …
Not so.

“There is one Universal Church of the faithful, outside of which there is absolutely no salvation.” (Innocent III ex cathedra, Fourth Council of the Lateran, 1215)

“Furthermore, we declare, we proclaim, we define that it is absolutely necessary for salvation that every human creature be subject to the Roman Pontiff.” (Boniface VIII ex cathedra, Unam Sanctam, 1302)

“[The Holy Roman Church] firmly believes, professes and preaches that all those who are outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans but also Jews or heretics and schismatics, cannot share in eternal life and will go into the everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless they are joined to the Catholic Church before the end of their lives; … and that nobody can be saved, no matter how much he has given away in alms and even if he has shed his blood in the name of Christ, unless he has persevered in the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church.” (Eugene IV ex cathedra, Council of Florence, 1442)

Don L; 4910554 said:
… but I have a relative (sister) who left the Church many years ago and says she now believes that she can get to heaven as a converted protestant who has “Found Christ.” It seems to me the Church had a strong position on this situation and I need some information about it. A:shrug:nyone know where to direct me?

Your sister has lost Christ, not found Him. 😦 Be assured of my prayers for her.
 
and that nobody can be saved, no matter how much he has given away in alms and even if he has shed his blood in the name of Christ, unless he has persevered in the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church." (Eugene IV ex cathedra, Council of Florence, 1442)
.
did you add** ex cathedra**, or was that part of the articles? Do you understand the usage of the term “ex cathedra?”

Catholic teaching, the Magisterium, and the councils can stand alone without adding our own interpretive marks.
 
GRACEANDGLORY

I was under the impression that the Church has only spoken ex cathredra on a couple of limited occasions??? “The Assumption of Mary” may have been one?
 
Apostasy is a mortal sin. If she does not repent before she dies then she cannot die with grace.

Pray for her and don’t forget the green scapular devotion
From the OP, it appears his sister has become a Protestant. An apostate is one who rejects the Christian religion, and not just several or many doctrines, as Protestants have.
 
Membership of the Church is necessary for all men for salvation. (De fide.)
 
From the OP, it appears his sister has become a Protestant. An apostate is one who rejects the Christian religion, and not just several or many doctrines, as Protestants have.
To deny one article of the faith is in principle to deny all of them as by denying one you are denying God who revealed them.
 
Apostasy is a mortal sin. If she does not repent before she dies then she cannot die with grace.

Pray for her and don’t forget the green scapular devotion
I love how this reply beautifully sums up the Church’s historical teaching on this matter and from there the thread degrades into various iterations of “But that’s sooo mean!”

Rejecting the Catholic Faith is serious business. Which is why, instead of trying to justify reasons for leaving, we should start praying for the return of those who have left. I’m sure all of us have at least one family member or friend who could benefit more from our prayers than our excuses
 
The complete renunciation of the Catholic Faith by a baptized person who had professed it. An apostate incurs excommunication, ipso facto, from the Church, and is refused Christian burial unless he repents. [according to the NAB dictionary]

Protestants are Christians. They do their own burials. What’s wrong with that? Better that than an atheist burial, right? My grandmother didn’t even go to church, so she ended up being buried by a Moravian minister just because my mom liked him.

I would argue that there are worse things than murder, like torture and child abuse, especially by mothers. But that’s just me. The thing with your dad is that he turned his back on God by refusing to submit to Him. Mortal sin. He has not repented of it, chose an “church” that is more convenient, that tells him what he wants to hear. You have to pray for his conversion. I understand, my dad’s in the same boat (only not in the Episcopalian group). I don’t like the truth of it either, but denying the truth will only guarantee that he doesn’t convert and that I may damn myself for putting my likes over God’s law. We have to pray for their conversion, that they confess and repent before death.

What good does it do to pray for somebody if you’re pretty sure they aren’t going to change their minds? I’ve had a terrible life here lately. Sometimes I humorously think to myself that I’m going through all these bad things because my family is a bunch of “heathens” and my suffering is for them. Didn’t Padre Pio say that, that your suffering may actually be for somebody else? Oh well, if I pray for them, it isn’t very intense. I don’t have much hope for them cause they’re stubborn. Them=my mom, my dad, my brother, my cousins, my whole family. I think I’m the only practicing Catholic left in my family. Sad.

Tracy, you and your dad will also be in my prayers.
Thanks, but like I said, I hope you are not wasting your time. 😦
 
Back to square one. We are not God and can not know the hearts and minds of other human beings. The Church’s teaching is clear for me. If I would turn my back on the Church, I would be in serious trouble. But for another human being, fortunately, I can leave this to the judgement and mercy of God. We must neither presume on the mercy of God nor should we presume on His judgement.
 
I understand that the question of a non-Catholic who in their heart seeks the true faith may reach heaven without becoming Catholic, but I have a relative (sister) who left the Church many years ago and says she now believes that she can get to heaven as a converted protestant who has “Found Christ.” It seems to me the Church had a strong position on this situation and I need some information about it. A:shrug:nyone know where to direct me?
Welcome to the forum, you just get in there and get her right back.👍
They proseltyzed her.
Read Patrick Madrid, Search and Rescue.
Pray with her.
 
Back to square one. We are not God and can not know the hearts and minds of other human beings. The Church’s teaching is clear for me. If I would turn my back on the Church, I would be in serious trouble. But for another human being, fortunately, I can leave this to the judgement and mercy of God. We must neither presume on the mercy of God nor should we presume on His judgement.
True, as long as that line of reasoning doesn’t follow to the conclusion that we shouldn’t be clear and precise about what the Church has always taught about the consequences of abandoning the Truth.

I’m not referring directly to Kestral’s post, but in general this seems to be the problem with many of the “we aren’t God” type responses.
 
Are protestants, as they claim, members of the Universal Church?

What is the one, holy, catholic, and apostolic church? The Episcopalians (the ones who don’t cross their fingers during the Creed) say that they believe in this when they recite substantially the same Creeds we do.
 
did you add** ex cathedra**, or was that part of the articles? Do you understand the usage of the term “ex cathedra?”

Catholic teaching, the Magisterium, and the councils can stand alone without adding our own interpretive marks.
The mentions that these are ex cathedra declarations are my own, but are not interpretative remarks, since it is a fact which cannot be the matter of dispute (see Vatican I, Catholic Encyclopedia etc).
 
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