False Prophets the most used comeback!

[Servant19]

The bahai solution has worked so well hasn’t it, you have stoppped world hunger, achieved a one world government headed by the house of universal justice and all crime and evil has been stomped out… or are you just fantasizing?

Your criticisng Christianity for offering no solution when the solution Christianity offers is quite profound, accept Christ. Thats all there is to it, Christianity isn’t firstly about making this world perfect, its about perfecting yourself and as it just so happens most people (including alot of Christians) don’t want to perfect themselves.

The proof of this “wondrous System” which Baha’u’llah has introduced to the world is the worldwide Baha’i community.

Let us not forget that there are less than 10 million Baha’is in the world, and less than 200 years of implementation of Baha’u’llahs world redeeming principles.

Please do not think that I am criticising Christianity by saying what I did. It is a reality that Christianity is about a Person, and personal salvation. This is not a criticism, this is a reality. It is also a reality that Christianity has received no guidance from Jesus on creating a Global System of governance.

Even a brief review of the current global climate will manifest a clear need for a change in global governance. The injustices are shocking. And it is this “wondrous System” which is the new Jerusalem that Baha’u’llah will invest all His adherents with the Holy Spirit for its construction, and the proof is the global Baha’i community

.

 

[Servant19]

The subject is false prophets, now suddenly you speak of the woes of a fallen world?
God came to die for an evil inclined and degenerate world, his blood covers all those
who seek his mercy through Jesus Christ. That is the standard rule, God works also
in other ways, can save those who don’t know, but for those who reject that Jesus is
the Son of God, coeternal with the Father & Holy Spirit, One God forever, who came
in the flesh among us to suffer for our salvation just might not make the cut.

I believe in all of those things as a Baha’i, no problems here…

What difference does it make, saving all those starving children, if I go
to Hell for not telling you that “Baha’u’llah is the Father incarnate” is a
very blasphemous statement to make?

Why is it blasphemous?
Christianity claims Jesus is God. Whats the difference?

Lastly, you would rather avoid going to hell, even if all those children die? You think Jesus would do that?

I would rather souls be saved than children fed, nothing wrong with feeding all them
hungry kids throughout the world, but that is no call for neglect on Jesus Christ, as
it is he who purchased for us the rewards of eternal life, offering it to us freely, how-
ever, we have to make the right choice. Is it Jesus, who is the Way, the Truth, and
the Life, or do we choose to believe that all major religions are right and follow the
false prophet called Baha’u’llah?

Souls are saved by the “**I **am” …the “I am” does not have a name but is manifested in all religions.

Faith PLUS works.

Faith in the “I am” saves but only if complemented by works
The works for this Day and Age relates to the True Prophet for this Day and Age, the Manifester of the “I am”

…and guess what, those works will bring about the “unification of the human race” eternally, and will end all human suffering eternally, and will end all death (spiritual death) eternally

Its really very simple…

.

 

[Servant19]

How are women subordinate to men in the Catholic Church, i.e., the Church teaches they are equal in dignity to men. There is no discrimination towards women, not unless you take a very modernized and politicized view of the Church.

Thats correct Josie

I think Catholic marriages are a wonderful demonstration of gender equality. I see no submissiveness specific to the wife. I see both husband AND wife are submissive to God. The way it should be…

But this is not reflective of the admonitions of Paul.

I believe Christianity has relativized this admonition of Paul towards modernistic gender equality, and rightly so!!



.

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

As much as this may concern you, but Jesus was “created” within the womb of His mother, Blessed Mary.

Begotten, not created. Jesus is coeternal with God the Father (who is NOT Baha’u’llah).

When Jesus refers to Himself as “**I **am” He is referring to the same “non-physical” identity that Baha’u’llah is referring to… …“Verily **I **am God!” and again the same identity that Lord Krishna tapped into when He announced “… **I **come to this world from Age to Age”…

It seems as though you are focusing solely on the word “I”, in which case one
could connect ANYTHING to ANYTHING in the world of religion. God said that
I AM THAT I AM, making him distinguished from all other Pagan gods around
the world. That was kinda weak.

My friend, any theology can attest to the fact that if it is able to be worded, then God is beyond and external to that. So to ascribe “eternity” to God is a theologically bankrupt statement, simply because God is beyond ANY human description…

Look, God is without beginning and God is without end. We call that “Eternal.”
“Eternal” is a word that can be applied to no apart from God. It is God who is
the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, he who was, is, and is
to come, not a created finite man called Jesus (but the Divine Creator who is
called Jesus), not the Bab, not even Baha’u’llah, but God alone.

How exactly?

By rejecting the Truth explained above.

I never said He did

But did you not use the “Why Call Me Good” story of Jesus and the rich man
to demonstrate that Jesus is not God, but distinct from the Divine Creator?

I cant be reading into the text if I didn’t ever say what you are assuming that I said. I never said that Jesus said “I am not God”

You never said it, right, okay, but what were you implying then before?

If you look back, you isolated the passage. You introduced the passage

I assumed (bad idea) that you would have remembered everything shown to you
in previous threads that say that Jesus is God. I figured then (another bad idea)
that the context was already there in your mind.

You should do both. Isolate AND read within the context of the whole. The Word of God has Truths within every single letter, even in isolation…

You can’t really do both. I don’t so much deny the potency of God’s Word,
but I don’t believe think we can just pick and choose as in a cafeteria. The
The Scriptures must be taken as a whole, as it defines itself and all within.

Which is why I never said that Jesus was not good. He was good, He was wonderful, but the definition of good changes with circumstances and periods.

If you’re talking about SECULAR goodness, disregarding what
God counts as Good, then you may have a point of sorts.

When Jesus destroyed the market place outside the Temple, was that a good thing?

YES! It wasn’t just outside the Temple, it was inside too I believe (depending
on what you consider in and out). If I broke into your house while you were a-
way, and turned it into a place for my business. Would you not be so upset?
Similarly, people had turned GOD’S HOUSE on earth into a den of thieves.

Even today, if you go to a market place and destroy other peoples property, you would get arrested, and rightly so!

Well just remember then: THAT WAS GOD’S HOUSE! It was a holy place of prayer
and sacrifice, and the Israelites had turned it into a den of thieves. Do you not have
any regard of how God feels about that? We sinful and evil creatures invading the
House of God and using it for our personal monetary benefit?

Jesus DEFINES good with His life for that period
Abraham also DEFINED good with His life, for that period

Jesus did, but not for THAT period but for all time.

How do you know that it was not the will of God at that time to populate the world, and utilising multiple wives was the way to do it? Ultimately good is what is pleasing in the sight of God, and you don’t really know what was pleasing to the sight of God 6000 years ago, so saying that Abraham sinned is premature conclusion-making.

Let’s take then, and look at the very beginning. Whether or not one
takes the literal interpretation of Genesis, we read that God made
one man named Adam and gave him ONE woman whose name
was later “Eve.” Where are all of Adam’s other wives? Did God
not want a populated world? Why only One Wife? Because
THAT is the way which God wants it to be.

No, I do not see a problem at all Judas. The passage speaks for itself. It CLEARLY says that in comparison to God, Jesus is not good, and rightly so, He humbled Himself to being a mere human being.
Its really not difficult language at all and does not require scholastic referencing to New Testament Greek rhetoric.

“CLEARLY”?! Nothing in the text says that Jesus is not good in
comparison to God, which is you again reading into the text.

Maybe, just maybe what my friend? The rich man would think that Jesus is God too?
There are many people on earth who are labelled “good”. By simply saying that “Only God is good” means now that they are God?

No, the context in which Jesus speaks says that ONLY GOD is GOOD. You can’t then
equivocate and say “Well there are many called ‘good’,” because that is completely ig-
noring what Jesus was talking about. You, me, everybody on this earth, are all wicked
and sinful people who deserve nothing but to be destroyed and forgotten (I added me in
there too, fyi). ONLY, in the way Jesus meant, GOD IS GOOD.

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

I believe in all of those things as a Baha’i, no problems here…

Except in the Baha’i Faith, Jesus is not eternal, Jesus is not the Creator,
Jesus is not the only created man who is the Alpha and the Omega, it is
not the same Jesus or even the same God.

Why is it blasphemous?
Christianity claims Jesus is God. Whats the difference?

Because the Father is in Heaven only, dwells in unapproachable Light,
and no man has ever seen, NOR CAN SEE, the Father. That is the en-
tire point, which you are painfully missing, of Jesus coming in the flesh,
to be the Visible Image of the Invisible God (the Father). In Baha’i, God
the Father is suddenly no longer God but a man who came to the Earth,
too wives, had children, had sin in his life, etc etc etc. That is just utter
blasphemy, and you really really should not hold that position.

Lastly, you would rather avoid going to hell, even if all those children die? You think Jesus would do that?

I don’t have to be Baha’i, as you said, to help those children, but that isn’t the issue.
If God gave me ONLY ONE option, (1) to feed those starving children with bread, or
(2) to feed those starving children with the Word of God (ie preaching to them), only
one here is worth anything of those two, the Word of God.

Now would you turn aside God, put something above God in terms of importance,
just to do something that you think is worth it like feeding poor starving children?
If the answer is yes, that is just scary, because remember, we are talking about
eternity here. One Billion years from now it won’t matter what we did, we will ei-
ther be in the Presence of God or the fires of Hell FOREVER!

Fortunately, my options are not exclusive to on the two you provided
above, so I can both help the poor and serve the God who died for me.

 

[Servant19]

I’m so very tired tonight Judas. We seem to be talking past each other friend

There are so many misunderstandings in your post it just daunts me to address them.

For now, would you mind giving me a reference to the statement that you made:

Because the Father is in Heaven only, dwells in unapproachable Light,
and no man has ever seen, NOR CAN SEE, the Father.

Thanks

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

…For now, would you mind giving me a reference to the statement that you made:

Thanks

1 Timothy 6 (Best read whole chapter, it isn’t so long).

 

[josie_L]

Thats correct Josie

I think Catholic marriages are a wonderful demonstration of gender equality. I see no submissiveness specific to the wife. I see both husband AND wife are submissive to God. The way it should be…

But this is not reflective of the admonitions of Paul.

I believe Christianity has relativized this admonition of Paul towards modernistic gender equality, and rightly so!!

The Catholic Church hasn’t relativised anything, i.e., the husband is still the head of the family, but he must treat his wife like Christ would his bride, the Church (those are big shoes to fill).

p.s. If I could meet a man who could love me in the same way Christ loved/s the Church, then as a woman I have no problem making my husband the head of the family.

 

[josie_L]

I’m so very tired tonight Judas. We seem to be talking past each other friend

There are so many misunderstandings in your post it just daunts me to address them.

For now, would you mind giving me a reference to the statement that you made:

Thanks

Have you read the Bible, because if you haven’t, then you’ll have problems understanding each other?

 

[IgnatianPhilo]

It is false because homosexuality goes against the creation of humanity in terms of mans purpose and use for the reproductive system and organs.

Therefore homosexuality will ALWAYS be “against the grain” of nature.

To ascribe this extremity of relativism to the Baha’i Faith is thoughtless and unfair

.

And at one time in the revelation celibacy was better than being married (Read the Apostle Paul) and that order of creation has changed. At one time Polygamy was acceptable and now isn’t. Your God could do this despite all your denials. Your Just like the Christians who said their religion would be forever and were overtaken by islam, instead of embracing the future you embrace a backward notion of the past. (I am speaking as a hypothetical future follower of the future manifestation).

 

[IgnatianPhilo]

The proof of this “wondrous System” which Baha’u’llah has introduced to the world is the worldwide Baha’i community.

Let us not forget that there are less than 10 million Baha’is in the world, and less than 200 years of implementation of Baha’u’llahs world redeeming principles.

Please do not think that I am criticising Christianity by saying what I did. It is a reality that Christianity is about a Person, and personal salvation. This is not a criticism, this is a reality. It is also a reality that Christianity has received no guidance from Jesus on creating a Global System of governance.

Even a brief review of the current global climate will manifest a clear need for a change in global governance. The injustices are shocking. And it is this “wondrous System” which is the new Jerusalem that Baha’u’llah will invest all His adherents with the Holy Spirit for its construction, and the proof is the global Baha’i community

.

Let us not forget there are aboutthe same number of Jehovah’s witnesses, mormons and other groups as well. Your numbers nor your geographical spread prove divine authority but rather the nature of man who rebels against God whenever the chance opens itself.

Now I dissagree in the first place that one needs a system more than living in fellowship in the Messiah Jesus. this is the basis, this is the highest goal, the world may embrace any form of government it wants and it will embrace any form of government it wants to either persecute or lessen the effect of religion.

TO think perfection lies in mankinds efforts to change the government in this world, which you think is the fulfillment of the gospel is the utter opposite of the gospel, that gospel meaning to abandon this world and live for Christ alone. We may effect change certaintly if it is good, but that is not the end all.

You will not achieve your ends despites your faith because you refuse to recognise people are too different and too rebellious to live according to your utopia.

 

[Servant19]

1 Timothy 6 (Best read whole chapter, it isn’t so long).

Hi Judas,

1 Timothy 6 says:

God, the blessed and only Ruler, the King of kings and Lord of lords, 16 who alone is immortal and who lives in unapproachable light, whom no one has seen or can see (NIV)

He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords, 16 who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen. (KJV)

Actually I can put any translation you like, but none of them ever mentions the Father. the father is not mentioned in the whole chapter, Judas. Is it the right reference you gave?

It talks about God.

.

 

[Servant19]

And at one time in the revelation celibacy was better than being married (Read the Apostle Paul) and that order of creation has changed. At one time Polygamy was acceptable and now isn’t. Your God could do this despite all your denials. Your Just like the Christians who said their religion would be forever and were overtaken by islam, instead of embracing the future you embrace a backward notion of the past. (I am speaking as a hypothetical future follower of the future manifestation).

I dont understand therefore, Ignatian.

Does the Christian Faith prefer celibacy over marriage or the other way around?

.

 

[IgnatianPhilo]

I dont understand therefore, Ignatian.

Does the Christian Faith prefer celibacy over marriage or the other way around?

.

The apostle Paul is quite clear that celibacy is the higher calling. Now if such a rule which was the rule for the new testament era and then subsequently changed by God could be changed when islam came back, I see no reason as to how you can object to Homosexuality being embraced by your God in the future. What is after all natural in your worldview? The natural cannot change you seem to argue, yet clearly it has. At one time Polygamy was acceptable, then with the New testament it was discouraged and with islam encouraged and now with bahai discouraged. What is more natural? I think by nature man wants to have more children so why not have more than one wife? The quran accepts polygamy and the bahai seemingly reject it.

Theres no consistency in your appeal to nature.

 

[Servant19]

Let us not forget there are aboutthe same number of Jehovah’s witnesses, mormons and other groups as well. Your numbers nor your geographical spread prove divine authority but rather the nature of man who rebels against God whenever the chance opens itself.

I never said that Ignatian. Our numbers is not a reflection of divine authority.

I said that its because of the FEWNESS of our numbers that the proper effects of Baha’u’llah’s world-redeeming principles cannot be felt as potently as they shoud. This was in response to you accusing us of not eliminating world poverty etc, remember.

Now I dissagree in the first place that one needs a system more than living in fellowship in the Messiah Jesus. this is the basis, this is the highest goal, the world may embrace any form of government it wants and it will embrace any form of government it wants to either persecute or lessen the effect of religion.

Dear friend, if it was simply fellowship with Jesus that will eliminate global poverty, then why is it so prevalent.
Let us not forget the valuable lessons history provides from the actions of those who had fellowship with Jesus.

The system needs to be changed so that institutionalized tyranny will never occur again. No fellowship with Jesus can prevent the tyrannical actions of others.

A system of government CAN, and WILL

TO think perfection lies in mankinds efforts to change the government in this world, which you think is the fulfillment of the gospel is the utter opposite of the gospel, that gospel meaning to abandon this world and live for Christ alone. We may effect change certaintly if it is good, but that is not the end all.

As I said before, Baha’is are not “mere human beings”, and Baha’i institutions are not “mere institutions”, the institutions especially are the harbingers of God’s grace to mankind and the handiwork of the Holy Spirit.

You will not achieve your ends despites your faith because you refuse to recognise people are too different and too rebellious to live according to your utopia.

Can you show me one instance where this has occurred please?
If you are referring to those that wish to challenge the Divine Institutions’ authority within the Baha’i Faith, then you are correct. The guidance is clear and unequivocal, no “individual” can ever claim authority in the Baha’i Faith

The Baha’i Faith is about collboration not individual glory.

.

 

[Servant19]

The apostle Paul is quite clear that celibacy is the higher calling. Now if such a rule which was the rule for the new testament era and then subsequently changed by God could be changed when islam came back, I see no reason as to how you can object to Homosexuality being embraced by your God in the future. What is after all natural in your worldview? The natural cannot change you seem to argue, yet clearly it has. At one time Polygamy was acceptable, then with the New testament it was discouraged and with islam encouraged and now with bahai discouraged. What is more natural? I think by nature man wants to have more children so why not have more than one wife? The quran accepts polygamy and the bahai seemingly reject it.

Theres no consistency in your appeal to nature.

Natural means using the reproductive organs for what they were created for.

If celibacy was the higher calling, how then was the world to populate itself?

Polygamy was never encouraged in Islam…show me the reference please…

.

 

[Judas_Thaddeus]

I dont understand therefore, Ignatian.
Does the Christian Faith prefer celibacy over marriage or the other way around?

Well let’s find the answer using the Bible: Now when Jesus had finished these sayings, he went away from Galilee and entered the region of Judea beyond the Jordan; and large crowds followed him, and he healed them there. And Pharisees came up to him and tested him by asking, “Is it lawful to divorce one’s wife for any cause?” He answered, “Have you not read that he who made them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one’? So they are no longer two but one. What therefore God has joined together, let not man put asunder.” They said to him, “Why then did Moses command one to give a certificate of divorce, and to put her away?” He said to them, “For your hardness of heart Moses allowed you to divorce your wives, but from the beginning it was not so. And I say to you: whoever divorces his wife, except for unchastity, and marries another, commits adultery; and he who marries a divorced woman, commits adultery.”The disciples said to him, “If such is the case of a man with his wife, it is not expedient to marry.” But he said to them, “Not all men can receive this precept, but only those to whom it is given. For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. He who is able to receive this, let him receive it.”
– (Matthew 19:1-12)
Including the words of Paul:I wish that all were as I myself am. But each has his own special gift from God, one of one kind and one of another. To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is well for them to remain single as I do. But if they cannot exercise self-control, they should marry. For it is better to marry than to be aflame with passion.
– (1 Corinthians 7:7-9)

 

[IgnatianPhilo]

I never said that Ignatian. Our numbers is not a reflection of divine authority.

I said that its because of the FEWNESS of our numbers that the proper effects of Baha’u’llah’s world-redeeming principles cannot be felt as potently as they shoud. This was in response to you accusing us of not eliminating world poverty etc, remember.

Dear friend, if it was simply fellowship with Jesus that will eliminate global poverty, then why is it so prevalent.
Let us not forget the valuable lessons history provides from the actions of those who had fellowship with Jesus.

The system needs to be changed so that institutionalized tyranny will never occur again. No fellowship with Jesus can prevent the tyrannical actions of others.

A system of government CAN, and WILL

As I said before, Baha’is are not “mere human beings”, and Baha’i institutions are not “mere institutions”, the institutions especially are the harbingers of God’s grace to mankind and the handiwork of the Holy Spirit.

Can you show me one instance where this has occurred please?
If you are referring to those that wish to challenge the Divine Institutions’ authority within the Baha’i Faith, then you are correct. The guidance is clear and unequivocal, no “individual” can ever claim authority in the Baha’i Faith

The Baha’i Faith is about collboration not individual glory.

.

See thats the problem, you think global illness and such will be illiminated when it will not. Human nature is not as pliable to good as you like and i think this really does come from two different worldviews. You think everyone will be saved, I know everyone will not be saved by the words of Jesus, that most will go through the wide gate into destruction, into death. you think you can change the world and make it perfect? No you cannot, people are far more complicated and far more fallen than you realise, not irredeemable but they will never be as perfect as you think they can become.

No governemnt, especially one government controlling everything can be trusted, all empires fall, all nations at a certain point fail, that is one fact about history that one cannot deny. The islamists won’t accept bahai, the secularists won’t accept your vision, the Christians will at every point resist this blending of societies you imagine and I cannot speak for how other nations and groups might react. I look at the world and I see it failing, we are to live in this world suffering while doing good yes, as much as good as we can, but in the end it will get worse than better by the efforts of people who reject God, like you. I really do think if bahai ever became as powerful as to dominate the entire world you would be just as tyrannical as the muslims or North korea as I think a fundmantalist Christian state would be.

 

[IgnatianPhilo]

Natural means using the reproductive organs for what they were created for.

If celibacy was the higher calling, how then was the world to populate itself?

Polygamy was never encouraged in Islam…show me the reference please…

.

Servant, your challanging the revelation of the time of the new testament. You must remember that it was the higher calling or do you deny the new testament?

Corinthians 7: 5 Do not deprive each other except perhaps by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control. 6 I say this as a concession, not as a command. 7 I wish that all of you were as I am. But each of you has your own gift from God; one has this gift, another has that.

Notice marriage is a concession, not the highest calling, celibacy and the total dedication to God is a higher and prestigious position than the married. Paul hwoever is not a gnostic who denies the good of marriage and he affirms totally that it is good, so there is no danger people running out and if everyone with christian virtue became celibate I dare say Christ would come back and usher in the kingdom of heaven on earth. But human nature is too weak for everyone to become celibate and I doubt such a thing happening.

This is the Christian view on celibacy.

Corinthians 7 25 Now about virgins: I have no command from the Lord, but I give a judgment as one who by the Lord’s mercy is trustworthy. 26 Because of the present crisis, I think that it is good for a man to remain as he is. 27 Are you pledged to a woman? Do not seek to be released. Are you free from such a commitment? Do not look for a wife. 28 But if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. But those who marry will face many troubles in this life, and I want to spare you this.

So if you want to object to the revelation given at the time Of Jesus which was the rule for the WORLD in your own religion you have conceded the point that nature changes, that God changes his expectations on people. But you will have to ultimately deny the authority of the apostle Paul on this matter, you will demean him and say he was mistaken in his fervour and you will say the true teaching of the time was to be married. You are of course wrong because Jesus told those who had become eunuchs (not literally) for the kingdom’s sake that they are not to be condemned.

Now polygamy is certaintly allowed in islam, the generation of followers of muhammad by many wives I think many muslims would not object to. If encouraged is the wrong word, then the right word was allowed but now it is disallowed in bahai. So heres the pattern according to bahai.

(Time of Adam) Unknown marriage-> (Time of Moses and Abraham and etc) Polygamous marriage, monogamous marriage, levitical marriage, celibacy was allowed-> (time of Jesus) monogamous marriage and or the higher calling to celibacy-> (time of Muhammad) Polygamous marriage, Monogamous marriage, celibacy in islam is practically unknown-> (time of Mirza Hussain) Monogamous marriage with celibacy deeply discouraged.

Where is your appeal to nature? What nature?

Where is your appeal to nature here?

 

[Servant19]

See thats the problem, you think global illness and such will be illiminated when it will not.

If it can be eliminated within a global community consisting of every race, colour, religious background and culture, then it can be eliminated globally.

The numbers joining this quest for a united world filled with the love of God is increasing day by day. You are welcome to join in and contribute, dear friend

Human nature is not as pliable to good as you like and i think this really does come from two different worldviews. You think everyone will be saved, I know everyone will not be saved by the words of Jesus,

Yes, you are correct, those that reject Jesus in His Second Coming may very well jeopardise their salvation, just as was noted in His first coming.

that most will go through the wide gate into destruction, into death.

Yes the gate is very narrow to salvation. Most people dismiss Baha’u’llah without even giving Him a second thought, without even reading about His life. Not many even know who the Bab is…the gate is very narrow, eye of the needle stuff

you think you can change the world and make it perfect?

No, I don’t think that, God does, through His institutions which He has established on the earth, through which His sweet-scented perfume can be smelled and His grace can be manifested on earth, as it is in heaven

No you cannot, people are far more complicated and far more fallen than you realise, not irredeemable but they will never be as perfect as you think they can become.

Again, you seem to underestimate the Divine power and mercy and blessings wielded by Baha’i institutions.

No governemnt, especially one government controlling everything can be trusted, all empires fall, all nations at a certain point fail, that is one fact about history that one cannot deny.

How many one world governments have you seen, dear friend?
You must have seen many to not trust them

The islamists won’t accept bahai,

You watch how many Muslims become Baha’i in Iran as soon as the oppresive regime ends in that country…

the secularists won’t accept your vision,

Most secularists are so fed up with religion (history has taught them well) that they are mostly blinded to anything new in terms of religion…but the Baha’is are resolving this matter

the Christians will at every point resist this blending of societies you imagine and I cannot speak for how other nations and groups might react.

Who said anything about “blending of societies”. The Baha’i Faith unequivocally pursues the maintaining of sovereign identities and cultures.

I look at the world and I see it failing, we are to live in this world suffering while doing good yes, as much as good as we can, but in the end it will get worse than better by the efforts of people who reject God, like you. I really do think if bahai ever became as powerful as to dominate the entire world you would be just as tyrannical as the muslims or North korea as I think a fundmantalist Christian state would be.

On what basis Ignatian?

Point to one verse, any verse, in the Baha’i Writings that shows anything other than ABSOLUTE LOVE FOR ALL, just one verse please…

.