Far right marchers rally amid tensions over Woolrich killing

[BroomWagon]

It’s easy to sympathise with the EDL simply because they are protesting the Islamisation of Europe, which is a reasonable thing to oppose, but it easily glosses over the fact that the EDL is not simply against Islamisation. They are a threat to fellow Europeans and Christians as well.

In fact, the EDL is hardly an ally to Catholics. One must understand that their primary objective to is to oppose anything they consider not English, and this is why they get their reputation for unbridled hatred and racism. They have attacked, taunted and even outright assaulted fellow Christians and Catholics simply for not being English, including Polish Catholics. While the Poles may be some of the most devout Catholics in the world, this fact is irrelevant to the EDL as they only see the non-Englishness of Poles as reason enough to consider them scum. This is one of the reasons why Eastern Europeans are one of the most vulnerable to EDL-provoked crime. Even Blacks and Asians are fair game for them, even if they are Catholics. It is ironic that despite the Catholic Church being the original faith of Europe and Britain, they seem to have no regard for that fact. It seems that despite the EDL leader being of Irish Catholic upbringing, his political positions do not identify with either. His support of Catholics seem to be conditional on them being of English ethnicity, and any love for Irish is only if they are Unionist.

If one wishes to protest Islamisation, there are hundreds of other organisations that are better suited to a good Catholic. The EDL is simply nothing more than fascism in populist disguise.

Can you link where you are getting your information from?

You certainly built a rock solid case!

 

[BroomWagon]

I know parts of America too. Never been there, but I know what an agenda based media tells me about it. I’m sure if I lived in America I’d see the US differently, i’d see the bigger picture as it were.
My own brother (admittedly a bit of a “leftie” lol) often turns up to demonstrate against the EDL rallies with the anti-fascist lot, so I’ve seen first-hand the photographs and the mobile-phone videos of the EDL in action. You can also find out their true beliefs easily just by joining the various political forums online and asking them. They’ll deny being nazis by name, while espousing a very neonazi ideology of what britain should be, but if a horse tells you it’s not a horse and then runs the grand national, it’s a horse.
To RAJCL, that’s a good point about the tv news after 9/11. I suppose it shows that militant jihadism is more popular in some countries than it is amongst British Muslims who for the most part are good decent British people.
Furthermore the EDL doesn’t actually want to keep militant Islam in check, it wants to send the foreigners “home”.
The nazi types such as EDL and BNP are awful people. Using these evil jihadists to make themselves seem reasonable by comparison just makes them worse. Two wrongs don’t make a right. Jihadist terror acts are beyond abhorrent, but they don’t justify Nazi thug organisations. If that makes Broom think I’m angry or RACJL think I’m naieve then I can live with that. I hate the EDL as much as I hate Jihad against us.

On a different note Broomwaggon I was really happy to see about that abortionist-turned prolife campaigner that you posted earlier. Even the baby killers can see the error of their ways so maybe there is hope for mankind to sort itself out.

To mis-quote Tupac: pray for peace in the middle east and on London’s streets.

No links, No backup. Thanks.

 

[BroomWagon]

I recall seeing a story about the English Defense League on the show “60 Minutes.” They seem to be a terrorist organization, not too different from the IRA and the JDL (Jewish Defense League), but of course with different goals. However, it’s the same kind of ethnic cleansing that the EDL advocates. Enough said.

60 minutes, that’s a start. JDL had a member who tried to bomb a mosque. We still haven’t had any real proof of anything beyond protests with the EDL.

 

[BroomWagon]

After the filmmaker Van Gogh was murdered, nearly decapitated on the streets in Amsterdam, there was a backlash.

Mosque set on fire in Netherlands
Inside the burnt-out mosque in Helden
Police said the mosque was too badly damaged to be usable
A fire has badly damaged a mosque in the Netherlands, in what may be the latest in a series of arson attacks.

…

There have been more than 20 incidents of fires or vandalism at Muslim buildings since the murder of the controversial filmmaker Theo van Gogh.

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4008781.stm

This is going to happen, EDL or not. People are going to get upset, backlash even happens in the USA.

 

[ringil]

cnn.com/2013/05/27/world/europe/uk-mosque-fire/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

Mosque set on fire day after EDL protest.

 

[JustaServant]

After the filmmaker Van Gogh was murdered, nearly decapitated on the streets in Amsterdam, there was a backlash.

news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4008781.stm

This is going to happen, EDL or not. People are going to get upset, backlash even happens in the USA.

You sound almost enthusiastic.

 

[BroomWagon]

Support for groups like the EDL would be very minimal, if the government and police took a firm stand against immigrant rioters in France, UK, Sweden, etc, but they still refuse to. France 2005 saw countless firebombings, attacks on police stations, and even reported shots fired at police. The England riots of 2011, weren’t much different. Yet were there ever shoot to kill orders given to police in the case of people throwing firebombs ? Of course not, and that’s why increasing numbers of people support groups like the EDL.

The last time there was some sort of outrageous disturbance, there they were the EDL.

Last Fall, a number of EDLers were arrested before they went to East London. The police did so to prevent a public nuisance.

Still, what has been shown amounts to little more than Hooliganism that use to be a problem in England and still, their cause is honourable being against Islamic Extremism and they do give voice to the protests.

 

[BroomWagon]

Obviously a lot of people are using this tragic death to push their own political agenda.

And of all things, an agenda to accuse others of not wanting a “non-white” Europe. So to me, this appears to just be trying to make this about racism. A horrible incident happened of Terrorism against the Military.

By the way, people from India and Pakistan have been in England forever now.

 

[JustaServant]

And of all things, an agenda to accuse others of not wanting a “non-white” Europe.

Sorry, but the last time I re-checked the postings, it is only your posts that are defending the European equivalent of the KKK.
What happened was terrible and the guilty parties are being punished.
However, it is never right to do wrong so that right might prevail.
Or, in laymans terms, two wrongs do not make a right.

 

[Sarcelle]

They are also defending a nation where the native people, the English and Scottish could become a minority in their own country by 2040, 2050, that might not be a problem if those coming were honorable faithful citizens. Death and Graying of the West.

A few individual protestors maybe and those charges are not always to be believed that are made against them, just like some people targetted the Tea Party and accused them of racism.

At least someone is defending their own country and pointing out an evil that happened.

And Newcastle is way North and is somewhat removed from what goes on in London and other places.

No one can blame the Muslim extremists with regards to the native English and Welsh people becoming a minority in their own country. The native English and Welsh did that to themselves.

This reminded me when I was confronted by an angry man over how his people, white people, were rapidly becoming a minority in the U.S. Well what was he waiting for, get married and have kids, lots of them. Don’t blame me.

 

[ringil]

This reminded me when I was confronted by an angry man over how his people, white people, were rapidly becoming a minority in the U.S. Well what was he waiting for, get married and have kids, lots of them. Don’t blame me.

Why would a white person be concerned that Caucasians were no longer the majority in the US? What about this demographic change would bother them.

The same in the UK- why would having more dark skinned people around bother them? Is there something intrinsically better in having a majority of the population of English, Scottish, or Welsh descent?

That’s what I don’t get.

 

[Sarcelle]

Broomwagon Don’t get me wrong pal it was a disgusting crime and I sympathise so much for the dead soldier and his family. I’m sure we all prayed for them at mass this weekend
I don’t like jihadist extremism anymore than you. . If I’ve seemed a little angry or forward during our exchange of opinions please forgive me. I mean you no offense personally. I am just scared of what these kind of terror attacks will turn this once peaceful nation into. I can see the backlash reaction going too far and turning us as bad as the people attacking us.
Issues like this create such strong feelings. And i fear that those feelings will be jumped on by politicians and misused and misdirected and end up causing things to get a whole lot worse. I can imagine the army doing a “bloody sunday” on a mosque to get revenge, and thus spawning a new wave of jihadist attacks against us, all the while the government will be using this new “war on terror at home” as an excuse to re-write law and turn us into even more of an orwellian police state than we already are. (this is how the rest of the world percieves whats been happening stateside since that awful attack on 9/11, with all the acts and amendments theyve passed and freedoms eroded since. I hope we don’t go this way.)

And you’re right we see it differently but I guess that’s just how it is.
I hope we can chat again on here another day.

Peace

I can definitely sympathize. This kind of terror attacks may spawn violent retaliation and so on and so forth which may bloom into a violent cycle. In the end innocent Muslims and non-Muslims get killed.

 

[ringil]

I can definitely sympathize. This kind of terror attacks may spawn violent retaliation and so on and so forth which may bloom into a violent cycle. In the end innocent Muslims and non-Muslims get killed.

The goal of the EDL is to spark such a confrontation.

 

[Sarcelle]

Today I sighed and turned off CAF.
My wife asked ‘whats wrong’?
I said it just amazes me that, while I think I am living in the twenty-first century, some people on this forum seem to have mindsets still in the sixth century. One would think WW2, the Holocaust, the Civil War, the Civil rights movement, never happened. It’s almost as if some here long for the days when people walked in abjuct darkness. When hate and fear led to war and bloodshed. Some even seem to long for it. The Catholic Church and its stand on social justice, standing up for the unborn and the oppressed, standing up for peace is ignored.
We really need at this hour to listen to the Church, and not Fox News.

Huh?

I watch Fox News and nowhere does it advocate going back to the Dark Ages or the 1950s for that matter.

By the way what is abjuct darkness?

 

[Sarcelle]

I do know the difference, but exactly where my family tree hits is still uncertain. So far, we have had more success on the Germanic side of the family. The Celts we only have back to the mid 1700s near Ennis, County Clare. They may have been among the invading hordes…or much later, or much earlier.
That is what I find so fascinating about history in the British Isles…there is so much of it when compared to relatively short written history in the Americas.

The history of white America you mean. I’m sure the native Americans have a much longer history.

 

[BroomWagon]

The history of white America you mean. I’m sure the native Americans have a much longer history.

Really, who knows when they crossed over the Bering strait.

 

[Sarcelle]

I am “traditionally minded”. I say my prayers in Latin sometimes. I attend the TLM periodically. I don’t like modern church architecture or music. Heck, I study the Middle Ages as one element of my hobby.

I sure as heck don’t have any sympathy for fascists though, and I don’t see any intrinsic value in keeping Europe white.

I do like presenting these types of topics though- to see what CAF members will voice their opinions.

As far as keeping Europe white, it’s a little too late for that don’t you think? It’s like trying to put toothpaste back into the tube. Unless you want to do ethnic cleansing.

You can blame European explorers in the 16th century or even earlier when they went to colonize Asia, Africa and the Americas. The world hasn’t been the same ever since. However, if it hadn’t been for these European explorers going to the other continents, I wouldn’t exist. (Just did some genealogical exploration of my family tree.)

 

[JackyB]

The question that should be asked is why the EDL exist and why are they gaining in popularity? The fact of the matter is that most articles written in connection with the slaughter of the soldier in broad daylight in the middle of the day, in a street in London, have had no comments allowed. The fact is many people are angry about British immigration policies past and present and they want to know what happened, why and what is going to happen in the future. It is never just as simple as name calling the EDL, they exist because past and present government’s are riding roughshod over people’s concerns and passing laws that the majority do not support i.e. homosexual ‘marriage’ together with the inability to stop more immigration in the coming new year from EU membership countries. The EDL come in from some very heavy-handed police intervention simply because in the political correct society that is Britain today they are a far easier target then a terrorist killing soldiers in a street in London.

 

[Sarcelle]

The question that should be asked is why the EDL exist and why are they gaining in popularity? The fact of the matter is that most articles written in connection with the slaughter of the soldier in broad daylight in the middle of the day, in a street in London, have had no comments allowed. The fact is many people are angry about British immigration policies past and present and they want to know what happened, why and what is going to happen in the future. It is never just as simple as name calling the EDL, they exist because past and present government’s are riding roughshod over people’s concerns and passing laws that the majority do not support i.e. homosexual ‘marriage’ together with the inability to stop more immigration in the coming new year from EU membership countries. The EDL come in from some very heavy-handed police intervention simply because in the political correct society that is Britain today they are a far easier target then a terrorist killing soldiers in a street in London.

I agree. The British people have expressed concern on the consequences of letting in potentially violent immigrants but their concerns and voices were ignored by the British government in the name of political correctness. At least the EDL has listened to these concerns.

 

[Just_Some_Guy]

Broomwaggon, as far as I know, the tea party aren’t a strong-beer-fuelled-neonazi-thug outfit, whereas the EDL are exactly that. We the people of Britain DO NOT want the EDL to defend our country as you put it. And the EDL disgrace the memory of a fallen soldier by using his death as an excuse to spread their nazi ideology. Please stop defending them.

Consider this:
Approximately 80 years ago the nazis came for the jews. Until it was too late, no-one stopped them.
NOW the neo-nazis thugs (EDL) are coming for (all) the Muslims.(regardless of extremist muslim or not) - So, Will anyone stand up for our Muslim brothers under God?

• Because if WE don’t, then when these ignorant nazi thugs come for the pope-worshipping,blood-drinking Catholics, WHO will be left to stand up for us?

The Muslims are coming for all of us. People will latch on to someone who stands for them. If the EDL is the only group that will do so…
“Normal” Brits, as we saw on the videos the other day, avert their gazes and continue walking down the street.

He does not love the unbelievers (30:45)

O ye who believe! Take not the Jews and the Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is (one) of them. Lo! Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk. (5:51)

Listen not to the unbelievers, but strive (Jihad) against them with the utmost strenuousness. (25:52)

Against them make ready your strength to the utmost of your power, including steeds of war, to strike terror into (the hearts of) the enemies of Allah and your enemies and others besides, whom ye may not know (8:60)

And unto Allah falleth prostrate whosoever is in the heavens and the earth, willingly or unwillingly (13:15)

We shall punish them gradually from directions they perceive not. (68:44)

Quran (3:56) - “As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help.”

Quran (4:89) - “They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them; and (in any case) take no friends or helpers from their ranks.”