Finding chastity difficult as a potential convert, currently in a relationship

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LemonAndLime said:
He knows about part of buddhism - but he’s decided not to follow those :rolleyes: he also at one point said “But if we decide to be chaste that’ll harm me which is causing harm which is something I have to avoid according to buddhism.”

I’ve saved those links everyone has posted and am going to look at them now! Thank you 🙂 I suppose the rest is up to me which is scary. 😦
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I am going to say this - and I hope it does not come off too bluntly because I don’t know him but you seem like wonderful lady. 🙂 If he is picking and choosing from his own religion - most likely he will expect you to do the same from yours. Is this something that you are willing to do. Remember Christ is in the Eucharist. When we do things that are against the teachings of Christ (sin) and we know they are against the teachings of Christ (with knowledge) of our free will (competence) and we do them for some other reason than to be closer to God (wrong intent) then we have committed mortal sin and we must remove ourself from the Eucharist until we have had an opportunity to make Confession. If we do these things with the beforehand knowledge that we can always go to Confession and “fix it later” than we sin against the Sacrament of Confession which is another sin unto itself.

That being said you could later be placed in a situation where the man (the physical one in your life) is asking you to choose between him and the other man in your life - the King of Kings - the Lord Jesus Christ. Dating is a disernment of marriage. Marriage is a Sacrament as well as a covenant between you, the spouse, and God. How can you make these promises with someone that will not respect your beliefs and your relationship with Him.
 
Here is a good book on Chastity, it helped me understand Chastity. Remember that love of God comes before anyone! If it is dangerous for your faith you leave. I was in a similar situation and now I see I was guilty of the things I did. God healed me in the sacraments of Penance and Eucharist. The book I provided you with, also has a section on how to fall out of love. Maybe you can convert your boyfriend like St. Cecilia coverted her’s?

columbia.edu/cu/augustine/arch/chastity.html
Here is a link to St. Cecilia: bardstown.com/~brchrys/Cecilia.htm
Here is more on marriage:
bardstown.com/~brchrys/Marriage.htm
 
joandarc2008 said:
I am going to say this - and I hope it does not come off too bluntly because I don’t know him but you seem like wonderful lady. 🙂 If he is picking and choosing from his own religion - most likely he will expect you to do the same from yours. Is this something that you are willing to do. Remember Christ is in the Eucharist. When we do things that are against the teachings of Christ (sin) and we know they are against the teachings of Christ (with knowledge) of our free will (competence) and we do them for some other reason than to be closer to God (wrong intent) then we have committed mortal sin and we must remove ourself from the Eucharist until we have had an opportunity to make Confession. If we do these things with the beforehand knowledge that we can always go to Confession and “fix it later” than we sin against the Sacrament of Confession which is another sin unto itself.

That being said you could later be placed in a situation where the man (the physical one in your life) is asking you to choose between him and the other man in your life - the King of Kings - the Lord Jesus Christ. Dating is a disernment of marriage. Marriage is a Sacrament as well as a covenant between you, the spouse, and God. How can you make these promises with someone that will not respect your beliefs and your relationship with Him.
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I’m aware of those issues and they trouble me every day. I love him so much - and he says he loves me too. We are more intimate then sexual when we see each other, and I do seem him as material for a long-term partner. At the beginning of my journey into the Catholic faith he absolutely hated all religion - now he is looking into buddhism, and is saying he has a spiritual void. He has made progress along with me so I’m not going to give up on him completely yet.

He already knows that if I become a Catholic I will only get married in a Catholic Church, and he will have to go RCIA as I have done (although doesn’t have to convert as long as the Bishop approves and he agrees to raise the children, if any, Catholic). I told him if he loves me he should do that. He doesn’t think its necessary but he didn’t say no. Celibacy is another thing; he’s been much more promiscuous then I have in the past and it’s very difficult for him to understand. I think it all comes down to understanding. We have yet to have a proper talk about it - he has already promised that “if” I decide to be chaste, he will never leave me over it but he will find it difficult. Then again - I continue to pray for his conversion.

I don’t worry that he’ll stop loving me if I stop having sex with him, more that he will get sexually frustrated. At the moment he’s trying to give up smoking and those together… 😦

I really do depend on him. I don’t have a lot of friends at university so its hard - also, he spends loads of money on nice gifts for me and I would feel guilty about giving him added stress. It feels like an impossible thing to do. 😦
 
LemonAndLime said:
I’m aware of those issues and they trouble me every day. I love him so much - and he says he loves me too. We are more intimate then sexual when we see each other, and I do seem him as material for a long-term partner. At the beginning of my journey into the Catholic faith he absolutely hated all religion - now he is looking into buddhism, and is saying he has a spiritual void. He has made progress along with me so I’m not going to give up on him completely yet.

He already knows that if I become a Catholic I will only get married in a Catholic Church, and he will have to go RCIA as I have done (although doesn’t have to convert as long as the Bishop approves and he agrees to raise the children, if any, Catholic). I told him if he loves me he should do that. He doesn’t think its necessary but he didn’t say no. Celibacy is another thing; he’s been much more promiscuous then I have in the past and it’s very difficult for him to understand. I think it all comes down to understanding. We have yet to have a proper talk about it - he has already promised that “if” I decide to be chaste, he will never leave me over it but he will find it difficult. Then again - I continue to pray for his conversion.

I don’t worry that he’ll stop loving me if I stop having sex with him, more that he will get sexually frustrated. At the moment he’s trying to give up smoking and those together… 😦

I really do depend on him. I don’t have a lot of friends at university so its hard - also, he spends loads of money on nice gifts for me and I would feel guilty about giving him added stress. It feels like an impossible thing to do. 😦
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I understand you wanting to watch out for his stress level. That is good and kind of you. However, meanwhile you are putting your own spiritual health on the line. Sex and even intimacy can become a fall back in a relationship. If you cut this off you will find out exactly what kind of relationship you have. After all - any of these problems are ones you should be able to continue to talk your way through - not turning to a physical outlet. Sex is not a physical outlet it is a renewing of vows between spouses and the Holy Spirit. To use it in any other way besides the procreative and/or unitive aspect even if a couple is married is sinful. While it can be stress relieving it is NOT it’s primary function. You must learn to be able to sit and talk these issues out without physical intimacy in order to have a good Sacramental marriage (or non-Sacramental, valid one if he is not baptized.)
 
LemonAndLime said:
I told him if he loves me he should do that. He doesn’t think its necessary but he didn’t say no. Celibacy is another thing; he’s been much more promiscuous then I have in the past and it’s very difficult for him to understand. I think it all comes down to understanding. We have yet to have a proper talk about it - he has already promised that “if” I decide to be chaste, he will never leave me over it but he will find it difficult. **Then again - I continue to pray for his conversion.
**
**I don’t worry that he’ll stop loving me if I stop having sex with him, more that he will get sexually frustrated. At the moment he’s trying to give up smoking and those together… 😦
**
I really do depend on him. I don’t have a lot of friends at university so its hard - also, he spends loads of money on nice gifts for me and I would feel guilty about giving him added stress. It feels like an impossible thing to do. 😦
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Well, I am going to be more blunt than you might like to read. It is out of concern for you. I am excited for you, that you are on a faith journey toward my Church, and believe me, I want to save you the kind of heartache and pain that I have had. It is my belief that if BOTH people who marry do not understand and support what the Church teaches about sexuality, that relationship will end up as a 2-legged stool. What is missing is the initial RESPECT that comes from honoring the sacredness of our sexuality by remaining virgins until you come together as a married couple.

You will not have that, because you have already been familiar with each other’s body. Sexual intimacy is not just a mere physical act, the chemicals released in our brains act as glue that holds us together, whether that person is the right choice for us or not. That is why abstaining until marriage is so critical, as well as the possibility of creating a life without a sold structure for supporting that new life. The bonding happens regardless of that other person’s suitability, so your discernment ability is severely compromised.

I firmly believe that an overwhelming proportion of the misery in marriage today is caused by sexual bonding with the wrong person. Now, I don’t know if God really wanted me to be with my husband, but I can tell you honestly that if we had not been sexual all along in our relationship, I would have been able to evaluate him more coldly as a future spouse. In my case, I was not a practicing Catholic at that point, though, so he might have passed any secular test I gave him. Since you ARE going to become a Catholic, you are able to start thinking in that way and considering all the ramifications of going forward into marriage with this boyfriend. The love you say you have for this young man is very much affected by that physical bonding that you have already experienced. Would you really choose to be with him if you had not already been sexual? Maybe, but maybe not.

See Part Two.
 
Part Two.

The religious differences are another huge concern. I think it’s good in a way that he is at least looking into Buddhism. Been there, done that, it’s empty. What I will warn you about is the personal dynamic between the two of you. He is putting an awful lot of his mental health “eggs” into your basket. After reading all of this thread - you are the strong one in the relationship, it seems. He is counting on you to hold him up, to help him stay stable, even to lead him to Jesus (well HE does not want that but you do). What happens when YOU need help? Do you recognize that the man is supposed to be the spiritual leader of the family? I can tell you from personal experience that if the father is not going to church, it won’t matter what the mother does and baptism isn’t going to take you very far. The kids will see what Daddy does or doesn’t do and you will lose the battle.

You have reversed the roles in your relationship and he doesn’t seem to have many strengths to offer you. You have said he had a very bad childhood, which you must know has left scars inside him. These wounds will not allow him to be the equal partner you need him to be. Do not minimize his background, LemonandLime. If it included sexual abuse, this is a huge problem. I would like to see him acknowledging the problems and getting mental health treatment for them. Facing the past with courage and making a solemn vow not to continue to carry those scars forward would be a good start. It still won’t be easy, because he has been so wounded and so damaged. Of course Jesus can heal anything but he is not ready to trust in a loving Father if his own earthly father hurt him and abused him.

You cannot heal those wounds. I would wish for you that you could find a whole person to love and one that could support you in your whole life. I think the woundedness in you cries out to the damaged parts of your boyfriend. I know how that is, it’s what drew me to my current husband. I want to see him healed of his inner pain as well. But there is no one to support me, he’s quite selfish in his own way and I am on my own with a lot of things. Being the strong one gets old after a while.

I think this is about rescuing a lost soul. If you two do get married, be prepared for a very rough road ahead. Are you with him because he’s good to you materially? A very shallow reason for staying together. Out of pity for him because he is so damaged, and you see the whole person you wish him to be? Probably won’t ever happen, unless HE chooses it and the familiar is always easier. People who have gone through pain in their childhoods are usually not eager to go back into that pain in therapy in order to heal. Once was enough, they bury it with addictions or ignore it with achievements or try to rescue others from the pain they themselves experienced.

I am more blunt than many people, but it’s all done out of concern, experience, and love. Think about and pray about this, and talk to your priest. I know your own family situation is troubled (from your other threads) so it will be hard for you to be objective. Saving another person might make you feel less helpless in your own life, but it ain’t easy work and the rewards aren’t as many as you might imagine. I’ve been at it 21 years so far and it’s nearly broken me, meanwhile, my husband sails on.

Christ has pierced your heart for a reason and led you toward His Church. Let His wisdom and love guide you as you go forward from here.
 
ok, I just asked my youngest daughter, who is in college, to her reaction to 17 year old boy interested in 13 year old girl …the response I got was a puzzled “ewe”, “gross”, “creeper”. and asked “Does he know she is 13? She is in middle school if she is 13, what is he doing being interested in her?” and she said without my prompting that a 13 year old should not date a 17 year old. I asked why. her response was that a 13 year old is too immature. .
 
This sounds like a difficult situation you are in, but I think you really need to ask yourself a few questions, what’s more important here, your increasing relationship with God and His Church or with this man?

We’re taught this about love:

1 Corinthians 13:4-8

Love is patient and kind; it is not jealous or conceited or proud; love is not ill-mannered or selfish or irritable; love does not keep a record of wrongs; love is not happy with evill, but is happy with the truth. Love never gives up; and it has faith, hope and patience will never fail.

Does your bf live like this? Does he behave like this? Tell him upfront you no longer want pre-martial sex, if he dumps you, then what does that say about his character?

My opinion, for what its worth, and with what you’ve said, is to break it off. For one, its not fair on you, and certainly not fair on him. You started a relationsnhip with this chap under teh premise that you weren’t really religious and that you were engaged in sex with him. He’s obviously not too happy about this now you’ve changed.

And what if he does stick it out with you, how will the marriage come about? What about children? How will he feel if you desire for yoru children the faith you are comign to know, when he is, as you say, anti-religious?

And finally, why are you selling yoruself so short? Is this the kind of person you want in your life? That God wants for you? Only you can answer this. But from what you’ve said, honestly, move on, and move closer to God. The rewards, spiritually, mentally and emotionally will be a lot better.
 
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