First Presidential Debate 9/26/16 Thread

[7_Sorrows]

I am confused why so many college educated women are voting for Hillary. Most of the college educated women I know including myself - do not want Hillary for president!

 

[ShrodingersCat]

Mr. Trump has to show why he is better for women than Hillary. He should point out the rape case of a 12 year old, where Hillary said it was the fault of the 12 year old. Is that more favorable to female rape victims or to monster criminal rapists? Why did Hillary blame the girl who was a child victim for this horrible crime?

While I agree she won’t be a good president AT ALL, I don’t think you can blame her for not doing her utmost to get her client off. That is the job description. The judge didn’t have to allow her lines of questioning if he thought they were inappropriate. Plenty of other reasons that indicate she’ll be a terrible president that are all far more relevant as they occurred while she was secretary of state.

 

[ComplineSanFran]

I am confused why so many college educated women are voting for Hillary. Most of the college educated women I know including myself - do not want Hillary for president!

And virtually ALL my friends who are college educated are strong Hillary supporters. I guess we see things differently.

 

[Al_Moritz]

I am confused why so many college educated women are voting for Hillary. Most of the college educated women I know including myself - do not want Hillary for president!

Right. Like the prominent lady in Massachusetts who said after Nixon’s 49-state landslide of 1972, “I don’t understand how Nixon won – all my friends voted for McGovern!”.

 

[mary_bobo]

And virtually ALL my friends who are college educated are strong Hillary supporters. I guess we see things differently.

You might try expanding your circle of acquaintances.

 

[mary_bobo]

I was responding to a poster discussing the role model Trump was to his sons due to Trumps infidelity …not Bill Clinton and not sure what you mean ,

I was acknowledging as another poster noted that Trump’s infidelity was tabloid news. Thus I imagined his children are and or were aware of that … I believe that Trump would want his children to avoid those same troubles and be faithful and have long lasting relationships …

I have been married twice … my first marriage ended in divorce - it is not something I am proud of - it is a constant reminder of my immaturity and failure …but the children I have from that marriage are not mistakes … they did have to suffer through it … and they had to grow and learn from it … Do I wish I had not brought that upon them? Yes … but also - my second marriage was was everything my first was not. Every thing I wish the first had been … It was Christ centered and full of love that holds fast during troubled times and happy wonderful times - where both of us pulled together as one - not pulling apart as individuals … I want my children to avoid those issues … not to make the same mistakes that I did … not being hypocritical - just wanting them to avoid the same pain - I love them …

We need to accept that people grow and change over time … that people can and do change …

Thus when Trump says he is pro-Life and would appoint pro-Life Justices … his stance may not be perfect - it maybe nuanced but I have - at this moment in time no reason to doubt that the man of today is not the same man from 10, 20 or 30 years ago …people can and do change …

Similarly, when Clinton says she will do everything in her power today to make abortion on demand a right, appoint pro-abortion justices and export abortion around the globe - I believe her … she too has changed and become even more radically pro-abortion … she has changed on same sex marriage - Now she is using a self proclaimed Catholic who tells people his faith is the foundation of his life for VP … but that VP has to openly promote abortion and same sex marriage in opposition to everything the Church teaches …

That is using someone’s faith to promote a political ideology - to get Catholics to think those positions are in line with Catholic teaching - that it is okay to dissent in matters like abortion … I find that practice condescending to the Church and Catholics everywhere … it worked for Obama with Biden … And its worked for the Democrat Party who likes to use many prominent pro-abortion Catholics to lead the faithful away from the Church - from Christ … always the photo op with a Pope or at a funeral somewhere receiving the Eucharist - and all the while voting for Abortion … repeal of the Hyde Amendment … etc … promising that they care for the poor - while passing legislation that destroys the family and keeps people in poverty … But Trump is Hitler … he divorced not one but two … and Hillary stood by Bill [while she work to destroy the women he slept with … sheesh]

Good points.

 

[stinkcat_14]

For those who laugh at the idea of Trump being a family man would probably describe JFK and Bill Clinton as family men despite the number of times each was guilty of being unfaithful to their wives. But that is the hypocrisy of the left.

I laugh at the idea of Trump being a family man and I have not voted for a democrat since I voted for Gary Hart in a primary. Even then I wasn’t really a liberal, I just didn’t see the point of voting in the republican primary in 84. So I guess it is the hypocrisy of the right as well.

 

[kat07]

While I agree she won’t be a good president AT ALL, I don’t think you can blame her for not doing her utmost to get her client off. That is the job description. The judge didn’t have to allow her lines of questioning if he thought they were inappropriate. Plenty of other reasons that indicate she’ll be a terrible president that are all far more relevant as they occurred while she was secretary of state.

Yes, even people convicted of the most heinous crimes deserves legal representation. But Hillary’s strategy was to blame the victim. Her comments in a filed affidavit were that children who come from disorganized families sometimes exaggerate or romanticize sexual experiences, and she stated the girl was emotionally unstable with a tendency to seek out older men, and engage in fantasizing. The girl surely didn’t dream up being raped and assaulted. She was a virgin prior and she was beaten so severely she was put in a coma. Hillary knew her client was guilty but it never bothered her nor did it to blame the 12 year old victim and to slander her. That’s Hillary’s typical M.O. The most chilling part is Hillary’s voice of indifference and bemusement when she talked about how she got her client off. This is a look into the soul of an enabler. Hillary has now even deleted a statement from her web site where she stated all survivors of sexual assault “have the right to be believed”…

 

[Tomdstone]

While I agree she won’t be a good president AT ALL, I don’t think you can blame her for not doing her utmost to get her client off. .

There is an honorable way to defend a criminal and there is a dishonorable way to defend a criminal. It is dishonorable to destroy the character and reputation of a twelve year old virgin after she had been brutally beaten and raped by a monster criminal.

 

[tweedlealice]

Nixon shared a podium with Kennedy. They sat down when the other spoke.

Hi,
Thanks.
God bless you and protect our miltary where ever they may be. St. Michael defend us in battle!!please.
Protect the persecuted.
in Christ’s love
Tweedlealice

 

[Mary_Gail_36]

I’m not sure either candidate did well on substance although I agree Hillary did better in her delivery.

I believe that most of the pundits don’t understand the psyche of much of the American people. They do NOT want a candidate who is slick, polished, even presidential sounding. What they want is a candidate who is different, unpredictable, and non-political. This is the public’s revolt against the establishment, and Hillary Clinton is perceived to be the epitome of an establishment candidate. Trump, on the other hand, for all his flaws, is exciting and speaks his mind, which is precisely what a lot of the public likes about him. If Trump is elected–and I am beginning to think this is a real possibility–it is guaranteed to be some ride. With Hillary, however, all we can expect is more of the same political maneuvering.

For the record, I do not support either candidate.

I think Hillary was definitely stronger in substance in various places. One place, ironically, was cyber security. Her answer showed she understood what the vulnerabilities were and who were the possible culprits. His answer was a ramble that mentioned the cyber being vulnerable to China and Russia and fat guys. And his son is good at computers. How could he have not prepared an answer that showed that Hillary was actually careless when it came to cyber security?

The other part where Hillary dominated in substance is when NATO was discussed. He suggested that China take out North Korea, and that Japan needs to pony up more money to be protected. Treaties don’t matter I guess. And a nuclear war in Asia is fine I guess, because Honda makes good cars that do well in the US.

On Twitter both Karl Reiner and Rob Reiner participate. Obviously Rob Reiner is a Hollywood Liberal. One point he made is that Trump sounds a lot like Archie Bunker.

 

[ShrodingersCat]

There is an honorable way to defend a criminal and there is a dishonorable way to defend a criminal. It is dishonorable to destroy the character and reputation of a twelve year old virgin after she had been brutally beaten and raped by a monster criminal.

Yeah maybe you are right, I just assumed the law didn’t allow for any sympathising with the victim and it was the judges job to arbitrate that stuff. I mean, I’m not a lawyer so I don’t know how far the defence is expected to go. I just assumed you chose the line that you thought would get the lowest sentence for your client and pursued it until the judge made you stop.

 

[stevegravy]

Absolutely amazing. They’ll rue the day when they realize the congress of the United States is turned into nothing but a debating society under another Clinton administration. The combination of her executive orders and a supreme court constituted to approve them, will be the end of the separation of powers.

They should think of that. So, someday or other, should liberals. Unless Clinton manages to kill off conservatism entirely, the reverse could happen in the (likely far) future, and the liberals will find that the only election that matters is the presidential election, because the country will be ruled by executive fiat entirely.

And Catholics, of course, should care as well unless “changing their religion” is okay with them. (and for some, it manifestly is) If Obama, who doesn’t even claim to force a religion change, forces the Little Sisters to provide abortifacients or face bankruptcy, how much more will Clinton, who actually says we have to change our religion, be oppressive?

Liberals’ short term gain if Clinton is elected, might bite them in the flank someday, particularly those who are Catholic.

Read last night and stumbled across this today thought it apropos.

quote:
The Declaration of Independence says that all men “are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights” among which are “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.” These rights—codified in the Constitution’s Bill of Rights—are not civil rights that governments may define. The free exercise of religion, freedom of speech and assembly, keeping and bearing arms, freedom from warrantless searches, protection against double jeopardy and self-incrimination, trial by jury of one’s peers, etc., are natural rights that pertain to human beings as such. Securing them for Americans is what the United States is all about. But today’s U.S. Civil Rights Commission advocates truncating the foremost of these rights because, as it stated in a recent report, “Religious exemptions to the protections of civil rights based upon classifications such as race, color, national origin, sex, disability status, sexual orientation, and gender identity, when they are permissible, significantly infringe upon those civil rights.” The report explains why the rights enumerated in the Declaration of Independence and the Bill of Rights should not be permissible: “The phrases ‘religious liberty’ and ‘religious freedom’ will stand for nothing except hypocrisy so long as they remain code words for discrimination, intolerance, racism, sexism, homophobia, Islamophobia, Christian supremacy, or any form of intolerance.”

Hillary Clinton’s attack on Trump supporters merely matched the ruling class’s current common sense. Why should government workers and all who wield the administrative state’s unaccountable powers not follow their leaders’ judgment, backed by the prestige press, about who are to be treated as citizens and who is to be handled as deplorable refuse? Hillary Clinton underlined once again how the ruling class regards us, and about what it has in store for us.

Read the whole thing here: claremont.org/crb/basicpage/after-the-republic/

Hard times are coming.

 

[tomarin]

And virtually ALL my friends who are college educated are strong Hillary supporters. I guess we see things differently.

I’m probably out of touch and elitist, but my reaction on hearing this was that if she can’t appeal to college educated white women, who can she appeal to? Aren’t they her base of support (because of the historical nature of her candidacy)?

This is one of my biggest turn-offs regarding the Democrat party, incidentally, that it seems to boil down to 99% identity politics these days.

 

[jtauke]

Trump scored major points by repeatedly talking about Clinton’s 30 year record of not solving problems.

.

30 year record? I dislike the woman as much as the next person, but where does this number come from? She is/was SoS for four years and was a Senator from 01-09.

Last I checked these positions didn’t have unilateral policy power. Never mind these numbers don’t add up to 30 years in political office.

 

[jtauke]

Mr. Trump has to show why he is better for women than Hillary. He should point out the rape case of a 12 year old, where Hillary said it was the fault of the 12 year old. Is that more favorable to female rape victims or to monster criminal rapists? Why did Hillary blame the girl who was a child victim for this horrible crime?

She was a lawyer, it’s her job to defend her client in whatever manner she can. Including attempting to discredit the victim.

Are you implying that lawyers shouldn’t defend their clients in anyway possible?

 

[qui_est_ce]

There once was a man who saw another’s man’s wife and lusted after her … a man of power and influence he was able to have the woman brought to him …

This man took her to his bed …

When the woman was found to be with child he had her husband murdered …

This man had many wives [yes - plural - wives] and used women for gratification who were not his wife

And God was able to use this man to lead a Nation …

God even blessed the man and the woman whose husband was murdered with a son who later ruled over the Nation …

I know that I am not the person I was 30 years ago - and I have made some awful decisions in my life I wish I never made … but I have grown up… yes - repented and learned from my mistakes …

In this election - we have a political party - whose platform states unequivocally its goal to promote the evil of abortion - not just here in America but exported to other nations around the globe - millions of lives are at stake.

Religious liberty and tolerance is at risk - where Catholic institutions like hospitals are being forced to provide abortions and cover services like contraception - sadly already many Catholic Hospitals like St Charles Medical Center in Bend Oregon are giving up their Catholic affiliation and identity in order to perform sterilizations and other ‘services’ that are in opposition to Church teaching.

Supreme Court life time appointments are at stake - one candidate has said they will nominate justices who will protect the right to murder unborn children at will - in line with their party platform.

A Catholic who publicly touts their Catholic identity while even more publicly promotes abortion support, same sex marriage support and other ideas in conflict with Church teaching has again been selected as the VP - joining the current VP who publicly touts his Catholic identity while even more publicly supports abortion and who performed a same sex marriage in his house … The Democratic party is using these men to promote the idea that this is what being a faithful Catholic looks like …

Trump - flawed man that he is - seems to be listening … he says he will put forth pro-Life judges. His children do seem to be loving caring human beings concerned with family unity [in spite of the divorces and re-marriages - but then - I cannot throw stones from my glass house] and who have a strong commitment to service. I think - like G W Bush, perhaps Trump touts his business acumen and tough guy business owner more than his kinder gentler side …

Perhaps [and I pray it is so] God is molding Trump to be better than even Trump imagines … like the story of the Man I started with whom I assume you all know by name

 

[jtauke]

i wonder what Chelsea Clinton learned about relationships from her father’s various (and very public) indiscretions.

I love the rationalizations from the Trump crowd. One good turn deserves another, right?

It doesn’t matter what my guy did, so long as the clinton’s have done the same thing. Never mind the fact that they’re both wrong.

 

[qui_est_ce]

I also hope those who want to turn this thread into attacks on the moral character of either candidate’s personal lives would refrain from doing so.

It is nasty and uncharitable.

Thank you. Beginning to see the results of lifting the ten post per day rule.

 

[Peter_Plato]

She was a lawyer, it’s her job to defend her client in whatever manner she can. Including attempting to discredit the victim.

Are you implying that lawyers shouldn’t defend their clients in anyway possible?

Are you implying that lawyers should simply abandon all contact with true justice and morality when they “defend their clients in any way possible?” Does “any way possible” include immoral, unjust or dishonest means?

Clinton knew what she was saying about the young girl was untrue but said it anyway. She knew she could find a way around lie detection – proving her dishonest methods and knowledge that her client was indeed lying.

Since when is bypassing true justice an implicit aspect of the justice system?