First Tridentine Mass: Mixed Feelings

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A few weeks ago I attended my first Tridentine Liturgy, something I’ve been meaning to do for some time now. And while others’ testimonies seem to be nothing but glowing, I find myself of mixed opinion on my experience.

For starters, I’m not totally in bed with anyone liturgy as the “best.” I love the Novus Ordo, I’m in awe of the majesty and mystery of the Divine Liturgies of the Eastern Rites, and I see a great deal of beauty in the Tridentine Liturgy. It’s a mass very rich in symbolism and ritual, which I find incredibly beautiful, and reading the texts of the mass is a very inspiring experience – there are definitely a few things from the old mass that I wish we’d incorporate into the Novus Ordo!

My biggest problem, however, was my own lack of participation. Much of the Eucharistic Prayer is said inaudibly by the priest, and while I can read along in a missal, it isn’t quite the same as hearing the words audibly. And many of the responses are simply sung by the choir of chanters (who are AMAZING), and I find that the majority of my time at mass is spent twiddling my thumbs in the pew. Now, I say that with some sarcasm because of course I was keeping myself attentive to the Mass, but it was still a bit of a difficulty.

All said, I see a great deal of what people love about the Tridentine Liturgy, but I don’t think it’s something I could ever do every week as my regular Mass. I routinely move between my home parish, a nearby Byzantine Catholic church, and now I’m adding the parish in our diocese that celebrates the Latin Mass to my rotation, but I have a hard time imagining experiencing the Tridentine Mass every week.

Just thought I’d offer my thoughts as a first-timer 🙂
 
Welcome to the wonderful world of traditionalism!

To be honest, I go to both Masses (A Mass is a Mass is a Mass, after all), and there are good things about both Forms.

As for the more passive participation in the liturgy (by praying, you’re participating along with the priest), it can take a little getting used to, but eventually it starts growing on you… seriously.

Also, it’s easier to keep track of Sundays, so you know roughtly where you are in the liturgical year. So yeah.
 
Thank you for your very heartfelt and thoughtful reaction to attending the TLM. I plan on attending one either tomorrow morning or next weekend and your observations are very helpful to me. I love the NO mass at my Jesuit parish, but I am interested in all aspects of our Faith, and I am curious about my own reaction to the priest having his back to the faithful.:confused:
 
Thank you for starting this thread and sharing your experience with us. A good explination of why the canon (eucharistic prayer) is and should be said silently can be read by clicking here.

@kozlosap, the priest is not just having his back to the people. He is facing the same way they are and leading them in the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
 
That was my experience, too. The first couple of times I went, I was mesmerized, and didn’t really have a problem just sitting there drinking it all in. But after a while . . . my mind wandered around. A lot. The local priest who says the EF speaks very quietly (even the parts that are supposed to be aloud are hard to make out), and I end up lost in the missal somewhere. I still really, really like it, but I can’t do it every week either.
 
I find it helpful to pray with the priest as he prays the Mass. Try not to think of yourself as a mere observer but as one who is actively and prayerfully participating.
 
You don’t have to be speaking aloud in the church to be participating. Pray. The priest is facing God and praying. Pray with him. Pray for him. Pray along with the missal, or even pray privately.
 
While I generally attend the NO, I try to attend a Tridentine Mass once every month. And everytime I go, it definitely humbles me.

What I’m getting from what you’ve written is that you’re looking at the finger pointing to the moon, not the moon itself (to use and age old axiom). How you’ve described your first time at the Mass is eerily similar to how some of my Protestant friends describe Catholic masses they’ve attended in the past: beautiful, full of symbolism, rich with tradition, yadda yadda, but they’d rather their own church services.

I’m not saying that the Latin Mass is better than the Novus Ordo - I’m not about to argue with the one true Church headed by Jesus Christ himself - but there are reasons that we still have the old Mass, and it’s not simply just so we can choose which one to go to on any given Sunday.

One thing that the Tridentine Mass does so well - and definitely something every Catholic should attend several times a year - is that it reminds you why you’re a Christian in the first place. See that tabernacle, just behind the altar? You know that thing you’re always forgetting when that young drummer does an amazing fill that just raises your spirits, or perhaps you just don’t see it most of the time as the priest is blocking it while facing the congregation? That’s Jesus, the real Christ, manifested by his whole person in those little communion wafers inside that tabernacle. Let’s make no mistake that most of us forget that (just watch how many people genuflect when there is no Most Blessed Sacrament in the tabernacle. It’s amazing).

We’re here because of Jesus, God Incarnate. Every Sunday, we’re making a real sacrifice to God. The priest is the mediator between us and God for the sacrifice, and we’re behind him every step of the way. He may speak silently, but rather than strain to listen to him, remember that he’s praying to God. Don’t worry about being on the same line, just be on the same wavelength, and the Holy Spirit will do the rest =).

Along with the Latin Mass being timeless and essentially the same all around the world, it definitely humbles us greater than the Novus Ordo. I say this because with the newer rite we generally add our local flavour in celebrating the Eucharist. While nothing can theoretically be wrong with it, more often than not, we start to see ourselves before the Eucharist.

Nevertheless, if you find yourself better following the NO, and that you can better follow and serve the Lord with its advantages, by all means =)
 
Well as a drummer who does play for the Liturgy somewhat regularly, I certainly try to avoid anything so extravagant as to distract people from prayer 🙂 But I digress…

All of you are touching on good points. As a theology student in college, and someone who’ll soon be starting a two-year journey toward an MA in Theology, I’m definitely on board with understanding that the participation in the Tridentine Mass is more passive – to use the terminology of the older days, we “assist” at Mass by praying with the Priest who offers the sacrifice. And yet, I think there’s some bit of irony in that it was often said, in the pre-Vatican II Church, that we “heard” mass. Of course I don’t suggest that attendance at a Tridentine Mass is entirely passive, but I feel like something is lost in the frequent passivity. Like someone up above me said, at several times in the mass I find myself lost in the Missal, flipping around to find where the priest has made it to while I’ve been thinking we were at another spot.

Of course, I’m doing my best to pray and be attentive at the whole mass, but I think there’s something to be said for the congregation taking a more active, vocal part in the prayer of the Mass as they do very heavily in the Novus Ordo, and to a slightly lesser extent in the Liturgies of St. John Chrysostom and St. Basil. The Mass is the highest prayer of the Church, the source and summit of our life, and so I think there’s something special about the congregation’s participation in the substantial prayers of the mass, as opposed to following along in silence. When we pray interiorly in our spirit during the Mass, it’s true that we participate in it – but to be speaking specific words and prayers particular to the Liturgy, rather than praying interiorly with much of the same prayers we’d offer at other times in the week helps to highlight, in my experience at least, that the Mass is a very unique prayer in the life of the Church.

That objection aside, as I’ve spent this weekend reading through a small Missal booklet, I’m amazed at how much humbler and more thorough many of the prayers are – and yet, in some cases, I still find myself wishing I could actually speak those prayers myself instead of merely having a server speak them on my behalf. The Confiteor, for example… It’s profoundly beautiful that the priest prays it addressing the people, and then the people pray it back, addressing the priest – except we don’t actually get to do that.

Now I know this was a pretty lengthy post that deals mostly with my criticism, but don’t get me wrong – I think the Latin Mass is as beautiful as any other and I plan to attend it once in awhile in my Liturgical “rotation” if you want to call it that. It’s just that single issue that strikes me the most in the midst of everything that I’m awestruck by at the Mass.
 
St. Boniface in Pittsburgh does have more participation (which my wife enjoys being a new Catholic herself). I have heard (I’m post Vatican 2) in the old days people would pray during the non-participitory parts.
 
I would love to be able to participate in a Tridentine High Mass (a sung Mass) again.

I converted to the Catholic faith in 1953, as a 9 year old child. I learned the Latin, so I could understand what was going on in the Mass. I could never understand why “birth Catholics” rarely could understand the Mass, and why they failed to participate.

I began serving Mass almost the day I was baptized (at the age of 13). I continued to serve Mass during my 10 years in the Army. (I attended daily Mass whenever possible, and served almost every day except Sunday, which was reserved for the younger servers).

I also learned to sing Gregorian Chant at the age of 9, and I loved (and still do love) that music).

I still do not understand why Roman Catholics simply refused to learn the language of their church.

In the course of my military career, I went to Germany, Vietnam, Korea, Turkey, all over the USA and to Panama. I loved the fact that the Mass was exactly the same, other than the Epistle, Gospel and homily, everywhere I went in the world. Sadly, that is no longer the case, and I get almost nothing from attending Mass in non-English speaking parts of the world.

The Church lost a fantastic library of music with the change to local languages and “modern” music. I do not believe that this loss has been of any favor to either the Church, or to the faithful.

In my diocese, there are less than 5 priests that are capable of celebrating a Mass in Latin. 3 of them can read the words, but they do not understand the meaning (which detracts from the celebration in my belief). The other two are retired priests, who learned Latin in seminary, and celebrated the Latin Mass for years.

By the way, a priest does NOT say the Mass, in English, Latin or any other language. He C E L E B R A T E S the Mass. He is celebrating the Eucharistic Feast!
 
CFXDrummer said:
When we pray interiorly in our spirit during the Mass, it’s true that we participate in it – but to be speaking specific words and prayers particular to the Liturgy, rather than praying interiorly with much of the same prayers we’d offer at other times in the week helps to highlight, in my experience at least, that the Mass is a very unique prayer in the life of the Church.

That objection aside, as I’ve spent this weekend reading through a small Missal booklet, I’m amazed at how much humbler and more thorough many of the prayers are – and yet, in some cases, I still find myself wishing I could actually speak those prayers myself instead of merely having a server speak them on my behalf. The Confiteor, for example… It’s profoundly beautiful that the priest prays it addressing the people, and then the people pray it back, addressing the priest – except we don’t actually get to do that.
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I almost always *pray *the Confiteor (as opposed to just reading the words) when assisting at a TLM. Even if our neighbors in the pews cannot hear us, God can.

Many of the other prayers of the TLM are also easy and inspiring to pray.

I had the same problem that you did, losing track of where the priest is in the Mass, but really, that are a lot of cues that you’re probably missing now that will tell you where he is, when you get more familiar with the Mass.

It isn’t a big deal anyway, if you get a little out of synch with what the priest is saying at the moment. If, with an awareness that you are in God’s holy presence, you are adoring the blessed Trinity, or offering thanksgiving and praise, or asking God and His saints to help you to become more conformed to His will, then you are worthily assisting at Mass, IMHO.
 
CFXDrummer said:
My biggest problem, however, was my own lack of participation. Much of the Eucharistic Prayer is said inaudibly by the priest, and while I can read along in a missal, it isn’t quite the same as hearing the words audibly. And many of the responses are simply sung by the choir of chanters (who are AMAZING), and I find that the majority of my time at mass is spent twiddling my thumbs in the pew. Now, I say that with some sarcasm because of course I was keeping myself attentive to the Mass, but it was still a bit of a difficulty.
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I can understand what you mean; the lack of responses on my part was a new thing, very new.

I approached it by simply considering the fact that in the TLM, I am praying as my parents and grandparents and ancestors back to the Middle Ages and beyond did. I took it as an opportunity to help deepen and focus myself on the liturgy instead of what I’m accustomed to - having my focus directed during the Novus Ordo.

Perhaps you might find that helpful, next time?
 
preV2tradcath said:
Thank you for starting this thread and sharing your experience with us. A good explination of why the canon (eucharistic prayer) is and should be said silently can be read by clicking here.

@kozlosap, the priest is not just having his back to the people. He is facing the same way they are and leading them in the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.
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Thanks for the clafification preV2! I wasn’t able to attend today, but next Sunday I plan on attending a High Mass which is held every Sunday at 11:00 AM. 😉
 
Why were you twiddling your thumbs when you are supposed to be praying? I think your problem is probably that you are not used to thinking and praying freely yourself during mass, internal prayer is how you participate at the mass in the extraordinary form you don’t just sit watching, it is not passive that is not correct at all it is just hidden.
 
You have to look at the Mass (any Mass) for what it is - the same sacrifice of Christ on Calvary. Look at the few faithful who were there at the cross and how did they ‘participate?’ It was an interior self offering in union w/ Christ’s suffering. It was one of profound contemplation. Even when the Priest (Christ) addressed those present (like when Christ gave us His Mother) the response was an interior one - an interior, prayerful response and acceptance.

No one ever participated more fully and ‘actively’ in the sacrifice of the Mass than the Blessed Virgin - we should learn from Her just what ‘participation’ truly means.
 
Although I attend the OF on occassion, I would attend the TLM exclusively, if I could afford the gas. I have no great affection for the OF but fully recognize it as a valid Mass.
 
I said in my original post that I said “twiddling my thumbs” in a tongue-in-cheek manner… I wasn’t ACTUALLY sitting there doing nothing, I was of course making every effort to pray fervently. It was just my little way of explaining the lack of dialogue in the Mass.

I’m sure it’s something that comes with practice, and with increased familiarity with the extraordinary form… I know I’ll grow more comfortable in it as time passes.
 
I like the EF, but I dislike.
-The Lack of Participation of the People.
-The Silent prayers.
-Instead of Paying attention, I spend half the time lost in the Missal.
-It’s a long drive from my house.
 
CFXDrummer said:
I said in my original post that I said “twiddling my thumbs” in a tongue-in-cheek manner… I wasn’t ACTUALLY sitting there doing nothing, I was of course making every effort to pray fervently. It was just my little way of explaining the lack of dialogue in the Mass.

I’m sure it’s something that comes with practice, and with increased familiarity with the extraordinary form… I know I’ll grow more comfortable in it as time passes.
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How much or how little dialogue occurs is up to you. Think of it this way at the ordinary form you pray to God in fixed terms not necessarily fully engaged going through the motions with everyone else, at the extraordinary form you are free to talk to God and also to listen as much as you want to in the manner you want, it just all takes place internally.

You don’t need to open your mouth to talk to God my friend He is within you and knows your every thought.
 
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