FLDS as true LDS

[why_me]

I understand that. It would still be un-Christian.

The problem with this statement is: it can also be used against catholics. To say that a christian faith is unchristian is to make a judgement based on your own perceptions of what exactly a christian is. The polygamous family in the video seem to have a very christian family, perhaps more so than most christian families. The father is a loving father and the mothers are loving mothers. Not bad at all.

 

[why_me]

a lot of modern mormans nvever heard of morman polygamy. apparently it is something they wish to not talk about.

recenlty I have brought up the subject with a couple of young mormans i know. the first never heard of it. the second had heard of it but said it was because of the shortage of men in the mormona camps, because of the wars.

I asked which wars but this youngseter was unable to identify which ones.

i gather that there is a weak grasp of mormann history among them.

I doubt this very much. Most know that Brigham had more than one wife. Polgamy is quite well known be non-mormons, never mind mormons.

In terms of history, most americans do not know their own history never mind the history of their church.

 

[why_me]

I began my comments by acknowledging my own inherent bigotry. (That’s what I meant when I said “I don’t think I can be objective…”)

I haven’t seen the video mentioned, but I’m sure there are some functional polygamist families in the world. Good for them. I think everyone should do what he or she wants.

Here you go brother LaMar:

166.70.44.68/multimedia/pluralfamily/

I think that I could be quite happy in this family as husband…what about you?

 

[why_me]

I haven’t seen the more normal types, except portrayed by fictional characters on HBO. I’m sure they exist and I wish them well. Provided everyone’s of age to choose his or her own lifestyle, and there’s nobody being coerced or mistreated, I support folks doing what they want, and don’t want my tax money used to bother them.

This family is right out of HBO and big love. It just looks like a normal happy family except there are three wives and many children. All the rest is ‘Leave it to Beaver’.

 

[why_me]

I sure don’t mind my taxes going to stop these crimes. We have an age of informed consent for a reason. You just aren’t allowed to coerce teenagers into sex or pimp out your children.

The family in the video that I posted are not criminals. Just mothers and a father loving their children. Or should I say: Raising a righteous seed?

 

[why_me]

LaMar,

I wasn’t referring to your post. And I resent your tone which seems quite condescending. You are welcome here as a guest, but you are not welcome to be rude to the rest of us.

Melanie, the mormons on this forum have not been treated very well either. I suppose that it comes with the turf. But if you think about it, in this section of the forum, the catholics are the guests since the catholics are discussing someone elses faith.

 

[MelanieAnne]

The problem with this statement is: it can also be used against catholics. To say that a christian faith is unchristian is to make a judgement based on your own perceptions of what exactly a christian is. The polygamous family in the video seem to have a very christian family, perhaps more so than most christian families. The father is a loving father and the mothers are loving mothers. Not bad at all.

The Catholic Church was founded by Jesus Christ.

The Mormon Church was founded by Joseph Smith.

By any definition of Christian based on theology, Mormons are non-Christian. Christian is a faith based on theological doctrine, it’s not a judgment based on anyone’s perceptions. The Mormon Doctrine of the Godhead is so different from Christian doctrine that it is classified as a separate religion. The “Jesus Christ” that is part of the name of their religion is not the same Jesus Christ worshipped by Christian churches.

You seem to define Christian in the way people behave. That may be the way you see it, and you may be comfortable with your perceptions, but that doesn’t make it so. As a matter of Doctrine, Mormons are not Christian. It’s not a slight, it’s just a fact.

 

[MelanieAnne]

Melanie, the mormons on this forum have not been treated very well either. I suppose that it comes with the turf. But if you think about it, in this section of the forum, the catholics are the guests since the catholics are discussing someone elses faith.

Catholic Answers (that’s the name) Forum rules, no matter where you are, require that all members treat one other charitably. There is no exception for this particular area of the forum. That you believe that Mormons haven’t been treated very well does not excuse anyone from deliberately mistreating another forum member.

The internet is loaded with places where people are free to read, post some cheap shot, and then scurry away to gloat over their own cleverness. This is not one of those places. Persons whose maturity level finds such behavior entertaining should seek other places to “play”.

People do not have to agree with other posters, but that disagreement does not give them the right to make accusations of stupidity, incoherence or other such pejoratives. That’s just rude. Rudeness is NOT part of the discourse here, at least not the sort of discourse intended by the creators of the forum. Indeed, rudeness is generally a sign that you cannot support your position.

 

[zaffiroborant]

The family in the video that I posted are not criminals. Just mothers and a father loving their children. Or should I say: Raising a righteous seed?

Except polygamy isn’t legal and adultery isn’t righteous.

 

[ibkc]

The problem with this statement is: it can also be used against catholics. To say that a christian faith is unchristian is to make a judgement based on your own perceptions of what exactly a christian is.

Since Mormons are not Christians, and didn’t even claim to be Christians until recently, we don’t have a problem here.

The polygamous family in the video seem to have a very christian family, perhaps more so than most christian families.

Now who’s judging? In any case, this is a preposterous claim to make after watching a video lasting three minutes long. You have no idea what goes on in that house. Maybe it’s uptopia. Maybe it’s hell. I personally found it incredibly creepy that they didn’t show the husband’s face. Maybe that’s a good sign that they’re doing something they shouldn’t be doing.

 

[J_C]

I doubt this very much. Most know that Brigham had more than one wife. Polgamy is quite well known be non-mormons, never mind mormons.

doubt if you want, but i know at least one young mormann whose only knowledge about Brighamm Young is that a college is named after him. well, she knows about p0lygamy now, i gawrantee it! next step will be to make sure she learns about D&C 132 (is that the right section?) where Emma is threateened with “destruction” unless she keeps her mouth shut.

In terms of history, most americans do not know their own history never mind the history of their church.

I’d say that is true, and true of mormonns as well as everyone else.

but americans do watch tv, and are keen on coverage of latter day saints who live on “compounds” near Waco, dress strange, act weird, have to be rounded up by deputies, have a temple with a wall around it that needs a helicopter to get over (i guess to keep out the impure), and whose prophet is behind bars for child abuse.

this type of press coverage works well to spark a conversation about history, whouldn’t you think?

 

[J_C]

Give us chapter and verse in the OT where God “sanctioned polygamy”. Just because the bible reports that someone did something, that doesn’t mean that God commanded or sanctioned it.

Paul

I guess whymee isn’t going to respond to this. i wonder why.

 

[xmormon]

I guess whymee isn’t going to respond to this. i wonder why.

Hi I will respond. Get your pen out etc. and write these down Why Me and others for future reference.

When God created humans He instituted His plan for marriage: one man should have one wife. Genesis 2:24 states: “Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife; and they shall be one flesh.”

The first mention of polygamy in the Bible is Genesis 4:19: "And Lamech [a descendant of Cain] took unto him two wives..." But this was not attributed to instructions from God.

If there was ever a justification for polygamy it would seem to have been needed when Adam and Eve were to populate the earth. Yet we see the pattern of just one woman and one man.

The same pattern is carried out by Noah at the time of the Ark (Genesis 7:7). Noah took his one wife into the ark. Again, if polygamy were ordained of God, why didn't He tell Noah to take additional wives to repopulate the earth faster?

God instructed Moses that the kings of Israel were to have only one wife: "Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away." (Deut. 17:17)

This is exactly what happened with Solomon. We read in I Kings 11:4: "For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the LORD his God, as was the heart of David his father."

David's heart was right with God because he did not turn to other gods, not because he practiced polygamy.

LDS will sometimes point to 2 Samuel 12:8 to prove that David's wives were approved by God. But that verse indicates that he inherited Saul's wives, not that David actually married them by God's appointment. It was the custom of the time for the succeeding ruler to receive all of the prior ruler's property and women. This is not a proof that God intends people to practice polygamy. It is contrary to the pattern of marriage established with Adam and Eve and His instructions in Deuteronomy.

Just as divorce was permitted, so too was polygamy. But it does not represent God's will. In Matt. 19:3-9 the Pharisees asked Jesus about divorce and Jesus answered: "Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female, And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife; and they twain [two] shall be one flesh? Wherefore they are no more twain [two], but one flesh."

The Pharisees then asked him why Moses allowed for divorce. Jesus answered: "Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so" (Matt.19:7).

In the New Testament the practice of polygamy would have kept a man from leadership in the church. Paul instructed Timothy: "A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife..." (I Tim.3:2)

Paul also wrote to Titus: "...ordain elders in every city...if any be blameless, the husband of one wife..." (Titus 1:6)

Thus we see that there is no teaching in the Bible that plural marriage was ever part of God's religious instruction to His people.

Tiber diving team of 2004 (we go deeper to penetrate the darkness with the light)

 

[LaMar]

Here you go brother LaMar:

166.70.44.68/multimedia/pluralfamily/

I think that I could be quite happy in this family as husband…what about you?

I respect the fact that you’re openminded about it all. Admittedly, it doesn’t look like a safety hazard or an issue for law enforcement, but it’s not the way I’d choose to live.

One theoretical downfall to this scenario is the fact that a fella with 20 children is not going to have time enough to have a meaningful relationship with each of them. If each of those 20 children have 3 children, that’s 100 descendants (counting spouses) so it’s going to be even more ridiculous as a grandparent.

People in families with 1-4 children are run ragged too, but fathers at least get a chance to do some meaningful parenting. This guy probably doesn’t know much more about them than names and birthdates. If he makes an effort to single one or two out to bond with, the others will imagine him to be playing favorites. If he holds himself aloof, he misses out on the most fun any male human being is going to be able to have.

He probably works really hard, comes home late, gets up early, and does it again. It resembles 3 single mothers living together with an absent father more than it does a functional home.

That’s just my opinion, but you asked for it.

 

[tundramom]

He probably works really hard, comes home late, gets up early, and does it again. It resembles 3 single mothers living together with an absent father more than it does a functional home.

That’s just my opinion, but you asked for it.

LaMar,
In my own experiences, the husband might work, but he isn’t the main breadearner. Usually one or two of the wives will stay home to homeschool and take care of the younger ones, while the other wives work. Not to mention the welfare ones who our tax dollars go to support. Welfare monies, WIC programs, Food Shelves, … you name it.

I was a single Mom at one time. Worked my tail to the bone trying to keep a roof over mine and my daughter’s heads and food on the table. During this time, I didn’t collect any food stamps, welfare or anything because I made “too much” money.

Something must be done about all these families.

in Christ
Steph

 

[MelanieAnne]

I agree Steph. If these multiple families choose to live the way they do, it’s not my business. When they want the rest of us to pay for their lifestyle, that becomes the business of the rest of us. They can choose to live as they like, as long as there are no issues about child abuse, violence, etc., but they should not expect us to pay for their choice.

 

[pnewton]

The family in the video that I posted are not criminals. Just mothers and a father loving their children. Or should I say: Raising a righteous seed?

I was referring to the Texas compound. And in Texas, sex with children is a criminal act.

 

[xmydreamsfadex]

it’s hard enough to please one wife, i could only imagine trying to please a few other wives… sheesh…
i love my wife though.

 

[J_C]

The family in the video that I posted are not criminals. Just mothers and a father loving their children. Or should I say: Raising a righteous seed?

whyme, i’m curious if you have a response to post #73. earlier you had made statements that polygamy was approved by God in OT times. xmormon did a pretty good layout of why your interpretation is wrong. if you have no response, i guess we can disregard those things you said earlier, as being incorrect.

 

[zaffiroborant]

whyme, i’m curious if you have a response to post #73. earlier you had made statements that polygamy was approved by God in OT times. xmormon did a pretty good layout of why your interpretation is wrong. if you have no response, i guess we can disregard those things you said earlier, as being incorrect.

And if not we can disregard the claims of being Catholic.