For the record: Rome has given SSPX right to ordain priests without permission of local ordinary

[johnnyc176]

Starting at the 15:25 mark in the video below, His Excellency Bishop Bernard Fellay, states:

Last year, I received a letter from Rome, telling me you can freely ordain your priests without the permission of the local ordinary. So if I can freely ordain that means the ordination is recognized by the Church not just as valid but in order. … So this is one more step in this acceptance that we are, let me call it, 'normal Catholics.

rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2017/05/for-record-rome-has-given-sspx-right-to.html?m=0

 

[twf]

If true, this is earth-shattering. It wasn’t that long ago that Pope Benedict stated that the priests of the Society have “no ministry” in the Church. If this happened last year, why wasn’t it all over Catholic news?

 

[PaulfromIowa]

This is not really a secret, it has been mentioned before. Pope Francis has granted several free gifts to the SSPX, asking for nothing in return. He is clearly hoping to regularize them back into the Church. The fact is that the SSPX has been ordaining priests for forty years without proper permission. It was only their consecration of four bishops in defiance of Pope John Paul II that led to a real break with the Church.

 

[Randolph]

This is not really a secret, it has been mentioned before. Pope Francis has granted several free gifts to the SSPX, asking for nothing in return. He is clearly hoping to regularize them back into the Church. The fact is that the SSPX has been ordaining priests for forty years without proper permission. It was only their consecration of four bishops in defiance of Pope John Paul II that led to a real break with the Church.

I understand the SSPX topic is against forum rules. I personally hope and pray for a reconciliation. There are many good priests and people there. But to be clear, unless it is news otherwise, SSPX has been illicitly ordained priests and bishops.

 

[johnnyc176]

This is not really a secret,

I did not realize that it was already known that the SSPX could ordain without permission from local ordinary. I had only heard of confession and marriage. When was it let on about Holy Orders?

 

[Edmundus1581]

I didn’t watch all of it, but in the section I saw I felt that Bp Fellay was implying that the Pope’s recognition of SSPX sacraments (previously confession and marriage, and now, allegedly ordination) was not a concession given from authority, but rather a recognition that the sacraments were valid, and always had been, and always will be.

I don’t think he said it quite so directly, but did anyone else get that impression?

Of course, we don’t want to start a discussion here of whether they are licit (no time…, and probably against forum rules), but I’m just curious as to whether that was in Fellay’s tone?

“So if I can freely ordain that means the ordination is recognized by the Church not just as valid but in order. … So this is one more step in this acceptance that we are, let me call it, ‘normal Catholics.’”

 

[Randolph]

I didn’t watch all of it, but in the section I saw I felt that Bp Fellay was implying that the Pope’s recognition of SSPX sacraments (previously confession and marriage, and now, allegedly ordination) was not a concession given from authority, but rather a recognition that the sacraments were valid, and always had been, and always will be.

I don’t think he said it quite so directly, but did anyone else get that impression?

Of course, we don’t want to start a discussion here of whether they are licit (no time…, and probably against forum rules), but I’m just curious as to whether that was in Fellay’s tone?

“So if I can freely ordain that means the ordination is recognized by the Church not just as valid but in order. … So this is one more step in this acceptance that we are, let me call it, ‘normal Catholics.’”

It would be wise and prudent that we wait for the official words of the Church. Otherwise, it should be treated, at best, as speculation.

 

[OaTmEaL]

It would be wise and prudent that we wait for the official words of the Church. Otherwise, it should be treated, at best, as speculation.

Francis himself said during the post-Fatima in-flight press conference that the SSPX submits laicization requests to the CDF for their approval. This seems to be a tacit admission that Rome approves of the SSPX ordinations. Otherwise, why would the CDF waste their time “undoing” an ordination that they never approved in the first place?

 

[pnewton]

It would be wise and prudent that we wait for the official words of the Church. Otherwise, it should be treated, at best, as speculation.

I would think so. “For the record” should really wait until there is something on record.

 

[Edmundus1581]

I would think so. “For the record” should really wait until there is something on record.

Yes, but we can talk about what Bp Fellay said. That is on record.

I thought it a little bit interesting that he had, perhaps, the attitude that the concessions we already know about, and the possible new one, are not actually concessions (voluntarily given by temporal authority) but recognition by Rome of the licitness of SSPX sacraments.

A little bit interesting, to someone who has had a passing interest in SSPX for many years.

 

[PaulfromIowa]

I didn’t watch all of it, but in the section I saw I felt that Bp Fellay was implying that the Pope’s recognition of SSPX sacraments (previously confession and marriage, and now, allegedly ordination) was not a concession given from authority, but rather a recognition that the sacraments were valid, and always had been, and always will be.

The Church has always recognized the validity of SSPX ordinations, although not their liceity.

See:

canonlawmadeeasy.com/2013/08/01/are-sspx-sacraments-valid-part-i/
“Are SSPX sacraments valid?”

 

[pnewton]

Yes, but we can talk about what Bp Fellay said. That is on record.

I wouldn’t call it a record. It is hearsay, unaccredited hearsay at that. I am all for any regularization of their ministry, but until that happens, anything official must come from the Holy See. That is the only record that I, as a Catholic, will accept.