For the "scientists" here who believe in evolution: what will we evolve into next?

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Ghosty:
Tom of Assisi: Evolution DOES stop if the pressures no longer exist. That’s the whole basis for Darwinian theory in the first place. When humans eliminate the pressures through technology, then we no long have to physically evolve.
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soooo…**environmental **pressures determine whether or not our genes randomly mutate during sexual reproduction??? If a change occurs in the genome of a family or population, and that change allows for greater reproductive success then it will be an example of evolution an alteration from one generation to the next.

What happens to trees does not influence how our genes randomly mutate. Not everything can be explained away through some environmental excuse.

Evolution does not stop. Please cite some scientific sources that imply sexual reproduction can occur without mutations and shifts in the gene pool.

Soon…you will be ME…prepare yourself
 
Hmmmmm. Why do some of the Catholic evolutionists insist evolution MUST have happened in the past…but can’t be happening now? Double standard anyone…

Maybe these Catholic evolutionists’ descendants will turn into ape-like creatures again (different ones of course–I’m not suggesting de-evolution here).
 
Tom of Assisi: Don’t confuse mutation of genes with evolution of a species, as they are not the same things. Evolution of a species is a shift of the genes of a set of the population, or the entire population, based on selective pressures. Mutations constantly occur, even in our own bodies, but they are not selected because a) they do not provide for better survival, and b) they are eliminated by genetic recombination in sexual reproduction.

For true evolution to occur, the mutation must not be “drowned out” in sexual reproduction, which requires that a reasonably large subset of the population has this mutation, which requires that the mutation allows for those who have it to survive to breeding age better than those who don’t. Without these factors, species evolution does not occur.

The reason that evolution has stopped in humans is that we control our environment to such a degree that our survivability is no longer greatly affected by minor genetic mutations. A sickly child can and will survive to breeding age, a dark skinned child who lives in a snowy climate will survive, ect. Without such selective elimination favoring certain mutations over others, evolution effectively ceases, while mutation in individuals may indeed occur.
 
Actually we as Catholics have no problem with evolution, as long as it is understood that God is the author of the physical world and it is he who put everything into motion and that at some point along the way he took our species and breathed life into us and gave us a soul and completed his physical work and his spiritual developement in us and we no longer number with the animals or any other species. we have been created in Gods image(either instantaneously or slowly over time) and that God had always had our finished product in mind because the second person of the trinity became a man which gave us a level of honor which is unsurpassed simply because God graced a body(Jesus) with his presence raising the value of humanity to sons and daughters of God not just creatures of God. Christ is truly our Brother and Mary is truly our Mother. Steve
 
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Ghosty:
Tom of Assisi: Don’t confuse mutation of genes with evolution of a species, as they are not the same things. Evolution of a species is a shift of the genes of a set of the population, or the entire population, based on selective pressures. Mutations constantly occur, even in our own bodies, but they are not selected because a) they do not provide for better survival, and b) they are eliminated by genetic recombination in sexual reproduction.

For true evolution to occur, the mutation must not be “drowned out” in sexual reproduction, which requires that a reasonably large subset of the population has this mutation, which requires that the mutation allows for those who have it to survive to breeding age better than those who don’t. Without these factors, species evolution does not occur.

The reason that evolution has stopped in humans is that we control our environment to such a degree that our survivability is no longer greatly affected by minor genetic mutations. A sickly child can and will survive to breeding age, a dark skinned child who lives in a snowy climate will survive, ect. Without such selective elimination favoring certain mutations over others, evolution effectively ceases, while mutation in individuals may indeed occur.
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bullcrap. Give me your recent sources to support your misunderstanding of evolution.
 
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fulloftruth:
Actually we as Catholics have no problem with evolution, as long as it is understood that God is the author of the physical world and it is he who put everything into motion and that at some point along the way ***he took our species and breathed life into us and gave us a soul ***and completed his physical work and his spiritual developement in us and we no longer number with the animals or any other species. we have been created in Gods image(either instantaneously or slowly over time) and that God had always had our finished product in mind because the second person of the trinity became a man which gave us a level of honor which is unsurpassed simply because God graced a body(Jesus) with his presence raising the value of humanity to sons and daughters of God not just creatures of God. Christ is truly our Brother and Mary is truly our Mother. Steve
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bullcrap. are you suggesting that our “ancestors” were not alive until God breathed life into them. All living things have souls…animals have animal souls. Did God take a dead ape…breath into it and make it into Adam…who then was raised by ape creatures…

pck one: the world or Christ. you cannot live in a fantasy world of your own devising by clinging to tennants of both.
 
Actually the animals in this world do not have the souls that we have. And yes, It is very possible(the church has never said one way or the other) that man may have come from apes but that at a very distinct instance in history, a specific moment, man, with all of his faculties to love and reason and so on, came into existence. Since God is the author of both Scripture and the physical world, they will never contradict eachother, and nothing I have said goes against anything in the creation story as written in Genesis. On the sixth day God created man, we don’t know, since the church has never said one way or the other whether those six days were literal 24 hour periods or they were longer periods of time symbolized by the word day. Just like the one hundred and fourty four thousand, and the 1000 years reign in Revelation, neither of which were meant to be taken literally, so could the 7 days be symbolic. None of this takes away from the actual creation narrative being literal in its events. I caution you to not paint yourself into a picture that science will eventually prove to be false, the Church has been wise enough not to. Science will always confirm the churches teachings, rest assured. It may very well be true that we did not come from apes( I happen to take this particular stance, because I have not seen any evidence to confirm that we have) But the church is wise enough to let science figure it out, and that way she will not lose credibility like every other end times predicting, protestant, left behind series Church in the US.
 
ev¡o¡lu¡tion cache.lexico.com/dictionary/graphics/AHD4/JPG/pron.jpg ( P ) Pronunciation Key (http://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/...o.com/dictionary/graphics/AHD4/GIF/schwa.gifn, http://cache.lexico.com/dictionary/...o.com/dictionary/graphics/AHD4/GIF/schwa.gif-)
n.

  1. *]A gradual process in which something changes into a different and usually more complex or better form. See Synonyms at development.

    1. *]
      • The process of developing.
        *]Gradual development.
        *]Biology.

        1. *]
        • Change in the genetic composition of a population during successive generations, as a result of natural selection acting on the genetic variation among individuals, and resulting in the development of new species.
          *]The historical development of a related group of organisms; phylogeny.
          *]A movement that is part of a set of ordered movements.
          *]Mathematics. The extraction of a root of a quantity.

          It doesn’t get much more basic than that. The dictionary says exactly what I just said, and in far fewer words.
 
Tom of Assisi:
That is simply not correct. What book on evolutionary theory published in the last ten years are you citing? Leave Sagan out–he was not an evolutionary biologist at all…just an liberal socialist pig.

Evolution does not just stop, and there is no reason to think it has for humans unless you are bending science to fit your theology…something the Catholic evolutionists here seem to think is a very bad thing 😛
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What books have you been reading? Please explain how humans are evolving and into what we are evolving. What evolutionary (environmental) pressures are selecting which traits?

My post had nothing to do with theology. It had to do with science. Please reread it.

I never considered Carl Sagan in my post. He was a cosmologist and an athiest.

Please clean up your language. Gutter language is the sign of an uneducated and ignorant person and is entirely unnecessary on these threads.
 
And it’s Tom of Assisi by a nose…

<< Please clean up your language. Gutter language is the sign of an uneducated and ignorant person and is entirely unnecessary on these threads. >>

Looks like he needs to evolve a little higher then…

Here’s a nice short book on this subject

The Journey of Man: A Genetic Odyssey

I saw this evolution thread was becoming extinct, thought I would give it a little more punctuated equilibria and put it on the first page for a while again…

You never can have too many evolution threads… :mad:

Phil P
 
Tom of Assisi:
Sagan is indeed a pig–one who is roasting in hell about now–you might call him a stuffed pig.
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You weaken your already shaky credibility with statements like this. Last time I checked, judging hearts and lives was part of God’s job description. Did I miss the special announcement that assigned those tasks to you?

Natural selection is a mechanism for change. The kinds of change being discussed in this thread, by and large, are broad, species-wide changes and are not discernible by looking at a few hundred million people, visually, over a few generations. It takes a lot more time for them to show up. And you really need to observe them by studying the DNA.

Please learn the difference between “natural selection” and the “origin of species”. The latter is what you are referring to when you rant about evolution.

Please don’t assume that just because I offer a correction to your rant that I am some “liberal”. Name-calling is the provence of those who have no legitimate answers.(Just paraphrasing the author(s) of some of the stuff on anti-Catholicism here at CA)

I don’t think that you are successfully sharpening your axe.

deborah1313:nope:
 
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Strider:
Please clean up your language. Gutter language is the sign of an uneducated and ignorant person and is entirely unnecessary on these threads.
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Sorry I did not realize you were the language police. What is more offensive…to use the word “bullcrap” or to think you evolved from it. Don’t be so sensetive. We’re adults here. Acting like your feelings are hurt does not give you any debate points.

You’ve made your choice obviously: humans are just evolved animals–we arrived here independent of God and we have no need of Christ’s redemptive blood because there never was an act of original sin. Genesis is a myth…much of the Bible probably is, right?

You choose the world and the world’s ideology. I choose Christ.

Peace to you–may Darwin continue to bless you.
 
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deborah1313:
Last time I checked, judging hearts and lives was part of God’s job description.
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And yet you judge me…is it perhaps a case of monkey see, monkey do.

I only “judge” Sagan’s actions…last time I checked that was ok…or does our court system need an overhall.

Fine…you guys want to be the natural offspring of apes…what do I care…it is up to you to either believe in God or not. I cannot make you. If you choose darwin’s naturalistic explanation–what do I care and what can I do?

May Darwin have mercy on you on the last day…or whatever you atheists think will happen.
 
TomA << Peace to you – may Darwin continue to bless you. >>

😃 😃 :eek:

“There is grandeur in this view of life, with its several powers, having been originally breathed by the Creator into a few forms or into one; and that, whilst this planet has gone cycling on according to the fixed law of gravity, from so simple a beginning endless forms most beautiful and most wonderful have been, and are being evolved.” (Gospel According to Darwin, chapter 14, last verse, final edition)

Phil P
 
You’ve made your choice obviously: humans are just evolved animals–we arrived here independent of God and we have no need of Christ’s redemptive blood because there never was an act of original sin. Genesis is a myth…much of the Bible probably is, right?
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The only myth here is your false dicotomy of a Godless evolution or a literal Genesis Creation. None of us here are advocating Godless evolution, nor are we saying Genesis is a myth, so drop it.
 
Carl Sagan, in *Dragons of Eden, * presented some pretty good evidence that human evolution is grinding to a halt.
 
Well…Nietzsche believes the next step is the Ubermensch, or Overman…Not really a noticeable physical evolution…but an intellectual evolution…an Overman should be able to establish their own values in the world, someone willing to risk all for the sake of humanity, someone who will have a profound effect and influence on others lives in the present and be indefinitely remembered throughout history…I can go on and on…but Nietzsche and his idea of the Overman is way to complex…it ties into his belief of the eternal recurrence, etc…“With this kind of attitude and the realisation of his own limitation in life, he would then be able to face life, look back with satisfaction, realising that all pasts make him what he is today, and hence feel happy if he were to repeat that very same life eternally. An overman should then be content with his own life and appreciate every bit of it even though some of them are painful and suffering. He spends each day of his life creating beauty, which affects the minds of others through out the time, knowing that his life has values and meanings since his existence of will-to-power will live on indefinitely.”…I love Nietzsche…he is my favorite philosopher and he was one of the greatest minds to ever live in my opinion.
 
Tom of Assisi:
I only “judge” Sagan’s actions…last time I checked that was ok…or does our court system need an overhall.
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Not being nasty, but what else can you judge, and secondly it has nothing to do with court systems, but what Christ has said. You said you believe in Christ.
 
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Strider:
What books have you been reading? Please explain how humans are evolving and into what we are evolving. What evolutionary (environmental) pressures are selecting which traits?
Ans:
We are evolving into God…the notorious Omega Point!
Gutter language is the sign of an uneducated and ignorant person …
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General Patton was “Uneducated” and “ignorant” ?
Come now.
He was one of the greatest military strategists since Alexander the Great, and highly educated. He just happened to have an affection for cursing words…nothing to do with education.
I, on the other hand have purity of words and at the same time uneducated and ignorant.😉
My goal is to discover (in the method of Teilhard de Chardin) a species with .666 of a wing evolved along with .666 of a feather. Also, I await the day shortly when the “survival of the fittest” truth will finally extinct germs and Texas Mesquitos as being inferior to the English Sparrow and Texas Jack Rabbit which of course evolved from it.

And that’s the truth! So help me de Chardin.
 
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