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larkin31
Guest
I was born-again once, nearly knocked down on a street. I know all about this. No one questions the power of personal experience. But for some, that is not all there is to say about it.
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Disciple96
Guest
StrawberryJam, are you there? I tried to send you a PM but your mailbox was full and it wouldn’t go through. If you empty out some space there, I can send you my message. And my email address too.
You can reach me at my blog too: Catholic Heart and Mind
Don’t disappear on me, okay?
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Bob4BVM
Guest
Don’t complicate things, it’s simple- Jesus stands outside the door of your heart, He won’t force His way in, that part is up to you…
So, you’ve have done about all any person can do. ? Really ? And God hasn’t shown you ANYTHING, hasn’t done Anything for you, right ? I’ve heard that line a time or two.
I suggest you spend some time on your knees, up close to a crucifix.
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Bob4BVM
Guest
Huh ? Are you saying God gave you the 2x4 treatment, that youve had the experience, yet now you are agnostic ?
…not all there is to say about it ??? Please rephrase, I dont follow you
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larkin31
Guest
Yes. I had an overwhelming experience on a city sidewalk one evening. Told my family. Told my girlfriend. Went to youth Christian meetings. And still drifted away 6 months later. My point is that there is more to it all than the 2x4.
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AlbertBall
Guest
Much respect, it takes real courage to properly analysis such experiences. Lets not forget these people have ‘experienced’ god too
youtube.com/watch?v=-3uDmyGq8Ok
How i wish everyone had the mindset to properly analysis such experiences.
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itinerant1
Guest
It looks like you re-upped your membership in the Intergalactic Club of Flippancy.There is only one person on this forum whom cannot see through your position. Guess who that is lol???
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Bob4BVM
Guest
Wow, sounds like there must be alot more to it for you. I’d like to talk to you about it. maybe we can ‘compare notes’. PM me if you want to do it away from all this noise.
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Mr_Skeptic
Guest
I’d like to see the results, and how you come to that conclusion, in the public fora. Thanks.
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simplynoone
Guest
It is error alone which needs the support of government. Truth can stand by itself. ~ Thomas Jefferson
I never thought that it was prudent of those who claim to know God to write a book (or anything really) to, as they say, “prove” that God exists. Then, I wonder … what god is it that such a person is worshiping that they feel the need to prove the existence of that god to everyone else … even, seeking the approval of the “others” in regard to their idea of that god?
Truth, indeed, exists with or without the acknowledgement of us … and if we need “our” acknowledgement … then, it is only merely what we perceive to be the truth in which we so desperately wish for others to accept.
I have often wondered at night, I hear the chirping in harmony of the insects around me in Nature and am in awe by the uniformity though they are functioning separately from one another. Is there the same “DO IT” in their head that is in my own head telling them to chirp … then, what makes me, as the human who is often praised for intelligence any different from these simple “creatures” existing w/in the same realm of nature as am I.
Often I question why it is we are not in harmony as they are … and the many other species of LIFE that are living amongst us. Yet, no longer do I question whether there is a Creator of it all … because OF COURSE … there is.
That we may not function in what we perceive to be harmony could merely be our “handicap” … much like the one that we would like to only attribute to the animal kingdom which does, actually, act in harmony w/ one another … unlike ourselves. Then, like the comet that was sent to wipe out the dinosaurs once upon a time, we may only be serving as such a type of destruction …
And in that case, to bring it back to the point of the thread, the truth exists w/in and w/out our acknowledgement of it. To one who needs a book to prove the existence of the Creator of LIFE, I find myself laughing within at the irony of such a thing … for who and how it is it needs to be proved by man. It is rather silly, really, by anyone claiming to have the Truth. :yup:
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larkin31
Guest
That’s enough sharing on that topic for me, thanks. This was my way of stating only that there is more to faith, for many people, than personal experience–but yes, personal experience is a very strong factor!
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AlbertBall
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Bob4BVM
Guest
You are certainly correct on that, it is a huge overall picture that God designs to fit within the unique shape of every life He creates. A personal fit for each of His unique creatures !
I’m open to talk anytime, if you want.
God bless you in your search.
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Bob4BVM
Guest
Yeah sure Albert, like I said to you before, if you only knew what has happened in my life.
Yeah, I believe all right…Like I believe that gravity holds me to the earth.
It’s not at all belief like you define belief .
Like gravity, I cannot explain it, but I do KNOW it is there.
You have NO idea what my experience has been, so don’t be telling me what I do or do not know.
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AlbertBall
Guest
It doesn’t matter, the point is KNOWLEDGE is NOT subjective!!! So i AM telling you that you don’t KNOW, you believe.
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itinerant1
Guest
What about self-knowledge?
“Socrates, call the Oracle at Delphi. ‘Know thyself’ is an illusory quest. It does not result in knowledge.”
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itinerant1
Guest
Methinks you BELIEVE that he does not know. That is JUST your personal (subjective) opinion.
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Bob4BVM
Guest
Forgive my poor grasp of language Albert, After all our discussion on varoius threads it seems we are still not communicating…
Did I say what I know is Subjective ? On the contrary, my experience was quite OBJECTIVE. By that I mean quite “from outside of myself”. That was the shocking part for me- it had nothing to do with what I wanted, or expected. Was 101% not conditioned by what i thought or believed at the time.
So quit putting your definitions into my statements, which you know absolutely nothing about.
Or are you trying to say that it is impossible for me to Know something which you do not know ? If that is your argument, it is laughable.
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Bob4BVM
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PerfectMethinks you BELIEVE that he does not know. That is JUST your personal (subjective) opinion.
Thank you itinerant1 !
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AlbertBall
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I am telling you the difference between belief and knowledge. There is nothing wrong with believing things, we all do, for example i believe my parents love me. However knowledge is different. You don’t know, you believe.Forgive my poor grasp of language Albert, After all our discussion on varoius threads it seems we are still not communicating…
Did I say what I know is Subjective ? On the contrary, my experience was quite OBJECTIVE. By that I mean quite “from outside of myself”. That was the shocking part for me- it had nothing to do with what I wanted, or expected. Was 101% not conditioned by what i thought or believed at the time.
So quit putting your definitions into my statements, which you know absolutely nothing about.
Or are you trying to say that it is impossible for me to Know something which you do not know ? If that is your argument, it is laughable.
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