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Scalia
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"I find that Catholics are unkind without knowing they are being unkind. They are negative but cant admit being negative.
They are harsh but do not realize they are being harsh or hatefull.]"
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itsjustdave1988
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I disagree. Some, no doubt, have been. I’ve met some Catholics who are vehemently anti-Protestant as well (as we all should be, but in a charitable and patient manner).
Yet all the the ex-Catholics that I personally know are still very respectful of my Catholic beliefs, and actually enjoy discussing them with me, as they learn a different perspective than that which they hold. Some have even come home to the Catholic faith. In fact, in most study groups I’ve been with, almost all of the Catholics in the group have at one time left the faith and then returned (“reverts”).
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michael777
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wow this is cool!!!
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Milton_Lopez
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This is a rather complicated matter than cannot be ‘resolved’ that easily. There are several reasons for Catholics to leave the Church: resentment against a priest, bishop, nun, lay person… Some leave because they want to marry someone of another faith; some leave because they found some elements they didn’t see before: a warm welcome, friendship, emotional or material assistance in needy times, dynamic bible teachings that sound very convincing, cheerful music, countless activities for the children, the young adults, the adults… a more ‘realistic’ relationship with the Lord Jesus. Their new home church doctrine is ‘proven’ with Bible verses in a more or less consistent way.
It is easier for ex-Catholics to become resentful perhaps because they think they should have had all these things in their Church; perhaps because now they can make ‘sense’ of their christian religion. Most converts on the other hand already had many of those elements but now they see the whole picture and embrace the undeniable: there is but one visible Church started upon Peter.
I’ve heard an ex-JW say: “If only one Catholic had taught me what I know now…”
I suppose most Protestants and ex-Catholics are ‘bolder’ in their antagonism with Catholics because they are the ones who feel the need to prove that Catholics are wrong. Many Catholics feel no need to prove anything, we know we are in the Church founded by the Lord Jesus even though we wouldn’t read the Bible that much or know much about many doctrines. We know how to ride the car, but we can’t explain how the car works…
My two cents.
mjlr
It is easier for ex-Catholics to become resentful perhaps because they think they should have had all these things in their Church; perhaps because now they can make ‘sense’ of their christian religion. Most converts on the other hand already had many of those elements but now they see the whole picture and embrace the undeniable: there is but one visible Church started upon Peter.
I’ve heard an ex-JW say: “If only one Catholic had taught me what I know now…”
I suppose most Protestants and ex-Catholics are ‘bolder’ in their antagonism with Catholics because they are the ones who feel the need to prove that Catholics are wrong. Many Catholics feel no need to prove anything, we know we are in the Church founded by the Lord Jesus even though we wouldn’t read the Bible that much or know much about many doctrines. We know how to ride the car, but we can’t explain how the car works…
My two cents.
mjlr
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oudave
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Hi
It has been my experience that when Prots convert it is because they dont have a very deep rooted faith so converting isnt a big deal. You see this often when a Prot man marries a Catholic Woman.
When a Catholic converts they are usaly upset because they were’nt taught much scripture in the Catholic church. That is why my wife was upset, she couldnt understand why they werent encouraged to read the Bible. Just my take on the question.
In Him and Only Him, Dave.
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gardenswithkids
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oudave, how sad that your wife wasn’t taught much scripture in the Catholic Church. I am truly amazed at what some Catholic parishes teach and don’t teach, so I believe she may have had a very bad education at hers.
I’ve know some of the anti-Catholic former-Catholics, and I think your wive’s perception is shared by many of them. I also think that much of what they were taught probably was from scripture, except Catholics typically don’t site scripture references when speaking. When I first started reading the Bible more seriously, I was amazed at how much of it I actually knew.
Dispite bad religious education at many parishes,I think that basic religious training is there in many Catholics who leave the Church. That’s why so many of them fill the leadership spots in their new churches–because they do have a decent basic knowledge of the Gospel. But without really understanding the fullness of the Catholic faith, they are led astray by well meaning protestant evangelists. With the zeal of a new convert in their new church, their knowledge grows by leaps and bounds because they had a foundation on which to build.
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jimmy
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I disagree, I think most protestants that become Catholic do so because they learn the truth of the Catholic Church. For example Scott Hahn and Tim Staples were both protestant pastors who when confronting knowledgable Catholics they discovered the truth of the Catholic Church. If you look at the archives of the guests on EWTN of the show “The Journey Home”, you will see that many of them were protestant pastors before becoming Catholic.
That is very false about the conversions from the Catholic Church. If you have been told that, the person who told you it has never been to a mass in there life. The entire mass is scripture. The Catholic Church strongly teaches that everyone should read the bible. In fact it is each persons duty to read the bible.
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Mickey
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I also strongly disagree. My observation shows that the “Bible believing sola scriptura” protestant is superbly versed in Scripture. He/she then realizes that everything points to the Catholic Church and he/she has no option but to enter into the fullness of truth. And so he/she discards the training wheels. But they remain charitable toward their protestant roots for teaching them how to ride the bike.
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oudave
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HiI also strongly disagree. My observation shows that the “Bible believing sola scriptura” protestant is superbly versed in Scripture. He/she then realizes that everything points to the Catholic Church and he/she has no option but to enter into the fullness of truth. And so he/she discards the training wheels. But they remain charitable toward their protestant roots for teaching them how to ride the bike.
I think you misunderstood my point, I am saying the prots who convert don’t have a strong Bible foundation or they would not leave the truth for the Catholic church. Of coures we both can say we know someone who was a Priest or a Minister who converted but I’m talking in general.
In Him and Him Only, Dave.
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SusanL
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Beg to differ, buddy. Protestantism ran deep in me and it took about 10 years to convert. Protestants and Catholics have their own culture. It’s hard to give up what you were raised in and, boy, I was raised Protestant. It’s a different cultural feeling. I prayed to God to help me because I considered it important. It was only after I prayed that I felt able to see things that I hadn’t seen before. Let me tell you, my jaw dropped when I saw things differently. You want to go and run and tell everybody. The problem is: people like you don’t want to be told.
I was steeped in the Bible. My father taught me so much bible that Sunday School was redundant. The teacher laughed at me (not unkindly) when I told him that I already knew the material.
If converts to protestantism are upset because they feel untaught by the Catholic church then it is their parents to blame. At every single mass there is more scripture taught than any protestant church service. I know. I’ve been to them for long periods of time. I’m sorry but your wife was sorely uncatechized. If she knew what she was leaving, she would never have left.
There is more but I have to take my son to the doctor. I would like to continue this discussion.
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mercygate
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I have been told that many, if not most, “conversions” to the Church *are *motivated by these situational exigencies, and then, you are right: no big deal.
However, the Church requires it to be a pretty big deal because the Church asks a lot of us. So even the lukewarm are required to confront certain hard issues.
Those converts (like me) who come in because we are well grounded in Scripture tend to struggle and kick against it – often for decades. When we finally surrender to Christ on his terms and in his Church, it is being “born again” in a way we could not have imagined. Joy and peace indescribable!
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Mickey
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No Dave. I understood you loud and clear. Every former protestant I know, who has converted to the Catholic Church, has had an extremely strong Bible foundation. That is what led them to the Catholic Church.
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STJOMO
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Karl Keating’s “Catholicism and Fundamentalism” is an extremely compelling defense of the faith against anti-Catholic “bible Christians.”
I’d recommend it strongly to Xavier and others like him who seem to believe in individual interpretation of Scripture.
Some claims that Catholics aren’t properly catechized are valid. I, too, was educated in Catholic schools, from kindergarten through my first year in college. I’ve been principal at a Catholic grade school. I have seen teachers in those schools who didn’t seem to have a firm grasp on the faith themselves – some appeared determined to put their own spin on Church teachings.
It’s up to the individual simply to discover all the Church does have to offer. Some people give up because they see protestant churches’ various “fellowship” programs. Some leave the Church because of the actions or inactions of individuals within a parish. Some let the scandalous behavior of certain priests cloud their vision of the Church.
The bottom line is, the Church was founded by Christ Himself and left to us as His legacy and authority here on Earth. He also left us with the promise that the gates of hell would never prevail against it. By the way, that is Scriptural.
That’s good enough for me.
I’d recommend it strongly to Xavier and others like him who seem to believe in individual interpretation of Scripture.
Some claims that Catholics aren’t properly catechized are valid. I, too, was educated in Catholic schools, from kindergarten through my first year in college. I’ve been principal at a Catholic grade school. I have seen teachers in those schools who didn’t seem to have a firm grasp on the faith themselves – some appeared determined to put their own spin on Church teachings.
It’s up to the individual simply to discover all the Church does have to offer. Some people give up because they see protestant churches’ various “fellowship” programs. Some leave the Church because of the actions or inactions of individuals within a parish. Some let the scandalous behavior of certain priests cloud their vision of the Church.
The bottom line is, the Church was founded by Christ Himself and left to us as His legacy and authority here on Earth. He also left us with the promise that the gates of hell would never prevail against it. By the way, that is Scriptural.
That’s good enough for me.
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TobyLue
Guest
I think that one of the main reason Catholics leave the Church is due to ignorance. I have a brother who was convinced by his wife to leave and they became vehemently anti-catholic. They started having “ecumenical” prayer meetings in their home and soon they claimed that they were not Catholic, nor Baptists, nor Methodists, etc., but they were “Christian”. They were shown scriptural passages from non-Catholics and they fell for the usual trap. “Look its says here in scripture that we should call no man “father” and that’s what Catholics do when addressing a priest! They are wrong! Look, it says here in scripture that we should not have graven images and look at all the statues in Catholic Churches! The Catholic Church is wrong! Look, it says here in scripture that we should worship only God, and look at what Catholics do when they worship Mary! The Catholic Church is wrong! Look, it says here in scripture that we should not repeat our prayers and look at what Catholics do when they pray they rosary!” And the list goes on and on and on. Unfortunately, they used to go to church only when they felt like it and when I invited them to a Charismatic prayer meeting and they found Christ in their lives. Unfortunately, my sis-in-law “felt” that she had been given special healing powers, and she was going around trying to heal everybody, and praying over others and rubbing their body and doing things that go against Catholic teachings. She got upset when she was told by the leaders that she was not to do that, and she was told by these other people that she needed to listen to the Holy Spirit and not to men. That the Holy Spirit was telling her to leave the Catholic Church so she did, took her whole family with her. Then she convinced her mother, father, sisters, bros-in-law to leave and that she had special gifts etc. and set up her own “Christian Church”. Now of course she is her own popette and my brother is the bishop, at least from my perspective. She tried to convince me, my mother, my sister, and my other brother to leave, but we stood fast; especially due to our devotion to the Holy Eucharist, which I new was not present in other Churches. This was what prevented me from leaving. Others that I know left because they got angry with a priest because the priest would not let them do certain things. I know a deacon also that left because he got into a disagreement with the pastor, however, he would at times attend mass and would go to communion; figure that out. None that I know left because they determined, after careful study and were convinced, that the church they were going to was the Church that Jesus founded. But seems like most non-Catholics that come into the Church, are convinced that the CC **is **the true Church that Christ founded.
I knew this other lady that left the CC, (her husband was still catholic but only by name) and she claims she knows what the CC teaches thats why she left. But of course she thinks she knows, but only because others have told her what they think that CC teaches.
I heard this guy once, who had a program on a Christian station, say that when he was a child and growing up catholic, the nuns would take the children to the church, and they had a light next to the Tabernacle. They were told that whenever the light would go on, that the Holy Spirit was there and they would all kneel. When the light would go off, then the Holy Spirit was no longer then and they would sit down. This would happen several times during the hour or so they would spend in the Church.
What people will come up with. 
I knew this other lady that left the CC, (her husband was still catholic but only by name) and she claims she knows what the CC teaches thats why she left. But of course she thinks she knows, but only because others have told her what they think that CC teaches.
I heard this guy once, who had a program on a Christian station, say that when he was a child and growing up catholic, the nuns would take the children to the church, and they had a light next to the Tabernacle. They were told that whenever the light would go on, that the Holy Spirit was there and they would all kneel. When the light would go off, then the Holy Spirit was no longer then and they would sit down. This would happen several times during the hour or so they would spend in the Church.
What people will come up with.
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deb1
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I respectfully beg to differ. I came from a very fundamentalist church and our pastor would come to our house once a week for bible studies. We were also encouraged to read our bibles daily and memorize scripture. It was partly reading my bible that led me to Catholisim. I noticed that when read in context certain Prot. beliefs don’t hold up, unless certain bible verses are twisted from their original meaning. For me, it was a very dark time. Everyone around me was simply accepting what the pastor taught, I thought that something was wrong with me. Why was I the only one questioning?
Ironically, now that I am looking into starting RCIA classes I find that I am reading the bible with a renewed zeal. A large portion of my family is fundamentalist, so I know that I will have to defend my beliefs.
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RobbyS
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Celibacy is a voluntary act, Only a small percentage of Catholics are priests, 50,000 out of more than 60,000,000. The passage is against those who say that marriage is sinful. Bishops used to be married men, but the passage does not say that they must be married but that they have had no more than one wife. Remember that Paul himself never married.
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