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Dorothy
Guest
God is not offended when we honor what His grace has done.
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Millie123
Guest
Keep things in perspective Dronald. I immeasurably LOVE my God. I immeasurably LOVE my Family, Child, Neighbors, the Saints etc. They are immortal souls, made in the image and likeness of God.
I LIKE Chocolate, Flowers, Bike rides, movies, my house. These are cold, worldly, material things that seem irrational to grow a Loving affection and attachment for. If you’re falling in love with your bicycle then maybe you need to reevaluate your worldly attachment for a material object.
C
Captain_America
Guest
for Protestants reading this:
I like the fact that Mary was so willing to do as God told her to: I am ENORMOUSLY IMPRESSED at Mary’s Fiat.
But she was human, and I just can’t feel much “worship” for her: great admiration, of course, as perhaps the very best exemplar of what a human being may be able to do as a Servant of God.
WHY the bugaboo here?
The people I’ve met who so-called “worship” Mary are usually older women who are likely empathetic to the expressly feminine aspect of having sons, raising a child, etc.
I like the fact that Mary was so willing to do as God told her to: I am ENORMOUSLY IMPRESSED at Mary’s Fiat.
But she was human, and I just can’t feel much “worship” for her: great admiration, of course, as perhaps the very best exemplar of what a human being may be able to do as a Servant of God.
WHY the bugaboo here?
The people I’ve met who so-called “worship” Mary are usually older women who are likely empathetic to the expressly feminine aspect of having sons, raising a child, etc.
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dronald
Guest
Then please explain Luke 14:26.
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marywarfield
Guest
Your question is Luke and Matthew. I’m trying not to
be hurtful here.
In Luke He is asking you to not let anyone or anything
stand in your way of complete dedication to him.
In Matthew He asks you not love anyone MORE than Him. I
see no one here suggesting they love anyone MORE
than Him.
What is complete dedication? To love Him with all
your might and your neighbor as yourself.
You love them because you love Him. You see Him
in them. They are your brothers as He is your brother.
So you strive to love them as Him.
And if you can’t do that because you believe in
your heart they are lesser or not deserving your
love for Him is deficient, quite frankly.
It’s a tall order, one we never fully achieve, but at
some point one in all humility must admit his love
for Him fails in that one doesn’t love his brothers as
much as he could. But the answer is not in justifying your
failure in loving Christ fully by saying others are not
worthy and you have to store it all up for Him alone
cause He said so. That is a false justification for your
failing to love Him in your brother.
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Millie123
Guest
The footnote from the Douay Rheims Bible explains it well:
The law of Christ does not allow us to hate even our enemies, much less our parents: but the meaning of the text is, that we must be in that disposition of soul, as to be willing to renounce, and part with every thing, how near or dear soever it may be to us, that would keep us from following Christ.
books.google.com/books?id=bZnD546VDE8C&pg=PA821&lpg=PA821&dq=douay+rheims+%22Hate+not%22…+The+law+of+Christ+does+not+allow+us+to+hate+even+our+enemies,+much+less+our+parents:+but+the+meaning+of+the+text+is,+that+we+must+be+in+that+disposition+of+soul,+as+to+be+willing+to+renounce,+and+part+with+every+thing,+how+near+or+dear+soever+it+may+be+to+us,+that+would+keep+us+from+following+Christ.&source=bl&ots=87XFIGfnjA&sig=PKYkBVXTpdZ9-w_Ibmn_eijUKE0&hl=en&sa=X&ei=55BOU7mhNOGSyQGP6IGYCg&ved=0CDQQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=douay%20rheims%20%22Hate%20not%22…%20The%20law%20of%20Christ%20does%20not%20allow%20us%20to%20hate%20even%20our%20enemies%2C%20much%20less%20our%20parents%3A%20but%20the%20meaning%20of%20the%20text%20is%2C%20that%20we%20must%20be%20in%20that%20disposition%20of%20soul%2C%20as%20to%20be%20willing%20to%20renounce%2C%20and%20part%20with%20every%20thing%2C%20how%20near%20or%20dear%20soever%20it%20may%20be%20to%20us%2C%20that%20would%20keep%20us%20from%20following%20Christ.&f=false
Christ is to always remain first in our lives, hypothetically speaking if I were being called to renounce and leave my family (for example if I was single and being called to a cloistered life in a convent). That would not mean that I would all of a sudden develop a sadistic and vitriolic hatred for my parents. I would still be called to Honor my Father and mother. And my love for them would remain strong and immeasurable, and the separation from them would be painful, but that would not mean that my love for them is lessened, if I were to chose a life in seclusion with Christ… I do not have a limited amount of love to give. However, that does not diminish the fact, that we are to put God first in our life, and I would be obligated to renounce my family to follow him. My love for God remains strong and immeasurable.
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dronald
Guest
So then we can only infer that we must love God more than our brothers, parents, ourselves, etc. It’s only logical.
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marywarfield
Guest
Yes except you are failing to see that love is expressed
for God in how much you love Him in your brothers, parents etc.
If you understood that you would not be constantly
questioning why we love Mary and the saints and pray to
them. It would be obvious.
S
SyroMalankara
Guest
Dronald,
When you have a son or daughter, you will one day be filled with joy when s/he first walks, first talks, learns to drive, graduates, gets married and has their own child. If you choose, you can instead of being overjoyed, opt to be angry because all these great things detract from your headship as dad/head of household. I choose to be overjoyed because when my children do something great, I am happy for them, I am happy that they are happy, and also their great accomplishment indirectly reflects on me as a parent. How much more is God overjoyed when his Saints reflect His Light?
When you have a son or daughter, you will one day be filled with joy when s/he first walks, first talks, learns to drive, graduates, gets married and has their own child. If you choose, you can instead of being overjoyed, opt to be angry because all these great things detract from your headship as dad/head of household. I choose to be overjoyed because when my children do something great, I am happy for them, I am happy that they are happy, and also their great accomplishment indirectly reflects on me as a parent. How much more is God overjoyed when his Saints reflect His Light?
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marywarfield
Guest
Gods love is unconditional. If you would
propose that your love of Him be first and foremost
then you will strive to love unconditionally as well
and stop with all the qualifiers, ifs ands and buts.
propose that your love of Him be first and foremost
then you will strive to love unconditionally as well
and stop with all the qualifiers, ifs ands and buts.
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adf417
Guest
Me too! I wonder if it was a stick shift or automatic.
E
EIF5A
Guest
Sometimes, I wish Scripture recorded more of Mary…
I read somewhere that she was more “hidden” to increase her humility
However, I always have a nagging feeling of, “Hmm…am I praying the Hail Mary too much?”
On the flip side, “Why don’t I feel as devoted to Mary as the next person? What is wrong with me???”
I read somewhere that she was more “hidden” to increase her humility
However, I always have a nagging feeling of, “Hmm…am I praying the Hail Mary too much?”
On the flip side, “Why don’t I feel as devoted to Mary as the next person? What is wrong with me???”
F
Faithdancer
Guest
When I was a Catholic, and since, I’ve always had trouble with the excessive titles and the statues of Mary dressed as a queen. Mary, Theotokos? I have no problem with that. But there is only one Mediator, Jesus Christ. And Mary, Queen of Heaven? I believe that verges upon pantheism. And even though I once felt obligated to say the rosary, that’s just what it was, an obligation and a rote recitation. I still pray the Lord’s Prayer, but nothing Marian.
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McCartney
Guest
If one were to pray to a statue and expect the statue to answer their prayers, that person would be foolish and an idolater. When Catholics pray in front of statues we pray to the person that the statue represents. This is no different to you hanging pictures of your parents on your wall. God commanded Moses to make two statues of angels to place on the Ark of the Covenant.
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adf417
Guest
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McCartney
Guest
Good one!Me too! I wonder if it was a stick shift or automatic.
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oneofmany
Guest
You aren’t a Catholic now? You can’t really stop you know, you were baptized a Catholic and it’s for life.
As far as saying the rosary. Read about the children of Fatima. Mary appeared to the children and instructed them to pray the rosary for the conversion of Russia. The Soviet Union did fall without a shot but it seems they are trying to resurface. I think praying the Rosary will work again if people would do it. It’s more than you think it is, it’s powerful if it can bring peace.
Also, do you ask people to pray for you? If you do than you are making them mediators so stop doing it, if that is what you are against.
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Millie123
Guest
No I would not say that would be logical. You are putting limits and boundaries on your love of God. God loves me without limits or boundaries, he does not love me more than or less than anyone else. God’s love for me is immeasurable. I do not love God more than, less than, or equal to anyone else. My love for God is without limits and without compare. My love for God is immeasurable.
Saint Bernard of Clairvaux has this to say…
“You want me to tell you why God is to be loved and how much. I answer, the reason for loving God is God Himself; and the measure of love due to Him is IMMEASURABLE LOVE… We are to love God for Himself, because of a twofold reason; nothing is more reasonable, nothing more profitable. When one asks, Why should I love God? he may mean, What is lovely in God? or What shall I gain by loving God? In either case, the same sufficient cause of love exists, namely, God Himself.”
Saint Bernard of Clairvaux.
people.bu.edu/dklepper/RN413/bernard_loving.html
Dronald—You protest my immeasurable love for God as if I’m not giving him the proper love due to him if I do not, quantify my love in your terms using limits such as “less than, more than, or equal too” I find it absolutely impossible to place limits and boundaries on my love for God in this fashion. My love for God is incomparable to my love for anyone else of his creation…My love for God is immeasurable.
My love for Our Blessed Mother is immeasurable. God’s love for me is immeasurable and his love for his mother is immeasurable. It was truly an immeasurable act of love on God’s part to give me His own mother as my mother, and intercessor. God loves his mother with an immeasurable love. We are called to imitate Christ and his love. Hence I do not put quantifying limits on my love for My Blessed Mother (Or my brothers and sister, the Saints). I do not love them, more than or less than anyone else, I try to love them as Christ loves them, with an immeasurable love.
And finally I love my family with an immeasurable love. It was truly an overabundance of God’s immeasurable love and care for me to bless me with this family. God’s love knows no limits, boundaries, or measure. In joy and thanksgiving to God’s for his immeasurable love for me and my family, I try to reflect an immeasurable love for my family. As God so abundantly loves them without measure, so I will try to love them without measure.
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rinnie
Guest
But in truth Mary is and was sinless.
Just out of curiosity answer me this. We are born in a state of sin because of the sin of Eve it was passed on to us. By the grace of the cross it is wiped away because of baptism.
Now Mary was saved from sin at the moment of her conception, if she has or had sin how could Christ not have had sin then from he?.
So either you accept Catholic teaching that she was indeed sinless or Christ had have inherited this sin. You can’t have it both ways.
Also if you cannot accept intercession, only on earth, how do you explain revelation that shows the prayers of the saints being offered before the throne, or do you feel the Saints have to be alive here on earth also to be heard?
Also you lost me on how the woman said Mary is blessed because she bore Christ, after she said this the scripture said she was blessed not ONLY because she bore Christ, but because she heard the word of God and obeyed it and kept it.
It is telling us we don’t have to give birth to Christ to follow her example, follow also the example she gave by hearing the word of God and accepting it. I have no idea what you are talking about here.
And how can following her example displace the male of the house??
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rinnie
Guest
To me a lot. Christ is not a most gracious advocate, Christ is God!!
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