Forms of persecution

[IronHammer]

I am preoccupied with the topic of where we are headed as a nation here in America with regards to our religious freedoms. Although I agree that our christian brothers and sisters in places like India, Pakistan, China and elsewhere are definitely experiencing the most extreme forms of persecution, I believe that the kinds of persecution we are about to experience here in the US, although less extreme, are every bit as valid and actually open the door to the possibility of more extreme forms of persecution as we go forward. Here in America our rights are slowly, systematically being attacked using the legal system. In some areas of the country we are being labeled has “hate groups” for not supporting gay marriage or abortion. This mentality will grow and is already being promoted at the highest level…our president. In Europe, last month, he stated to the world that “America is no longer a Christian nation”. Today he refuses to observe National Day of Prayer in any meaningful way. What message does that send to the liberal left that wants to see all religion in America eradicated as if it were some malignant tumor? It sends a green light to go forward with stopping these “backwards thinking christians” from spreading their ideology to their children. They will start with the education system. If they can prevent little christian children from growing into adult christians, they will stem the tide, so to speak. That is just one prong of a multi pronged attack, I believe.

Any persecution of a group of people requires a certain mentality on the part of the masses. It only takes a large section of the public, vocal enough and determined in their agenda to affect a change in public policy. All they need is a little support from the government. In Hitler’s day, the German people generally despised and hated the Jews but they kept a modicum of restraint…until the German leaders began to enflame this sentiment. Law enforcement began to look the other way when crimes against Jews were committed. Persecution went from nasty comments to acts of violence in a very short period of time.

This can happen here. Don’t think for a second that it can’t. They didn’t think it could in Canada and the UK, either. Right now, the liberal left sees religion and Christian values as archaic and even dangerous! Persecution via the legal system in the UK and Canada are only slightly more advanced in these areas. Religion is slowly being choked out of existence in Europe. Homosexuality is being taught in their schools as a normal thing. Opting out is not an option for parents and doing so can result in jail time.

My reason for posting this is to generate discussion on the forms of persecution (however mild) that you have witnessed in your “neck of the woods”. The internet is a powerful tool to stay informed that we absolutely must make use of. It will probably be the only way to stay informed since the mainstream media will not report on these kinds of issues. Maybe Fox News will, but probably not.

Any kind of persecution of your beliefs, however mild or innocuous, is still persecution, even it’s source is our own legal system.

 

[Scoobyshme]

I don’t think we’re going to have to wait that long to see Catholics persecuted more in this country. It’s going to get a lot worse before it gets better. The national media is violently anti-Catholic and will stop at nothing, including outright calumny, to attach the Church and Catholics. If they merely substituted Muslims, Jews, blacks, gays, etc., for some of the statements they made against Catholics and the Church, there would be a tremendous outrage! People in the media would lose their jobs overnight. But, if it’s against us, no problem. Anti-Catholicism is the last acceptable bigotry in the U.S.

The government of the United States seems intent on running away from God as fast and far as possible. The House is passing a law to make it illegal to say anything bad about homosexuality, which would include anything from the Bible at Mass condemning the practices. The new definition of separation of church and state is mostly aimed at Catholics, in my opinion. There was a case in Colorady, I believe, where the courts ruled that a public high school could not have a copy of the Bible in its library. But it could have the Koran, the satanic bible, or anything else along those lines!

I predict that the persecution will get much worse and include physical violence against Catholics and the Church. And we will not get adequate, if any, protection from the government.

It’ll be another good opportunity to help the Church grow and sanctify through the shedding of the blood of martyrs. Worked in the first century, oughta work now.

God bless!

Scooby
alabamacatholicresources.com

 

[Dale_M]

II believe that the kinds of persecution we are about to experience here in the US, although less extreme, are every bit as valid and actually open the door to the possibility of more extreme forms of persecution as we go forward

I think your worries are exaggerated, which I discuss below.

In some areas of the country we are being labeled has “hate groups” for not supporting gay marriage or abortion.

Such is the nature of politics. I would point out that Christians and Christian groups say equally awful things about supporters of abortion rights or gay rights.

This mentality will grow and is already being promoted at the highest level…our president. In Europe, last month, he stated to the world that “America is no longer a Christian nation”.

I think you are wrong and would welcome a news citation backing up your claim. What you say sounds very much like a distortion which has been spread around right wing internet sites and emails, fueled in part by suspicious editing of a Fox News video.

What he said, in a speech, three years ago, before a US Christian conference was:
"Obama:

Whatever we once were, we are no longer a Christian nation – at least, not just. We are also a Jewish nation, a Muslim nation, a Buddhist nation, and a Hindu nation, and a nation of nonbelievers.

factcheck.org/askfactcheck/did_obama_say_we_are_no_longer.html

Today he refuses to observe National Day of Prayer in any meaningful way.

It is true that he gave it less prominence than Bush, but so did Clinton. Perhaps a problem with the National Day of Prayer is that it has become too politicized. Among the presenters at its 2009 event was Focus on the Family James Dobson and Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann. Perhaps the organizers of the NDoP should pick less politically charged representatives if they want to reach out to all of the US.

What message does that send to the liberal left that wants to see all religion in America eradicated as if it were some malignant tumor?

You have no idea of what liberals want. There are a few radical atheists, but they are a tiny minority. Most liberals are fine with religion and many are religious.

It sends a green light to go forward with stopping these “backwards thinking christians” from spreading their ideology to their children. They will start with the education system. If they can prevent little christian children from growing into adult christians, they will stem the tide, so to speak. That is just one prong of a multi pronged attack, I believe.

What are you talking about? It sounds as if you are talking about some kind of conspiracy.

 

[IronHammer]

I think your worries are exaggerated, which I discuss below.

They may seem exaggerated, but only in the current light. Time will tell. I pray that you are right. I pray that our constitution is respected and our right of free speech and freedom of religion is not abrogated in the name of “hate speech”.

Such is the nature of politics. I would point out that Christians and Christian groups say equally awful things about supporters of abortion rights or gay rights.

This is exactly what I am saying. The battle lines are being drawn around gay marriage and abortion. It is coming down to a large percentage of the population with no morals against those with.

I think you are wrong and would welcome a news citation backing up your claim. What you say sounds very much like a distortion which has been spread around right wing internet sites and emails, fueled in part by suspicious editing of a Fox News video.

What he said, in a speech, three years ago, before a US Christian conference was:

factcheck.org/askfactcheck/did_obama_say_we_are_no_longer.html

Sure he threw in a little snake oil, but his intention was the same. He wants to promote an image of America that doesn’t include it’s religious foundations. That would appear too archaic to him, too unintelligent for the world stage.

It is true that he gave it less prominence than Bush, but so did Clinton. Perhaps a problem with the National Day of Prayer is that it has become too politicized. Among the presenters at its 2009 event was Focus on the Family James Dobson and Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann. Perhaps the organizers of the NDoP should pick less politically charged representatives if they want to reach out to all of the US.

Oh, no, we can’t have our leaders setting any sort of decent example for our children! That might give them the impression that we still have a some kind of faith in God left in them, even though it’s been utterly eradicated from every government building and organization! The National Day of Prayer tells America that it still believes in divine providence. Snubbing it, in my opinion, it snubbing our Creator.

You have no idea of what liberals want. There are a few radical atheists, but they are a tiny minority. Most liberals are fine with religion and many are religious.

I know they want to be able to kill their own babies, they want to be able to join Holy Matrimony with others of their own sex. They want to put gay men and women in postion as priests and even bishops! If gay marriage is allowed, then the next things to follow will be plural marriage (polygamy), bestial marriage (marrying an animal) and all sorts of bizarre arrangements.

Just because we have the freedom as Americans to do a thing, doesn’t mean we can. That is why there is a moral code. Without a moral code, this nation will fall in on itself.

What are you talking about? It sounds as if you are talking about some kind of conspiracy.

I am not talking about a conspiracy. I am talking about a mob-ocracy. One of the things our founding fathers feared. I am talking about an active, well-funded and growing segment of the population that, regardless of their religious views, believes that the ultimate good is their government, not God. This segment voted for Obama, generally. This segment lobbies for hate crime legislation which is the beginning of the end of free speech. It is their ace in the hole. If they can use the very law itself to silence criticism and opposition, then they have won half the battle. Call it a conspiracy if you want. I call it liberalism. And a blind, weak minded public is swallowing it hook, line and sinker.

Most of these so-called Christians who voted for Obama and are part of this liberal movement you seem to think are benign, support gay marriage and abortion and women priests, etc (many of them call themselves Catholic!)… Those issues represent the moral “line in the sand”. If that line is removed, nothing is prohibited. Think of the implications of that.

 

[irishpatrick]

I think your worries are exaggerated, which I discuss below.

Such is the nature of politics. I would point out that Christians and Christian groups say equally awful things about supporters of abortion rights or gay rights.

I think you are wrong and would welcome a news citation backing up your claim. What you say sounds very much like a distortion which has been spread around right wing internet sites and emails, fueled in part by suspicious editing of a Fox News video.

What he said, in a speech, three years ago, before a US Christian conference was:

factcheck.org/askfactcheck/did_obama_say_we_are_no_longer.html

It is true that he gave it less prominence than Bush, but so did Clinton. Perhaps a problem with the National Day of Prayer is that it has become too politicized. Among the presenters at its 2009 event was Focus on the Family James Dobson and Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann. Perhaps the organizers of the NDoP should pick less politically charged representatives if they want to reach out to all of the US.

You have no idea of what liberals want. There are a few radical atheists, but they are a tiny minority. Most liberals are fine with religion and many are religious.

What are you talking about? It sounds as if you are talking about some kind of conspiracy.

If you read the founders, their intention was that this nation would be a Christian nation, with freedom for people to follow any faith or denom they wanted to follow. Yet, make no mistake this nation is a Christian nation founded on Judeo-Christian values and if we lose that, we will cease being the nation we once were and we will become something far worse.

 

[Soutane]

I think your worries are exaggerated, which I discuss below.

Such is the nature of politics. I would point out that Christians and Christian groups say equally awful things about supporters of abortion rights or gay rights.

I think you are wrong and would welcome a news citation backing up your claim. What you say sounds very much like a distortion which has been spread around right wing internet sites and emails, fueled in part by suspicious editing of a Fox News video.

What he said, in a speech, three years ago, before a US Christian conference was:

factcheck.org/askfactcheck/did_obama_say_we_are_no_longer.html

It is true that he gave it less prominence than Bush, but so did Clinton. Perhaps a problem with the National Day of Prayer is that it has become too politicized. Among the presenters at its 2009 event was Focus on the Family James Dobson and Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann. Perhaps the organizers of the NDoP should pick less politically charged representatives if they want to reach out to all of the US.

You have no idea of what liberals want. There are a few radical atheists, but they are a tiny minority. Most liberals are fine with religion and many are religious.

What are you talking about? It sounds as if you are talking about some kind of conspiracy.

There are none so blind as the wilfully blind.

 

[Teelynn]

There are none so blind as the wilfully blind.

You got** that** right!! Maybe the average liberal is not necessarily intent on eliminating God from the landscape, but the far left ideologues are intent on making this nation into purely secular country. MAKE ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT ABOUT IT. And might I add, they are ruthless in their quest. No mention of God allowed unless in your own home or in your own church…and yes, the public schools in this country are intent on indoctrinating our children in the same vein, for example, NO mention of God allowed; National Day of Silence (for respect and reverence to the gay population); normalizing and even glamorizing gay relationships in books even as young as kindergarten; passing out condoms in Junior High Schools (at least in California, and I believe in some in Illinois); lued and vulgar dancing allowed and encouraged at Junior High School dances. I could go on and on but they are intent on indoctrination of our young. The public schools in this country are cesspools, and war zones!

 

[Muzhik]

I don’t view it as “liberalism” so much as “progressivism”. You can be a Democrat or a Republican and be a progressive. I believe in America we will begin to experience a uniquely American form of repression and oppression. It will NOT be because we are Catholic – that would be prohibited by the Constitution. It WILL be because we are opposing progressivism and promoting hate, through our opposition to abortion and gay marriage. It will manifest itself in law officials paying closer attention to what is said during Mass and Knights of Columbus meetings; through slower response times when police and fire departments are called; through stronger and more blatant anti-Catholic editorials and gross misrepresentations of Catholic doctrine in the media. As IronHammer put it, a “mob-ocracy”, where a mob starts reinforcing its own beliefs and behaviors by eliminating and ignoring any opposing views. I see the beginnings of that in the media coverage of the Tax Day protesters, where the simple fact that people were protesting against massive tax-funded bailouts for corporations was presented by the media as proof that these people were “crazy”, “racist”, and “obviously hate black people.”