Fox News opinion piece BLASTS Pope Francis as “the Catholic Church’s Obama” [Fr. Z]

[RPRPsych]

Also, can I say that I really don’t like these crazy partnerships with conservative Protestants and, worse, Mormons that the Catholic Church has been doing on local levels or even on macro (Prop 8) levels on issues we agree on. They’ll gladly take our money to spend on this issue, and then they’ll immediately stab us in the back when we discuss a part of moral theology they consider anti-Biblical (such as contraception for one).

I’m with you on this. It has all the makings of an abusive relationship - or at the very least, an unequal one. I don’t recall the early Church seeking alliances with any other religion simply because some of their political or social agendas happened to coincide.

Catholics believe that the Kingdom of God refers to the Kingship of Christ. Protestants (see: Calvin, John; Luther, Martin; Afrikaaner Calvinism; Christian Reconstructionism) believe that it refers to an actual earthly kingdom. And the twain shall never meet.

 

[RPRPsych]

“With this in mind, I encourage financial experts and political leaders to ponder the words of one of the sages of antiquity: ‘Not to share one’s wealth with the poor is to steal from them and to take away their livelihood. It is not our own goods which we hold, but theirs’.”

I have a question that no one seems willing to answer: WHO are “the poor”?

That’s an excellent question.

I’d say it refers to those who, for no major fault of theirs, suffer economic hardship and social or cultural discrimination. They may have made attempts to ameliorate their situation lawfully, but these attempts have failed due to social or political factors.

Under this definition, for example, we would include - those who face genuine racial, caste-based or nationality-based discrimination; victims of natural or man-made disasters; victims of unjust Governmental policies; “the widow and the orphan”, etc. We would exclude - those who refuse to work, those who need help for another sort of problem (mental illness, substance abuse) which is best addressed using another option, and those who claim discrimination based on their own choices (“gay rights” activists).

 

[CrossofChrist]

But conservative Protestants were the ones who were trying to snuff out our schools and kick out our religion from the US in the early 20th century; we partnered with them THEN too???

At least in voting for Democrats, yes.

The Democrats were proimmigrant and prolabor. Catholics were generally immigrants and blue collar union members. Hence, they consistently voted for Democrats.

Conservative Evangelicals (southern Dems) were Democratic for issues regarding segregation and to a large extent, tradition.

Keep in mind the GOP was largely anti-Catholic (WASPs) and for big business too.

 

[KyrieEleison17]

Everything the Pope has said and taught in EG can be found in your Catechism and in the Magisterium of the Popes. This is not new. If it is, then your society’s culture and habits have succeeded marvellously is preventing you from ever hearing it.

 

[gwarald]

Seems to me that Pope Francis’ economic statements would make Popes John Paul, and Benedict proud.

Everything he says regarding economics fits right in with The “Compendium of Social Doctrine of the [Catholic] Church”.
The whole point of the compendium is a call for “fairness, equality, social justice, economic justice, etc.,” which basically means that everyone must participate in sharing what he has with whomever the state says he must. This will open the door and set the stage for the church to be more effective at making converts.
Pope Francis is merely saying what the compendium says, that all people have a share in the common good and all have something to contribute to the common good.
He is aggressively establishing his role with the world leaders as the voice of reason. If he succeeds, then pews will fill up faster than can be built.

 

[SuperLuigi]

The following verse comes to mind, somehow:

“And he said to them: Go and tell that fox: Behold, I cast out devils and do cures, to-day and to-morrow, and the third day I am consummated.”

(Luke 13: 32)

Those who wish to follow Adam Shaw (who has as much authority on this issue as I do, frankly), can do so. I’ll stick with Pope Francis and the Catholic Church.

Sigh. And people like this wonder why the rest of the world can’t take them seriously. Take off those Political glasses for a moment, for Heaven’s sake!

Well, I don’t want to discount FOX NEWS in general over this, but Shaws piece made me want to do a facepalm half-way through.

It’s just another journalist with particular political leanings in the West worried that this Pope will lead some kind of crusade against their ideology, defeat it, and bring about the Dark Ages or something.

Also, in America one needs to be particularly careful. I think some right-wing Protestants are feeling the pressure from atheism/secular ways on one side and rising Catholic numbers due to immigration and adult Baptisms on the other.

I expect in the future that instead of looking at their own flock addressing their own issues such as a poor birth-rate or making posters about how Jesus loves us instead of hitting the hard moral questions in religious ed, you can expect them to blame their situation on us.

 

[Abu]

gwarald #63
Seems to me that Pope Francis’ economic statements would make Popes John Paul, and Benedict proud.

The imprecision is foreign to Bl John Paul II and Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI.

everyone must participate in sharing what he has with whomever the state says he must.

False. There is no kowtowing to the Welfare State – Pope Francis warns against the “welfare mentality” (204).

Catholic Social Teaching condemns the Welfare State.
“In recent years the range of such intervention has vastly expanded, to the point of creating a new type of State, the so-called “Welfare State”. This has happened in some countries in order to respond better to many needs and demands, by remedying forms of poverty and deprivation unworthy of the human person. However, excesses and abuses, especially in recent years, have provoked very harsh criticisms of the Welfare State, dubbed the “Social Assistance State”. Malfunctions and defects in the Social Assistance State are the result of an inadequate understanding of the tasks proper to the State. Here again the principle of subsidiarity must be respected: a community of a higher order should not interfere in the internal life of a community of a lower order, depriving the latter of its functions, but rather should support it in case of need and help to coordinate its activity with the activities of the rest of society, always with a view to the common good.” [Bl John Paul II, *Centesimus Annus, #48].

 

[RPRPsych]

Well, I don’t want to discount FOX NEWS in general over this, but Shaws piece made me want to do a facepalm half-way through.

Me too. The “fox” quote was just a bit of wordplay. Shaw’s failings do not reflect the views of the rest of the network.

It’s just another journalist with particular political leanings in the West worried that this Pope will lead some kind of crusade against their ideology, defeat it, and bring about the Dark Ages or something.

Methinks he has been playing too many of those “solitary hero defeats corrupt institution” video games.

Also, in America one needs to be particularly careful. I think some right-wing Protestants are feeling the pressure from atheism/secular ways on one side and rising Catholic numbers due to immigration and adult Baptisms on the other.

I expect in the future that instead of looking at their own flock addressing their own issues such as a poor birth-rate or making posters about how Jesus loves us instead of hitting the hard moral questions in religious ed, you can expect them to blame their situation on us.

Excellent points.

 

[SuperLuigi]

Also, can I say that I really don’t like these crazy partnerships with conservative Protestants and, worse, Mormons that the Catholic Church has been doing on local levels or even on macro (Prop 8) levels on issues we agree on. They’ll gladly take our money to spend on this issue, and then they’ll immediately stab us in the back when we discuss a part of moral theology they consider anti-Biblical (such as contraception for one).

I’m not sure what you mean. Contraception is evil and is marketed with false promises.

catholictiger;11469708]I’m sick and tired of the misinterpretations of the Pope.

:banghead:

 

[SuperLuigi]

Keep in mind the GOP was largely anti-Catholic (WASPs) and for big business too.

That’s part of the problem in America: people voting like it’s 1910.

And then they wonder why Ted Cruz can’t single-handedly save their health care plan—or the country for that matter.

 

[CrossofChrist]

That’s part of the problem in America: people voting like it’s 1910.

Who does this? Meaning that 110% of the population votes in Democratic areas? Or something else.

 

[pnewton]

Anyone who lauds the Pope because he happens to fit their political motives, whether liberal or conservative, is exalting him for the wrong reason.

I think this is true, as well as the opposite of those who criticize him do so because of their political motives.

The error is placing one’s politics over one’s faith. Catholic doctrine is not judged on how well it fits the conservative or liberal mode. These two political ideologies need to be evaluated on how well they fit Catholic theology, and on this count, both come up short.

 

[ianjmatt]

I have to be honest - a lot of these concerns only exist in North America. Surely anyone with any understanding of Catholic Social teaching should understand that it sits outside of the left/right and authoritarian/libertarian dichotomies. It is something other than can ably critique the failings of both left wing and right wing theories whilst offering a distinct and unique pattern.