Foxe's Book of Maryrs and Maryrs' Mirror

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CopticChristian—

Hmmm…You are quoting things that one of the men from The Berean Call said. One of them was apparently raised Catholic, and he’s talking about himself. I said The Berean Call was anti-Catholic. In the link, they are criticizing Philip Yancey, who has never been Catholic.
 
AbideWithMe said:
CopticChristian—

Hmmm…You are quoting things that one of the men from The Berean Call said. One of them was apparently raised Catholic, and he’s talking about himself. I said The Berean Call was anti-Catholic. In the link, they are criticizing Philip Yancey, who has never been Catholic.
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You are correct. It was Tom, I assume that to be T.A. McMahon. I will send him Evangelical is not enough. As for Phil Yancy
So, Philip Yancey, shame on you! That you don’t know a Protestant, a true believer who knows how to pray,
Click to expand...
I will send him an email about Romans 8. Be sure to get a copy of Evangelical is not enough.👍
 
It was by David Currie. I read it about a year ago----I think the title is Born Fundamentalist, Born Again Catholic. It qualifies as one of the most poorly-written Christian books I’ve ever read. I think the preface was by Howard.
 
AbideWithMe said:
It was by David Currie. I read it about a year ago----I think the title is Born Fundamentalist, Born Again Catholic. It qualifies as one of the most poorly-written Christian books I’ve ever read. I think the preface was by Howard.
Click to expand...
I have a copy of that. Why was it poorly written so I might look at it and compare it to Evangelical is Not Enough?
 
Hi CopticChristian-----

I’m having a really full day here but I think I’ll be home tonight, and will answer then.

To give a very brief answer, I’m kind of leery of the whole genre, regardless of what the author was converting to or from. If a person, for example, goes from Catholicism to Protestantism, I take his account of what Catholicism really teaches with a grain of salt. Instead, I go right to the source—good, mainstream Catholic writers, the Vatican archives website, and the Catechism.

Conversion stories can have their place, but there are also pitfalls to be avoided in writing them. Currie, IMO, fell rather easily into some of those pitfalls. I think he meant well; it seemed like one of his objectives in publishing the book was to stand in between Protestants and Catholics and explain one to the other. Though well intentioned, it’s usually better to direct each group to quality writings of the other group.
 
AbideWithMe said:
Hi CopticChristian-----

I’m having a really full day here but I think I’ll be home tonight, and will answer then.

To give a very brief answer, I’m kind of leery of the whole genre, regardless of what the author was converting to or from. If a person, for example, goes from Catholicism to Protestantism, I take his account of what Catholicism really teaches with a grain of salt. Instead, I go right to the source—good, mainstream Catholic writers, the Vatican archives website, and the Catechism.

Conversion stories can have their place, but there are also pitfalls to be avoided in writing them. Currie, IMO, fell rather easily into some of those pitfalls. I think he meant well; it seemed like one of his objectives in publishing the book was to stand in between Protestants and Catholics and explain one to the other. Though well intentioned, it’s usually better to direct each group to quality writings of the other group.
Click to expand...
I appreciate your thoughts. This is in tune with what I am thinking and planning to write. If you are consistent this would mean that Paul in writing, comparing and contrasting the Old Covenant with the New. Covenant…you would be likely to go to the source, the OT to understand Christian thought because after all Paul is in the same vain as what you describe. I appreciate your putting forth this line of thinking as I believe that too many so called “christians” fail to see the Church in the OT and that is why they become Protestant. I thank you for your unexpected, unanticipated and welcome perspective. I hope that I see that you have done the same in examing the truths of Christianity as it regards the Church. If the Church is the mystery hidden for all ages as Paul says then Paul saw it in the OT and so should you.👍

I will be wrapping up and concluding my thoughts on Martyrs Mirror and its position as historical or not and then develop thoughts that address the Hussites and the like that are relevant to rebels and martyrs as it pertains to the OP.
 
AbideWithMe said:
It was by David Currie. I read it about a year ago----I think the title is Born Fundamentalist, Born Again Catholic. It qualifies as one of the most poorly-written Christian books I’ve ever read. I think the preface was by Howard.
Click to expand...
Well, Howard is a very good writer, so clearly reading Currie is no substitute for reading Howard:D.

Edwin
 
Sword_Brethren said:
“200 years ago.”? What about the Moorish Muslim invasion and occupation of Spain starting at 711 A.D. till 1492 A.D.?
Click to expand...
What about the European occupation of North America starting in, well, 1492 A.D. and continuing until the present?

At what point does it stop being an invasion and just start being humans living in a place?

Human beings attack and invade each other. It isn’t a peculiarly Muslim phenomenon.

The case you’re trying to make depends on massaging complex historical evidence so that any Islamic act of aggression “counts” as part of one massive, long-term act of aggression. If you argue that this is reasonable because of the religious basis for aggressive warfare in Islam, then again, this depends on so framing the evidence that aggressive passages in the Qur’an “count” in a way that similar passages in the Bible don’t, and so on.

Sure you can do this. You can say that the horrific genocides commanded in the OT don’t “count” as explanation for aggressive warfare by Christians because they are in the OT and “can’t” be taken out of their immediate context, and so on. You can construct a nice, tidy paradigm in which Muslims are raving aggressors and Christians are always just “defending themselves.”

And if in the course of defending ourselves we find ourselves storming over the walls of Jerusalem and massacring Christians, Muslims, and Jews indiscriminately, well, we make allowances for ourselves. Easy to do when we are judge and jury and defendant and plaintiff all at once, isn’t it?

Or you can choose to accept that the historical record is messy, that Muslims and Christians are sinners alike, and that both groups have elements in our respective religious traditions that can be used to support our sinful impulses. You can do this without whitewashing Islam and without ruling out the possibility that Islamic religious tradition really does provide a stronger basis for violence than Christian tradition. I’m not saying that this is necessarily false. I’m simply calling for nuance and precision. And nuance and precision is not served by lumping together events that happened centuries apart.

Edwin
 
AbideWithMe said:
Hi CopticChristian-----

I’m having a really full day here but I think I’ll be home tonight, and will answer then.

To give a very brief answer, I’m kind of leery of the whole genre, regardless of what the author was converting to or from.
Click to expand...
I am too. Well, I have a morbid fascination with it, actually. . . :o

Howard is a pretty good example, though. One of the better ones you will find out there.

And in fact when he wrote Evangelical is not Enough he wasn’t Catholic–he was Anglican. He became Catholic later.

Edwin
 
CopticChristian and Contarini----

The excerpt from Howard did appear better written than Currie’s book. And, in fairness to Currie, he wrote soon after converting; so I think he could have been more seasoned and better grounded as a Catholic before venturing to publish. And if he had waited longer, he also might have foregone the temptation to paint Protestant theology with as broad of a brushstroke as he did.

CopticChristian, I am going out tonight, but I look forward to seeing what you have in mind.
 
To my knowledge, Foxe’s Book of Martyrs is basically a work of Protestant piety concerning the martyrdom’s of the Reformation years and beyond. The funny thing is, I believe the book jumps the gap from the early Church martyrs all the way to the initial rumblings of the Reformation - what about everyone in between???
I think it’s an interesting read for sure, but I believe that it’s historicity is considered fairly dubious.
 
theidler said:
To my knowledge, Foxe’s Book of Martyrs is basically a work of Protestant piety concerning the martyrdom’s of the Reformation years and beyond. The funny thing is, I believe the book jumps the gap from the early Church martyrs all the way to the initial rumblings of the Reformation - what about everyone in between???
I think it’s an interesting read for sure, but I believe that it’s historicity is considered fairly dubious.
Click to expand...
Your knowledge may be inadequate. Piety? Check the book out online here…

ccel.org/f/foxe/martyrs/home.html

Look at chapters that follow and see if you believe it is piety.

Chapter IV – Papal Persecutions
Chapter V – An Account of the Inquisition
Chapter VI – An Account of the Persecutions in Italy, Under the Papacy
Chapter VII – An Account of the Life and Persecutions of John Wickliffe
Chapter VIII – An Account of the Persecutions in Bohemia Under the Papacy
Chapter IX – An Account of the Life and Persecutions of Martin Luther
Chapter X – General Persecutions in Germany
Chapter XI – An Account of the Persecutions in the Netherlands
Chapter XII – The Life and Story of the True Servant and Martyr of God, William Tyndale
Chapter XIII – An Account of the Life of John Calvin

Brad Stephens points out that Foxe was one of the originators of the spin. He turned the notion that Protestants had invented their heretical beliefs to the notion that the OHCAC had added and changed. I always wondered where this came from. This is doing evil to produce good. Foxe wrote for Propaganda and twisted the notion that earlier heretics although not necessarily exactly like in belief as Knox, Zwingli, Calvin and Luther were the nascent kernels of the true gospel that sprang forth from these heretics to establish the purity of the gospel as it was practiced in the “Ancient Church”…another lie.

This is what he says about Calvin…guess he forgot that Calvin and his boys thought it was OK to murder people if you didn’t believe as he did and that Calvinists persecuted the Anabaptists, Baptists and others.
“Much as the name of Calvin has been scoffed at and loaded with reproach by many sons of freedom, there is not an historical proposition more susceptible of complete demonstration than this, that no man has lived to whom the world is under greater obligations for the freedom it now enjoys, than John Calvin.”
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As for Luther he forgot to mention that Luther said things contrary to his actions wishing he had never done what he did and that Lutherans too persecuted Baptists and Anabaptists.
After this he said as ensueth, thrice: “I commend my spirit into Thy hands, Thou hast redeemed me, O God of Truth! ‘God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have life everlasting.’” Having repeated oftentimes his prayers, he was called to God. So praying, his innocent ghost peaceably was separated from the earthly body.
Click to expand...
 
CopticChristian said:
Your knowledge may be inadequate. Piety? Check the book out online here…

ccel.org/f/foxe/martyrs/home.html

Look at chapters that follow and see if you believe it is piety.

Chapter IV – Papal Persecutions
Chapter V – An Account of the Inquisition
Chapter VI – An Account of the Persecutions in Italy, Under the Papacy
Chapter VII – An Account of the Life and Persecutions of John Wickliffe
Chapter VIII – An Account of the Persecutions in Bohemia Under the Papacy
Chapter IX – An Account of the Life and Persecutions of Martin Luther
Chapter X – General Persecutions in Germany
Chapter XI – An Account of the Persecutions in the Netherlands
Chapter XII – The Life and Story of the True Servant and Martyr of God, William Tyndale
Chapter XIII – An Account of the Life of John Calvin

Brad Stephens points out that Foxe was one of the originators of the spin. He turned the notion that Protestants had invented their heretical beliefs to the notion that the OHCAC had added and changed. I always wondered where this came from. This is doing evil to produce good. Foxe wrote for Propaganda and twisted the notion that earlier heretics although not necessarily exactly like in belief as Knox, Zwingli, Calvin and Luther were the nascent kernels of the true gospel that sprang forth from these heretics to establish the purity of the gospel as it was practiced in the “Ancient Church”…another lie.

This is what he says about Calvin…guess he forgot that Calvin and his boys thought it was OK to murder people if you didn’t believe as he did and that Calvinists persecuted the Anabaptists, Baptists and others.

As for Luther he forgot to mention that Luther said things contrary to his actions wishing he had never done what he did and that Lutherans too persecuted Baptists and Anabaptists.
Click to expand...
By piety, I meant it is almost a work of pious homage to these figures (pious in the sense of almost legend-like rather than factual).😉 It is definitely one of the most slanted books I have ever seen, for sure.
I’ve read some of the book, I know it talks about the papacy much like tabloids talk about ants from space.😛
Couldn’t agree more on Calvin by the way - I sometimes wonder if the Christianity non-Christians despise so much isn’t simply Calvinism.:sad_yes:
 
**
On another REALM, the Roman*tic Catholic Church has made it Very clear of its Traditional Faith and standards for itself, when it has full control and dominon over its Realms and Kingdoms.

PLS/ … REMEMBER / Acording to the True Catholic (authority / Vatican ) ~ When they Gain Full CONTROL.

A heretic merits the pains of fire. By the Gospel, the canons, civil law, and custom, heretics must be burned"

(pp. 148,169 Directorium Inquisitorum Rome, 10/1584**

And

A heretic merits the pains of fire…By the Gospel, the canons, civil law, and custom, heretics must be burned.” The American Textbook of Popery, p 164 (quoting from the “Directory for the Inquisitors

**See Here for more Amazing statements Regarding the people that Catholics
Code: 
                            [lightministries.com/id525.htm#burned_1](http://www.lightministries.com/id525.htm#burned_1)
Lets take at HONEST LOOK at the ROOT of the Situation.

Remember : ~~ THE COUNCIL OF TARRAGONA - 1234 A.D.

The Council of Tarragona / 1234, 2 ND Canon :

Quote “No one may possess the books of the Old and New Testaments in the Romance language, and if anyone possesses them he must turn them over to the local bishop within eight days after promulgation of this decree, so that they may be burned…”

-D. Lortsch, Historie de la Bible en France, 1910, p.14.

Remember : ~~ THE BIBLE was PROHIBITED BY THE INDEX LIBRORUM PROHIBITORUM

"Pope Pius IV had a list of the forbidden books compiled and officially prohibited them in the
Index of Trent (Index Librorum Prohibitorum) of 1559.

These are excerpts taken from the Popes Declaration :

Rule IV

" The reading of the Holy Bible…more damage than advantage

…Whoever reads or has such a translation in his possession…cannot be absolved from his sins until he has turned in these Bibles…"-

Die Indices Librorum Prohibitorum des sechzehntenJahrhunderts (Tübingen, 1886), page 246f.
Source: The Reformation, by Hans J. Hillerbrand, copyright 1964 by SCM Press Ltd and Harper and Row, Inc.,
Library of Congress Catalog Card Number 64-15480,pages 474, 475.

" We too exhort you to try every means of keeping your flock from those deadly pastures.

Do everything possible to see that the faithful observe strictly the rules of our Congregation of the Index. To Convince them that to allow holy Bibles in the ordinary language…would…cause more harm than good."

-From the Encyclical UBI PRIMUM of POPE LEO XII, MAY 5, 1824**
 
**And Remember The COUNCIL OF TOULOUSE - 1229 A.D.

Canon 1. We appoint, therefore, that the archbishops and bishops shall swear in one priest, and two or three
laymen of good report, or more if they think fit, in every parish, both in and out of cities, who shall
diligently, faithfully, and frequently seek out the heretics in those parishes, by searching all houses
and subterranean chambers which lie under suspicion. And looking out for appendages or outbuildings, in the
roofs themselves, or any other kind of hiding places, all which we direct to be destroyed.

Canon 6. Directs that the house in which any heretic shall be found shall be destroyed.

Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should NOT be permitted to have the books of the Old or New

Testament.

Source: Heresy and Authority in Medieval Europe, Edited with an introduction by Edward Peters, Scolar Press,

London, copyright 1980 by Edward Peters, ISBN 0-85967-621-8, pp. 194-195, citing S. R. Maitland, Facts and

Documents [illustrative of the history, doctrine and rites, of the ancient Albigenses & Waldenses], London,
Rivington, 1832, pp. 192-194.

Additional Sources:

Ecclesiastical History of Ancient Churches
of the Albigenses, Pierre Allix,
published in Oxford at the Clarendon Press in 1821,
reprinted in USA in 1989
by Church History Research & Archives,
P.O. Box 38, Dayton Ohio, 45449, p. 213 [Canon 14].

Remember that ROME did not have a bible Translation untill 400 AD.

With the last 1600 yrs ~ of Roman*tic Catholicism we can see today that OVER the Years when NON CATHOLIC

people Tried to dispute and Spread the True Biblical Apostolic Faith of The Church.
Code: 
                                                     THE BIBLE / Scriptures.
The Catholic Masses, seeing that the bible Translations did not Show a Catholic Church in scripture.

The Catholic Church as a Whole, began to try to Make *( INTO LAW ) ~~ Catholic Faith as Mandatory Law.

BUT Wait…!..Go back …REMEMBER ~/~( Itallian Romantic Catholics, ( COMOMN PEOPLE )

Did not have ANY access WhATSOEVER, to Any of the Bible, untill Long AFTER the 4 th, - Century.

and slowly around the late 7 th Century when Rome finally / - SLOWLY began to correct the 600 + ERRORS of

Jeromes 4 th Century Latin Vulgate /.

ROME released it SLOWLY and ONLY to the Priests and BISHOPS.

ROME had no interest or desire to Make a German Translation or Arabic or Syrian or Hebrew or Aramiac or

Samaritan or any OTHER Translation WHATSOEVER. * ( At all )

WE can get into FURTHER Facts, Details and much DEEPER discussion, as we begin to get answers and divers

subjects and as Intentional diversions begin to come.

But rememeber FINALLY as the MAIN CONCLUSION of these FACTS… How the Catholic Church REFUSED to PUT

the bible into other languages…

And even BANNED all NON Catholic bibles. (* Claiming they were in Error )…A Danger & harmfull to their

Church.

Today we have the Pope auctually KISSING the Quran / BOWING down to the quran and declaring that **Allah)(

god of islam _) is the Lord Jesus Christ.

it is pretty CLEAR that the Catholic Church trully dislikes *( WITH A PASSION )… Gods word and His Church /

Peoples~~ trusting & Learning his word…

AUCTUAL PHOTO ~POPE KISSIN~ HIS…~ K.K.K.-URAN images.google.com/images?q=photos%20%20of

%20pope%20kissing%20quran&hl=en&lr=&sa=N&tab=wi

Having spent every MEANS possible including Murdering & Persecuting translators . BURNING & BANNING

bibles. And MAKING threats to People for possesing these bibles…

Claiming Error… While today they Kiss the Quran… & it really makes thing clear…**
 
On another REALM, the Roman*tic Catholic Church has made it Very clear of its Traditional Faith and standards for itself, when it has full control and domionon over its Realms and Kingdoms.

PLS/ … REMEMBER / Acording to the True Catholic (authority / Vatican ) ~ When they Gain Full CONTROL.

A heretic merits the pains of fire. By the Gospel, the canons, civil law, and custom, heretics must be burned" (pp. 148,169 Directorium Inquisitorum Rome, 10/1584**

And

A heretic merits the pains of fire…By the Gospel, the canons, civil law, and custom, heretics must be burned.” The American Textbook of Popery, p 164 (quoting from the “Directory for the Inquisitors

See Here for more Amazing statements Regarding the people that Catholics
Code: 
                            [lightministries.com/id525.htm#burned_1](http://www.lightministries.com/id525.htm#burned_1)
Lets take at HONEST LOOK at the ROOT of the Situation.

Remember : ~~ THE COUNCIL OF TARRAGONA - 1234 A.D.

The Council of Tarragona / 1234, 2 ND Canon :

Quote “No one may possess the books of the Old and New Testaments in the Romance language, and if anyone possesses them he must turn them over to the local bishop within eight days after promulgation of this decree, so that they may be burned…”-

D. Lortsch, Historie de la Bible en France, 1910, p.14.

Remember : ~~ THE BIBLE was PROHIBITED BY THE INDEX LIBRORUM PROHIBITORUM

"Pope Pius IV had a list of the forbidden books compiled and officially prohibited them in the
Index of Trent (Index Librorum Prohibitorum) of 1559.

These are excerpts taken from the Popes Declaration :

Rule IV

" The reading of the Holy Bible…more damage than advantage

…Whoever reads or has such a translation in his possession…cannot be absolved from his sins until he has turned in these Bibles…"-

Die Indices Librorum Prohibitorum des sechzehntenJahrhunderts (Tübingen, 1886), page 246f.
Source: The Reformation, by Hans J. Hillerbrand, copyright 1964 by SCM Press Ltd and Harper and Row, Inc., Library of Congress Catalog Card Number 64-15480,pages 474, 475.

" We too exhort you to try every means of keeping your flock from those deadly pastures.

Do everything possible to see that the faithful observe strictly the rules of our Congregation of the Index. To Convince them that to allow holy Bibles in the ordinary language…would…cause more harm than good."

-From the Encyclical UBI PRIMUM of POPE LEO XII, MAY 5, 1824**
 
**** And Remember The COUNCIL OF TOULOUSE - 1229 A.D.

AS a FINAL and second post to this FACT/./////

Canon 1. We appoint, therefore, that the archbishops and bishops shall swear in one priest, and two or three laymen of good report, or more if they think fit, in every parish, both in and out of cities, who shall diligently, faithfully,

and frequently seek out the heretics in those parishes, by searching all houses and subterranean chambers which lie under suspicion. And looking out for appendages or outbuildings, in the roofs themselves, or any other kind of hiding places, all which we direct to be destroyed.

Canon 6. Directs that the house in which any heretic shall be found shall be destroyed.

Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should NOT be permitted to have the books of the Old or New Testament.

Source: Heresy and Authority in Medieval Europe, Edited with an introduction by Edward Peters, Scolar Press, London, copyright 1980 by Edward Peters, ISBN 0-85967-621-8, pp. 194-195, citing S. R. Maitland, Facts and Documents [illustrative of the history, doctrine and rites, of the ancient Albigenses & Waldenses], London, Rivington, 1832, pp. 192-194.

Additional Sources:

Ecclesiastical History of Ancient Churches
of the Albigenses, Pierre Allix,
published in Oxford at the Clarendon Press in 1821, reprinted in USA in 1989
by Church History Research & Archives, P.O. Box 38, Dayton Ohio, 45449, p. 213 [Canon 14].

Remember that ROME did not have a bible Translation untill 400 AD.

With the last 1600 yrs ~ of Roman*tic Catholicism we can see today that OVER the Years when NON CATHOLIC people Tried to dispute and Spread the True Biblical Apostolic Faith of The Church.
Code: 
                                                     THE BIBLE / Scriptures.
The Catholic Masses, seeing that the bible Translations did not Show a Catholic Church in scripture.

The Catholic Church as a Whole, began to try to Make *( INTO LAW ) ~~ Catholic Faith as Mandatory Law.

BUT Wait…!..Go back …REMEMBER ~/~( Itallian Romantic Catholics, ( COMOMN PEOPLE )

Did not have ANY access WhATSOEVER, to Any of the Bible, untill Long AFTER the 4 th, - Century.

and slowly around the late 7 th Century when Rome finally / - SLOWLY began to correct the 600 + ERRORS of Jeromes 4 th Century Latin Vulgate /.

ROME released it SLOWLY and ONLY to the Priests and BISHOPS.

ROME had no interest or desire to Make a German Translation or Arabic or Syrian or Hebrew or Aramiac or Samaritan or any OTHER Translation WHATSOEVER. * ( At all )

WE can get into FURTHER Facts, Details and much DEEPER discussion, as we begin to get answers and divers subjects and as Intentional diversions begin to come.

But rememeber FINALLY as the MAIN CONCLUSION of these FACTS… How the Catholic Church REFUSED to PUT the bible into other languages…

And even BANNED all NON Catholic bibles. (* Claiming they were in Error )…A Danger & harmfull to their Church.

Today we have the Pope auctually KISSING the Quran / BOWING down to the quran and declaring that **Allah)( god of islam _) is the Lord Jesus Christ.

it is pretty CLEAR that the Catholic Church trully dislikes *( WITH A PASSION )… Gods word and His Church / Peoples~~ trusting & Learning his word…

AUCTUAL PHOTO ~POPE KISSIN~ HIS…~QURAN google.com/search?q=photos+of+pope+kissing+quran&hl=en&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=RVD5TpjgAYKftwe62d3PBg&ved=0CD4QsAQ&biw=1187&bih=568**

Having spent every MEANS possible including Murdering & Persecuting translators . BURNING & BANNING bibles. And MAKING threats to People for possesing these bibles…

Claiming Error… While today they Kiss the Quran… & it really makes thing clear

Thank you and Pls pray for Catholics & muslims… that they will Turn from serving Allah & Turn to Jesus**
 
AnnieBarnhardt said:
On another REALM, the Roman*tic Catholic Church has made it Very clear of its Traditional Faith and standards for itself, when it has full control and domionon over its Realms and Kingdoms.

PLS/ … REMEMBER / Acording to the True Catholic (authority / Vatican ) ~ When they Gain Full CONTROL.

A heretic merits the pains of fire. By the Gospel, the canons, civil law, and custom, heretics must be burned" (pp. 148,169 Directorium Inquisitorum Rome, 10/1584****

And

A heretic merits the pains of fire…By the Gospel, the canons, civil law, and custom, heretics must be burned.” The American Textbook of Popery, p 164 (quoting from the “Directory for the Inquisitors

See Here for more Amazing statements Regarding the people that Catholics
Code: 
                            [lightministries.com/id525.htm#burned_1](http://www.lightministries.com/id525.htm#burned_1)
Lets take at HONEST LOOK at the ROOT of the Situation.

Remember : ~~ THE COUNCIL OF TARRAGONA - 1234 A.D.

The Council of Tarragona / 1234, 2 ND Canon :

Quote “No one may possess the books of the Old and New Testaments in the Romance language, and if anyone possesses them he must turn them over to the local bishop within eight days after promulgation of this decree, so that they may be burned…”-

D. Lortsch, Historie de la Bible en France, 1910, p.14.

Remember : ~~ THE BIBLE was PROHIBITED BY THE INDEX LIBRORUM PROHIBITORUM

"Pope Pius IV had a list of the forbidden books compiled and officially prohibited them in the
Index of Trent (Index Librorum Prohibitorum) of 1559.

These are excerpts taken from the Popes Declaration :

Rule IV

" The reading of the Holy Bible…more damage than advantage

…Whoever reads or has such a translation in his possession…cannot be absolved from his sins until he has turned in these Bibles…"-

Die Indices Librorum Prohibitorum des sechzehntenJahrhunderts (Tübingen, 1886), page 246f.
Source: The Reformation, by Hans J. Hillerbrand, copyright 1964 by SCM Press Ltd and Harper and Row, Inc., Library of Congress Catalog Card Number 64-15480,pages 474, 475.

" We too exhort you to try every means of keeping your flock from those deadly pastures.

Do everything possible to see that the faithful observe strictly the rules of our Congregation of the Index. To Convince them that to allow holy Bibles in the ordinary language…would…cause more harm than good."

-From the Encyclical UBI PRIMUM of POPE LEO XII, MAY 5, 1824
Click to expand...
Thank the Lord you have arrived…I rest on the words…
Be determined not to please the enemy by allowing words of unfavorable criticism to lead you to retaliate, or to depress you. Make the enemy’s efforts a failure so far as you are concerned. The Lord will draw near to you, and will give you a rich measure of love and peace and joy, so deep and full that even in the midst of the trial of your faith, you can bear triumphant witness to the truth of the word of promise. You will have a sense of the divine presence. The eyes of your understanding will be enlightened, and the truth that at times you have seen but dimly, you will then see clearly. You will be able to tell the story of the cross with a deep appreciation of the Saviour’s love; for this love will have melted your heart. You will bear about with you in the daily life the witness that Christ is formed within, the hope of glory.
Click to expand...
**Mrs. E. G. White. **:eek:

Shall we discuss SDR Christology? There is a thread for SDA you know.

As you know we have been discussing Anti-Catholic sites…thanks for showing up.👍
 
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