Fr. Corapi Responds to Some of His Order's Charges

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I think He would have gotten crucified to say the least. Because you see, He was quite the liberal in His time. He went against the clerical heirarchy of His time and they nailed him with CALUMNY AND GOSSIP! My…sounds familar.

(Let it be known, I do NOT compare Corapi with Jesus at all…but he is still a priest, an alter christus…deliberating on this issue is a sin…IMHO)🙂
While we do not know what fact is since both SOLT and Fr. Corapi have two different stories, here is the recent SOLT press release accusing him of impropriety based on their investigation and evidence obtained. soltnews.blogspot.com/2011/07/press-release-concerning-fr-john-corapi.html This press release was posted by a CAF Apologist and is not gossip, it is a statement by Fr. Corapi’s order stating he is guilty. Now, we have to keep in mind Fr. Corapi has a side and may state that SOLT has made inaccurate decisions based on evidence (which could be forged and so on).
 
But either SOLT or Fr. Corapi are not accurate.
Quite right. At this point we do not know, but as has been stated many times, we do know that Fr. Corapi is currently in violation of the orders given by his superior. The rest may or may not ever come out to be honest. There is no requirement for the Church to deal with this type of situation transparently that I am aware of and it isn’t going to come out in a civil suit necessarily so it is quite possible that we will never have the facts to the matter.
 
Actually, the point is that the lawsuit is not so much about the non-disclosure contract. The main part of it is defamation and libel, challenging all the allegations of impropriety wilfully spread by the disgruntled ex-employee. She will have to defend the truthfulness of her allegations in court. I don’t think Fr. Corapi is afraid to face the accuser openly when he’s in the proper arena.
I will bet that the case never gets to trial, that it will be settled before then. I don’t think John Corapi wants any hard evidence coming to light, which it would if he presses on with his case.
 
I believe that some things need to be clarified as charitably as possible.
The original charges don’t even matter any more. He has disobeyed a direct order from his superior, thus placing himself outside of the authority of the Church.
When you defy a direct order, either from your major superior or your bishop, you do not place yourself outside of the Church. That would mean that you excommunicate yourself. This is not possible, unless you are a religious in solemn vows. Father Corapi and the SOLT make simple vows. This does not apply to them. It is a sin of disobedience and defiance. Usually, the superior must insist at least three times. After that, the superior has the right to begin dismissal proceedings against you, unless you have filed an appeal.
So true.

But all of it is so much water under the bridge because John Corapi (I leave off the Fr. title because he ASKED us to, so I respect his wish) has shown disobedience to his superiors and disregard for the priesthood by resigning from SOLT and not attaching himself to any diocese. That is the important thing now.
He cannot attach himself to any diocese until he is released by his superior. When we make profession in a religious community or a society of apostolic life, we become incardinated into that institute and no bishop has the authority to receive us without the written permission of the major superior. The major superior may not give such a permission, while a person has a canonical investigation in progress, because that’s dumping his problem onto a bishop.
NO ONE, ESPECIALLY A RELIGIOUS SUPERIOR, IS ALLOWED TO PRATICE DETRACTION AND CALUMNY
Shoshana, the major superior did not violate moral law or canon law. In fact, he complied with what the Church demands of him. It is the moral and legal obligation of every major superior to protect his community, whether it be a religious community or a society of apostolic life, as is the SOLT. If a person leaves the community quietly, the superior would be indiscrete and even immoral to speak about the person’s problems in a public fashion.

However, when the person illegally and publicly abandons the community and publicly charges the community with wrong-doing, the superior has a moral duty to reveal the facts, as best he knows them, in defense of his community. He must place the welfare of the community over the individual. The community has to be protected as any family has to be protected from a child who is angry and is making allegations that are damaging.

Also, his superior did not give him permission to file a civil suit. Father Corapi never said that his superior granted such permission. He said that he received the advice from the founder. The founder of the SOLT is no longer their superior. Since they are not an order of friars or monks, the founder ceases to have authority once he steps down from office. The successor become the legitimate and legal authority.

He is acting within the moral and canon laws of the Church. We can say that he could have worded things differently. Heck, all of us can always go back and soften something we’ve said or restate it so that it’s not so shocking. But he had an obligation to his community to make a public statement. The community has the right to demand that the major superior do so. That is the right of the professed members of the society. They have a right to be protected by their superior from allegations that are damaging to them, if such allegations are unjust. A superior’s job is not only to govern, but also to protect the community.

You referred to him as a shepherd. The truth is that major superiors are not shepherds in that sense. The Church does not expect them to shepherd the laity. The Church expects them to lead their brothers and to protect their brothers. The Council of Trent was so clear on this that it even passed legislation denying the laity and the bishops power over major superiors and their subjects. That’s how seriously Catholic tradition takes the role of a superior toward his community. It is not his job to protect us. It is his job to protect his sons and daughters. It is the job of the local bishop to protect the laity. Superiors work with him to make this happen.

I hope this helps.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
 
Point taken!

As for John Michael Talbot, I’m not a follower but from what I googled, he is a lay brother in a monastery that he founded? It is called The Brothers and Sisters of Charity. Their charism or ministry or whatever is the right term is to preach the gospel through music. He does wear a habit. I’m not a cradle Catholic so all these different nuances are confusing for me.
 
Oops, I shoulda quoted. My “point taken” was that Jesus would have been crucified as said by Shoshana." Now back to read Br. JR’s comment.
 
I believe that some things need to be clarified as charitably as possible.

When you defy a direct order, either from your major superior or your bishop, you do not place yourself outside of the Church. That would mean that you excommunicate yourself. This is not possible, unless you are a religious in solemn vows. Father Corapi and the SOLT make simple vows. This does not apply to them. It is a sin of disobedience and defiance. Usually, the superior must insist at least three times. After that, the superior has the right to begin dismissal proceedings against you, unless you have filed an appeal.

He cannot attach himself to any diocese until he is released by his superior. When we make profession in a religious community or a society of apostolic life, we become incardinated into that institute and no bishop has the authority to receive us without the written permission of the major superior. The major superior may not give such a permission, while a person has a canonical investigation in progress, because that’s dumping his problem onto a bishop.

Shoshana, the major superior did not violate moral law or canon law. In fact, he complied with what the Church demands of him. It is the moral and legal obligation of every major superior to protect his community, whether it be a religious community or a society of apostolic life, as is the SOLT. If a person leaves the community quietly, the superior would be indiscrete and even immoral to speak about the person’s problems in a public fashion.

However, when the person illegally and publicly abandons the community and publicly charges the community with wrong-doing, the superior has a moral duty to reveal the facts, as best he knows them, in defense of his community. He must place the welfare of the community over the individual. The community has to be protected as any family has to be protected from a child who is angry and is making allegations that are damaging.

Also, his superior did not give him permission to file a civil suit. Father Corapi never said that his superior granted such permission. He said that he received the advice from the founder. The founder of the SOLT is no longer their superior. Since they are not an order of friars or monks, the founder ceases to have authority once he steps down from office. The successor become the legitimate and legal authority.

He is acting within the moral and canon laws of the Church. We can say that he could have worded things differently. Heck, all of us can always go back and soften something we’ve said or restate it so that it’s not so shocking. But he had an obligation to his community to make a public statement. The community has the right to demand that the major superior do so. That is the right of the professed members of the society. They have a right to be protected by their superior from allegations that are damaging to them, if such allegations are unjust. A superior’s job is not only to govern, but also to protect the community.

You referred to him as a shepherd. The truth is that major superiors are not shepherds in that sense. The Church does not expect them to shepherd the laity. The Church expects them to lead their brothers and to protect their brothers. The Council of Trent was so clear on this that it even passed legislation denying the laity and the bishops power over major superiors and their subjects. That’s how seriously Catholic tradition takes the role of a superior toward his community. It is not his job to protect us. It is his job to protect his sons and daughters. It is the job of the local bishop to protect the laity. Superiors work with him to make this happen.

I hope this helps.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
Thank you Brother as always for your insights. As a quick question on the issue of obedience, how do the promises of obedience that Father Corapi would have made at his ordination to the priesthood play into this situation in your view?

Thanks!

Jason
 
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And maybe this thread should be closed on this note…🙂
I hope not, because I think it has been a very helpful thread to the many of us who feel a great sense of loss and sorrow over this situation. Of course, for some the topic may have run it’s course, but that would be a different story.
 
I believe that some things need to be clarified as charitably as possible.

When you defy a direct order, either from your major superior or your bishop, you do not place yourself outside of the Church. That would mean that you excommunicate yourself. This is not possible, unless you are a religious in solemn vows. Father Corapi and the SOLT make simple vows. This does not apply to them. It is a sin of disobedience and defiance. Usually, the superior must insist at least three times. After that, the superior has the right to begin dismissal proceedings against you, unless you have filed an appeal.

He cannot attach himself to any diocese until he is released by his superior. When we make profession in a religious community or a society of apostolic life, we become incardinated into that institute and no bishop has the authority to receive us without the written permission of the major superior. The major superior may not give such a permission, while a person has a canonical investigation in progress, because that’s dumping his problem onto a bishop.

Shoshana, the major superior did not violate moral law or canon law. In fact, he complied with what the Church demands of him. It is the moral and legal obligation of every major superior to protect his community, whether it be a religious community or a society of apostolic life, as is the SOLT. If a person leaves the community quietly, the superior would be indiscrete and even immoral to speak about the person’s problems in a public fashion.

However, when the person illegally and publicly abandons the community and publicly charges the community with wrong-doing, the superior has a moral duty to reveal the facts, as best he knows them, in defense of his community. He must place the welfare of the community over the individual. The community has to be protected as any family has to be protected from a child who is angry and is making allegations that are damaging.

Also, his superior did not give him permission to file a civil suit. Father Corapi never said that his superior granted such permission. He said that he received the advice from the founder. The founder of the SOLT is no longer their superior. Since they are not an order of friars or monks, the founder ceases to have authority once he steps down from office. The successor become the legitimate and legal authority.

He is acting within the moral and canon laws of the Church. We can say that he could have worded things differently. Heck, all of us can always go back and soften something we’ve said or restate it so that it’s not so shocking. But he had an obligation to his community to make a public statement. The community has the right to demand that the major superior do so. That is the right of the professed members of the society. They have a right to be protected by their superior from allegations that are damaging to them, if such allegations are unjust. A superior’s job is not only to govern, but also to protect the community.

You referred to him as a shepherd. The truth is that major superiors are not shepherds in that sense. The Church does not expect them to shepherd the laity. The Church expects them to lead their brothers and to protect their brothers. The Council of Trent was so clear on this that it even passed legislation denying the laity and the bishops power over major superiors and their subjects. That’s how seriously Catholic tradition takes the role of a superior toward his community. It is not his job to protect us. It is his job to protect his sons and daughters. It is the job of the local bishop to protect the laity. Superiors work with him to make this happen.

I hope this helps.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
Thank you Brother. My whole argument here is the continual discussion on this subject when we do not know all the facts. And even if we did, who are we to deliberate on corapi’s sin of disobedience? Have we not all sinned? Of course, this is causing scandal. I try to understand myself the whole situation. I just feel so uncomfortble with it all. i am surprised that this is continuing to the extent it is.

The best example and one I try to follow, is the example of St Francis. He never criticized that priest…it was his humble respect for the priethood that caused the priest to repent. Is this not what we shoudl do? Is this not lacking in these threads?

If anyone could have criticized the priest would have been St Francis…but he didn’t. His holiness caused a priest to return to the holiness of his priesthood.

I am so sad, so sad. I have been on catholic.com for many, many years. This is the saddest I have ever been…

But this too shall pass…
 
I wonder if at some point the Moderators will need to call a moratorium on Fr. Corapi threads. Accusations are flying and seems the same ground being covered.

SOLT has credibility and has fired a shot across the bow and fire returned by Fr. Corapi. I certainly think we need to take seriously the charges against Corapi and the church has a responsibility to act based on the evidence. I feel for the Church in that when they don’t act they are damned and when they do people damn them. The cause of Christ is bigger than Fr. Corapi and bigger than SOLT.

The fact that SOLT would so publicly accuse Corapi of having a relationship with a prostitute (at the time), shacking up, recent sexting, alcohol abuse,etc simply must be taken seriously…period. I cannot see why they would risk him suing them for defamation unless the evidence and e-mails they had were reasonable enough to make a judgment of some kind.

Soshana, I understand your hurt but the church goes on and is much bigger than any of this. The devil only wins if we do not deal with the issues or let it sidetrack us from the cause of Christ.
 
I hope not, because I think it has been a very helpful thread to the many of us who feel a great sense of loss and sorrow over this situation. Of course, for some the topic may have run it’s course, but that would be a different story.
I agree and I think no threads should be closed. we are adults here and I have not seen any trolls on here so far so let us be and if people don’t like a thread ignore it. I don’t have a clue as to why they closed the other thread. That kind of stuff is needless. There was not flame wars cursing swearing or vulgar language. Don’t get it. Scoob
 
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Yes, i understand. But it is confusing, would you not say? Do the civil suit, do not do the civil suit, forget about it…come back home.
It does not confuse me at all, because his announcement was clear that he sought advice from his previous bishop and previous superior, both of whom are retired, and no longer in positions of authority over him.

It is also very possible that he withheld information from both of them, and had they had all the facts, they may have advised him differently.

According to all I have read, his current superior NEVER advised him to file a civil suit.
 
It does not confuse me at all, because his announcement was clear that he sought advice from his previous bishop and previous superior, both of whom are retired, and no longer in positions of authority over him.

It is also very possible that he withheld information from both of them, and had they had all the facts, they may have advised him differently.

According to all I have read, his current superior NEVER advised him to file a civil suit.
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OK, guam. My stand is my response to Brother. I ama loving child of the Church seeking admission into the carmelite order. I am not a fanatic at all…just trying to follow in st francis’s footsteps. I do not want to be guilty before the Lord on deliberating on a priest who may or may not be guilty. It doesn’t really matter, as I believe one way or another, we have no right to deliberate at all when it comes to a priest. I have enough sins to confess without having to confess this one…😦
 
As one in the process of converting to Catholicism, I did not know of Father Corapi during his heyday on EWTN, etc and really only first heard of him when the scandal broke. I have since followed it pretty closely however, having read up on the situation in a variety of places, including his own former and present websites, the SOLT website, and the blogosphere. I hesitate to venture an opinion due to my newness to the Faith, but I must say that the whole thing strikes a very sour note within me. So many of his actions seem questionable, not at all humble or obedient, and I sense vanity and ego taking over. The changes in his physical appearance I find alarming as well.

I hope all ends well for John Corapi–we can only pray for him.
 
The reason I hope this thread stays up a bit longer is because of Shoshana’s last post. She is HURTING. She is grieving. She is reaching at straws to defend her belief in Fr. Corapi, and then admitting that very fact. As long as souls are still anguishing over the affair, I hope the mods keep this thread open for us to hash it all out, even if it is repetitious to some.

Shoshana - I am going to be praying for you. Sincerely. I can feel your pain. Try to hold onto the fact that our Lord has this all in hand, no matter how dark it may feel now. And good is coming from it. I promise. Just as Fr. Corapi is being called to obedience, so are we all.

The whole Church and Vatican authority and bureaucracy seems pretty crazy to us Americans, but we have to stand on faith and believe that the whole crazy mess was instituted by Christ and is overseen by the Holy Spirit. As the old saying goes, “It all turns out all right in the end (I read the book).”
 
As one in the process of converting to Catholicism, I did not know of Father Corapi during his heyday on EWTN, etc and really only first heard of him when the scandal broke. I have since followed it pretty closely however, having read up on the situation in a variety of places, including his own former and present websites, the SOLT website, and the blogosphere. I hesitate to venture an opinion due to my newness to the Faith, but I must say that the whole thing strikes a very sour note within me. So many of his actions seem questionable, not at all humble or obedient, and I sense vanity and ego taking over. The changes in his physical appearance I find alarming as well.

I hope all ends well for John Corapi–we can only pray for him.
You bring up a good point. For whatever sins Fr. Corapi may have committed, he is not the Catholic Church. You are coming to the faith for other reasons that transcend the scandal. The devil only wins when we allow ourselves to be sidetracked from the purposes of Christ.
 
Thank you Brother. My whole argument here is the continual discussion on this subject when we do not know all the facts. And even if we did, who are we to deliberate on corapi’s sin of disobedience? Have we not all sinned? Of course, this is causing scandal. I try to understand myself the whole situation. I just feel so uncomfortble with it all. i am surprised that this is continuing to the extent it is.

The best example and one I try to follow, is the example of St Francis. He never criticized that priest…it was his humble respect for the priethood that caused the priest to repent. Is this not what we shoudl do? Is this not lacking in these threads?

If anyone could have criticized the priest would have been St Francis…but he didn’t. His holiness caused a priest to return to the holiness of his priesthood.

I am so sad, so sad. I have been on catholic.com for many, many years. This is the saddest I have ever been…

But this too shall pass…
Yes we all sin and we are all sinners. THe difference is that John Corapi has much more knowledge and a higher responsibility. He scandalised the Church if these findings are true. Ok diocesan priests do not take the vow of poverty. But do you think it is healthy to have a priest that owns several motorboats fancy cars and houses?? Not healthy. My experience with him has been very negative. His secratary was nasty he ignored me and when I questioned him about where is all the money going he sent me a nasty gram. That sent a red flag with me and that was 4 years ago. He never responds to his fans’ comments he wouldn’t share the “stage” with anyone. He had an ego problem something a priest shouldn’t have. So he is held to a much higher standard or responsibility than a lay person as us. I think just like all the other “bombshells” it gets old and this thread will be forgotten soon. Talking about something is a way of healing and we all need healing when a scandal comes out regarless who is the cause. Corapi isn’t saying much and so that is that. My heart goes out to SOLT and they got the shaft in regards to Corapi. While we have Nuns losing their homes and priests needing medical care Corapi is buying cars and boats and STUFF!! when that money could have saved an order of nuns from being displaced into governmental housing which really breaks my heart. I don’t like the man but I pray for him and that he wil lbe a good stewart of his gifts and will finaly help the Church. Scoob.
 
I agree and I think no threads should be closed. we are adults here and I have not seen any trolls on here so far so let us be and if people don’t like a thread ignore it. I don’t have a clue as to why they closed the other thread. That kind of stuff is needless. There was not flame wars cursing swearing or vulgar language. Don’t get it. Scoob
I agree. Not everyone will find every topic being discussed at CAF something they are interested in or wish to take part in discussing, and that is fine. But to suggest threads be closed because someone has decided the topic has run its course for them personally is, in my opinion, inappropriate. Unless, as Scoob said, there is flaming, vulgarity, etc., going on, I don’t see why this or any thread should be arbitrarily closed. Furthermore, this situation is still developing and as such, there are many Catholics who will want to discuss these developments in order to understand what is going on and process it all, especially those of us who followed Fr. Corapi in the past.
 


Shoshana, the major superior did not violate moral law or canon law. In fact, he complied with what the Church demands of him. It is the moral and legal obligation of every major superior to protect his community, whether it be a religious community or a society of apostolic life, as is the SOLT. If a person leaves the community quietly, the superior would be indiscrete and even immoral to speak about the person’s problems in a public fashion.

YES - and thank you so much, Brother.

However, when the person illegally and publicly abandons the community and publicly charges the community with wrong-doing, the superior has a moral duty to reveal the facts, as best he knows them, in defense of his community. He must place the welfare of the community over the individual. The community has to be protected as any family has to be protected from a child who is angry and is making allegations that are damaging.

Again, yes and thank you.

Also, his superior did not give him permission to file a civil suit. Father Corapi never said that his superior granted such permission. He said that he received the advice from the founder. The founder of the SOLT is no longer their superior. Since they are not an order of friars or monks, the founder ceases to have authority once he steps down from office. The successor become the legitimate and legal authority.

YES.

He is acting within the moral and canon laws of the Church. We can say that he could have worded things differently. Heck, all of us can always go back and soften something we’ve said or restate it so that it’s not so shocking. But he had an obligation to his community to make a public statement. The community has the right to demand that the major superior do so. That is the right of the professed members of the society. They have a right to be protected by their superior from allegations that are damaging to them, if such allegations are unjust. A superior’s job is not only to govern, but also to protect the community.

… and yes.

You referred to him as a shepherd. The truth is that major superiors are not shepherds in that sense. The Church does not expect them to shepherd the laity. The Church expects them to lead their brothers and to protect their brothers. The Council of Trent was so clear on this that it even passed legislation denying the laity and the bishops power over major superiors and their subjects. That’s how seriously Catholic tradition takes the role of a superior toward his community. It is not his job to protect us. It is his job to protect his sons and daughters. It is the job of the local bishop to protect the laity. Superiors work with him to make this happen.

Again, YES and thank you so much.

I hope this helps.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, OSF 🙂
Dear Brother, I thank you
as do so many others. God bless you as always.
 
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