Free-range pigs -- not so happy

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  1. the author said the males were castrated to prevent a strong taste in the meat. anyone who has owned a complete male animal knows why they are castrated: they are extremely agressive, esp if there are several all together.
  2. The author quoted someone saying the nose-ringed pigs are depressed because they can’t fulfill their identity or some such baloney? (I couldn’t read the article easily because half of it kept getting covered up by a block of grey.) People think animals are people… ridiculous.
And Rence, if you need to keep the pigs in the same area, you can’t let them root it all up. Just because it grows back doesn’t mean it grows back fast enough. The nose-rings appear to be a part of pasture management.
 
St_Francis said:
  1. the author said the males were castrated to prevent a strong taste in the meat.
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Which is perfectly true.
St_Francis said:
anyone who has owned a complete male animal knows why they are castrated: they are extremely agressive, esp if there are several all together.
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This doesn’t justify castration without painkillers.
St_Francis said:
  1. The author quoted someone saying the nose-ringed pigs are depressed because they can’t fulfill their identity or some such baloney? (I couldn’t read the article easily because half of it kept getting covered up by a block of grey.) People think animals are people… ridiculous.
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Ringing is very painful, and prevents pigs from doing what they’re naturally inclined to do (foraging) - hence they get depressed. Although animals aren’t people, animals are very similar to people in many relevant ways.
 
What is “agenda posting?” Are certain topics not allowed to be discussed on this forum?
 
I do have a particular “viewpoint,” but I’ve been posting on wide range of important issues: hunting, bullfighting, meat consumption, etc. So I just don’t understand the “agenda” charge. In fact, although critics won’t admit it, they probably like the topics I’ve been raising - as evidenced by their close scrutiny of my threads.
 
I intend to provoke discussion and debate on important issues, and if that’s “agenda posting,” then I suppose I’m guilty.
 
St_Francis said:
And Rence, if you need to keep the pigs in the same area, you can’t let them root it all up. Just because it grows back doesn’t mean it grows back fast enough. The nose-rings appear to be a part of pasture management.
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Yeah, you’re right about that. You guess you have to use a ring if you use the same area.
 
spencelo said:
What flaws?
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First, there is his claim that nose-rings are near universal on free-range farms. Bat doesn’t seem to be the case in the US, and Mr. McWilliams offers no evidence in support of his claim.

Then there is the matter of castration. It is not done when young, sexually mature boars will attack one another, often causing grievous injuries to themselves.
spencelo said:
I haven’t looked into this, but even if true, it has nothing to do with the Slate article I posted.
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But it does. He has, in both articles, made unsubstantiated claims and misled by withholding important information.

It is similar to that article you posted by Ingrid Newkirk. She claimed 40% of food is wasted in the US and wanted us to think that meant 40% of meat is wasted. But that implication doesn’t automatically follow and she offers no evidence in support of that claim.

Its this kind of sleight of hand rhetoric which makes me suspicious of the articles you have been posting.
 
Dale_M said:
First, there is his claim that nose-rings are near universal on free-range farms. Bat doesn’t seem to be the case in the US, and Mr. McWilliams offers no evidence in support of his claim.
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Like I said, one or two counter-examples doesn’t challenge McWilliams claim. Ringing appears to be a common practice.
Dale_M said:
Then there is the matter of castration. It is not done when young, sexually mature boars will attack one another, often causing grievous injuries to themselves.
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Who disputes that castration isn’t done when young? It is. And even if castration is necessary, here’s the key point: it’s often done without painkillers.
Dale_M said:
But it does. He has, in both articles, made unsubstantiated claims and misled by withholding important information.
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Circumstantial ad hominen. Whatever errors (if any) McWilliams might have made in some prior article doesn’t disqualify his statements in this present article.
Dale_M said:
It is similar to that article you posted by Ingrid Newkirk. She claimed 40% of food is wasted in the US and wanted us to think that meant 40% of meat is wasted.
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No, she gave the (correct) impression that a lot of meat is wasted – not necessarily 40%. I already addressed this in the other thread.
Dale_M said:
Its this kind of sleight of hand rhetoric which makes me suspicious of the articles you have been posting.
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There’s no sleight of hand. The factual assertions in McWilliams article were not refuted in any way.
 
Dale_M said:
But it does. He has, in both articles, made unsubstantiated claims and misled by withholding important information.

It is similar to that article you posted by Ingrid Newkirk. She claimed 40% of food is wasted in the US and wanted us to think that meant 40% of meat is wasted. But that implication doesn’t automatically follow and she offers no evidence in support of that claim.

Its this kind of sleight of hand rhetoric which makes me suspicious of the articles you have been posting.
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No wonder many people here (including myself) tend to suspect him.
 
Real and honest: mcaf.ee/tosh4

“What I do is wrong. I know it in my bones, even if I can’t yet act on it. Someday it must stop. Somehow we need to become the sort of beings who can see what we are doing when we look head on, the sort of beings who don’t weave dark, damning shrouds to sustain, with acceptance and celebration, the grossly unethical, solely for shallow sensual pleasure. Deeper, much deeper, we have an obligation to eat otherwise.”
 
What about eating only roadkill? What about animals that die of natural causes? Who’s going to force the carnivores to adjust their diet? I mean, wrong is wrong, even if it’s evolution. Right?
 
It’s not eating meat that’s unethical. It’s the way the poor animals are treated beforehand and how they are slaughtered.
 
Christmastwin said:
It’s not eating meat that’s unethical. It’s the way the poor animals are treated beforehand and how they are slaughtered.
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I agree with you, but wonder how much responsibility do consumers have to make sure the meat they purchase is ethically produced?

Certainly there are wholesome farms which raise their pigs with respect for the nature of the animal. But the meat produced by these farms cost significantly more than meat raised by conventional pork industry standards. Should consumers boycott the cheaper pork? Should they organize to publicize the animal abuse involved in mainstream methods? Is there a moral obligation to protest factory farming of animals?

As for the essay posted in the first link, I hope the farmer is able to find a different line of work soon. Cognitive dissonance can be painful. At some point he will have to bite the bullet, and take financial losses if need be. Its been done many times before: clergy quitting their posts because they have become atheist, Planned Parenthood directors quitting because they are now horrified by abortion, career military officers quitting because of a change in their life outlook. There are many such examples. He won’t be alone in making a sacrifice for the sake of his conscience.
 
spencelo said:
Real and honest: mcaf.ee/tosh4

“What I do is wrong. I know it in my bones, even if I can’t yet act on it. Someday it must stop. Somehow we need to become the sort of beings who can see what we are doing when we look head on, the sort of beings who don’t weave dark, damning shrouds to sustain, with acceptance and celebration, the grossly unethical, solely for shallow sensual pleasure. Deeper, much deeper, we have an obligation to eat otherwise.”
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And I’m sure that somewhere in the bowels of the internet I could find a racing driver who thinks cars are evil.
 
In another thread

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=714135

some of us talk about a sympathetic sharing in the pain of others. I am one of them. I am also a vegetarian. Maybe I empathize too much but when I see a peace of meat I cannot help but think of the animal alive. I do not judge others I just make my own choice.
 
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