Free-will and Pontius Pilate

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Pontius Pilate and Free Will. What would have happened to history if Pontius Pilate refused to condemn Jesus Christ? Another thought is if God uses people or chooses in order to reach his point or to accomplish his mission - Is it that God knew and knows the heart of Pontius Pilate and everyone else? What about free will? If God knows everything How does free will fit into his plan? What would have happened if Pontius Pilate at the very last second said no, I will not condemn Jesus Christ? Or perhaps there are instances such as this that God must intervene in order to accomplish his goals. Everything with our good Lord is such a great mystery. And I know we cannot know it all. Not until our death.
 
“Wishing to please the crowd” - but he found no guilt. He sought reason to set Him free, but allowed himself to be persuaded by external demands.
 
This is a very recurring question both here on CAF and in Philosophy. The thing is that GOD is all knowing HE does not need to infringe on our free will to bring about HIS plan. The plan of salvation was put in place even before the Universe was created. How is that possible one asks. Well as stated before GOD already knew everything. Then somebody says: Well if GOD knew all along how it all would turn out then why bother?
But if GOD hadn’t created the Universe we would have never existed and be here pondering all this things. So for that I am grateful to GOD to allow me be here and marvel at all HE has created for me and us to discover.
Hope this helps some.
Peace!
 
We humans actually do this all the time with others.

We often know how a person or group will respond to particular situations. We might not know the exact details of what they will do and say, but we often know the general outcome.

This is why coups have often been attempted throughout history during times of strife. During times of strife, we often know how people and select leaders will respond to key situations based on their past actions & personality.

This allows groups to “take advantage” of a situation.

God operates in a similar way. The only difference is He 100% knows what we will do, it’s not a just very educated guess like when we humans do it.

I pray this helps
 
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Nan3 said:
What would have happened to history if Pontius Pilate refused to condemn Jesus Christ?
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As neither Herod or Pilate sent Jesus to execution, Jesus would’ve continued his ministry. However, the Sanhedrin wouldn’t have stopped their campaign against him. It’s very probable that Jesus would’ve been brought before Pilate and/or Herod several times and eventually would have been crucified. Either way, Pilate was eventually recalled to Rome over violently suppressing another rebellion. So, the next Governor could very well have crucified Jesus.
 
Nan3 said:
Pontius Pilate and Free Will. What would have happened to history if Pontius Pilate refused to condemn Jesus Christ?
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That’s nothing more than a speculative “What If?”
It didn’t happen…
That’s all.

_
 
The thing is, he kind of did say no. Every Good Friday I am struck with how his choice was not to kill Jesus but to step out of the way.

If he had stood his ground? My best guess is that the crowd would have revolted and killed Jesus anyways. Possibly killing Pilate in the process. Perhaps the only result of handing Jesus over was that Pilate missed his chance to be one of the first martyrs.
 
Inquiry said:
If he had stood his ground? My best guess is that the crowd would have revolted and killed Jesus anyways. Possibly killing Pilate in the process. Perhaps the only result of handing Jesus over was that Pilate missed his chance to be one of the first martyrs
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Again… A What If? which could lead to endless speculations… .
 
Well I tried to keep my what if focused not on what would have changed historically, but in terms of what would have changed for those directly involved.
 
Inquiry said:
Well I tried to keep my what if focused not on what would have changed historically, but in terms of what would have changed for those directly involved
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Yes … You’ve said that several times now.

Since What If? speculations usually have no purpose whatsover within discussions of What’s Happened with Jesus - including being realized as therefore generally meaningless,
one question lit is:

For What Reason? (besides saying you personally want to engage in doing so)

_

_
 
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Source Info from John

The Jewish leaders took Jesus from Caiaphas to the palace of Pilate who came out to them and asked, “What charges are you bringing against this man?”
“If he were not a criminal we would not have handed him over to you.”

Pilate said, “Take him yourselves and judge him by your own law.”
But we have no right to execute anyone,” they objected.
Pilate summoned Jesus and asked him, “Are you the king of the Jews?”
“Is that your own idea,” Jesus asked, “or did others talk to you about me?”

“Am I a Jew?” Pilate replied.
“Your own people and chief priests handed you over to me. What is it you have done?”

Pilate went out again to the Jews gathered there and said, “I find no basis for a charge against him. But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover. Do you want me to release ‘the king of the Jews’?”

They shouted back, “No, not him! Give us Barabbas!”

Then Pilate took Jesus and had him flogged. .

Once more Pilate came out and said to the Jews gathered there, “Look, I am bringing him out to you to let you know that I find no basis for a charge against him.”

As soon as the chief priests and their officials saw him, they shouted, “Crucify! Crucify!”

But Pilate answered, “You take him and crucify him. As for me, I find no basis for a charge against him.”

The Jewish leaders insisted,
“We have a law, and according to that law he must die, because he claimed to be the Son of God.”

Pilate said. “Don’t you realize I have power either to free you or to crucify you?”

Jesus answered, “You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin.”

From then on, Pilate tried to set Jesus free, but the Jewish leaders kept shouting, “If you let this man go, you are no friend of Caesar. Anyone who claims to be a king opposes Caesar.”

It was the day of Preparation of the Passover; it was about noon.

“Here is your king,” Pilate said to the Jews.

But they shouted, “Take him away! Take him away! Crucify him!”

“Shall I crucify your king?” Pilate asked.

“We have no king but Caesar,” the chief priests answered.

Finally Pilate handed him over to them to be crucified.
 
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Possibly more polite, but also more radical. In The Last Temptation, it eventually turns out that it was a dream, Jesus dies on the Cross, and history is left unchanged. In Caillois’ book, the Crucifixion never happened. From that moment on – the acquittal – the history of the world was completely different than the one we know.
 
BartholomewB said:
Possibly more polite, but also more radical. In The Last Temptation, it eventually turns out that it was a dream, Jesus dies on the Cross, and history is left unchanged. In Caillois’ book, the Crucifixion never happened. From that moment on – the acquittal – the history of the world was completely different than the one we know.
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Yes … Speculation -
Best is to stick with the Gospel accounts…
Lesser… A movie? The Passion of Christ…

Those who like to solely focus upon ‘the Romans’
are spreading a Falsehood and in some cases a Lie
for purpose of peddling Doubt re: Guilt

_
 
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EndTimes said:
Yes … Speculation -
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No, it isn’t speculation. It’s fiction. When you read a novel, you’re not expected to believe that you’re reading a history book. It’s a different kind of book.Think about it.
 
OK

Best is to stick with the Gospel accounts… and leave Fiction out of it…

Those who like to solely focus upon ‘the Romans’
are spreading a Falsehood and in some cases a Lie
for purpose of peddling Doubt re: Guilt
 
Since The Talmud didn’t come into existence until Centuries AFTER the Jewish Authorities handed Jesus over to Pilate to execute Him, that understanding can not in any manner - dovetail with Sacred Scriptures/NewTestament/Gospel.

As Catholics . Sacred Scriptures are The GOTO for Source Info the Crucifixion

Source Info from John

The Jewish leaders took Jesus from Caiaphas to the palace of Pilate who came out to them and asked, “What charges are you bringing against this man?”
“If he were not a criminal we would not have handed him over to you.”

Pilate said, “Take him yourselves and judge him by your own law.”
But we have no right to execute anyone,” they objected.
Pilate summoned Jesus and asked him, “Are you the king of the Jews?”
“Is that your own idea,” Jesus asked, “or did others talk to you about me?”

“Am I a Jew?” Pilate replied.
“Your own people and chief priests handed you over to me. What is it you have done?”

Pilate went out again to the Jews gathered there and said, “I find no basis for a charge against him. But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover. Do you want me to release ‘the king of the Jews’?”

They shouted back, “No, not him! Give us Barabbas!”

Then Pilate took Jesus and had him flogged. .

Once more Pilate came out and said to the Jews gathered there, “Look, I am bringing him out to you to let you know that I find no basis for a charge against him.”

As soon as the chief priests and their officials saw him, they shouted, “Crucify! Crucify!”

But Pilate answered, “You take him and crucify him. As for me, I find no basis for a charge against him.”

The Jewish leaders insisted,
“We have a law, and according to that law he must die, because he claimed to be the Son of God.”

Pilate said. “Don’t you realize I have power either to free you or to crucify you?”

Jesus answered, “You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin.”

From then on, Pilate tried to set Jesus free, but the Jewish leaders kept shouting, “If you let this man go, you are no friend of Caesar. Anyone who claims to be a king opposes Caesar.”

It was the day of Preparation of the Passover; it was about noon.

“Here is your king,” Pilate said to the Jews.

But they shouted, “Take him away! Take him away! Crucify him!”

“Shall I crucify your king?” Pilate asked.

“We have no king but Caesar,” the chief priests answered.

Finally Pilate handed him over to them to be crucified.
 
It’s not theory that The Babylonian Talmud was compiled circa year 500 AD.

Not all Jews are to Blame … for Christ’s Crucifixion.

Pilate too has some blame. Less weighty than the Jewish Leadership
 
You acknowledge there exists a False putting of all the blame on the Romans…
Why do you think that’s been occurring?

No one here has put all the blame on all the Jews.

For sure, according to Jesus
  • those of the Jewish Leadership are guiltier of His Death than is Pilate.
 
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Be that as it may…

God’s Gospel supersedes mere secular-driven "political correctness"
which often is manufactured so as to control the speech and thoughts of people.

Attempts to squelch Jesus’ Gospel is AntiChristian

TO THE OP

According to Jesus
  • those of the Jewish Leadership are guiltier of His Death than is Pilate.
 
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