Free Will in the Westminster Confession of Faith

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You stated that “the Reformed insist we CAN know”. He was and continues to be a paragon of the Reformation and didn’t seem to share your certainty - at least in private.
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You should know that Reformed and Lutheran theologies are very different. It is bizarre how some people want to drag Luther into every conversation. This thread is not about Luther.
If your concept of “Reformed theology” includes the perseverance of the saints, then there is no uncertainty expressed because that would undermine the supposed absolute sovereignty of God in the entire salvific process from start to finish.
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Have you every read the Westminster Confession of Faith? Perhaps you should.
Not absurd at all.

Using different lenses for different texts is something covered in the opening 5 minutes of your Textual Criticism class at your local U or seminary…
Amusing.
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The OT saints were given as examples for our learning and walk. Now you are telling me that we can learn nothing from David? That the OT has nothing to teach us?

And bringing up oral sex is crass and uncalled for.
 
Changed to ‘Free Will in the Westminster Confession of Faith’ or something like that.

@Fauken thank you!
 
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SojournerOnEarth said:
How do Catholics interpret 2 Peter 1:10 (New International Version)

Therefore, my brothers and sisters, make every effort to confirm your calling and election. For if you do these things, you will never stumble,…"

You can only obey this if there is a way to confirm your calling and election.
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I read 2 Peter 1:10 in the context of verses 3-9
3 His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence, 4 by which he has granted to us his precious and very great promises, that through these you may escape from the corruption that is in the world because of passion, and become partakers of the divine nature.[c] 5 For this very reason make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, and virtue with knowledge, 6 and knowledge with self-control, and self-control with steadfastness, and steadfastness with godliness, 7 and godliness with brotherly affection, and brotherly affection with love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, they keep you from being ineffective or unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For whoever lacks these things is blind and shortsighted and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins
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Verses 5-7 seem to be saying your status is maintained and confirmed by living the faith and attaining the virtues of gospel morality.

It seems to me St. Peter is saying we know for sure that people who don’t supplement their faith… are NOT confirming their calling and election.

I don’t really see him coming right out and saying you CAN know you are among the elect. It seems he is saying you CAN know you AREN’T among the elect.

If we read the next chapter St. Peter goes on to tell us that our calling is jeopardized if we become re-entangled in a life of sin.
20 For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overpowered, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21 For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22 It has happened to them according to the true proverb, The dog turns back to his own vomit, and the sow is washed only to wallow in the mire.
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It seems we are being taught here that there is a real danger that we might fall. Therefore it is important to confirm your calling and election, by the actions in verses 5-7, so by your actions you can know you are cooperating with God’s call. As for having complete assurance of ones election, I don’t see this verse going that far.

God Bless
 
SojournerOnEarth said:
You should know that Reformed and Lutheran theologies are very different.
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🤔
You should know that “reformed” and “Calvinist” aren’t always synonyms. If you’re wanting to discuss only Calvinism, use that language please.
Have you every read the Westminster Confession of Faith? Perhaps you should.
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Read it more than I care to remember back in my younger days at a Baptist Seminary that was leaning hard toward Calvinism…
The OT saints were given as examples for our learning and walk. Now you are telling me that we can learn nothing from David? That the OT has nothing to teach us?
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Not the point.

The point is that you don’t read Psalms in the same way you read Leviticus. I think you know this.
 
You should know that “reformed” and “Calvinist” aren’t always synonyms. If you’re wanting to discuss only Calvinism, use that language please.
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We are discussing the system of faith expressed in the Westminster Confession of Faith.
Read it more than I care to remember back in my younger days at a Baptist Seminary that was leaning hard toward Calvinism…
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Then please display some understanding of it. Thank you. How long were you there? Did you get a degree? Was it an accredited seminary? The point being, you are attempting to show academic competence and bringing that into the discussion, so it is fair to ask. Do you have credentials?
Not the point.
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Exactly the point.
 
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SojournerOnEarth said:
We are discussing the system of faith expressed in the Westminster Confession of Faith.
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👍
Then please display some understanding of it. Thank you. How long were you there? Did you get a degree? Was it an accredited seminary?
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Where would you like for me to have the Registrar’s Office mail the transcript?
🤣
Exactly the point.
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Those found in the OT have lots to teach us.
But, again, you need to treat different texts differently. This fact is so basic, so fundamental to analyzing texts that I’m not going to belabor it with you any further.
 
Where would you like for me to have the Registrar’s Office mail the transcript?
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Funny. So you survived at least one course long enough to have a transcript?
But, again, you need to treat different texts differently. This fact is so basic, so fundamental to analyzing texts that I’m not going to belabor it with you any further.
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True, but not really pertinent. David was expressing eternal security and confidence in his salvation.
 
To avoid a stupid gun-battle over definitions:

He knew he was saved.
He is an example to be followed.
Therefore we can know we are saved.
 
SojournerOnEarth said:
To avoid a stupid gun-battle over definitions:

He knew he was saved.
He is an example to be followed.
Therefore we can know we are saved.
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The bold part is your error. David’s just a man. What he thinks and feels isn’t doctrine.
 
And how about “Today you will be with me in paradise”?

Presumption if the thief believed Jesus’ own words?
 
Then I guess we can’t believe anything anyone ever says, because they are just men.
 
So Scripture is not inspired in your view? David was not inspired by the Holy Spirit when he said that?

Keep trying.
 
SojournerOnEarth said:
Then I guess we can’t believe anything anyone ever says, because they are just men.
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If they’re saying it descriptively as men, right. It’s just an opinion.

If it’s being said as a prescriptive by Jesus, an Apostle and so on, then it’s truth.
 
Vonsalza said:
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SojournerOnEarth:
Then I guess we can’t believe anything anyone ever says, because they are just men.
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If they’re saying it descriptively as men, right. It’s just an opinion.

If it’s being said as a prescriptive by Jesus, an Apostle and so on, then it’s truth.
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As in Holy Scripture? The psalms are just David’s opinions?
 
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