freemasonry

  • Thread starter Thread starter andrew_chong
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
A

andrew_chong

Guest
what is the church current and official view on freemasonry and the reasons
 
Catholicism and freemasonry have a long, and heated history, and even other Christian faiths have their problems with the practice of masonry.

Catholics believe that masonry is a faith unto itself, a false faith, where a “universal god” is all that is needed for entry into it. So all faiths are therefore equal, whether its Buddism, Hinduism, Christainity, Judaism, Muslim, etc, etc. In other words, everyone is right, and nobody is wrong. There god is a deity, not necessarilly Jesus Christ, and masonry can lead a Christian astray from Him. Masonry, in Europe especially, is at odds with The Church because they see us as oppressors to freedom, and it is said that some of their degree ceromonies are anti-Catholic. Of course, masons will deny any anti Catholicism exists in masonry, but we can never know for sure since it is a secret society, which in and of itself is a sin for a Catholic man to be part of.

Memebership in freemasonry used to mean excommunication for a Catholic. These days you are not excommunicated, but it is still a mortal sin, and you cannot recieve Holy Communion…

There is so much to the “relationship”, that it’s impossible to cover the subject here…
 
tq Jim for your thoughts. what’s the latest pronuncement from the church on the subject?
 
Not long ago did not our Pope Benedict say that Catholics who belong to the masons still can’t receive Communion
 
vatican.va/roman_curia/congregations/cfaith/documents/rc_con_cfaith_doc_19850223_declaration-masonic_articolo_en.html
Precisely by considering all these elements, the Declaration of the Sacred Congregation affirms that membership in Masonic associations «remains forbidden by the Church», and the faithful who enrolls in them «are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion».
With this last statement, the Sacred Congregation points out to the faithful that this membership objectively constitutes a grave sin and by specifying that the members of a Masonic association may not receive Holy Communion, it intends to enlighten the conscience of the faithful about a grave consequence which must derive from their belonging to a Masonic lodge.
Finally, the Sacred Congregation declares that «it is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above». In this regard, the text also refers to the Declaration of 17 February 1981, which already reserved to the Apostolic See all pronouncements on the nature of these associations which may have implied derogations from the Canon Law then in force (Can. 2335). In the same way, the new document issued by the S.C.D.F. in November 1983 expresses identical intentions of reserve concerning pronouncements which would differ from the judgment expressed here on the irreconcilability of Masonic principles with the Catholic faith, on the gravity of the act of joining a lodge and on the consequences which arise from it for receiving Holy Communion. This disposition points out that, despite the diversity which may exist among Masonic obediences, in particular in their declared attitude towards the Church, the Apostolic See discerns some common principles in them which require the same evaluation by all ecclesiastical authorities.
 
There was just a thread on this, it got really ugly, for no reason. But the Roman Catholic Church says it is forbidden for a Catholic to belong to the masons and receive Communion. That is what the Church says, so i guess unless something changes which it doesnt look good, its still forbidden. Hope this helps.
 
rinnie said:
There was just a thread on this, it got really ugly, for no reason. But the Roman Catholic Church says it is forbidden for a Catholic to belong to the masons and receive Communion. That is what the Church says, so i guess unless something changes which it doesnt look good, its still forbidden. Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
Actually there have been (at least) three threads on masonry in the past week. It seems some new CA members might have joined CA to push membership in the masons. (The masonic membership in this country is way way down, thanks be to God.) It doesn’t take much insight to notice a trend when a topic that has barely been mentioned in months is suddenly “hot” in three threads. Yes, as always, Catholics are FORBIDDEN to join the masons. No change there.
 
catharina said:
Actually there have been (at least) three threads on masonry in the past week. It seems some new CA members might have joined CA to push membership in the masons. (The masonic membership in this country is way way down, thanks be to God.) It doesn’t take much insight to notice a trend when a topic that has barely been mentioned in months is suddenly “hot” in three threads. Yes, as always, Catholics are FORBIDDEN to join the masons. No change there.
Click to expand...
Wonder why huh. Because if anything if a Catholic did think about it these threads would be more proof the other way not to do it. Oh well the best thing to do is then just ignore them. thanks for the heads up.
 
catharina said:
Actually there have been (at least) three threads on masonry in the past week. It seems some new CA members might have joined CA to push membership in the masons. (The masonic membership in this country is way way down, thanks be to God.) It doesn’t take much insight to notice a trend when a topic that has barely been mentioned in months is suddenly “hot” in three threads. Yes, as always, Catholics are FORBIDDEN to join the masons. No change there.
Click to expand...
Catharina,

Hope this message finds you doing well.

I pray that my post have not been taken incorrectly. Freemasons are not allowed to recruit new members.

I really came to CAF to try to obtain the reason as to why the Church is against Freemasonry.

Thank you for your post.
 
catharina said:
Actually there have been (at least) three threads on masonry in the past week. It seems some new CA members might have joined CA to push membership in the masons. (The masonic membership in this country is way way down, thanks be to God.) It doesn’t take much insight to notice a trend when a topic that has barely been mentioned in months is suddenly “hot” in three threads. Yes, as always, Catholics are FORBIDDEN to join the masons. No change there.
Click to expand...
Catharina,

I haven’t been to a lodge meeting in years, but from what I have seen new membership is at an all time high. This being said, it is only fair to mention that there are lodges that are struggling with membership–especially the ones in the smaller rural towns and in the older urban areas (I think this is because of the aging population in those areas).

One question, who are the other masons on CAF? I thought I was the only one.

Thank you for your post.
 
DallasTexas said:
One question, who are the other masons on CAF? I thought I was the only one.
Click to expand...
Not to get to personal, and feel free not to answer, but, are you Catholic?

And if you are, how do you reconcile what the Church teaches on the matter of masonry, and your membership in it?:confused:
 
DallasTexas said:
Catharina,

I haven’t been to a lodge meeting in years, but from what I have seen new membership is at an all time high. This being said, it is only fair to mention that there are lodges that are struggling with membership–especially the ones in the smaller rural towns and in the older urban areas (I think this is because of the aging population in those areas).

One question, who are the other masons on CAF? I thought I was the only one.

Thank you for your post.
Click to expand...
The reason to abandon your membership is this simple: so you’ll be free once more to receive Holy Communion, after making a good confession. I don’t think very many Catholics expect that “the Church” will invite them in for a sit-down to explain the history and reasons for a teaching. Wouldn’t the usual course of affairs be one of humble obedience, to drop your membership and then “ask questions” if you feel you must do so?
Code: 
Encylclical "IN EMINENTI"

ON FREEMASONRY

PAPAL BULL OF POPE CLEMENT XII

April 28, 1738


CLEMENT, BISHOP, Servant of the Servants of God to all the faithful, Salutation, and Apostolic Benediction.

Since the divine clemency has placed Us, Whose merits are not equal to the task, in the high watch-tower of the Apostolate with the duty of pastoral care confided to Us, We have turned Our attention, as far as it has been granted Us from on high, with unceasing care to those things through which the integrity of Orthodox Religion is kept from errors and vices by preventing their entry, and by which the dangers of disturbance in the most troubled times are repelled from the whole Catholic World.

Now it has come to Our ears, and common gossip has made clear, that certain Societies, Companies, Assemblies, Meetings, Congregations or Conventicles called in the popular tongue Liberi Muratori or Francs Massons or by other names according to the various languages, are spreading far and wide and daily growing in strength; and men of any Religion or sect, satisfied with the appearance of natural probity, are joined together, according to their laws and the statutes laid down for them, by a strict and unbreakable bond which obliges them, both by an oath upon the Holy Bible and by a host of grievous punishment, to an inviolable silence about all that they do in secret together. But it is in the nature of crime to betray itself and to show itself by its attendant clamor. Thus these aforesaid Societies or Conventicles have caused in the minds of the faithful the greatest suspicion, and all prudent and upright men have passed the same judgment on them as being depraved and perverted. For if they were not doing evil they would not have so great a hatred of the light. Indeed, this rumor has grown to such proportions that in several countries these societies have been forbidden by the civil authorities as being against the public security, and for some time past have appeared to be prudently eliminated.

Therefore, bearing in mind the great harm which is often caused by such Societies or Conventicles not only to the peace of the temporal state but also to the well-being of souls, and realizing that they do not hold by either civil or canonical sanctions; and since We are taught by the divine word that it is the part of faithful servant and of the master of the Lord's household to watch day and night lest such men as these break into the household like thieves, and like foxes seek to destroy the vineyard; in fact, to prevent the hearts of the simple being perverted, and the innocent secretly wounded by their arrows, and to block that broad road which could be opened to the uncorrected commission of sin and for the other just and reasonable motives known to Us; We therefore, having taken counsel of some of Our Venerable Brothers among the Cardinals of the Holy Roman Church, and also of Our own accord and with certain knowledge and mature deliberations, with the plenitude of the Apostolic power do hereby determine and have decreed that these same Societies, Companies, Assemblies, Meetings, Congregations, or Conventicles of Liberi Muratori or Francs Massons, or whatever other name they may go by, are to be condemned and prohibited, and by Our present Constitution, valid for ever, We do condemn and prohibit them.

Wherefore We command most strictly and in virtue of holy obedience, all the faithful of whatever state, grade, condition, order, dignity or pre-eminence, whether clerical or lay, secular or regular, even those who are entitled to specific and individual mention, that none, under any pretext or for any reason, shall dare or presume to enter, propagate or support these aforesaid societies of Liberi Muratori or Francs Massons, or however else they are called, or to receive them in their houses or dwellings or to hide them, be enrolled among them, joined to them, be present with them, give power or permission for them to meet elsewhere, to help them in any way, to give them in any way advice, encouragement or support either openly or in secret, directly or indirectly, on their own or through others; nor are they to urge others or tell them, incite or persuade them to be enrolled in such societies or to be counted among their number, or to be present or to assist them in any way; but they must stay completely clear of such Societies, Companies, Assemblies, Meetings, Congregations or Conventicles, under pain of excommunication for all the above mentioned people, which is incurred by the very deed without any declaration being required, and from which no one can obtain the benefit of absolution, other than at the hour of death, except through Ourselves or the Roman Pontiff of the time.

Moreover, We desire and command that both Bishops and prelates, and other local ordinaries, as well as inquisitors for heresy, shall investigate and proceed against transgressors of whatever state, grade, condition, order dignity or pre-eminence they may be; and they are to pursue and punish them with condign penalties as being most suspect of heresy. To each and all of these We give and grant the free faculty of calling upon the aid of the secular arm, should the need arise, for investigating and proceeding against those same transgressors and for pursuing and punishing them with condign penalties.

Given at Rome, at Saint Mary Mayor, in the year 1738 of Our Lord.


Link 

[papalencyclicals.net/Clem12/c15inemengl.htm](http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Clem12/c15inemengl.htm)
 
To whom it may concern, I work and lecture at a local historical site and meet people from around the world and who also are in many different types of organizations…one is the Masons…I have found them to be fine folks,Christians,Patriots etc…I have always felt they have suffered and been used by the ruling class to be one of ‘them’…the cause of most of the worlds ills! In fact I have been invited to speak to one of their lodges since they like my stories of faith ,hope and charity…and so an Orthodox Catholic…a retired Catholic high school teacher and a right-winger in politics…geesch…will be the featured speaker…who wudder taugt? Jesus said to go into the market place and preach…once several years back I was invited to speak to a so called 'christian mens luncheon club…some speakers…well the chaplain for the states famours pro hockey team etc…well,anyway I spoke,delivered some half dozen bios…and caught a reflection of hatred on the part of the president…a wall street tycoon…anyway…I asked permission for just one more,I got the OK and gave them the dramatic story of Pvt.Milton Olive,who in Nam gave his life for 5 of his white buddies…thus earning the congressional medal of honor…I ended with.and staring down the phony christian,declared how so many claim.'they’do nothing for this nation,all on welfare or into crime…lets never forget Milton Olive etc…I thought he would have kittens right there…I finished ,applause and packed up to leave…he kept glaring and never did hand me my little gratuity…as I left I am sure he and his friends heard the legendary cry…‘hi ho silver…away’ …good nite boys and girls…next week tune in for the exciting true story about the blind girl I met on a train years ago while in the service and how she helped a frightened GI thru some bad moments…she could 'see’better then most…Nino
 
jimcav said:
Not to get to personal, and feel free not to answer, but, are you Catholic?

And if you are, how do you reconcile what the Church teaches on the matter of masonry, and your membership in it?:confused:
Click to expand...
Jim,

Thank you for the posting.

Yes, I am Roman Catholic. I believe that the Church has made an error with it prohibition against masonry.

Sincerely,
 
DallasTexas said:
Jim,

Thank you for the posting.

Yes, I am Roman Catholic. I believe that the Church has made an error with it prohibition against masonry.

Sincerely,
Click to expand...
I do understand that you’re a rather new Catholic.

Do you understand that we who are Catholics are not free to pick-and-choose regarding Church teachings according to what seems “acceptable” to us? If the Church has repeated a ban on any Catholic’s membership in the masons for nearly 300 years, then why would imagine that you are “free” to reject the teaching as (in your opinion) an error?

I can’t grasp your stance re this.
 
Why is Freemasonry incompatible with Christianity?
Freemasonry is incompatible with Christianity because it promotes indifferentism. Indifferentism is the heretical belief that all religions are equally legitimate attempts to explain the truth about God which, but for the truth of His existence, are unexplainable. Such a view makes all truths relative and holds that God can be equally pleased with truth and error. Because Christians believe that God has definitively revealed Himself in the person of Jesus Christ, and desires that all men come to the knowledge of this truth, indifferentism is incompatible with Christian faith. Jesus said, “I am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me.” (John 14:6).

Freemasonry’s teachings and practices also result in syncretism which is the blending of different religious beliefs into a unified whole. This is evidenced most especially by Masonry’s religious rituals which gather men of all faiths around a common altar, and place all religious writings along side the Bible on the Masonic altar. This is also demonstrated by the Lodge’s prayers and its unique names and symbols for God and heaven. Syncretism is the logical consequence of indifferentism.

The Lodge’s practice of requiring its members to swear immoral oaths is also incompatible with Christianity. These oaths require a Christian to swear on the Holy Bible that he will uphold a code of moral conduct that prefers Masons over non-Masons, and to preserve secret passwords and handshakes. Such oaths are gravely immoral because their subject matter is trivial or does not give rise to the necessity of an oath. These oaths are also sworn under symbolic, blood-curdling penalties of physical torture and death called self-curses (e.g., having my throat cut across, and my tongue torn out by its roots). These penalties show a lack of respect for God and amount to blasphemy which is a serious sin.
 
DallasTexas said:
Jim,

Thank you for the posting.

Yes, I am Roman Catholic. I believe that the Church has made an error with it prohibition against masonry.

Sincerely,
Click to expand...
Many people think that the Church has made errors in its probitions. The gays think that they should be allowed to marry, women think they should be priests, and other think that there is no purgatory and confession to a priest isn’t necessary. And you think that Catholics should be allowed to be masons. The list would be endless should all Catholics ask such questions on doctrine. It’s easier to say that “the Church made an error” than to accept 2000 years of Church doctrine, and thousands of writings that say why it is doctrine.

Let me ask you a another question if I may Dallas.

As a 32nd degree mason, have you been “enlightened”? Have any secrets been handed to you? Why study and achieve these degrees when as Catholics we have all the answers we need?

Do you not feel that Christianity and Catholicism have enlightened you? Do you feel the need to know more than the Church and Jesus Christ teaches about life and death and everything in-between?

I do understand the draw to masonry. Many of our founding fathers were masons, and many of the freedoms we enjoy came out of masonic thinking. It is human nature to want to be in on the “secrets”, but when one looks at the history of European masonry, one can only conclude that it was anti-Catholic in its thinking, its operation, and its foundations.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top