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zz912
Guest
The French have abandoned their Catholic birthright and faith. Fruits of the French Revolution and the Reign of Terror.
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GraceSofia
Guest
This isn’t a matter of apologies and grudges. It’s a matter of protecting our families and countries. Steps can be taken to defend ourselves that have nothing to do with grudges.I found it!
We can either wait until the extremists apologize, which will not likely occur, and hold onto our grudges forever, or we can take the steps to forgive, and regain a holiness that was lost when we clung to anger and resentment.
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St_Francis
Guest
A woman can forgive the man who attacked her, while still doing what she can to ensure he is jailed.Good Morning Darryl,
I found it!
Benedict cited John Paul II’s statement that ‘‘Respect and dialogue require reciprocity in all spheres,’’ particularly religious freedom, a major issue for the Vatican in Saudi Arabia and other countries where non-Muslims cannot worship openly.
therevival.co.uk/forum/general/1827
I agree, Darryl, there is a place for a “negotiated” mutual respect in terms of religious tolerance between and within nations. The fact is, however, that true respect cannot be negotiated. Like forgiveness, it has to come from the heart.
Jesus asks us to forgive our enemies. It is forgiveness that is going to solve these ongoing problems.
Jesus asks us to forgive, Darryl. There were no conditions set, remember?
Actually Jesus said this:
New International Version
If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that?
Matthew 5:46
Forgiveness is a matter between people and between an individual and God. Jesus does not make love or forgiveness a matter involving reciprocity. By our nature, our hearts soften towards those we forgive, and we reap what we sow.
So, the choice is ours. When we have gotten over our anger and have done what we can to control the situation, there is a time to forgive. We can either wait until the extremists apologize, which will not likely occur, and hold onto our grudges forever, or we can take the steps to forgive, and regain a holiness that was lost when we clung to anger and resentment.
Jesus, of course, calls us to the latter.
Why do you and others on this thread think it necessary to reiterate very basic Catholic teaching here?
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zz912
Guest
Shepherds carry weapons to protect their flocks from wolves and other predators…
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OneSheep
Guest
Yes, steps can and should be taken to defend, but we can also make offensive moves.
Forgiveness is an offensive move, it is a decision to love our enemies, and it is the greatest act of mercy. It cannot be forced, though. We have to be ready.
And when we do, we inspire forgiveness.
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Geist
Guest
Its called concealed carry for a reason.
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Seamus_L
Guest
In 1844 Anti-Catholic violence was on the rise in America. I think it may have been Archbishop Kenrick of Philadelphia who took a very pacificistic stance. 2 churches in Philadelphia were burned to the ground and several people were killed. In New York City Archbishop John Hughes promised all out war if Catholic churches were attacked. Needless to say, things went alot more peaceful in NY.
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Geist
Guest
“The object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other bastard die for his.” - George S. Patton
I think we can safely swap a word or two and remind ourselves we shouldn’t be martyrs; we should make them be the martyrs.
I think we can safely swap a word or two and remind ourselves we shouldn’t be martyrs; we should make them be the martyrs.
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Rosebud77
Guest
My “take” on forgiveness, learned in a long hard school and with much agony of prayer when my very life had been compromised deliberately by someone in power, is this.
If I am walking over a high bridge with you and you push me off, while I am recovering in hospital I may well forgive you… as Jesus bids us and through His grace.
But be sure of this; there is no way I will ever, ever cross a bridge with you again. NO WAY.
We forgive for our own peace. If we do not, only we suffer.
If I am walking over a high bridge with you and you push me off, while I am recovering in hospital I may well forgive you… as Jesus bids us and through His grace.
But be sure of this; there is no way I will ever, ever cross a bridge with you again. NO WAY.
We forgive for our own peace. If we do not, only we suffer.
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tbcrawford
Guest
Eternal God , in whom mercy is endless,
and the treasury of compassion inexhastible ,
look kindly upon us and increase Your mercy in us ,
that in difficult moments we might not despair
nor become despondent , but with great confidence ,
submit ourselves to Your Holy Will ,
which is love and mercy itself . Amen
Memorare (Prayer to Our Lady)
Remember, O most gracious Virgin Mary, that never was it known that anyone who fled to your protection, implored your help, or sought your intercession, was left unaided.
Inspired by this confidence, I fly unto you, O Virgin of virgins, my Mother. To you do I come, before you I stand, sinful and sorrowful. O Mother of the Word Incarnate, despise not my petitions, but in your mercy, hear and answer me. Amen
and the treasury of compassion inexhastible ,
look kindly upon us and increase Your mercy in us ,
that in difficult moments we might not despair
nor become despondent , but with great confidence ,
submit ourselves to Your Holy Will ,
which is love and mercy itself . Amen
Memorare (Prayer to Our Lady)
Remember, O most gracious Virgin Mary, that never was it known that anyone who fled to your protection, implored your help, or sought your intercession, was left unaided.
Inspired by this confidence, I fly unto you, O Virgin of virgins, my Mother. To you do I come, before you I stand, sinful and sorrowful. O Mother of the Word Incarnate, despise not my petitions, but in your mercy, hear and answer me. Amen
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GraceSofia
Guest
Interesting. I didn’t know that.
And we should all have learned from WWII that appeasement always makes bullies worse.
And our elitist leaders keep taking us across the same old bridges with the same old results.
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OneSheep
Guest
Hi Rosebud,
I agree, and forgiveness takes time. We can certainly “will” it, but there is a process to go through, including allowing ourselves to be very angry and resentful.
Like you said, forgiveness does not mean that we are to trust someone who cannot be trusted. Trust, also, takes time to recover and may never during a lifetime.
What I am seeing on this thread are* valid* and important questions, such as “how do we protect ourselves?” and “do you share my anger?”. I am thinking that in the Year of Mercy (not that mercy is to be limited to a year!
) it would be good to end this thread by addressing a long-term solution, as demonstrated by Jesus. Forgiveness is a long-term solution, a solution that builds the Kingdom.And building the Kingdom includes prayer for all people involved in the tragedy. Do you agree?
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JimG
Guest
“The Normandy tragedy and the martyrdom of Fr. Hamel is only one of a horrifying string of recent bloodbaths. This attack, though, is somehow more horrifying than the indiscriminate death of 84 people under the wheels of a truck in Nice. It is more horrifying because it is more symbolic. Instead of mass murder, it was murder at Mass. The war against the West is a war of religion. It is a war between Islam and Christianity.”
Priest Martyrdom a Warning to the West
Priest Martyrdom a Warning to the West
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Crusaderbear
Guest
Don’t we have a duty to those yet to be victimized by the brutality of extremism,? These extreme hate groups must be eliminated to save the future!
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OneSheep
Guest
Hi Jim,
Well, I am not at war, and the Church is not at war, right? Does the author intend to instill or flame rage, or is he a voice for mercy and forgiveness?
My guess is that he shares our anger, and that is the context of his words. He is feeling angry and resentful, probably, and that is our normal, natural reaction to atrocities. In time, he too will see that there comes a time to forgive, though this does not preclude the need to protect ourselves.
Let’s continue to pray for all involved.
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qui_est_ce
Guest
This is a great post, and something I have been thinking about for a long time. Europe is very secular, hence my remark about so few people being at mass that day.
I have heard there are many Muslims converting to Christianity in Europe. There are a few theories of why this is happening, one being that they would have been killed in their native countries for apostasy.
I’m wondering if God isn’t using this to bring us back to him. I see people lighting candles and holding prayer vigils at the site of the attacks.
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OneSheep
Guest
Hi Bear,
I share your anger, and I share your desire to punish, but no, we are not called to eliminate people who have hate. We are all capable of hate, and we all hate at times, right?
The “Islamic state” is also rationalizing the elimination of those who hate them, in order to “save the future”. They reap revenge and persecution. They reap murder. Do we go with our automatic response to take revenge, or do we return with mercy? Of course, I am not talking about letting them kill us or refraining from self-protection.
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Padres1969
Guest
Pope Francis disagrees with you.
cruxnow.com/world-youth-day-krakow/2016/07/27/pope-francis-says-world-war-not-war-religions/
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DeusExMachina
Guest
This is horrific. Maybe now the French government will push for reforming the EU’s insane open borders policy
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