Frustrating discussion with a protestant friend of mine

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JillianRose said:
I swear its like a bad rerun…these type of protestants need to get some new material. We can tell them and prove to them that we are not Mary worshiping whores of Babylon, they don’t care. They will keep listening to their hate mongrel preachers.
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No, all I have to do is watch my catholic mother.
 
Robert_in_SD said:
OK. I’ll bite.

Hello Micah. What does your mother do that you feel justifies your anti-Catholic position?

Peace,
Robert
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The whole statue in the yard, flowers/candles around the picture deal, kneeling before it all…the usual.

BTW I’m not anti-catholic, I’m anti-denominational.
 
Robert_in_SD said:
OK. I’ll bite.

Hello Micah. What does your mother do that you feel justifies your anti-Catholic position?

Peace,
Robert
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Thanks Bob!! I was not going to touch that with a ten foot pole. LOL I was upset I already got my first infraction a month ago. Should I frame it? lol
 
Micah11 said:
The whole statue in the yard, flowers/candles around the picture deal, kneeling before it all…the usual.

BTW I’m not anti-catholic, I’m anti-denominational.
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I don’t know your mother. I learned that there are a lot of catholics that do not know what a Catholic believes.

One time I was at my friends farm and her workers were talking about worshiping and praying to Mary. She asked them what church is that? They said “Catholic.”. She told them that Catholics Worship Jesus and Adore his mother. They said “we don’t worship Jesus just Mary?” Ummm

I grew up in Chicago, ONLY IN MY EXPERIENCE it seemed there were a lot of people who where ill informed of their Baptismal covenant.

Have you ever asked your mother why she does this? Is it for adoration? Intercession? If so, she is not doing anything wrong. Sorry you feel that way friend. 😉
 
Wandile said:
Please give me any advice on how to approach any of these issues? One thing I do know is that I need to be patient… Also please say prayers for the both of us and for ,more importantly, the reunification of the Church
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My best suggestion is, ‘why do only all these miracles only happen in this one Church’? Of course that will begin another conversation,……but is someone trying to tell me something?

I have my bible, tradition, magisterium, and my signs that I see ever more clearly now through this internet. 👍
 
Della said:
I agree. People are not always ready to listen, are they? So, as you say patience is key.

Potential converts are like cats. We can’t make them do what they don’t what to do and we can’t turn them into dogs. We have to accept them as they are and where they’re at, while giving them incentives to see things differently.

A lot of people have been brought up thinking and believing a particular way. They’ve built who they are and all they know around it–they have a personal stake in keeping themselves as they are, which is why they can lash out if challenged. It can be very hard to get anyone to see things differently. We have to carefully and prayerfully ween them away from their misconceptions with love, love, and more love.
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Your last paragraph quite succinctly describes my Bro-In-Law an Ex-Catholic. Lashing out is one of his traits, when put in a corner (by yours truly) by careful analysis of context in Scripture 😃 I shall be patient! :cool:

MJ
 
MartinJordan said:
Your last paragraph quite succinctly describes my Bro-In-Law an Ex-Catholic. Lashing out is one of his traits, when put in a corner (by yours truly) by careful analysis of context in Scripture 😃 I shall be patient! :cool:

MJ
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I will pray for you. If you talk to alot of Ex-Catholics, that is why the are ex-catholics. Then they go spreading their misconceptions. I am so glad the Church is really getting the kids to learn more about their faith.

My child goes to mass 3 times a week and they have bible studies and Catechism contest. The priest says, “you ain’t catholic or Devote Catholics, tell me where to send your transfer papers. You will not use my school as a private school. I take you SOULS VERY seriously.”

I think that is something ALL catholics should have.

P.S. I can’t believe my 6 year old can answer basic catechism questions already. Its a real bonding experience for our whole family.
 
JillianRose said:
I will pray for you. If you talk to alot of Ex-Catholics, that is why the are ex-catholics. Then they go spreading their misconceptions. I am so glad the Church is really getting the kids to learn more about their faith.

My child goes to mass 3 times a week and they have bible studies and Catechism contest. The priest says, “you ain’t catholic or Devote Catholics, tell me where to send your transfer papers. You will not use my school as a private school. I take you SOULS VERY seriously.”

I think that is something ALL catholics should have.

P.S. I can’t believe my 6 year old can answer basic catechism questions already. Its a real bonding experience for our whole family.
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That’s really nice of you Jillian! :hug1: So you DO know the difficulties.

The good news is that my sister (who left the Church to follow her husbands faith non-denominational Christian and then after fervent prayers by my family and others; came back!), has successfully had both her kids Baptised and the elder one Confirmed in the Catholic Church. :extrahappy:

The next one we pray is eventually my Bro In Law and we will not give up the prayers. Neither will his kids. 🙂

Congratulations on your 6 year old! Beautiful!

MJ
 
MartinJordan said:
That’s really nice of you Jillian! :hug1: So you DO know the difficulties.

The good news is that my sister (who left the Church to follow her husbands faith non-denominational Christian and then after fervent prayers by my family and others; came back!), has successfully had both her kids Baptised and the elder one Confirmed in the Catholic Church. :extrahappy:

The next one we pray is eventually my Bro In Law and we will not give up the prayers. Neither will his kids. 🙂

Congratulations on your 6 year old! Beautiful!

MJ/QUOTe

I do know. I too myself left the church for 6 years. For the…wait for it…Calvinists Church:eek:

SO I have heard it all. The problem I have found in the non denominational church is they preach too my milk of scripture and no meat. They run John 3:16 into the ground. Also a lot of them don’t have pastors that don’t have a degree in theology. I have noticed also they are kind of all on there own as far as scripture. Which makes me wonder they how is that a defense for sola scriptura.
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JillianRose said:
Have you ever asked your mother why she does this? Is it for adoration? Intercession? If so, she is not doing anything wrong. Sorry you feel that way friend. 😉
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What’s the difference between adoration and worship?
 
Micah11 said:
mmmm, but he left the apocrypha. 😃
And if you want to be perfectly honest about it, each denomination has there own twist on the scriptures.
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What do you mean by twist?

Which denominations?
 
Micah11 said:
What’s the difference between adoration and worship?
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Adoration -could- be construed as worship using modern vernacular. However, Catholics use it in its older sense, which is:
a feeling of profound love and admiration.
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We love and admire Mary for her role in the life of Jesus. Because of this deep respect for her, we honor her… well, that and Jesus told us to:
25 Near the cross of Jesus stood his mother and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary of Magdala.
26 Seeing his mother and the disciple whom he loved standing near her, Jesus said to his mother, ‘Woman, this is your son.’
27 Then to the disciple he said, ‘This is your mother.’ And from that hour the disciple took her into his home.
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Jesus made Mary the mother of all, and as God commands us to honor our mothers and fathers, it is only logical that we honor Mary as well.
 
Wandile said:
May the fruitful discussion continue. I would like to add that I would still like to know how I could have approached the three issues better please? 🙂
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continue to study like you are doing. Someone mentioned Karl Keating’s book which I agree with. Karl Keating’s sequence, The Usual Suspects" is also good and will give you info and ideas when dealing with these types of discussions. Keep praying and studying and standing. While you might not seems successful, at least you will be faithful and planting seeds!
 
Wandile said:
So today I was at school (I’m in first year at University) and I had a discussion which touched on some important issues :

1 - My friend started to allege that although God is Trinity, there was a time pre-genesis that God fused into 1 being as the father alone and that the “separation” of persons happened later… I pointed out to him that God has always been trinity as the scripture says God is the same yesterday, today and forever. He still kept pushing his ideology despite this

2- I touched on the bible and how protestants had vandalised the holy text by removing 7 books from the bible. He acknowledged that, that was wrong but then immediately contradicted this by saying he will only believe in the 66 book bible because he doesn’t know the 7 other books :banghead:

3- He claims he doesn’t trust the Church and believes in the bible alone. I told him that the Church gave him the bible so he should trust the Church that gave him the bible. He refused and started throwing cheap shots and straw man statements like saying the Pope is a child molester, Catholics worship statues etc. :mad:

Please give me any advice on how to approach any of these issues? One thing I do know is that I need to be patient… Also please say prayers for the both of us and for ,more importantly, the reunification of the Church
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Okay. Here is an easy solution for that one. Ask him to explain to you then the scripture BEFORE Abraham I AM!

As far as his horrible statements about the Pope, I would just say that you should not bear false witness against your neighbor, its breaking a commandment of God.

But the best thing that my Father taught me, is never argue over religion. Sometimes we have to take the high road, shake the dust from our sandles (remember that) and just say God Bless and walk away.

Be a great example of your faith, and pray for him. Thats all you can really do.

I was in your place with a cousin of mine, she called the pope the devil, said horrible things about the Blessed Mother. That was the last straw for me, and unfortunately we had to part ways. But sometimes God understands.
 
Thanks to all for the great advice.

I’m just worried that I might have avalanched too much information on him at once and thus it put him in a defensive position. A case in point would be when I pointed out that the Catholic Church is the true and most trustworthy church (by mentioning a lot of historical facts), he replied with an emphatic “NO”…as if he just couldn’t accept that the Church of Rome is the true Church.

Should I have been easier in my approach?
 
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