Fullness of Truth vs. Partial Truth....help!

[CHESTERTONRULES]

A dilemma I assure you. I believe that Jesus’ true followers are being led into all truth. We both know in our heart of hearts that Jesus’ true followers are not exclusive to one denomination.

That’s your best answer?

What if these two true followers disagree?

How do you decide which one is being led into all truth.

You can’t, unless you refer to a higher authority here on earth, a gift from Jesus, a CHURCH!

 

[dzheremi]

That’s the whole point.

That’s a pretty lousy point.

Don’t Baptists believe they have the truth? Don’t Seventh Day Adventists? Mormons? Jews? Does anyone anywhere purposely stay in a religious community that they believe to be false in some way?

Unless you’re a Universalist, I don’t see how you can even think you’re making a point here.

 

[Shana]

Well, there it is. If you’re a true follower, you’ll be led to the truth. Whether you believe or not, there is only one authoritative Church who speaks for Christ. This is how we’ll ever know whether you’re a true follower of Christ… whether you come to realize the pillar and bulwark of truth… the one Church built by Christ, built on the rock who is Kepha. The people in the early Church knew this. Those who are “too smart” for this, deny this truth. One must be humble enough to accept the truth. Otherwise, arrogance will keep one from the truth.

I believe that there are sincere Christians who aren’t formally Catholic, all I’m saying is that I believe the fullness of the faith can only be found in the Catholic Church. I’ve been shown that this is true beyond a reasonable doubt. I know my friend is a sincere Christian.

 

[franklinf]

Presuposition --Catholic Church is the fullness of truth.

Why are you so easily persuaded that it is true?
Why would God not reveal the fullness of truth to Orthodox? To Coptics? To Calvinists?

Because the Catholic Church is the Church founded by God. Orthodox and Protestants all split away from the One True Church and fell into heresy. The Catholic Church has the fullness of truth - it is the only Church that did not separate and follow heresy.

 

[withwind]

I have a Protestant (Baptist) friend and was talking to her about Catholicism and she doesn’t seem to care much about doctrinal differences as long as we are saved. How can I make her understand that it does matter whether one has the fullness of truth as opposed to partial truth? She doesn’t want to get into an argument and neither do I but I don’t understand why she doesn’t care more about the truth…

Why not inviting her to the Catholic mass once in awhile if it doesn’t seem to matter to her about donctirnal diferences? One step at a time.

I have a new friend who is currently a Baptist. He is considering Catholicsm because the unity that draws him. He attends mass and Legion of Mary right now. Please keep him in your prayer. His name is Jerry.

God bless.
PS: this particular non-catholic forum is not a good place for your post as other suggested you to post it on Apologetics.

 

[underdog]

Why not inviting her to the Catholic mass once in awhile if it doesn’t seem to matter to her about donctirnal diferences? One step at a time.

God bless.
PS: this particular non-catholic forum is not a good place for your post as other suggested you to post it on Apologetics.

I suggest that you first tell her that Roman Catholics eat the actual literal flesh and drink the actual literal blood of Jesus Christ at Mass. By honest with her with what you believe as a Catholic Christian. Tell her that the Bible is not the final authorative truth in the Catholic Faith. Now let’s see if doctrine no longer matters to her.

 

[withwind]

I suggest that you first tell her that Roman Catholics eat the actual literal flesh and drink the actual literal blood of Jesus Christ at Mass. By honest with her with what you believe as a Catholic Christian. Tell her that the Bible is not the final authorative truth in the Catholic Faith. Now let’s see if doctrine no longer matters to her.

Well, my friend Jerry is exploring the Catholic church. He is a Baptist. He knows how to pray Hail Mary and along with our Rosary prayer.

Your suggestion can always be a good idea.
On the second thought, being honest and throwing in everythings at once is not smart. Being honest does not mean one has to bring up every single subject at once to discuss. It is too over-zealous – turns people off sometimes.

 

[underdog]

Well, my friend Jerry is exploring the Catholic church. He is a Baptist. He knows how to pray Hail Mary and along with our Rosary prayer.

Your suggestion can always be a good idea.
On the second thought, being honest and throwing in everythings at once is not smart. Being honest does not mean one has to bring up every single subject at once to discuss. It is too over-zealous – turns people off sometimes.

Mormon missionaries have that exact same philosophy. What are you trying to hide from the uninformed Christian?

 

[withwind]

Mormon missionaries have that exact same philosophy. What are you trying to hide from the uninformed Christian?

Did you pray before you posted? otherwise, it sounds a bit silly on your part.

On another note, Jerry wants to think of joining the Catholic church because he likes the idea of unity.

 

[underdog]

Did you pray before you posted? otherwise, it sounds a bit silly.

Christians who don’t understand Christianity beyond 21st century Christianity. You know, contemporary Christians who have no clue in regards to any church history.

 

[withwind]

Christians who don’t understand Christianity beyond 21st century Christianity. You know, contemporary Christians who have no clue in regards to any church history.

Are you ok? Could I offer you a cup of coffee and have a good discussion and more focusing rather throwing things from left to right?

…___/?

If not, I will be only interested in the OP. No offense.

 

[underdog]

Are you ok? Could I offer you a cup of coffee and have a good discussion and more focusing rather throwing things from left to right?

…___/?

If not, I will be only interested in the OP. No offense.

I’m trying get some work out the door in three hours. Therefore, I respond quickly between work breaks. But thanks for the coffee, I think I’ll have a cup.

 

[withwind]

I’m trying get some work out the door in three hours. Therefore, I respond quickly between work breaks. But thanks for the coffee, I think I’ll have a cup.

Why can’t you do that work and at the same time discussing? I hope you get the idea.

 

[underdog]

Why can’t you do that work and at the same time discussing? I hope you get the idea.

I’m trying to. My work requires thinking. So, what are the issues again?

 

[withwind]

I’m trying to. My work requires thinking. So, what are the issues again?

None. You need a break my friend.

 

[underdog]

None. You need a break my friend.

Thanks, let’s continue later.

 

[MDK]

I believe that there are sincere Christians who aren’t formally Catholic, all I’m saying is that I believe the fullness of the faith can only be found in the Catholic Church. I’ve been shown that this is true beyond a reasonable doubt. I know my friend is a sincere Christian.

Thanks. Sincerity is good, but certainly not the only thing of virtue. I believe Martin Luther was sincere in his heresies. As we know, you can’t really know true Christianity without the pillar and bulwark of truth, teaching what is and is not true. Anyone you care about, should be urged to become and be truly Catholic.

 

[SIA]

That’s a pretty lousy point.

Don’t Baptists believe they have the truth? Don’t Seventh Day Adventists? Mormons? Jews? Does anyone anywhere purposely stay in a religious community that they believe to be false in some way?

Unless you’re a Universalist, I don’t see how you can even think you’re making a point here.

Some Protestant denominations do believe that they alone are the only full truth faith. Many others believe that they are part of the one holy catholic and apostolic Church which is contrary to Catholicism and some Protestants.

 

[dzheremi]

Their churches may be small-c “catholic” in the sense of being universal, but this is not the same as being part of the Catholic Church (which is not only Roman, of course).

I may see myself as being orthodox in my orientation to my faith (in the sense that I try to not be a “cafeteria Catholic”), but if I go around calling myself an Orthodox Christian, I know many people who will have very big problems with that.

There is more to our affiliations than simply declaring ourselves to be X, Y, or Z. Part of being a large-C Catholic is recognizing the truth of the Catholic Church that is not wholly present in the Protestant churches. Why this bothers you, I don’t know. Surely if you are honest with yourself you must think that you have some truth in your own denomination that is not present in the Catholic Church, or else you would probably not be whatever type of non-Catholic Christian that you are.

So again, what is the point that you are making? That the Catholic Church is wrong for asserting about itself what you are in effect asserting about your own denomination, albeit in an indirect way?

 

[SIA]

Their churches may be small-c “catholic” in the sense of being universal, but this is not the same as being part of the Catholic Church (which is not only Roman, of course).

I may see myself as being orthodox in my orientation to my faith (in the sense that I try to not be a “cafeteria Catholic”), but if I go around calling myself an Orthodox Christian, I know many people who will have very big problems with that.

There is more to our affiliations than simply declaring ourselves to be X, Y, or Z. Part of being a large-C Catholic is recognizing the truth of the Catholic Church that is not wholly present in the Protestant churches. Why this bothers you, I don’t know. Surely if you are honest with yourself you must think that you have some truth in your own denomination that is not present in the Catholic Church, or else you would probably not be whatever type of non-Catholic Christian that you are.

So again, what is the point that you are making? That the Catholic Church is wrong for asserting about itself what you are in effect asserting about your own denomination, albeit in an indirect way?

I think that you are the one with the superiority complex here. I never said that my denomination was the only one with the fullness of the faith. You are the one ascerting that about the RCC.