Fundamentalism

[mastda]

You know it is sad but almost from the begining of his threads malachi d serva true colours showed. That is why I warned everyone to look at his posts. He came here to confuse and create doubt in our faith. He left furstrated because no one listened so he decided to leave but not before insulting us. This is OK because I left the protestant church in the same way. When my wife and I announced to our protestant friends we were becoming catholic, they were angry, used scripture to condem us, at one point even accused us as being weak. My best friend looked at me and said that within 2 years my wife would leave and my entire family would be destroyed. That was in 2001 and to today not one of these friends speak to us.

In regards to us Catholics watching "Desperate Houswives) and being of the world, let me comment. I really do not want to stoop to his level but when of the 20 or so couples that we met when we first became protestant in 1991, 11 are divorced. These were bible thumpin, praise the lord, halleluiah, spirit slayed evangelical born again christians.

Perhaps malachi_d_serva should read her bible, especially the part where it says to not worry about the speck in your neighbours eye when you have a log in yours.

Anyway he is gone now, and he wont be reading this.

 

[deb1]

mastda:

You know it is sad but almost from the begining of his threads malachi d serva true colours showed. That is why I warned everyone to look at his posts. He came here to confuse and create doubt in our faith. He left furstrated because no one listened so he decided to leave but not before insulting us. This is OK because I left the protestant church in the same way. When my wife and I announced to our protestant friends we were becoming catholic, they were angry, used scripture to condem us, at one point even accused us as being weak. My best friend looked at me and said that within 2 years my wife would leave and my entire family would be destroyed. That was in 2001 and to today not one of these friends speak to us.

In regards to us Catholics watching "Desperate Houswives) and being of the world, let me comment. I really do not want to stoop to his level but when of the 20 or so couples that we met when we first became protestant in 1991, 11 are divorced. These were bible thumpin, praise the lord, halleluiah, spirit slayed evangelical born again christians.

Perhaps malachi_d_serva should read her bible, especially the part where it says to not worry about the speck in your neighbours eye when you have a log in yours.

Anyway he is gone now, and he wont be reading this.

Whenever we post we have to remember that we have a bigger audience then just the people that we are debating. Many lurkers are attracted to this thread because they are undecided. I was like that once and this forum helped me tremendously.

Sometimes the most antiCatholic poster can be more of a help to us then we think. Even though it annoys us to repeat the same thing over and over, to be polite to those who are not, to have all our questions and answers ignored; we have to remember that it isn’t the person debating with us that we will win over. It is the fence sitter who is too uncertain to post who might be influenced by what we say. They will notice which debators ignore questions and answers addressed to them, and are rude.

 

[allischalmers]

Hi All:
When I was going up my father had a job where we had to move a lot so we went to whatever church was available. We went to mostly protestant churches, sometimes Lutherian and yes Catholic churches too. After I got married I bought my father-in-laws farm so after that I did not have much time for church going untill one day there was a terrible accident on the farm. To make a long story short after a series of events I could see the hand of God in what had happened.
About this time we started looking for a church to attend. We thought that a Catholic church would best fit our needs. Giving up two hours a week wouldn’t be bad. We went there a couple of weeks but there was nothing there. People did not even talk to each other. It was like I did my duty and now I’am gone until another week.
Then we went one of those mega churches but there were to many people and all they talked about was their beautiful big church building with the gym and Tim Hortons restaurant.
Well we finally end at wonderful Baptist Church. The people were freindly, the pastor was great , very knowledgeable in the Bible. In fact he could recite whole chapters of the Bible with looking at it.
But the people there, they did not mind coming to church three or four times a week. They were family, children of God coming together in love to encourage and pray for each other. In fact they did not leave as soon as the service was over but they stayed and fellowships with each other for maybe a hour or longer. Just a wonderful place to be!

allischalmers

 

[Thinkin_Leavin]

allischalmers:

Hi All:
When I was going up my father had a job where we had to move a lot so we went to whatever church was available. We went to mostly protestant churches, sometimes Lutherian and yes Catholic churches too. After I got married I bought my father-in-laws farm so after that I did not have much time for church going untill one day there was a terrible accident on the farm. To make a long story short after a series of events I could see the hand of God in what had happened.
About this time we started looking for a church to attend. We thought that a Catholic church would best fit our needs. Giving up two hours a week wouldn’t be bad. We went there a couple of weeks but there was nothing there. People did not even talk to each other. It was like I did my duty and now I’am gone until another week.
Then we went one of those mega churches but there were to many people and all they talked about was their beautiful big church building with the gym and Tim Hortons restaurant.
Well we finally end at wonderful Baptist Church. The people were freindly, the pastor was great , very knowledgeable in the Bible. In fact he could recite whole chapters of the Bible with looking at it.
But the people there, they did not mind coming to church three or four times a week. They were family, children of God coming together in love to encourage and pray for each other. In fact they did not leave as soon as the service was over but they stayed and fellowships with each other for maybe a hour or longer. Just a wonderful place to be!

allischalmers

Yes, this sounds nice. People who don’t vanish after Mass. Perhaps talking about God and Jesus. From what I gather, Fundamentalist want to please God and be obedient. They want to go to church, to learn the Bible, to share the Good News.

I understand they are more “formal” in appearance and I think that shows respect. Put on your “Sunday Best”, that is the way it should be or at least what I am being lead to look for.

I have a good prayer life and have been asking for direction. I have also been strong in not “caving in” to my friend’s peer presure to try this and that and to live like what we see on TV.

My father doesn’t attend mass but my mother does. She is a very loyal Catholic, like myself but yet I want more. She won’t discuss anything about this with me. She just says this is the way it is. This is the way the church is. Your not suppose to enjoy it, just do it. My relatives are Catholic but not like my Mom and I. They go on Christmas and Easter. Don’t want to talk about Jesus. Feel it is a private matter.

Are all Baptists fundamentalists?

 

[mastda]

allischalmers:

Hi All:
When I was going up my father had a job where we had to move a lot so we went to whatever church was available. We went to mostly protestant churches, sometimes Lutherian and yes Catholic churches too. After I got married I bought my father-in-laws farm so after that I did not have much time for church going untill one day there was a terrible accident on the farm. To make a long story short after a series of events I could see the hand of God in what had happened.
About this time we started looking for a church to attend. We thought that a Catholic church would best fit our needs. Giving up two hours a week wouldn’t be bad. We went there a couple of weeks but there was nothing there. People did not even talk to each other. It was like I did my duty and now I’am gone until another week.
Then we went one of those mega churches but there were to many people and all they talked about was their beautiful big church building with the gym and Tim Hortons restaurant.
Well we finally end at wonderful Baptist Church. The people were freindly, the pastor was great , very knowledgeable in the Bible. In fact he could recite whole chapters of the Bible with looking at it.
But the people there, they did not mind coming to church three or four times a week. They were family, children of God coming together in love to encourage and pray for each other. In fact they did not leave as soon as the service was over but they stayed and fellowships with each other for maybe a hour or longer. Just a wonderful place to be!

allischalmers

Hello Allison, this is a nice story and thank you for sharing it. One question though, what point are you trying to make? Please answer as this is very confusing to me.

 

[mastda]

Thinkin' Leavin:

Yes, this sounds nice. People who don’t vanish after Mass. Perhaps talking about God and Jesus. From what I gather, Fundamentalist want to please God and be obedient. They want to go to church, to learn the Bible, to share the Good News.

I understand they are more “formal” in appearance and I think that shows respect. Put on your “Sunday Best”, that is the way it should be or at least what I am being lead to look for.

I have a good prayer life and have been asking for direction. I have also been strong in not “caving in” to my friend’s peer presure to try this and that and to live like what we see on TV.

My father doesn’t attend mass but my mother does. She is a very loyal Catholic, like myself but yet I want more. She won’t discuss anything about this with me. She just says this is the way it is. This is the way the church is. Your not suppose to enjoy it, just do it. My relatives are Catholic but not like my Mom and I. They go on Christmas and Easter. Don’t want to talk about Jesus. Feel it is a private matter.

Are all Baptists fundamentalists?

Thinkin’ Leavin, I think we Catholics can learn from other faith groups. I once posted that I needed to become a fired up evangelical protestant before I became a fired up evangelical catholic. This is sad and I know how exactly you feel right now because I felt the same way a few years ago. I used to watch John Hagee and listen to Chuck Swindoll and other and cried because our parish was full of people who were catholic in culture only.

I have a challenge for you and I hope you will take me up on it. I wish someone made me this challenge. Instead of only going to Church to be fed, start going to church to serve. If your church is lacking in spirit, you bring the spirit. Get on organizing comittees and start planning coffee on Sundays after mass and start talking to people. YOU BE THE FIRE. WHEN YOU SET YOURSELF ON FIRE, PEOPLE WILL COME FOR MILES JUST TO SEE IT!!!

When I became Catholic again, I got involved. People in the Parish know who I am and what I stand for. Guess what, some people dont like me, who cares. I go to RCIA and I dont sit there and just have the instructor teach, if he/she says something wrong, I speak up. What would Jesus do! Stay and fix it or go somewhere he felt nice and cuddly?

I say this lovingly, DON’T BE A WIMP! Jesuse was not a Wimp.

 

[Quatsch]

malachi_a_serva:

Hopfully I have done this correctly. I am responding to the comment, "as Jesus Drank, and was even accused of being a wine biber,…

Here is a document that best explains why alcohol should not be consumed:

THE BIBLE AND WINE

By Bruce Lackey

1. The word wine in the Bible is a generic term; sometimes it means grape juice; sometimes it means alcoholic beverages. The following verses prove that the word “wine” can mean fresh grape juice, the fruit of the vine: De. 11:14; 2 Ch. 31:5; Ne. 13:15; Pr. 3:10; Is. 16:10; 65:8; 1 Ti. 5:23.
2. The context will always show when “wine” refers to alcoholic beverages. In such cases, God discusses the bad effects of it and warns against it. An example would be Ge. 9, Noah’s experience after the Flood. Verse 21, “and he drank of the wine, and was drunken,” clearly refers to alcoholic beverage. Pr. 20:1 speaks of the same thing when it warns us, “Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging; and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.” Alcoholic wine is deceptive; but how? In the very way that people are advocating today, by saying that drinking a little bit will not hurt. Everyone admits that drinking too much is bad; even the liquor companies tell us not to drive and drink, but they insist that a small amount is all right. However, that is the very thing that is deceptive. Who knows how little to drink? Experts tell us that each person is different. It takes an ounce to affect one, while more is necessary for another. The same person will react to alcohol differently, depending on the amount of food he has had, among other things. So, the idea that “a little bit won’t hurt” is deceptive, and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise!

Pr. 23:30-31 refers to alcoholic wine, because it tells us in the previous verse that those who drink it have woe, sorrow, contentions, babbling, wounds without cause, and redness of eyes. What a graphic description of those who “tarry long” at alcoholism. Verses 32-35 continue the same description; context always makes it clear when alcohol is meant.

If “wine” may mean fresh grape juice or alcohol, how can we know which is intended? The context determines the meaning. We can tell when “wine” means fresh grape juice and when it means alcoholic beverage by reading the context, just as we have done in the previous paragraphs…

gotothebible.com/HTML/bibleandwine.html

This response may be a little late, but are you insinuating that Christ was called a “wine biber” because he drank grape juice?

Also, if alcohol was inherently sinful, would Christ have turned water into wine at the wedding at Cana? Or do you think he turned it into grape juice there, too?

Drinking in excess is definitely warned against, I agree with you there, but it is not inherently sinful to consume alcohol. It is a personal decision as allowed by the free will allotted to us by God. Taking away that free will is really what should be in question.

Blessings,

Q

 

[Thinkin_Leavin]

allischalmers:

Hi All:
When I was going up my father had a job where we had to move a lot so we went to whatever church was available. We went to mostly protestant churches, sometimes Lutherian and yes Catholic churches too. After I got married I bought my father-in-laws farm so after that I did not have much time for church going untill one day there was a terrible accident on the farm. To make a long story short after a series of events I could see the hand of God in what had happened.
About this time we started looking for a church to attend. We thought that a Catholic church would best fit our needs. Giving up two hours a week wouldn’t be bad. We went there a couple of weeks but there was nothing there. People did not even talk to each other. It was like I did my duty and now I’am gone until another week.
Then we went one of those mega churches but there were to many people and all they talked about was their beautiful big church building with the gym and Tim Hortons restaurant.
Well we finally end at wonderful Baptist Church. The people were freindly, the pastor was great , very knowledgeable in the Bible. In fact he could recite whole chapters of the Bible with looking at it.
But the people there, they did not mind coming to church three or four times a week. They were family, children of God coming together in love to encourage and pray for each other. In fact they did not leave as soon as the service was over but they stayed and fellowships with each other for maybe a hour or longer. Just a wonderful place to be!

allischalmers

Yes, this sounds nice. People who don’t vanish after Mass. Perhaps talking about God and Jesus. From what I gather, Fundamentalist want to please God and be obedient. They want to go to church, to learn the Bible, to share the Good News.

I understand they are more “formal” in appearance and I think that shows respect. Put on your “Sunday Best”, that is the way it should be.

 

[deb1]

Thinkin' Leavin:

Are all Baptists fundamentalists?

No, they are not.

 

[deb1]

Thinkin' Leavin:

Yes, this sounds nice. People who don’t vanish after Mass. Perhaps talking about God and Jesus. From what I gather, Fundamentalist want to please God and be obedient. They want to go to church, to learn the Bible, to share the Good News.

I understand they are more “formal” in appearance and I think that shows respect. Put on your “Sunday Best”, that is the way it should be.

Fundamentalists are a minority of Protestants. More then likely you have attended a evangilcal church. Occasionally, I enjoy fellowship with such evangelicals, they are good, earnest Christians.

Fundamentalists don’t simply follow the bible, although they will claim to. They invent rules that aren’t in th bible and are very strict on following them. In some churches there is an almost cultlike atmosphere. As long as you agree with their viewpoint, everything is fine. Try to leave though and these people will hound you or turn their back on your friendship.

 

[deb1]

deb1:

Fundamentalists are a minority of Protestants. More then likely you have attended a evangilcal church. Occasionally, I enjoy fellowship with such evangelicals, they are good, earnest Christians.

Fundamentalists don’t simply follow the bible, although they will claim to. They invent rules that aren’t in the bible and are very strict on following them. In some churches there is an almost cultlike atmosphere. As long as you agree with their viewpoint, everything is fine. Try to leave though and these people will hound you or turn their back on your friendship.

 

[St.Eric]

Thinkin' Leavin:

Yes, this sounds nice. People who don’t vanish after Mass. Perhaps talking about God and Jesus. From what I gather, Fundamentalist want to please God and be obedient. They want to go to church, to learn the Bible, to share the Good News.

I understand they are more “formal” in appearance and I think that shows respect. Put on your “Sunday Best”, that is the way it should be or at least what I am being lead to look for.

I have a good prayer life and have been asking for direction. I have also been strong in not “caving in” to my friend’s peer presure to try this and that and to live like what we see on TV.

My father doesn’t attend mass but my mother does. She is a very loyal Catholic, like myself but yet I want more. She won’t discuss anything about this with me. She just says this is the way it is. This is the way the church is. Your not suppose to enjoy it, just do it. My relatives are Catholic but not like my Mom and I. They go on Christmas and Easter. Don’t want to talk about Jesus. Feel it is a private matter.

Are all Baptists fundamentalists?

The Catholic Church HAS SO MUCH more than just goinmg to Mass and doing your duty to worship God. As another post suggessted, get involved in your local parish. Aslo, start consuming books related to the faith and the early fathers! If you are not much of a reader, there are tons of audio cds and cassettes and video and DVD to learn from and help your knowledge and faith expand. So folks who are worth listening to and learing from include: Scott Hahn, Marcus Grodi, Father John Corapi, Father Phillip Scott, Bishop Fulton Sheen, John Henry Newman, G.K. Chesterton, All of the Church doctors and early Fathers, Tim Staples, Etc. Etc,. These people will light your faith on FIRE. The thing of it is, you have to do the work (and it is well worth it) for the most part. In my experience to be a Catholic deep in the faith, it takes a scholarly approach. You can’t get it all by going to a Sunday and Wednesday “service” and listening to a preacher “light it up” for an hour or two. There is sooo much in this faith that an hour at Mass each week will only scratch the very surface. Remember, scripture tells us that only by “seeking out” the father will we come to him. You gotta be pro-active.

 

[Robin]

You Wrote:
I guess the reason my mom never knew much of the bible is because all of her formative years and then adult years the mass was said in Latin.

This doesn’t equate to people being able to understand the bible, except if you understood Latin. Another proof that the church wanted it’s parishiners to only believe what they were told.

Everyone had a missal that had the latin and the direct translation
in the column next to it in English, French, Spanish, Etc. up until the recent change into the English mass- or depending on your native language. Most people actually learned the latin and Knew what it said without referring to the English translation . In fact, they Preferred it in many cases.

Up until about l930, every Public High School and University of any worth, tought Latin as a second language. Why, Because it was still the "Universal Language of the World. It Still is in the Sciences and Medicine.

Anyone who was “educated” in the Old World and The New since about 300AD could read Latin. English was not even a true spoken langauage until around the 12 century. English and German in both Speaking and Writing and also script - were nearly identical languages. MOSTLY derived from Latin.

Thats Why in the Passion Movie " Idiot" by the Roman Soldier at the scourging of Christ - is Correct Language for the time!!
The Volgate Catholic Bible - The Latin Bible you derived Your Bible from Was the Common Language Bible for nearly 1200 Years.

Please folks…T-h-i-n-k. Catholics are steeped in the Bible. Its their book. They sorted through 50 Gospels to come up with the 4 you have in your bible. No more -No Less. And Jerome 390 AD translated every one of them from the Greek - which was becoming a Dead Language in the Western World. Augustine and Jerome were contemporarys. Without the Catholic Church, there would be no Bible at all. In fact, Augustine ( who has become the patron saint of most fundamentalist churches ) said " If it wasnt for the Catholic Church, I wouldn’t believe the Gospels. Everytime you open the Bible - Thank the Lord for the Catholic Church that gave it to you. Christianity was preserved by the Catholic Church (Named so by Ignatious of Antioch in 110 AD shortly before becoming food for the Roman Circus Lions ) - nearly 400 years without any Bible at all. Praise the Lord!

Just a few scriptures. Maybe John in one church, Matthew in another, Some of Pauls Epistles in another. But the Church - holding itself together by Holy Tradition. Doing what Catholics always did since Christ started His Church. Preserved Christianity - and continues to do so today. Withness the 30,000 scattered
christian sects of today other than the Catholic Church.

“To be deep in History - is to cease to be Protestant” John Henry Newman." :yup:

 

[SolaChristo]

Robin:

You Wrote:
I guess the reason my mom never knew much of the bible is because all of her formative years and then adult years the mass was said in Latin.

This doesn’t equate to people being able to understand the bible, except if you understood Latin. Another proof that the church wanted it’s parishiners to only believe what they were told.

Everyone had a missal that had the latin and the direct translation
in the column next to it in English, French, Spanish, Etc. up until the recent change into the English mass- or depending on your native language. Most people actually learned the latin and Knew what it said without referring to the English translation . In fact, they Preferred it in many cases.

Up until about l930, every Public High School and University of any worth, tought Latin as a second language. Why, Because it was still the "Universal Language of the World. It Still is in the Sciences and Medicine.

Anyone who was “educated” in the Old World and The New since about 300AD could read Latin. English was not even a true spoken langauage until around the 12 century. English and German in both Speaking and Writing and also script - were nearly identical languages. MOSTLY derived from Latin.

Thats Why in the Passion Movie " Idiot" by the Roman Soldier at the scourging of Christ - is Correct Language for the time!!
The Volgate Catholic Bible - The Latin Bible you derived Your Bible from Was the Common Language Bible for nearly 1200 Years.

Please folks…T-h-i-n-k. Catholics are steeped in the Bible. Its their book. They sorted through 50 Gospels to come up with the 4 you have in your bible. No more -No Less. And Jerome 390 AD translated every one of them from the Greek - which was becoming a Dead Language in the Western World. Augustine and Jerome were contemporarys. Without the Catholic Church, there would be no Bible at all. In fact, Augustine ( who has become the patron saint of most fundamentalist churches ) said " If it wasnt for the Catholic Church, I wouldn’t believe the Gospels. Everytime you open the Bible - Thank the Lord for the Catholic Church that gave it to you. Christianity was preserved by the Catholic Church (Named so by Ignatious of Antioch in 110 AD shortly before becoming food for the Roman Circus Lions ) - nearly 400 years without any Bible at all. Praise the Lord!

Just a few scriptures. Maybe John in one church, Matthew in another, Some of Pauls Epistles in another. But the Church - holding itself together by Holy Tradition. Doing what Catholics always did since Christ started His Church. Preserved Christianity - and continues to do so today. Withness the 30,000 scattered
christian sects of today other than the Catholic Church.

“To be deep in History - is to cease to be Protestant” John Henry Newman." :yup:

Have you ever read the bible cover to cover?

 

[St.Eric]

Amen Robin! Nice response! SolaChristo, I for one hae read the New Testament 3 times and a few books out of the Old. I do need to finish the Old Testament. I really don’t know what your point would be though. Maybe something like “you are not really a complete Christian unless you have read the bible from cover to cover?” Maybe that’s not your point, just a guess. Reading the bible is good, I am all for it and would encourage others to do so as well. But as far as the protestant notion of private interpretation goes- no way. That is unbiblical (show me where the bible compells us to use private interpretation, show me where the bible says it is the sole rule of faith, and finally, show me where the bible says that being born again means all one has to do is accept Jesus as a “Personal Lord and Savior”.). In fact, the bible itself warns us against doing that. A person can easily be led astray through private interpretation.

 

[Cath.orProtes]

“To be deep in history is to cease to be a Protestant”
John Henry Newman

I guess one could say, “To be deep in The Lord Jesus Christ is to become a Protestant”.

Are any of you familiar with John Schroeder? I would be interested in hearing if what he says is correct.

Here is a snippet of an email he wrote:
*
One of the marks of a cult is a supreme leader who claims - but does not have - special powers and favor from God. A second mark is this leader’s absolute control over the teachings and doctrines followers must believe, even if the Bible says otherwise. At the AD 1870 First Vatican Council, Bishop Josip Strossmayer, in a speech acknowledged by the Catholic Encyclopedia as having taken place, exposed the papacy as an office created by men, not Jesus. Following is a quote from the conclusion that speech:

“I conclude victoriously, with history, with reason, with logic, with good sense, and with a Christian conscience, that Jesus Christ did not confer any supremacy on St. Petrer and that the bishops of Rome did not become sovereigns of the Church, but only by confiscating one by one all the rights of the episcopate.”

History shows that bishop Strossmayer was correct in all of his research and conclusions. Catholic popes are imposters. They demand that Catholics believe many doctrines contradictory to the Holy Bible. For instance, you are forced under pain of sin to believe that Mary the mother of Jesus was a virgin before, during, and after the birth of Christ. But the Word of God says Jesus was her “firstborn,” and she had four other sons and at least two daughters, all siblings of our Lord. Historians Josephus and Eusebius confirm what the Bible teaches. You are **forced **to believe there is a Purgatory, but the Word of God says there is heaven and there is hell. By faith in the finished work of Jesus one goes directly to heaven at the time of death, having received His righteousness. By faith in a religion one goes directly to hell.

“I am the way, the truth, and the life; no man cometh to the Father but by me.” (Mary can’t help.)

“I am the resurrection and the life; he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live. And whosover liveth and believeth in me shall never die.” (Whosoever means anyone of faith, not religionists alone.)

“For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that whoseoever believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” (Belief must be in Christ, not Catholic doctrines.)

“For by grace are you saved through** faith**; and that **not **of yourselves; it is the **gift **of God, not of works, lest any man should boast.” (Sacramental works don’t count. It’s a totally free gift.)

“Not by works of righteousness that we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us through the washing of regeneration, and the renewing of the Holy Spirit.” (He did the dying, all we do is the believing & trusting.)

What appears to you to be Catholic “bashing” is, in reality, aggressive “witnessing” in the hope of shaking Roman Catholics out of the complacency that prevents them from comparing Catholic doctrines with the infallible and unchanging Scriptures. Once a Catholic can be motivated to do what the Bereans did under Paul’s preaching, that is, “search the Scriptures,” it is not long until they come to realize that the Catholic Jesus is not the Jesus of Scripture, and salvation is not to be found in any of the various religions."…Jesus said He is the door (gate), not the pope or Catholicism. *

 

[Cath.orProtes]

“To be deep in history is to cease to be a Protestant”
John Henry Newman

I guess one could say, “To be deep in The Lord Jesus Christ is to become a Protestant”.

Are any of you familiar with Johnm Schroeder? I would be interested in hearing if what he says is correct.

Here is a snippet of an email he wrote:
*
One of the marks of a cult is a supreme leader who claims - but does not have - special powers and favor from God. A second mark is this leader’s absolute control over the teachings and doctrines followers must believe, even if the Bible says otherwise. At the AD 1870 First Vatican Council, Bishop Josip Strossmayer, in a speech acknowledged by the Catholic Encyclopedia as having taken place, exposed the papacy as an office created by men, not Jesus. Following is a quote from the conclusion that speech:

“I conclude victoriously, with history, with reason, with logic, with good sense, and with a Christian conscience, that Jesus Christ did not confer any supremacy on St. Petrer and that the bishops of Rome did not become sovereigns of the Church, but only by confiscating one by one all the rights of the episcopate.”

History shows that bishop Strossmayer was correct in all of his research and conclusions. Catholic popes are imposters. They demand that Catholics believe many doctrines contradictory to the Holy Bible. For instance, you are forced under pain of sin to believe that Mary the mother of Jesus was a virgin before, during, and after the birth of Christ. But the Word of God says Jesus was her “firstborn,” and she had four other sons and at least two daughters, all siblings of our Lord. Historians Josephus and Eusebius confirm what the Bible teaches. You are forced to believe there is a Purgatory, but the Word of God says there is heaven and there is hell. By faith in the finished work of Jesus one goes directly to heaven at the time of death, having received His righteousness. By faith in a religion one goes directly to hell.

“I am the way, the truth, and the life; no man cometh to the Father but by me.” (Mary can’t help.)

“I am the resurrection and the life; he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live. And whosover liveth and believeth in me shall never die.” (Whosoever means anyone of faith, not religionists alone.)

“For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that whoseoever believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.” (Belief must be in Christ, not Catholic doctrines.)

“For by grace are you saved through faith; and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast.” (Sacramental works don’t count. It’s a totally free gift.)

“Not by works of righteousness that we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us through the washing of regeneration, and the renewing of the Holy Spirit.” (He did the dying, all we do is the believing & trusting.)

What appears to you to be Catholic “bashing” is, in reality, aggressive “witnessing” in the hope of shaking Roman Catholics out of the complacency that prevents them from comparing Catholic doctrines with the infallible and unchanging Scriptures. Once a Catholic can be motivated to do what the Bereans did under Paul’s preaching, that is, “search the Scriptures,” it is not long until they come to realize that the Catholic Jesus is not the Jesus of Scripture, and salvation is not to be found in any of the various religions."*

 

[CheesusPowerKid]

Cath.orProtes.?:

I guess one could say, “To be deep in The Lord Jesus Christ is to become a Protestant”.

Are any of you familiar with John Schroeder? I would be interested in hearing if what he says is correct.

Here is a snippet of an email he wrote:

One of the marks of a cult is a supreme leader who claims - but does not have - special powers and favor from God. A second mark is this leader’s absolute control over the teachings and doctrines followers must believe, even if the Bible says otherwise. At the AD 1870 First Vatican Council, Bishop Josip Strossmayer, in a speech acknowledged by the Catholic Encyclopedia as having taken place, exposed the papacy as an office created by men, not Jesus. Following is a quote from the conclusion that speech:

"I conclude victoriously, with history, with reason, with logic, with good sense, and with a Christian conscience, that Jesus Christ did not confer any supremacy on St. Petrer and that the bishops of Rome did not become sovereigns of the Church, but only by confiscating one by one all the rights of the episcopate."

History shows that bishop Strossmayer was correct in all of his research and conclusions. Catholic popes are imposters. They demand that Catholics believe many doctrines contradictory to the Holy Bible. For instance, you are forced under pain of sin to believe that Mary the mother of Jesus was a virgin before, during, and after the birth of Christ. But the Word of God says Jesus was her “firstborn,” and she had four other sons and at least two daughters, all siblings of our Lord. Historians Josephus and Eusebius confirm what the Bible teaches. You are **forced **to believe there is a Purgatory, but the Word of God says there is heaven and there is hell. By faith in the finished work of Jesus one goes directly to heaven at the time of death, having received His righteousness. By faith in a religion one goes directly to hell.

"I am the way, the truth, and the life; no man cometh to the Father but by me." (Mary can’t help.)

"I am the resurrection and the life; he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live. And whosover liveth and believeth in me shall never die." (Whosoever means anyone of faith, not religionists alone.)

"For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son, that whoseoever believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life." (Belief must be in Christ, not Catholic doctrines.)

"For by grace are you saved through** faith**; and that **not **of yourselves; it is the **gift **of God, not of works, lest any man should boast." (Sacramental works don’t count. It’s a totally free gift.)

"Not by works of righteousness that we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us through the washing of regeneration, and the renewing of the Holy Spirit." (He did the dying, all we do is the believing & trusting.)

*What appears to you to be Catholic “bashing” is, in reality, aggressive “witnessing” in the hope of shaking Roman Catholics out of the complacency that prevents them from comparing Catholic doctrines with the infallible and unchanging Scriptures. Once a Catholic can be motivated to do what the Bereans did under Paul’s preaching, that is, “search the Scriptures,” it is not long until they come to realize that the Catholic Jesus is not the Jesus of Scripture, and salvation is not to be found in any of the various religions."…Jesus said He is the door (gate), not the pope or Catholicism. *

Welcome to the forums,

I appreciate your insight, but I must say I was a little bit offended.
sir, I am not forced to believe anything…I CHOOSE to believe, because I HAVE read scripture and I DO believe that Christ gave authority to HIS church, the Catholic church, and I DO believe in everything it teaches, not because I have to but because I have personally and spiritually witnessed that it IS TRUTH and it IS Christ…I am a Catholic because it is in my heart, my mind, and my mouth, and I chose to believe everything full-heartedly and completely knowledgably, as I am sure others on this board will attest to as well…please don’t ever accuse us of otherwise. Your points are well presented, but I would suggest that you start individual threads for each of them or better yet do a search in the forums for other threads that cover them exactly as I can assure you that we have argued them over and over again dozens of times before. God bless,
In Him,
Britty

 

[Cath.orProtes]

St.Eric:

Reading the bible is good, I am all for it and would encourage others to do so as well. But as far as the protestant notion of private interpretation goes- no way. That is unbiblical (show me where the bible compells us to use private interpretation,

Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. - JOHN 5:39

These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so. Therefore many of them believed; also of honourable women which were Greeks, and of men, not a few. - ACTS 17:11-12

But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works. - 2 TIMOTHY 3:14-17

For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope. - ROMANS 15:4

But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. - 1 CORINTHIANS 2:9-16

 

[Alfie]

deb1:

Try to leave though and these people will hound you .

I thought this was a rather funny remark. In Protestantism the Holy Spirit is some times refered to as “The Hound of Heaven”.