J
jastor
Guest
I would think things get lost in translation.
Bible and quran.
Bible and quran.
- Status
I
Irish_Polock
Guest
I always found this to be a kind of funny part of our Scripture…
Deuteronomy 25
11 "When men fight with one another, and the wife of the one draws near to rescue her husband from the hand of him who is beating him, and puts out her hand and seizes him by the private parts, 12 then you shall cut off her hand; your eye shall have no pity
(RSV STD ED)
I mean who would think? …
Deuteronomy 25
11 "When men fight with one another, and the wife of the one draws near to rescue her husband from the hand of him who is beating him, and puts out her hand and seizes him by the private parts, 12 then you shall cut off her hand; your eye shall have no pity
(RSV STD ED)
I mean who would think? …
D
Dirk_Skene
Guest
I don’t see anything wrong in mocking a false holy book. This koran thing also says that Jesus is only a prophet. Christians know better.
T
tomarin
Guest
So that whole “do unto others as you would have them do unto you” business doesn’t apply here? How would you feel if someone mocked the Bible? Angry and hostile, right?
F
french
Guest
Wow… The OP doesn’t even know what a “Surah” is… They mistake it for a verse!
Doesn’t this simple mistake already make you question the credibility of the OP? I mean, after all, if they don’t even know something so basic about this religion, I have my doubts they know anything about it.
Do they know what a Madhab is? Do they know what Tafsir is? Do they know what Aqeedah is? Do they know Arabic?
Without using Google, I bet they couldn’t answer at least 2 of the first 3 questions. This is sad, because you should know madhabs and their usool, you should know tafsir, as it is very important to understanding what the Qur’an means. You should know aqeedah to help with understanding of the attributes of Allah subhana wa t’ala.
Enough of my complaining though, as it doesn’t actually address the questions. However, the answers to the questions have all been answered by famdigy.
If… men… are fighting together: they will eventually come to blows, as it is said:“[to rescue her husband] from his assailant.” [The moral here is:] Peace cannot result from strife. — [Sifrei 25:160]
You shall cut off her hand: [This verse is not to be understood literally, but rather, it means:] She must pay monetary damages to recompense the victim for the embarrassment he suffered [through her action. The amount she must pay is calculated by the court,] all according to the [social status] of the culprit and the victim (see B.K. 83b). But perhaps [it means that we must actually cut off] her very hand? [The answer is born out from a transmission handed down to our Rabbis, as follows:] Here, it says לֹא תָחוֹס,“do not have pity,” and later, in the case of conspiring witnesses (Deut. 19:21), the same expression, לֹא תָחוֹס, is used. [And our Rabbis taught that these verses have a contextual connection:] Just as there, in the case of the conspiring witnesses, [the literal expressions in the verse refer to] monetary compensation (see Rashi on that verse), so too, here, **[the expression “You must cut off her hand” refers to] monetary compensation. **— [Sifrei 25:161]
Still, funny that someone could be punished, even by monetary compensation! Or it is at least funny that the Torah even mentions this issue!
Doesn’t this simple mistake already make you question the credibility of the OP? I mean, after all, if they don’t even know something so basic about this religion, I have my doubts they know anything about it.
Do they know what a Madhab is? Do they know what Tafsir is? Do they know what Aqeedah is? Do they know Arabic?
Without using Google, I bet they couldn’t answer at least 2 of the first 3 questions. This is sad, because you should know madhabs and their usool, you should know tafsir, as it is very important to understanding what the Qur’an means. You should know aqeedah to help with understanding of the attributes of Allah subhana wa t’ala.
Enough of my complaining though, as it doesn’t actually address the questions. However, the answers to the questions have all been answered by famdigy.
Yeah, certainly weird, especially if taken literally. Rashi however, interprets at least the punishment to not be literal.
If… men… are fighting together: they will eventually come to blows, as it is said:“[to rescue her husband] from his assailant.” [The moral here is:] Peace cannot result from strife. — [Sifrei 25:160]
You shall cut off her hand: [This verse is not to be understood literally, but rather, it means:] She must pay monetary damages to recompense the victim for the embarrassment he suffered [through her action. The amount she must pay is calculated by the court,] all according to the [social status] of the culprit and the victim (see B.K. 83b). But perhaps [it means that we must actually cut off] her very hand? [The answer is born out from a transmission handed down to our Rabbis, as follows:] Here, it says לֹא תָחוֹס,“do not have pity,” and later, in the case of conspiring witnesses (Deut. 19:21), the same expression, לֹא תָחוֹס, is used. [And our Rabbis taught that these verses have a contextual connection:] Just as there, in the case of the conspiring witnesses, [the literal expressions in the verse refer to] monetary compensation (see Rashi on that verse), so too, here, **[the expression “You must cut off her hand” refers to] monetary compensation. **— [Sifrei 25:161]
Still, funny that someone could be punished, even by monetary compensation! Or it is at least funny that the Torah even mentions this issue!
D
Dirk_Skene
Guest
No, actually not. The muslams mock it all the time with their false teachings. I know Christianity is right. I know the Bible it the True word of the Real God. I am secure in that & don’t need to defend anything when folks tell lies.
F
famdigy
Guest
The Qur’an advises us not to mock other people’s faith even if we believe it to be wrong
T
tomarin
Guest
Disagreeing and mocking are not the same thing. You can disagree respectfully with someone, which is how I feel about muslims’ beliefs (and Jews and protestants as well). I don’t feel any need to say hurtful things to them about it. I think it’s wrong frankly and I’m pretty sure it’s against the forum rules.
D
Dirk_Skene
Guest
But I do not respect the koran, or muhammad. The koran is a “holy” book that disagrees with the Bible. Therefore it is false. Muhammed was a “prophet” that contredicted the teaching that Jesus was God. What is to respect?
D
deb1
Guest
I find that sort of funny also. I remember reading it and thinking, “My goodness, did the ancient Jews have some strange habits or what?”
This must have been a problem or else why would God have included a warning against it.
T
tomarin
Guest
I would say their monotheism, and the fact that they hold Jesus and Mary in high regard. I think they even believe in the virgin birth. That’s more than one can say for Judaism. (But then following your logic Jews are also fit to be mocked, since their beliefs disagree with the Christian Bible.)
Muslims are wrong about a lot of things, but not everything.
T
tomarin
Guest
By the way, I think it’s a question of respecting the person you are talking to, not the beliefs that he or she subscribes to.
D
Dirk_Skene
Guest
If someone is critisizing my befiefs, on a forum that says “Catholic” and promoting theirs, then I do not respect the person nor the beliefs. If I want their opinion I’ll look them up.
T
tomarin
Guest
Sounds reasonable, except I don’t see anyone criticizing Catholic beliefs here. You on the other hand, are defending the right of someone to engage in uncharitable behavior toward members of other faiths. So you are the one with the aggressive stance, not the other way 'round.
The forum rules state quite clearly that non-catholics are welcome to participate here provided they respect the faith of the catholic posters. So if you think someone did that, you should report them to the moderators. (And if you think non-catholics should not be allowed to be here at all, you should take that up with the moderators too.)
T
thedavidwilson
Guest
I love how the muslims immediately change the subject rather than address the OP that demonstrates the lack of logic of the quran.Maybe.
A surah is a chapter in the Qur’an, that’s what I was getting at. You quoted a verse here, a verse there, the correct word for which is ayah.
Saying “Funny surahs” is like “funny chapters,” so you’d need to point out whole chapters you found amusing.
Didn’t you used to be a Muslim?
D
Dirk_Skene
Guest
It’s never done any good in the past. Why should I bother now? That is the primary reason I have never sent any funds in.
D
Dirk_Skene
Guest
That brings up a question: It has been a few years since Iast read the koran. Dosen’t it have stories of Moses doing things that Abrahan actually did & vis-versa? I think I remember that.… that demonstrates the lack of logic of the quran.
T
tomarin
Guest
Just so I understand your point of view better, let me ask: are you saying that non-catholics just saying what they believe and why constitutes an attack on catholicism? Because I would say the vast majority of posts I have seen here are in that category.
D
Dirk_Skene
Guest
No, not exactly, but you are kinda close. They are correct as so far as they believe the same way we do. They cease being correct when they disagree. From that point there are 3 things they can do. 1) Accept the fact that they are wrong & learn from us. 2) get mad & go away or 3) stoutly state that they are right. It is the latter I have no patience for. That’s why my “ignore” list takes up about 2 pages.
Kinda funny … over the course of a week I visit about 10 web forums. Some more often than others. Some only once for about 3 minuets. This is the ONLY one where I feel impelled to use the ignore feature.
T
tomarin
Guest
What you say is admirably straightforward. Carry on, sir.
I guess I enjoy the give and take of argumentation. Which is why I’m a frequent visitor to CAF.
- Status