Gay marriage a threat to humanity's future: Pope

[Catherine_S]

Thanks, that was interesting.

Women do not seem to realize what abortion can and does do to them physically, mentally, psychologically, and spiritually. *
…
Obama Orders Catholics to Act Against Their Faith; Bishops Call it 'Unconscionable’
.“To force American citizens to** choose** between violating their consciences and forgoing their healthcare is literally unconscionable,” said Dolan. “It is as much an attack on access to health care as on religious freedom. Historically, this represents a** challenge** and a** compromise** of our religious liberty."*
"Indeed, such* nationwide government coercion*** of religious people and groups to sell, broker, or purchase ‘services’ to which they have a moral or religious objection represents an unprecedented attack on religious liberty," the bishops told HHS.
.
In announcing the final version of the regulation on Friday, Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said the administration would allow* some non-profit groups, which object to the rule** on religious grounds,** an** extra year to comply as long as these groups file a certification document with the administration** and** inform** their employees about where they can find contraceptives.*
.
“Women’s rights and** pro-choice** groups, including the** Feminist Majority Foundation**, Planned Parenthood Action Fund, the** National Women’s Law Center**, the National Council of Jewish Women, the** National Organization** for Women (NOW), and** NARAL** Pro-Choice America, urged the Obama Administration** not to consider the broader religious exemption,”** said Smeal.
.
House Minority Leader* Nancy Pelosi***, a Catholic, defended Obama’s move.
“I strongly support this action by the** Obama Administration** to** expand access to fundamental**,** basic health care** and will continue to fight to** protect** the** benefits** of health care reform for the American people,” said Pelosi.
http://cnsnews.com/news/article/obama-orders-catholics-act-against-their-faith-bishops-call-it-unconscionable.

 

[Teelynn]

Women do not seem to realize what abortion can and does do to them physically, mentally, psychologically, and spiritually. *
..
Obama Orders Catholics to Act Against Their Faith; Bishops Call it 'Unconscionable’
.“To force American citizens to** choose*** between violating their consciences and forgoing their healthcare is literally unconscionable,” said Dolan. “It is as much an attack on access to health care as on religious freedom. Historically, this represents a** challenge** and a** compromise** of our religious liberty."
"Indeed, such* nationwide government coercion*** of religious people and groups to sell, broker, or purchase ‘services’ to which they have a moral or religious objection represents an unprecedented attack on religious liberty," the bishops told HHS.
.
In announcing the final version of the regulation on Friday, Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said the administration would allow some non-profit groups, which object to the rule** on religious grounds,** an** extra year to comply as long as these groups file a certification document with the administration** and** inform** their employees about where they can find contraceptives.
.
“Women’s rights and** pro-choice** groups, including the** Feminist Majority Foundation**, Planned Parenthood Action Fund, the** National Women’s Law Center**, the National Council of Jewish Women, the** National Organization** for Women (NOW), and** NARAL** Pro-Choice America, urged the Obama Administration** not to consider the broader religious exemption,”** said Smeal.
.
House Minority Leader* Nancy Pelosi***, a Catholic, defended Obama’s move.
“I strongly support this action by the** Obama Administration** to** expand access to fundamental**,** basic health care** and will continue to fight to** protect** the** benefits** of health care reform for the American people,” said Pelosi.
[cnsnews.com/news/article/obama-orders-catholics-act-against-their-faith-bishops-call-it-unconscionable](http://cnsnews.com/news/article/oba...st-their-faith-bishops-call-it-unconscionable).

I believe this is all a maneuver to bolster Planned Parenthood. The administration needs them and vice versa. They contribute heavily to the liberal wing, and they have taken a beating this year. There is still a push to defund them in Congress, didn’t pass the first time, but if we keep pushing…

And yes, sadly, women do not realize what a terrible effect an abortion has on them in all respects, until they experience it. Physical complications, mental, emotional and spiritual annihilation. And sadly, some of them are sooooo ashamed of this they won’t talk about it sometimes for a lifetime. Meanwhile it is destroying them on the inside. Some even commit suicide. And now we are finding out what it does to the fathers of these children. It is an ugly diabolical thing.

 

[Catherine_S]

I believe this is all a maneuver to bolster Planned Parenthood. The administration needs them and vice versa. They contribute heavily to the liberal wing, and they have taken a beating this year. There is still a push to defund them in Congress, didn’t pass the first time, but if we keep pushing…

And yes, sadly, women do not realize what a terrible effect an abortion has on them in all respects, until they experience it. Physical complications, mental, emotional and spiritual annihilation. And sadly, some of them are sooooo ashamed of this they won’t talk about it sometimes for a lifetime. Meanwhile it is destroying them on the inside. Some even commit suicide. And now we are finding out what it does to the fathers of these children. It is an ugly diabolical thing.

You are certainly correct Teelyn and we have to keep pushing right back and pray, pray, pray! My belief is that when things appear the darkest, God is the closest to us, trying to get our attention and to hold it until we see clearly. **
I pray for Michael Voris every day since I first heard him speak several weeks ago! He has a style that turns some folks away from him but he is right up front* about things and spending** a lot of energy** trying to get the message out! He and so many others! God Bless them all.*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-EzQB9R_6A

 

[Teelynn]

You are certainly correct Teelyn and we have to keep pushing right back and pray, pray, pray! My belief is that when things appear the darkest, God is the closest to us, trying to get our attention and to hold it until we see clearly. **
I pray for Michael Voris every day since I first heard him speak several weeks ago! He has a style that turns some folks away from him but he is right up front** about things and spending** a lot of energy** trying to get the message out! He and so many others! God Bless them all.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-EzQB9R_6A

I like him too. He doesn’t pull any punches. If you have noticed, however, he has also been attacked by certain hierarchy in the Church. Certainly Kathleen Sebelius is correct. “We are at War” alright. Not with flesh and blood, but with principalities and powers.

 

[chepner3]

To me this is a perfect example as to why medical insurance should not now, nor ever should have been, provided through an employer. All medical insurance should be obtained privately. Insurance provided through an employer came about only because of the old practice of going to the “company doctor”, then unions lobbied for employer tax credits for offering that service. The whole practice snowballed from there to the severely flawed system we have today. Isn’t sad that the system wasn’t fixed back in 2010 when we had the chance.

 

[Elizabeth502]

Insurance provided through an employer came about only because of the old practice of going to the “company doctor”, then unions lobbied for employer tax credits for offering that service.

Not going to challenge your statement. However, the practice remained in place because of the economy of group rates. But surely there are other avenues for group rates – such as through private affiliations (religious, civic, or other kinds of associations).

 

[snowpiece]

Sounds like Pope Benedict really thinks that if not for social mores, all men would be gay. That says much more about him (and his “secretary”) than it does about homosexuality.

It’s pretty clear that Pope Benedict is a homosexual.

 

[nickybr38]

Sounds like Pope Benedict really thinks that if not for social mores, all men would be gay. That says much more about him (and his “secretary”) than it does about homosexuality.

It’s pretty clear that Pope Benedict is a homosexual.

Yeah, and society thinks that without free sex all men are children molesters. Says a lot about society, doesn’t it?

 

[snowpiece]

Yeah, and society thinks that without free sex all men are children molesters. Says a lot about society, doesn’t it?

I’m not sure who this “society” person is, but I don’t think they’re a very good influence. Or where you’d think that society at large thinks that without sex all men are child molesters…

My guess is that they looked at the Catholic Church’s policy on priests & celibacy, then looked at the rates of child rape in the Catholic Church… and drew a few erroneous conclusions.

It’s the Catholic Church, not lack of sex, that ALLOWS (not makes, ALLOWS) men in positions of power within its organization to commit child abuse and rape.

No need to shrug… just look at the photos of the Pope with his secretary & you’ll gasp!

 

[Rhuarc]

I don’t think gay marriage is as big a deal as people make it out to be. Gays should be allowed to “marry” as in get a marriage license from the state and get benefits that come with being married. But… BUT gays should not expect to EVER get their marriage recognized by the Church.

 

[nickybr38]

I’m not sure who this “society” person is, but I don’t think they’re a very good influence. Or where you’d think that society at large thinks that without sex all men are child molesters…

My guess is that they looked at the Catholic Church’s policy on priests & celibacy, then looked at the rates of child rape in the Catholic Church… and drew a few erroneous conclusions.

It’s the Catholic Church, not lack of sex, that ALLOWS (not makes, ALLOWS) men in positions of power within its organization to commit child abuse and rape.

No need to shrug… just look at the photos of the Pope with his secretary & you’ll gasp!

sigh

Just saying that all I ever hear is that if Catholic priests could get married they would stop molesting children… which says to me that the only reason priests abuse children is because they can’t have sex… which translates to: Men who can’t have sex become children abusers.

 

[incense]

I don’t think gay marriage is as big a deal as people make it out to be. Gays should be allowed to “marry” as in get a marriage license from the state and get benefits that come with being married. But… BUT gays should not expect to EVER get their marriage recognized by the Church.

Why? What benefit to society is there in giving benefits to gay couples? They do not procreate. They do not need to make a nest to give security to mother and children. Why should anyone be forced to give them benefits that were meant to foster society?

They can jump from partner to partner, forcing the group insurance to pay for the new medical needs of the latest partner. They might even consider it a kindness, to offer someone their insurance coverage to take care of a surgery or other high cost medical expense. But it forces others to cover it in higher premiums.

 

[DasErlibnis]

This is a great and worthy article.

 

[chepner3]

However, the practice remained in place because of the economy of group rates. But surely there are other avenues for group rates – such as through private affiliations (religious, civic, or other kinds of associations).

The whole discussion of medical insurance could be a thread on its own (and probably should be). However, the myth that group insurance lowers rates is like saying I need to be apart of a group to get lower rates for my auto or homeowners insurance.

As to "Why? What benefit to society is there in giving benefits to gay couples? They do not procreate. They do not need to make a nest to give security to mother and children. Why should anyone be forced to give them benefits that were meant to foster society?

They can jump from partner to partner, forcing the group insurance to pay for the new medical needs of the latest partner. They might even consider it a kindness, to offer someone their insurance coverage to take care of a surgery or other high cost medical expense. But it forces others to cover it in higher premiums."

I just have to sigh. Of course homosexuals can procreate. There are thousands of homosexual fathers and mothers out there and their children DO need protection. But that whole issue is mute because we don’t deny infertile or older heterosexual couples the benefit of marriage. We certainly don’t question older heterosexual couples who may be marrying merely to share medical insurance coverage! The whole idea of marriage and divorce is to make it more difficult to “jump from partner to partner”. I find it interesting that homosexuals are begging for the right to restrict their ability to be promiscuous. That alone flies in the face of every argument against homosexual marriage.

 

[incense]

T I find it interesting that homosexuals are begging for the right to restrict their ability to be promiscuous. That alone flies in the face of every argument against homosexual marriage.

How does pretending marriage limit promiscuity among homosexual couples? Even they admit that they’re not monogamous.

Besides, why would God view a sinful act with one person better than the same act with many different people.

 

[incense]

I just have to sigh. … There are thousands of homosexual fathers and mothers out there and their children DO need protection.

Children are covered under a parent’s insurance right now. Marriage is not needed.

 

[Elizabeth502]

Of course homosexuals can procreate.

Not with each other, they can’t. Basic biology. Perhaps you missed that class in school.

The whole idea of marriage and divorce is to make it more difficult to “jump from -]partner to partner”/-] heterosexual partner to heterosexual partner.

I find it interesting that homosexuals are begging for the right to restrict their ability to be promiscuous.

I find it far more interesting that you exhibit no understanding of the Catholic position on traditional marriage as affecting all of secular society, including the invalidity of “marriage” in the context of homosexuality.

Further, there are recent studies of how the title “marriage” does not restrict promiscuity in “married” gay men. Those have been cited on this forum. You might want to do a search.

 

[Teelynn]

You are certainly correct Teelyn and we have to keep pushing right back and pray, pray, pray! My belief is that when things appear the darkest, God is the closest to us, trying to get our attention and to hold it until we see clearly. **
I pray for Michael Voris every day since I first heard him speak several weeks ago! He has a style that turns some folks away from him but he is right up front** about things and spending** a lot of energy** trying to get the message out! He and so many others! God Bless them all.
[youtube.com/watch?v=O-EzQB9R_6A](

)

He had an interesting take on the HHS mandate and the Bishops response: It is wonderful and fitting for the Bishops to take this fight to the Administration, but for years some of the Bishops have been giving the green light to contraception. The relative theology that has been prominent in this country has of course permeated a portion of the laity. The watered down faith has been somewhat responsible for some of the defecting from the Church. And so now, when push comes to shove the Bishops are trying to rally the troops…of which we have lost maybe close to half of them. In essense there are some “Catholics” (maybe in name only) that are saying…“so what’s the big deal? We’ve been told that contraception is maybe warranted in some cases, so now it’s a big deal?” In order to try and keep people in the pews and not scare them off by soft peddling the faith, they’ve bitten off their noses to spite their faces.

That all being said, we are, as a people of God including the clergy, starting to turn this ship around and especially with the young clergy…thank you Lord! But some of the damage has already been done. How do you put the spilled milk back in the bottle?

 

[ivebeenshown]

To those not understanding how it is a threat:

Maybe it’s because you’re already too old and set in your ways – combined with a belief that sexuality does not include any choice or decision. I can tell you that is not the case.

 

[Teelynn]

I don’t think gay marriage is as big a deal as people make it out to be. Gays should be allowed to “marry” as in get a marriage license from the state and get benefits that come with being married. But… BUT gays should not expect to EVER get their marriage recognized by the Church.

Some people feel this way. And they SHOULD NEVER be recognized in the Church, but they are already trying to force it’s hand. If any Church rents out their property to others for marriages, they will HAVE to marry gays or be slapped with a discrimination suit.