Gays and catholics

[jean8]

Well, I know this might be a hard one (or not), but are homosexuals evil? I have herd that their actions are evil, but if you look it from a “normal” persons view, then you just would see 2 persons in love…so is it wrong or is it something else

mani,
No, I don’t think they are evil, they are sinners like the rest of us. We are are called to repent,daily! Rom.1:24-32 tells us about sin. Listed is every kind of wickedness. Evil, greed, gossips, slanderers, God-haters,faithless, boastful, , they disobey their parents, they are heartless and ruthless. So you can see, no one is perfect. btw, this isn’t a complete list of wrong doing.

“Those who believe in Christ no longer stand before God as guilty sinners, instead we stand before Him in Christ.”
Invite Christ into your heart. Yo will never be the same.

God bless,
jean8

I missed your comment about two persons in love? God created Adam and Eve. Male and female
Sexual perversion is an abomination to the Lord. See Rom.1:24-25,27 Please read this.

 

[BarbaraTherese]

Romans Chapter 1 -

26 For this cause God delivered them up to shameful affections. For their women have changed the natural use into that use which is against nature. 27 And, in like manner, the men also, leaving the natural use of the women, have burned in their lusts one towards another, men with men working that which is filthy, and receiving in themselves the recompense which was due to their error. 28 And as they liked not to have God in their knowledge, God delivered them up to a reprobate sense, to do those things which are not convenient; 29 Being filled with all iniquity, malice, fornication, avarice, wickedness, full of envy, murder, contention, deceit, malignity, whisperers, 30 Detractors, hateful to God, contumelious, proud, haughty, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,

As you have pointed out (and as quoted above in Romans) sexual perversion is an abomination for our bodies are temples of The Holy Spirit. Homosexual acts are not the only possible sexual perversion, nor are heterosexually orientated people preserved from sexual deviancies.

All mortal sin is an abomination to God and as you rightly pointed out again, we are all sinnners, only the nature of the sin may differ.

.*

 

[blessedtoo]

Quoting grandfather

… …but it is very easy for some to misunderstand that there is judging, and there is judging? We can judge an act as immoral or wrong, even evil…but we cannot state the disposition of a person’s soul as in mortal sin or not in mortal sin as a categorical statement - we can certainly state and should, in certain cirumstances, that the person is involved in grave moral matter and may be in real danger of mortal sin and eternal loss of their souls to Hell.

… …

… …if the person confesses to mortal sin publicly then they are in immmediate danger of Hell or eternal loss of their souls.

I have always been ‘long winded’ and I really do admire those with the gift of clear statement in a conscise manner…just not my gift I am afraid!

Barb

Barb,
I think you’ve been quite articulate and have expressed much of what I have tried to convey to friends and family.

It is not unusual, unfortunately, to find wonderful caring folks here on CAF pronouncing, almost with an air of infallibility, that a brother or sister has committed mortal sin. It’s rare, of course, to see direct condemnation to eternal hellfire, but the implication does surface at times and I find it troubling as well.

So if a person publicly professes some sin and insists it is not evil, then we know without ourselves judging anyone that the person is in danger of eternal loss.

I don’t think we can know, even in this situation. I suppose we can guess, but why would we? Even the Church does not pronounce on who is in hell or who is bound for hell.

To apply this scenario to a practical example, if a homosexual “insists” his actions are not evil, how can we ever know what lies beneath such a sentiment? Those of us who have homosexual family and friends know, first hand, how removed they are from objective truth - brainwashed almost. This is not an excuse - no argument from me on the objective sinfulness of homosexual activity. However, I can’t presume to know how God will judge this person - how culpable he might be for his actions given his distance from truth. When I am confronted with the situation (which is quite frequently), I respond by saying that homosexual activity is a sin - period. I don’t tell the person THEY are sinning or that they are doomed to hell. If they are practicing Catholics, I recommend they see their priest. If they are fallen-away Catholics, I give them literature. If they don’t ever want to talk about it again with me - I pray for them.

 

[BarbaraTherese]

Barb,
I think you’ve been quite articulate and have expressed much of what I have tried to convey to friends and family.

It is not unusual, unfortunately, to find wonderful caring folks here on CAF pronouncing, almost with an air of infallibility, that a brother or sister has committed mortal sin. It’s rare, of course, to see direct condemnation to eternal hellfire, but the implication does surface at times and I find it troubling as well.

I don’t think we can know, even in this situation. I suppose we can guess, but why would we? Even the Church does not pronounce on who is in hell or who is bound for hell.

To apply this scenario to a practical example, if a homosexual “insists” his actions are not evil, how can we ever know what lies beneath such a sentiment? Those of us who have homosexual family and friends know, first hand, how removed they are from objective truth - brainwashed almost. This is not an excuse - no argument from me on the objective sinfulness of homosexual activity. However, I can’t presume to know how God will judge this person - how culpable he might be for his actions given his distance from truth. When I am confronted with the situation (which is quite frequently), I respond by saying that homosexual activity is a sin - period. I don’t tell the person THEY are sinning or that they are doomed to hell. If they are practicing Catholics, I recommend they see their priest. If they are fallen-away Catholics, I give them literature. If they don’t ever want to talk about it again with me - I pray for them.

I heaved a huge sigh of reliefhttp://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_19_3.gif when I read your post. I was starting to think that I was expressing myself so badly, readers were getting the completely wrong impression and interpretation of what I was trying to say!

zI don’t think we can know, even in this situation. I suppose we can guess, but why would we? Even the Church does not pronounce on who is in hell or who is bound for hell.

I completely agree with you all the way! …I completely agree with all your comments.
I was doing a fair bit of ducking and weaving back there in this thread and as I said, starting to think I was coming across really badly and incorrectly and perhaps so longwinded that I was completely distorting my points. I was really and truly starting to actually worry about it all…and when I worry a touch of OCD clicks in and I am obsessed and compelled in this case to try and get my points across with accuracy and fearing that I was failing.
I really think it should be troubling when we come across Catholics with a confused understanding of what exactly is mortal sin? Of course to state another is in the state of mortal sin is, as a silent implication, a condemnation to Hell in potential.
Mortal sin is a heinous and dreadful, fearful, matter!

This is a Moral Theology Forum and it is important I think that we understand what is mortal sin and what is not and where we stand re judging others and what that judgement actually is that we must not do? i.e judging the soul. I hope our OP is not too confused.

Thank goodness for you, BT!http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/36/36_19_3.gif…and extremely well put!..Barb
We had a young man on our campus of homosexual orientation and he was fearfully victimized. He was often bruised having been bashed. He always sought me out as I think he knew that I saw him as a person for who he was - just another person. Thank goodness he is now off campus and I hope happy and well.

 

[KingAlfred]

You have this backwards. The homosexual person is disordered. The act is sinful, or evil.

Not according to the Catechism of the Catholic Church.

 

[Genesis12345]

Barbara,
According to your knowledge, it is fine to have homosexual acts because we can be forgiven through confession; yes, we can be forgiven, but if we continue to have these homosexual acts, the priest has the right of refusing you absolution. I think this is an insult to God. Let’s continue sinning because if we go to confession, we will be forgiven. You are mocking the Powerful Sacrament of Confession. If one continues to have these acts, how can he be sorry and keep going to confession? He will never grow spiritually. God will give him graces, but if he is determined to continue these acts, I sincerely doubt that a priest would give him absolution. The Sacrament of Confession is so powerful that if that person does not have the intention of discontinuing what he is doing, he is making a mockery of this powerful Sacrament. End of question and I will NOT respond because you are not LISTENENING!!!

 

[LaSalle]

The Church has taught for over 2000 years that homosexuality is a sin. Let’s not forget that.

Let’s also remember that we must not judge. Telling someone that homosexuality is a sin IS loving the person. That’s not judging, in fact, that’s what we are expected to do -

Luke 17:1
Jesus said to his disciples:”Things that cause people to sin are bound to come, but woe to that person through whom they come. It would be better for him to be thrown into the sea with a millstone tied around his neck than for him to cause one of these little ones to sin. So watch yourselves.
If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him.”

2 Tim 4
“Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. **For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. **They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry.”

Titus 2:11
“For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, while we wait for the blessed hope—the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.”

There is a difference between judging someone and warning someone to stay away from sin.

 

[Genesis12345]

Barbara,

I was not being uncharitable and being truthful. If you do not accept my opinions, fine and God bless you.

I do not wish to discuss this anymore. Have a nice day.

I personally think when it comes to Moral Questions, a priest should address the issue. I say this because I was previously in the seminary studying for the Catholic priesthood and laypeople do not have a background in Moral Theology, unless they have a degree and to give advice in these grave matters of concern is accountable to God. So, I am not judging you, but I personally would not give advice on moral issues unless one is qualified.
May the Mother of God bless you and the Holy Spirit descend upon you. There is no need for further discussion on this topic because I am not a moral theologian and I do not want to be responsible to God for giving wrong advice. I hope you can understand my view point in this serious matter.

 

[LaSalle]

Saint Maria Goretti was murdered by a young man trying to rape her. He claimed she enticed him sexually and then refused his advances. He stabbed her fourteen times. She appeared to him in a dream and handed him fourteen roses, each time saying “Alessandro I want you to be with me in heaven.” He confessed his crime and her innocence.

In court he asked for forgiveness and Maria’s mother stood up and said she forgave him. The crowd hated him and shouted at her. “How can you forgive this despicable criminal who murdered your daughter.” She said, “What if Jesus does not forgive me.”

After he spent many years in prison he was released, but no town would allow him to remain there. He wandered around as a beggar. He received a note of invitation to spend Christmas at a rectory from a priest. He went there and the housekeeper answered the door. It was Maria’s mother.

On the day Maria Goretti, the patron of purity, was canonized, at the papal Mass her mother was present. It was the first time in history that a parent of a saint was to witness the canonization of her child. Standing next to Maria’s mother was Alesandro, Maria’s murderer.

He spent the last years of his life as a monk.

Please don’t tell me that the Catholic Church stigmatizes evil doers, or that labels that call sin sin harm us. The Church’s entire mission is that of redemption, bringing mercy to all, no matter how depraved or guilty we are. Before you can be forgiven you must admit your guilt. You can not ask for mercy, unless you admit you need it. If a person is a slave to some sin we uphold them. They might fall a thousand times and we accept them.

By the power God gave the apostles the Church forgives sin. We do not excuse it. We do not say it is just. We say it is evil and if you do evil you can be pardoned no matter how evil you are.

So what do we say to Alessandro? You could not control your sexual cravings. It is understandable. You were driven to do what you did by normal biological functions. If there were not all of the moral restrictions placed on normal sexual appetite by religion you would not have been driven to become a murderer. It was not your fault. It was the fault of society and religion that you became a predator and a murderer and now you are stigmatized with the title murderer. You really are a victim. Your life is ruined, because you had no outlet for your healthy sexual desires.

Anyone who says what you did is wrong is judgmental and we know what Jesus said about that evil.

Saint Maria, as you lay dying you forgave your depraved murderer, pray for us.

Fantastic post!

 

[stbruno]

It is important to respect a person…because he is a person created by God to know, love, serve Him so that one day he may be happy with God in heaven…that’s our catechism, the reason for our creation.

Being that sad…respecting all people as a creation of God is what we are supposed to do…love the sinner is another way of saying it.

But no where does it say, not to denounce the sin. Jesus told the woman about to be stoned…go and sin no more. That’s harder for some to their own personal conversion but not impossible if the sinner turns to God for help. No one can do it without assistance. It’s an impossible task to resist all the physical, emotional, society inclinations of the sin…the devil is relentless in pursuit of one who is weak and far from God…but even the worst sinner can repent and become a saint, which I hope we are all aiming for…Don’t believe me…crack open a book on the lives of the saints…start with St.Paul, whose year we celebrate.

So for those who are burdened with their same sex attractions, this is a daily struggle, I am sure…but not insurmountable, to not sin anymore. Just go to God.

 

[Brendan]

All mortal sin is an abomination to God and as you rightly pointed out again, we are all sinnners, only the nature of the sin may differ.

.

Not true.

Sin may differ in both nature and degree.

They may also differ in number.

A person who sins by performing illict sexual acts daily differs from a another who infrequently commits theft, and that differs still from third person who commited a venial case of envy a single time.

All are sinners, but the sins differed in nature, degree and number.

 

[BarbaraTherese]

Not true.

Sin may differ in both nature and degree.

They may also differ in number.

A person who sins by performing illict sexual acts daily differs from a another who infrequently commits theft, and that differs still from third person who commited a venial case of envy a single time.

All are sinners, but the sins differed in nature, degree and number.

I stand corrected and thank you, Brendan. Sin can certainly degree not only in nature, but also in degree and number.

Barb

 

[BarbaraTherese]

Originally Posted by Genesis12345 forums.catholic-questions.org/images/buttons_cab/viewpost.gif
Barbara,
*According to your knowledge, it is fine to have homosexual acts because we can be forgiven through confession; yes, we can be forgiven, but if we continue to have these homosexual acts, the priest has the right of refusing you absolution.

I think this is an insult to God. Let’s continue sinning because if we go to confession, we will be forgiven. You are mocking the Powerful Sacrament of Confession.

*If one continues to have these acts, how can he be sorry and keep going to confession? He will never grow spiritually. God will give him graces, but if he is determined to continue these acts, I sincerely doubt that a priest would give him absolution. The Sacrament of Confession is so powerful that if that person does not have the intention of discontinuing what he is doing, he is making a mockery of this powerful Sacrament. End of question and I will NOT respond because you are not

Barbara,

I was not being uncharitable and being truthful. If you do not accept my opinions, fine and God bless you.

I do not wish to discuss this anymore. Have a nice day.

I personally think when it comes to Moral Questions, a priest should address the issue. I say this because I was previously in the seminary studying for the Catholic priesthood and laypeople do not have a background in Moral Theology, unless they have a degree and to give advice in these grave matters of concern is accountable to God. So, I am not judging you, but I personally would not give advice on moral issues unless one is qualified.
May the Mother of God bless you and the Holy Spirit descend upon you. There is no need for further discussion on this topic because I am not a moral theologian and I do not want to be responsible to God for giving wrong advice. I hope you can understand my view point in this serious matter.

Dear Genesis

You are mocking the Powerful Sacrament of Confession.

It is very difficult if the poster does not quote the words to which he is referring to. And certainly to state that a Catholic is “mocking the Powerful Sacrament of Confession” is insulting to that poster. It is a personal accusation and insulting to a Catholic especially to make such an accusation and especially to me as I value the Sacrament of Reconcilation with great awe and gratitutde. Again, it is an insulting personal statement.

Worse and another personal insult, you accuse me of insulting God. And this is another personal attack:

I think this is an insult to God.

I really have no idea at all what it is that I have posted that is so upsetting to you. I have posted at least once and probably more your own posts and my response to them and it really does seem to me that you are reading me wrongly. Your posts leave me nothing but in confusion as to what comments of mine you are referrring with which you are in such degree of heated disagreement and condemnation.
If you would quote my comments that you regard as incorrect, then I can address the issue and even amend my thinking if I do realize that I am incorrect.

According to your knowledge, it is fine to have homosexual acts because we can be forgiven through confession;

I have never said this at all and if you think I have, then please quote from my Post where you have found it. You are accusing me of stating something that I have not stated at all.

This is a Moral Theology Forum and a Discussion Forum and I think personally all Catholics should have a working knowledge of moral theology and certainly to understand what mortal sin is and what it is not, the Sacrament of Reconciliation, and also judging others. If you have any problems with everday Catholics posting into a Moral Theology Forum their thoughts and concepts re moral theology, then address those problems to the moderator of this Forum or to The Administrator.

I am very tempted to report your insulting post to the moderator and if you were not a new member, I would be more inclined to do so than I am. You are not only personally insulting, you have accused me of stating matters that I have not stated at all. But as a new member especially I am refraining at this point from reporting your insulting Post.

Blessings and my regards…Barb

 

[blessedtoo]

Dear Genesis

It is very difficult if the poster does not quote the words to which he is referring to. And certainly to state that a Catholic is “mocking the Powerful Sacrament of Confession” is insulting to that poster. It is a personal accusation and insulting to a Catholic especially to make such an accusation and especially to me as I value the Sacrament of Reconcilation with great awe and gratitutde. Again, it is an insulting personal statement.

Worse and another personal insult, you accuse me of insulting God. And this is another personal attack:

I really have no idea at all what it is that I have posted that is so upsetting to you. I have posted at least once and probably more your own posts and my response to them and it really does seem to me that you are reading me wrongly. Your posts leave me nothing but in confusion as to what comments of mine you are referrring with which you are in such degree of heated disagreement and condemnation.
If you would quote my comments that you regard as incorrect, then I can address the issue and even amend my thinking if I do realize that I am incorrect.

I have never said this at all and if you think I have, then please quote from my Post where you have found it. You are accusing me of stating something that I have not stated at all.

This is a Moral Theology Forum and a Discussion Forum and I think personally all Catholics should have a working knowledge of moral theology and certainly to understand what mortal sin is and what it is not, the Sacrament of Reconciliation, and also judging others. If you have any problems with everday Catholics posting into a Moral Theology Forum their thoughts and concepts re moral theology, then address those problems to the moderator of this Forum or to The Administrator.

I am very tempted to report your insulting post to the moderator and if you were not a new member, I would be more inclined to do so than I am. You are not only personally insulting, you have accused me of stating matters that I have not stated at all. But as a new member especially I am refraining at this point from reporting your insulting Post.

Blessings and my regards…Barb

Take a DEEP breath, Barb! You’re just fine!

 

[BarbaraTherese]

The Church has taught for over 2000 years that homosexuality is a sin. Let’s not forget that.

Let’s also remember that we must not judge. Telling someone that homosexuality is a sin IS loving the person. That’s not judging, in fact, that’s what we are expected to do -

Luke 17:1
Jesus said to his disciples:”Things that cause people to sin are bound to come, but woe to that person through whom they come. It would be better for him to be thrown into the sea with a millstone tied around his neck than for him to cause one of these little ones to sin. So watch yourselves.
If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgive him.”

2 Tim 4
“Preach the Word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. **For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. **They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. But you, keep your head in all situations, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelist, discharge all the duties of your ministry.”

Titus 2:11
“For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, while we wait for the blessed hope—the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.”

There is a difference between judging someone and warning someone to stay away from sin.

Hi LaSalle…Same gender sexual acts are certainly grave matter and gravely morally wrong and Scripture both in the Old and New Testament state this.

Let’s also remember that we must not judge. Telling someone that homosexuality is a sin IS loving the person. That’s not judging, in fact, that’s what we are expected to do

and…

There is a difference between judging someone and warning someone to stay away from sin

… …and we should be aware that we are all sinners and only the nature, degree and number of our sins differ - and certainly some are more blest to avoid sin and the occasions of sin than others. As an example, I (heterosexual) am celibate and my celibacy presents to me no problems at all and certainly now in my later years (62yrs) this is absolutely no merit of mine and hence nothing of a virtue, and probably due to the fact that I am well and truly post menapausal and my libido is markedly reduced by the medications that have been prescribed for my health. I no longer struggle with celibacy as I did in my younger years (and not taking the current medication) and God has preserved me from serious temptations in the sexual area. Some and though by call or by force of circumstances must remain celibate can have dreadful temptations in the celibacy area. I have been preserved from such. Not through virtue, but through equal force of circumstances.

Blessings and regards…Barb

 

[jean8]

---

As you have pointed out (and as quoted above in Romans) sexual perversion is an abomination for our bodies are temples of The Holy Spirit. Homosexual acts are not the only possible sexual perversion, nor are heterosexually orientated people preserved from sexual deviancies.

All mortal sin is an abomination to God and as you rightly pointed out again, we are all sinnners, only the nature of the sin may differ.

.*

Barbara,
good point, our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit.

God bless,
jean8

 

[BarbaraTherese]

Take a DEEP breath, Barb! You’re just fine!

Thanks, BT! I really do need this reassurance…and taking very deep breaths indeed - problem is I can feel the indignant anger pushing to come to the surface and explode. It is in a battle with laughter. Nothing worse I don’t think than to be totally tempted and resist it …and then in the end loose it anyway. I am trying to keep in mind the dreadful boo boo’s (Aussie for mistakes) I made when first a member of CAF. I really do appreciate your sensitivity and very real affirmation and generosity in fraternity. …Blessings and my regards…Barb

 

[jean8]

When a person commits the sin of murder the person is arrested and tried for the crime. We pray for this person’s conversion, repentance and his immortal soul. We do not judge the person spiritually, but leave that to God. We hope for mercy for all.

Nevertheless, murder is evil. Adultery is evil. The acts are evil. The person who commits murder is a murderer.

The Church says the homosexual condition is “intrinsically disordered”. It is not sinful, but disordered. The homosexual act is evil. You may not think so and you may say that is judging people, but that is the position of the Catholic Church today and for all time.

No one is judging anyone. We are discussuing whether homosexuality is normal, not sinful.?
Scriptures teach that this lifestyle is a perversion.
See Lev.18:22-30, 20:13. Rom.1:24–28, 1Cor.6:9, 1Tim.1:10
God destroyed Sodom because of this sin.
This is my last word on this subject.
You will notice, I provided scripture to prove my point. I’m not judging anyones lifestyle. The word of God judges our sins.

God bless,
jean8

 

[BarbaraTherese]

Barbara,
good point, our bodies are the temple of the Holy Spirit.

God bless,
jean8

Thanks Jean - Deo Gratius! - I have a saying for myself “I cannot please them all, but it sure feels good to please a few”.

St. Paul had very important things to say about our bodies:

Corionthians - Chapter 6 - 16 Or know you not, that he who is joined to a harlot, is made one body? For they shall be, saith he, two in one flesh. 17 But he who is joined to the Lord, is one spirit.

18 Fly fornication. Every sin that a man doth, is without the body; but he that committeth fornication, sinneth against his own body. 19 Or know you not, that your members are the temple of the Holy Ghost, who is in you, whom you have from God; and you are not your own? 20 For you are bought with a great price. Glorify and bear God in your body.

Corinthians - Chapter 3
*

16

• Know you not, that you are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 But if any man violate the temple of God, him shall God destroy. For the temple of God is holy, which you are. 18 Let no man deceive himself: if any man among you seem to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise. 19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written: I will catch the wise in their own craftiness. 20 And again: The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.

It is such an awesome matter to think that if one is in the state of Grace, that The Blessed Trinity resides within our bodies, in our souls. Sometimes after Holy Communion, I reflect that I am now as a tabernacle. The dictionary definition of “tabernacle” is:
.a temporary dwelling or shelter, as a tent or hut.
.a dwelling place.
Hence in the state of Grace even our bodies are tabernacles.

Stunning matter to reflect on!

Barb

 

[BarbaraTherese]

No one is judging anyone. We are discussuing whether homosexuality is normal, not sinful.?
Scriptures teach that this lifestyle is a perversion.
See Lev.18:22-30, 20:13. Rom.1:24–28, 1Cor.6:9, 1Tim.1:10
God destroyed Sodom because of this sin.
This is my last word on this subject.
You will notice, I provided scripture to prove my point. I’m not judging anyones lifestyle. The word of God judges our sins.

God bless,
jean8

Hi again Jean…This is one of things I find puzzling at times in this thread - that we most all, I think (I certainly cannot recall anyone stating to the contrary) regard homosexual acts as seriously morally wrong and hence grave matter and potentially mortally sinful. Yet posts crop up now and then that insist it is sinful - it is and we all agree on this to my memory. I think that same gender sexual attraction is not normal - for if it were then how can same gender sexual acts be morally wrong? If same gender sexual attraction is normal, then why is it that by far the majority are not so inclined…is mankind made up of a majority of abnormal people.

This of course can lead into debate on what on earth is “normal” in a human being and I dont mean sexuality only but right across the board of the human being and psyche.

I think the jury is still well and truly out, however, on what the actual cause of same gender sex attraction actually may be. The long debated nature/nurture issue. If homosexuality or same sex attraction were normal, then why would science be looking for the cause of same - there would be no need for science to look for a cause if it were normal for a human being to be same sex attracted. Obviously hence it seems to me, it is not normal. If it were proposed that it is normal, then it would mean that science is blinded on the issue looking for a cause and that the majority of human beings are abnormal. Science is not searching for a cause of heterosexuality to my knowledge, albeit if it can find the cause of homosexual leanings, the cause of our heterosexual leanings may just slip into place.

Blessings…and regards…Barb