Germany is quietly building a European army under its command

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Germany is quietly building a European army under its command

romania-insider.com/romanian-brigade-joins-german-army/

uk.businessinsider.com/germany-is-quietly-building-european-army-under-command-2017-5?r=US&IR=T
Germany has managed to take a radical step this year towards a European army without raising much political interest after announcing an integration of the armed forces with the Czech Republic and Romania, according to the magazine Foreign Policy.
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**Every few years, the idea of a European Union army finds its way back into the news, causing a kerfuffle. The concept is both fantasy and bogeyman: For every federalist in Brussels who thinks a common-defense force is what Europe needs to boost its standing in the world, there are those in London and elsewhere who recoil at the notion of a potential NATO rival.
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But this year, far from the headlines, Germany and two of its European allies, the Czech Republic and Romania, quietly took a radical step down a path toward something that looks like an EU army while avoiding the messy politics associated with it: They announced the integration of their armed forces…
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In doing so, they’ll follow in the footsteps of two Dutch brigades, one of which has already joined the Bundeswehr’s Rapid Response Forces Division and another that has been integrated into the Bundeswehr’s 1st Armored Division. According to Carlo Masala, a professor of international politics at the University of the Bundeswehr in Munich, “The German government is showing that it’s willing to proceed with European military integration” — even if others on the continent aren’t yet.
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The European Commission’s president, Jean-Claude Juncker, has repeatedly floated the idea of an EU army, only to be met with ridicule or awkward silence. That remains the case even as the UK, a perennial foe of the idea, is on its way out of the union…But under the bland label of the Framework Nations Concept, Germany has been at work on something far more ambitious — the creation of what is essentially a Bundeswehr-led network of European miniarmies…
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Germany may not yet have the political will to expand its military forces on the scale that many are hoping for — but what it has had since 2013 is the Framework Nations Concept. For Germany, the idea is to share its resources with smaller countries in exchange for the use of their troops. For these smaller countries, the initiative is a way of getting Germany more involved in European security while sidestepping the tricky politics of Germany military expansion. “It’s a move towards more European military independence,” Masala said…
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Col. Anthony Leuvering, the 43rd Mechanized’s Oldenburg-based commander, told me that the integration has had remarkably few hiccups. “The Bundeswehr has some 180,000 personnel, but they don’t treat us like an underdog,” he said. He expects more countries to jump on the bandwagon: “Many, many countries want to cooperate with the Bundeswehr.”…According to Masala, the Scandinavian countries — which already use a large amount of German-made equipment — would be the best candidates for the Bundeswehr’s next round of integration…
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Outside politics, the real test of the Framework Nations’ value will be the integrated units’ success in combat. But the trickiest part of integration, on the battlefield and off, may turn out to be finding a lingua franca. Should troops learn each other’s languages? Or should the junior partner speak German? The German-speaking Dutch Col. Leuvering reports that the binational Oldenburg division is moving toward using English.**
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An article published today in the Guardian with respect to the role Macron may play in future European military integration:

theguardian.com/business/2017/may/23/how-can-emmanuel-macron-unite-europe-start-with-the-armies#comments
**How can Emmanuel Macron unite Europe? He can start with the armies
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Hans-Werner Sinn
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The French president’s desire to advance political and fiscal union should be applauded. After the UK leaves he should start pushing for a European military
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…
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it is important that European integration moves forward. There is still much work to do to improve the EU’s cross-border traffic routes, and to strengthen its security partnerships. Indeed, Europe should take a lesson from the wars of the 20th century and do away with national armies altogether. Only then will Europe’s union for peace become a reality, and not just a platitude invoked by politicians.
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During the postwar era, European heads of state drafted a treaty to establish a western European defence community. But the proposal fell through in 1954, owing to a veto by France’s National Assembly, against the recommendation of Charles de Gaulle. Later, the UK opposed a joint European military.
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But the UK will no longer be a part of the EU, at least for the foreseeable future; and France has a young, dynamic new president. So it is time to try again. The German people can probably be persuaded to agree to this form of integration, in the same referendum that will have to be held, anyway, to approve Macron’s fiscal plans. The same can be said for the people of eastern Europe.
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By pursuing true political integration based on a common army and security partnership for the entire EU, Macron can guarantee his place in the history books.
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**
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Well, integration of Dutch and Romanian units into German forces is not without precedent in Europe. :eek:
 
EU is garbage, hope the whole thing fails, stop globalisation
 
Ridgerunner said:
Well, integration of Dutch and Romanian units into German forces is not without precedent in Europe. :eek:
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I was, of course, expecting the allusions to the Wehrmacht and foreign SS fighters during World War II. 🙂
 
Vouthon said:
I was, of course, expecting the allusions to the Wehrmacht and foreign SS fighters during World War II. 🙂
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If you expected it then the same thoughts had obviously crossed your mind as well.
 
It seems like it would be better for the EU to go all in and make plans for a unified army rather than let one member country silently lead the organization.
 
Vouthon said:
I was, of course, expecting the allusions to the Wehrmacht and foreign SS fighters during World War II. 🙂
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Crossed my mind too, have to admit. Ignoring the past could lead to repeating the mistakes of the past, no?
 
Wesrock said:
It seems like it would be better for the EU to go all in and make plans for a unified army rather than let one member country silently lead the organization.
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It should be noted that Germany is not a military power of great note and is doing this with genuine reluctance. The Germans still don’t spend anywhere near enough of their GDP on defence relative to the size of their economy and demographics.

The desire for integration within the Bundeswehr is chiefly coming from its partner European countries, rather than Germany itself.

That said, I completely agree with you that it would be far more ideal a situation if military integration and defence cooperation could be enacted across the Union as a whole, multilaterally under a supranational designated administration representing all the nation’s of the EU equally. Traditionally, this has been blocked by Britain and hindered by the French.

But now with Brexit about to happen and President Macron in the Elysee Palace, there is a rare opportunity to change the dynamic and make moves towards the unified “army” (if such is the right term) that you speak of.

I believe it will happen eventually but the German initiative is a substitute in the mean time and a testing ground for a more elaborate venture later on.
 
And what exactly would an EU army do ? Act as debt collectors (an EU minister already made frightening comments about Greece some years ago) Tear down fences put up to keep dangerous aliens out ?
 
Vouthon said:
The desire for integration within the Bundeswehr is chiefly coming from its partner European countries, rather than Germany itself.

I believe it will happen eventually but the German initiative is a substitute in the mean time and a testing ground for a more elaborate venture later on.
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Either it’s a German initiative or it isn’t.
 
WWI. WWII. The Holocaust. Nazism. Protestantism. The EU Army.

Delicious sausage and beer isn’t going to make up for this stuff FOREVER Germany!
 
Difference this time is that Germany’s leaders want to destroy the country’s ethnic origins and replace it with Middle Easterners, North Africans, Turks, Afghans, etc.
 
Seamus_L said:
Difference this time is that Germany’s leaders want to destroy the country’s ethnic origins and replace it with Middle Easterners, North Africans, Turks, Afghans, etc.
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:rolleyes:

Do they? Germany’s leaders are primarily devoted to the elimination of Germany and German culture and people?

That’s so paranoid. Can this be what you truly think?

I know…Germany and it’s leaders and people should instead devote themselves to purging from their borders any and all who are not … of the pure master race? Maybe they can only allow citizens who can vouch for their racial purity by extensive genealogical tests and pedigrees?

And then German women can be compelled to breed with approved racial partners for the good of the master race? BARF

Please…that’s gross. And it’s been tried before in living memory to such disasterous consequences that the German people will be forever shamed by their history.

No. Never again. I applaud the German people for their determination to never go down this road again, and do thier part as a civilized nation to welcome refugees and immigrants into their nation and culture.

The Germans are going to be just fine.

Your fears are misplaced.
 
Questioner2 said:
:rolleyes:

Do they? Germany’s leaders are primarily devoted to the elimination of Germany and German culture and people?

That’s so paranoid. Can this be what you truly think?

I know…Germany and it’s leaders and people should instead devote themselves to purging from their borders any and all who are not … of the pure master race? Maybe they can only allow citizens who can vouch for their racial purity by extensive genealogical tests and pedigrees?

And then German women can be compelled to breed with approved racial partners for the good of the master race? BARF

Please…that’s gross. And it’s been tried before in living memory to such disasterous consequences that the German people will be forever shamed by their history.

No. Never again. I applaud the German people for their determination to never go down this road again, and do thier part as a civilized nation to welcome refugees and immigrants into their nation and culture.

The Germans are going to be just fine.

Your fears are misplaced.
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youtube.com/watch?v=rMDWAaxFnCA
they are not misplaced at all. The national self loathing spread by Germans and Swedes is truly staggering
only these western countries are parlysed with guilt to the extent that they will become minorities in their own land
you wont see this with Japan, a country with alot to be ashamed of for sure.
Going to be just fine, if you call a rape epidemic, sporadic acts of terror fine, then ok
 
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