Get the Kids Out - 0f public school

[jwatza]

love my six,

First of all, I did not bring up the topic. I am just joining in a thread that was started by someone else and am giving my opinion, insights, experience… Take it or leave it–if you are defensive and, I am not sure that you are, then you should examine if there is a sensitive chord that I have touched upon and think about it. That’s all.

I agree that children can be messed up from all different types of schooling and that parents need to discern what is best for the child/family.

The point that I am trying to get across is that our society has become so toxic, that I believe Christian parents need to think good and hard (not to mention pray hard) about where our children spend most of their day. How in the world are our children going to have a positive influence in this toxic culture if they are absorbed in it? Do you not recall peer pressure when you were growing up?–guess what? the peer pressure is still there, but the things being pushed are even more damaging than when we were growing up.

I don’t recall ever mentioning a specific type of schooling being better than another. I am giving my opinion about the status of schooling situations in our society today–do you not agree that our society is toxic and morally bankrupt? If that it is so, then would you agree that much of that has filtered into the school systems whether by teachers, students or curriculum? And if so, shouldn’t we be wary of letting our kids spend most of their days in that type of situation?

We can’t change the culture if we are absorbed in it and don’t seek different ways of doing things.

 

[buffalo]

love my six,

First of all, I did not bring up the topic. I am just joining in a thread that was started by someone else and am giving my opinion, insights, experience… Take it or leave it–if you are defensive and, I am not sure that you are, then you should examine if there is a sensitive chord that I have touched upon and think about it. That’s all.

I agree that children can be messed up from all different types of schooling and that parents need to discern what is best for the child/family.

The point that I am trying to get across is that our society has become so toxic, that I believe Christian parents need to think good and hard (not to mention pray hard) about where our children spend most of their day. How in the world are our children going to have a positive influence in this toxic culture if they are absorbed in it? Do you not recall peer pressure when you were growing up?–guess what? the peer pressure is still there, but the things being pushed are even more damaging than when we were growing up.

I don’t recall ever mentioning a specific type of schooling being better than another. I am giving my opinion about the status of schooling situations in our society today–do you not agree that our society is toxic and morally bankrupt? If that it is so, then would you agree that much of that has filtered into the school systems whether by teachers, students or curriculum? And if so, shouldn’t we be wary of letting our kids spend most of their days in that type of situation?

We can’t change the culture if we are absorbed in it and don’t seek different ways of doing things.

A way to look at this is to contrast it to the past.

In the 50’s your local public school pretty much supported your Catholic values. The media did as well as the community.

Today - who supports those values?

The Catholic Schools as imperfect as they are stand alone.

 

[kage_ar]

I, for one, am proud of the Christian kids who are salt and light to the world, every single day.

 

[PaulinVA]

I, for one, am proud of the Christian kids who are salt and light to the world, every single day.

 

[Joseph_L_Varga]

I agree in principle. That is why we are asking for vouchers. We then have the choice where we want that money to go to.

Yes, it’s not like the government would give our tax money to private schools, with strings attached. The government would instead give us the parents vouchers in return for collecting taxes from us, and let us choose where we bring those vouchers. This is simply you the parent taking control of where your tax money goes and where your children are educated, instead of leaving that decision to the government.

 

[PaulinVA]

Yes, it’s not like the government would give our tax money to private schools, with strings attached. The government would instead give us the parents vouchers in return for collecting taxes from us, and let us choose where we bring those vouchers. This is simply you the parent taking control of where your tax money goes and where your children is educated, instead of leaving that decision to the government.

The idea of vouchers sounds good, but is selfish.

The free market principles don’t work for school. Letting people leave public schools will not make the public schools better. They make them worse.

If you can get a voucher to send your child to a private school, could someone with no children get a voucher to go to college? No, of course not.

 

[mommyof4]

I, for one, am proud of the Christian kids who are salt and light to the world, every single day.

And teachers too!

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

Well, I just think about who Jesus hung around with.

And he wasn’t a vulnerable, confused only-human child.

 

[Corki]

If you can get a voucher to send your child to a private school, could someone with no children get a voucher to go to college? No, of course not.

Funny you mention that. Someone with no children can currently get a tax break for tuition spent to go to college but we can’t get any relief at all for private/Catholic school tuition beyond pre-school. There is something wrong with that system.

 

[yellowbird]

And he wasn’t a vulnerable, confused only-human child.

Why would a child from a strong Catholic family be vulnerable and confused? What are we raising… a generation of wimps?

Some public schools really stink. I think it’s a reflection of the neighborhoods… there are ALOT of places I would not want to live because of crime, gangs, rampant drugs etc. But there are great places too… with wonderful public schools. So assuming it’s a good public school… what’s up with the fear? Is our faith so shallow and weak that we think the day spent next to some children who may not share our views is going to completly destroy all the work we’ve put into our kids? Where are your prayers? Where is your faith in the Holy Spirit to protect your children? Seriously, and what’s up with the assumption that your child will be surrounded by morally bankrupt people? My town is mainly Catholic / Evangelical. No idea where you live that your neighbors are so horrible? Mine don’t go to my church necessarily, but they are good people. Maybe you should move?

Sailor ~ All of my post isn’t necessarily directed at you, but for all posters who apparently believe that all public schools are of Satan.

 

[lovemysix]

jwatza,

I’m sorry if I misunderstood you to be suggesting one type of schooling over another; I took your statement that your sister says to “get the kids out of the schools” an an endorsement of homeschooling only vs. having children in a school environment.

I have to say I don’t feel any need to be defensive of my choices at all. As my children grow older and are turning out to be loving, kind, and interesting people, I am reinforced in my beliefs that there is no ONE right way for everyone.

I do get irritated when I see people (I do realize you are not the originator of this thread) attempting to sway parents’ decisions about the education of their children through fear-mongering.

Lauren

 

[leonie]

the problem with this topic is that it’s too general. It’s impossible to evaluate each family’s situation (and each child’s) and each school’s quality.

Better threads would be:

What constitutes a good Catholic education?
How can you partner with a school to form a Catholic worldview?
How do you evaluate a school to determine if it is educating your child in the Catholic tradition?

The truth is that throughout time, families have worked very hard to find good education for their kids. It’s always been a struggle. For example, St. John Bosco had to leave home at a young age, work for his expenses (tuition and living), and board in town to obtain his education–which was not available to him at home or in his town. The Martin family utilized homeschooling, a day school, a boarding school, and tutors at various times and for particular children. The Martin family was St. Therese’s family–they had five surviving dds who all become Religious.

There’s no one path, so blanket statements like, “This form of schooling is the best one.”

Our parish school is very good, but the parish in which I grew up had a horrible school both in academics and in faith formation. But, did I get a Catholic education with the combination of public school and ccd? Not really, if you evaluate it on the basis of forming a Catholic identity and worldview. Was I better off in public school? Probably because the faith formation was so incredibly poor at the parish school. At least at my public school, I had excellent academics.

I know my parents have many regrets about the secular education and faith formation that my sibs and I received. However, it would not have been “fixed” by sending us to the parish school.

 

[PaulinVA]

Funny you mention that. Someone with no children can currently get a tax break for tuition spent to go to college but we can’t get any relief at all for private/Catholic school tuition beyond pre-school. There is something wrong with that system.

The federal tax break for college tuition is to encourage an educated workforce. What would be encouraged by giving a tax break for sending your child to a private school? Elitism?

I’m not bashing Catholic school. I’m just saying there is no public policy reason to give a tax break to send your child to a private elementary school, when a ‘free’ education is already provided.

That said, Virginia gives around $3200 a year to students of private Virginia colleges. The public policy reason? Virginia private colleges have good lobbyists! (That, and they support the economies in some small towns)

 

[Beautiful]

Get the Kids Out!

I would say to you, dear friends, it may require some sacrifice, but I urge you to send your children to godly schools. If you send them off to some public school, keep in mind that you are shooting dice with your children’s eternal souls. It is a gamble that no Christian should be willing to make.

wow buffalo ~ you have really taken a flogging by some CAF guests. I understand your concern but perhaps Dr. D. James Kennedy might not have been the best person to quote .

Anyway - Mommyof4 ~ I’m thankful you have a job and all and I hope you manage to keep it throughout the economic crisis but it is always my hope and prayer that the public school systems levels to the ground and rebuilds itself in a way that allows more freedom of choice and economic incentives for parents when choosing schools for their youngsters.
I happen to live in an area that requires residents to pay more money in school taxes than the other 90% of the country. And what are the results of so much money?..nothing but fat, happy over indulged over paid faculty, staff and admin.

Hear Here! thanks jwatza

My sister is a psychologist who sees lots of high school kids for counseling–her advice is to get your kids out of the schools. She says that the environments are extremely toxic in the public schools. And she is not really talking about the teachers, there are so many kids coming from broken homes and painful situations that the way they treat each other is awful. Her practice is in a decent suburban area (Midwest values) and the issues that these kids come to her with are extremely serious and damaging. Think about who your kids are sitting in classes with for 7 hours out of each day. Kids who are drinking, drugging, hooking up, cutting, bullying, from broken families, unchurched, wiccans, atheists…the list goes on.

 

[buffalo]

The idea of vouchers sounds good, but is selfish.

The free market principles don’t work for school. Letting people leave public schools will not make the public schools better. They make them worse.

If you can get a voucher to send your child to a private school, could someone with no children get a voucher to go to college? No, of course not.

Vouchers follow you school taxes.

 

[buffalo]

wow buffalo ~ you have really taken a flogging by some CAF guests. I understand your concern but perhaps Dr. D. James Kennedy might not have been the best person to quote .

Anyway - Mommyof4 ~ I’m thankful you have a job and all and I hope you manage to keep it throughout the economic crisis but it is always my hope and prayer that the public school systems levels to the ground and rebuilds itself in a way that allows more freedom of choice and economic incentives for parents when choosing schools for their youngsters.
I happen to live in an area that requires residents to pay more money in school taxes than the other 90% of the country. And what are the results of so much money?..nothing but fat, happy over indulged over paid faculty, staff and admin.

Hear Here! thanks jwatza

I usually do when topics are discussed that are uncomfortable and hit home.

Until public schools have to compete our kids will suffer. Adults will suffer in that they are paying 4 times the cost for an inferior product. Who buys a car in that fashion?

 

[Beautiful]

The idea of vouchers sounds good, but is selfish.

The free market principles don’t work for school. Letting people leave public schools will not make the public schools better. They make them worse.

Oh Lord! I mean - Oh Lord! How much worse can they get?

Something - anything needs to be done to save children from the dregs of socialist public school system that is already collapsing in on itself.

The idea of vouchers isn’t selfish…it is freedom of choice!

 

[buffalo]

Oh Lord! I mean - Oh Lord! How much worse can they get?

Something - anything needs to be done to save children from the dregs of socialist public school system that is already collapsing in on itself.

The idea of vouchers isn’t selfish…it is freedom of choice!

A bureaucratic monopoly Federal school system does not serve the public interest.

What it has done is dumbed down the populace. The hard facts are is some children cannot keep up and we need to recognize that.

 

[Beautiful]

I usually do when topics are discussed that are uncomfortable and hit home.

Until public schools have to compete our kids will suffer. Adults will suffer in that they are paying 4 times the cost for an inferior product. Who buys a car in that fashion?

Quoting Dr. Kennedy might actually have been a good choice. Catholics aren’t the only ones concerned.

Yea! Who buys a car or anything the way we choose schools for our children. People on welfare and foodstamps must buy certain brand items allowed by the system. This is because it is a free government handout. Parents today have been turned into the largest recipients of welfare and this takes place in the form of public education of our most precious children. Economically, parents have been forced to take what Big government hands them. And what has it netted? Failure for the most part…

 

[PaulinVA]

Oh Lord! I mean - Oh Lord! How much worse can they get?

They can get a lot worse.

Something - anything needs to be done to save children from the dregs of socialist public school system that is already collapsing in on itself.

So give me my voucher and I’m otta here. Good luck to the rest of you.

The idea of vouchers isn’t selfish…it is freedom of choice!

Sure it’s selfish. “I’m leaving because this school is not up to MY standards.” Once you take your children out, are you still going to work for the success of that school? No, probably not.