Get the Kids Out - 0f public school

[Beautiful]

where do you live, because our schools are not like this at all!

And I guess someone has to think of the poor kids left in a “crumbling rotten system”, just because you remove your kids from the school, doesn’t mean you shouldn’t care about the kids who can’t get out. What if both parents work, what if this is the only option they have, then what, oh well, not your kid, let them rot?

New York! Where taxes are so high you gotta’ work 1/3 of the year to pay your tax bill!

The deinstitutionalization of mentally ill people helped make possible the development of better public awareness, treatments and medication and placed more emphasis on family and community. Harnessing our most needy and underprivileged children to a system that has obviously failed nearly everyone except the over fattened teacher union that binds it together is pointless.

Deinstitutionalizing education will allow greater emphasis on solving real problems and situations and placing more necessary burden on families and community…families and communities in a realistic way and not just in taxes paid.

 

[happymommy]

Give me a break - do you know who gets on a public school board? Pretty much the ones who just go along with the spending plan. We need more money to solve these problems. Teacher moral will go down if we don’t give them a raise. The kids can’t learn unless we build a bigger and newer palace. We need more highly paid administrators. It goes on and on.

And Catholic education does so much more with 1/4 the cost.

Yes, I know who all is on our school board!!
wow, we must live in a bubble because our school doesn’t run this way! Maybe that’s why we have such a great school system!

If a Catholic education can do it better, with 1/4 the cost, why are the shutting down so many Catholic schools?

 

[buffalo]

Yes, I know who all is on our school board!!
wow, we must live in a bubble because our school doesn’t run this way! Maybe that’s why we have such a great school system!

If a Catholic education can do it better, with 1/4 the cost, why are the shutting down so many Catholic schools?

Because they charge tuition.

In the Diocese of Wichita children of active parishioners go K-12 tuition free because of stewardship and their school are full.

 

[happymommy]

Because they charge tuition.

In the Diocese of Wichita children of active parishioners go K-12 tuition free because of stewardship and their school are full.

so are the parents told how much they have to give to the church or is up to everyone else in the parish to pay for the kids to go? Nothing is free, someone is paying for it!!

I understand about tuition, I went to our local Christian school grades 2 through 8. I don’t feel I had any advantage going there, I feel I would have learned more in our public schools because they have better qualified teachers then what they had at the Christian school here!

 

[GhostMan]

Frankly, I fail to see any merit in the Public School arguments. They seem to boil down to a few standard ones:

1. Godly children in the Public Schools serve to be (missionaries to the un-churched) (salt-and-light) (ambassadors for Christ)

This is a collection of similar thoughts. It amounts to sending out untrained soldiers to fight a war. How much more common is it for children raised in God-fearing homes to make bad decision than for un-churched children to become interested in the things of God? If we’re being honest here, we know the answer. If you are sending your child to Public school in order for him/her to convert other children, then I fear you are in for horrible surprises.

1. If my child is home-schooled, then he(she) will never be confident in the “Real” world. He(she) needs to be exposed many ideas and concepts in order to be strong in the faith.

On the surface, this sounds good. Again, however, we’re talking about children, not adults. In my garden, I raise tomatoes. Now, I could simply throw out seeds, never weed, water or fertilize, and see what I harvest. I could fail to provide protection from bunnies, gophers and deer and say I did not want “coddled” tomatoes. Since I want a bumper crop of super-tasty ones, however, I careful select the seeds I want, germinate them in my basement in the cold of winter, subject them to slight stress in order to make a strong root system, water and fertilize as my years of experience have taught me, slowly introduce them to the strong sun rays as spring matures, transplant them after the last frost, and protect them from predators.

My goal is to get the healthiest, most productive plants. I don’t care if the gophers go hungry, or if my plants are grown inside part of the year. I don’t care what my neighbor does. I am only trying to grow my own crop.

Similarly with my children, I am only interested what best serves them. I will not expose young children to the cold of winter, or the predator who wishes to devour them in order to “make them stronger”, rather I will nurture them and transplant them when they can flourish and produce a bumper crop for themselves.

Yes, by the way, I have adult children who have been through the entire cycle and are now producing fruit on their own. This is not theory for me, it is the voice of experience.

1. Removing my children would be selfish. What about the other kids who would be left?

God has not called me to save the schools or the children in the schools. He has given me children and I will be accountable for how I raise them. He has called some to vocations in the schools and we will hope and pray they can have an affect on the un-churched. My only goal is to raise men and women of faith. All my decisions are based on that.

1. Home schooling is good for some, but it would not work for us.

I would challenge anyone to really reconsider this statement. Even a single parent who works can home school their child if that is their desire. It comes down to choices. What’s your priority? That may sound harsh, but we are told that where our heart is, is where our treasure will be. Many home schoolers endure very hard sacrifices in order to be able to accomplish their goals. No, it isn’t easy; no, it isn’t free. It is, however, demonstrably better for the children in any home with a loving parent.

No, I did not say that only home school parents love their children. That was meant to say that a “toxic” home might not be the best environment.

Home schooling is not a panacea. It only keeps your children out of the prevalent culture while they mature and can make mature decisions for themselves. My goal has been to get them through through their teens without succumbing the vices of the world. All of my older children have made the transition to secular colleges with ease and have not fallen into patterns of vice-sin when they leave the home.

 

[PaulinVA]

Ghost Man, I’m sure you are doing what you think is best for your children.

 

[Em_in_FL]

1. Godly children in the Public Schools serve to be (missionaries to the un-churched) (salt-and-light) (ambassadors for Christ)

This is a collection of similar thoughts. It amounts to sending out untrained soldiers to fight a war. How much more common is it for children raised in God-fearing homes to make bad decision than for un-churched children to become interested in the things of God? If we’re being honest here, we know the answer. If you are sending your child to Public school in order for him/her to convert other children, then I fear you are in for horrible surprises.

Thank you for underestimating us!

I think there are different parenting philosophies and I am fine with that!
But if my personal experience is a testimony to your doubt, then maybe others’ can be too!

 

[kage_ar]

Frankly, I fail to see any merit in the Public School arguments. They seem to boil down to a few standard ones:

1. Godly children in the Public Schools serve to be (missionaries to the un-churched) (salt-and-light) (ambassadors for Christ)

This is a collection of similar thoughts. It amounts to sending out untrained soldiers to fight a war. How much more common is it for children raised in God-fearing homes to make bad decision than for un-churched children to become interested in the things of God? If we’re being honest here, we know the answer. If you are sending your child to Public school in order for him/her to convert other children, then I fear you are in for horrible surprises.

I send MY child to school to learn readin’ rightn’ and rithmetic’.

The BIG R - Religion, I teach at home and in life and in Parish.

90% of the children in the public schools here ARE “churched”.

I don’t know how to break this to you, but, there are kids who are homeschooled and who are in Catholic schools who also make bad decisions

Most children with involved, caring parents will thrive, no matter where they go to school. Those who do make bad decisions would likely do it no matter what school they attended.

 

[happymommy]

Frankly, I fail to see any merit in the Public School arguments. They seem to boil down to a few standard ones:

1. Godly children in the Public Schools serve to be (missionaries to the un-churched) (salt-and-light) (ambassadors for Christ)

This is a collection of similar thoughts. It amounts to sending out untrained soldiers to fight a war. How much more common is it for children raised in God-fearing homes to make bad decision than for un-churched children to become interested in the things of God? If we’re being honest here, we know the answer. If you are sending your child to Public school in order for him/her to convert other children, then I fear you are in for horrible surprises.

1. If my child is home-schooled, then he(she) will never be confident in the “Real” world. He(she) needs to be exposed many ideas and concepts in order to be strong in the faith.

On the surface, this sounds good. Again, however, we’re talking about children, not adults. In my garden, I raise tomatoes. Now, I could simply throw out seeds, never weed, water or fertilize, and see what I harvest. I could fail to provide protection from bunnies, gophers and deer and say I did not want “coddled” tomatoes. Since I want a bumper crop of super-tasty ones, however, I careful select the seeds I want, germinate them in my basement in the cold of winter, subject them to slight stress in order to make a strong root system, water and fertilize as my years of experience have taught me, slowly introduce them to the strong sun rays as spring matures, transplant them after the last frost, and protect them from predators.

My goal is to get the healthiest, most productive plants. I don’t care if the gophers go hungry, or if my plants are grown inside part of the year. I don’t care what my neighbor does. I am only trying to grow my own crop.

Similarly with my children, I am only interested what best serves them. I will not expose young children to the cold of winter, or the predator who wishes to devour them in order to “make them stronger”, rather I will nurture them and transplant them when they can flourish and produce a bumper crop for themselves.

Yes, by the way, I have adult children who have been through the entire cycle and are now producing fruit on their own. This is not theory for me, it is the voice of experience.

1. Removing my children would be selfish. What about the other kids who would be left?

God has not called me to save the schools or the children in the schools. He has given me children and I will be accountable for how I raise them. He has called some to vocations in the schools and we will hope and pray they can have an affect on the un-churched. My only goal is to raise men and women of faith. All my decisions are based on that.

1. Home schooling is good for some, but it would not work for us.

I would challenge anyone to really reconsider this statement. Even a single parent who works can home school their child if that is their desire. It comes down to choices. What’s your priority? That may sound harsh, but we are told that where our heart is, is where our treasure will be. Many home schoolers endure very hard sacrifices in order to be able to accomplish their goals. No, it isn’t easy; no, it isn’t free. It is, however, demonstrably better for the children in any home with a loving parent.

No, I did not say that only home school parents love their children. That was meant to say that a “toxic” home might not be the best environment.

Home schooling is not a panacea. It only keeps your children out of the prevalent culture while they mature and can make mature decisions for themselves. My goal has been to get them through through their teens without succumbing the vices of the world. All of my older children have made the transition to secular colleges with ease and have not fallen into patterns of vice-sin when they leave the home.

I agree with you! And these are the reasons we are thinking of homeschooling, not because our children are not getting a good education. We have a very good school system and I feel our children are getting an excellent education, but we worry about protecting our children from this value free culture we have now. But, I have concerns that I just can’t do it. That I will be doing a huge disservice to my children, because I can’t teach them as well. It’s a debate I keep having with myself. I’m praying about it and researching more and we will see what the next school year brings.

I do think that if some feel very strongly about the condition of the schools then they should step up and get things changed. Be the voice for those kids that are just getting pushed through the system.

But, like a lot of other topics, we can all argue and state our cases and not really change the minds of anyone.

 

[Lil_Cat]

I also don’t see how vouchers are selfish, given that all parents would have the opportunity to use the vouchers.

Where do you draw the line at where parents can use these vouchers, seeing as you said ALL parents? Catholic Schools? Protestant schools? Fundamentalist Muslim schools?

Bad, bad idea, IMHO. I see what you guys are saying about public schools, but maybe they are that way because every Christian is ducking and running to somewhere that little Johnny won’t have to defend what he believes in.

 

[Lux_Caelum]

Get the Kids Out!

I would say to you, dear friends, it may require some sacrifice, but I urge you to send your children to godly schools. If you send them off to some public school, keep in mind that you are shooting dice with your children’s eternal souls. It is a gamble that no Christian should be willing to make.

Don’t send an eight-year-old out to take on a forty-year-old humanist. I have never seen any people more unhappy than fathers or mothers who have come to me and said, “Where did we go wrong? We gave him everything, and now he’s turned his back completely on everything we believe.” Yes, they gave him everything but a Christian education.

Dr. D. James Kennedy (Training Your Children 396060)

​

hmmm, I’m the product of public education. I observe all the requirements of the Catholic Church (which I can say 90% of the people at my parish likely don’t do). I know specific individuals that were products of “godly” schools that turned out well and I also know people who are now agnostic. I have a cousin who was educated in Catholic school from 1st-12th, went to seminary droped out and is now living in San Francisco with his ‘friend’.

Christian education as with most things starts at home.

 

[sanctamaria17]

Another proud product of public education who:

A) converted to Catholicism
B) got into and currently attend a good school in a big city
C) has had to defend her faith and beliefs for the past six years (counting from freshman year of high school)
D) can answer questions about Catholicism or pro-life without feeling backed into a wall
E) Is still very active in the Church and happy to be there

Now, I’m just one example. I’m just saying, not every public school kid turns into a drug abusing criminal.

The kids in my school who were screwed up had either: A) very rich parents who gave them every thing they could, except actual presence and discipline or B) were completely clueless and did not take the time to get to know their kids’ friends or about their kids lives. Or C) they expected the kids to surpass their own abilities and dictated everything to them, without allowing the kid to grow into themselves or admit their own personal shortcomings. Because their child was their “perfect child”

Honestly, I’d rather send my kids to a public school, where they expect things to be different since there will be non-Catholics (and don’t tell me kids don’t know the difference, I did!), rather than a “Catholic” school, where they learn to be cliquey elitists (true story of the Catholic schools in my home area!) and nothing of what the Church actually teaches.

 

[Joseph_L_Varga]

Where do you draw the line at where parents can use these vouchers, seeing as you said ALL parents? Catholic Schools? Protestant schools? Fundamentalist Muslim schools?

Bad, bad idea, IMHO. I see what you guys are saying about public schools, but maybe they are that way because every Christian is ducking and running to somewhere that little Johnny won’t have to defend what he believes in.

I think Catholic, Protestant, Jewish and Muslim Schools would be in the mix (perhaps others, too). In fact where I live, 70% of the population is Jewish and they mostly send their children to private Jewish schools because they also need to observe their religious holidays that would be difficult to accommodate in the public school system. I have no problem with Muslim schools as long as they respect the laws of our country and don’t try to raise terrorists or deny women’s rights.

It’s partly about defending little Johnny’s soul from immorality and teaching him good Catholic values. The other part is giving him a better education in the 3 R’s, if the Catholic school is better prepared to do that.

I should say magnet schools within the public system are also very good and a step in the right direction. In New Orleans, there are 2 magnet schools and kids can apply to those schools no matter which part of the city they live in. Those 2 schools are perhaps the best schools in the whole city, given that acceptance to them is competitive. I still don’t see why it would be selfish for a 14-year old who knows that he/she wants to work hard, and go attend an academically demanding school where the classmates will be likeminded people, to do so.

 

[lovemysix]

"4) Home schooling is good for some, but it would not work for us.

I would challenge anyone to really reconsider this statement. Even a single parent who works can home school their child if that is their desire. It comes down to choices. What’s your priority? That may sound harsh, but we are told that where our heart is, is where our treasure will be. Many home schoolers endure very hard sacrifices in order to be able to accomplish their goals. No, it isn’t easy; no, it isn’t free. It is, however, demonstrably better for the children in any home with a loving parent.

No, I did not say that only home school parents love their children. That was meant to say that a “toxic” home might not be the best environment. "

Ghostman,

I have no doubt you are doing a wonderful job with your kids and giving them what you consider to be the best possible educational environment for them But I challenge you to consider that there are parents like me who are totally bored out of our gourds with teaching the 3 Rs to our children (just being honest here—never had ANY desire to be a teacher). And I would NEVER want my children to be taught by somebody who is barely stifling a yawn while at the chalkboard I think we have a very happy home, and one that is not in any way, shape, or form toxic. But I do believe it could become so if we were forced to try to fit into somebody else’s ideas about how a child should be schooled.

I am by no means against homeschooling—most of our friends and family members do it. I see lots of positives, and I see some negatives, just like with any other form of education. Nothing’s perfect in this world. But I do think it’s important for parents to know their strengths, and if patience and an enjoyment of teaching/instructing are not among them, perhaps God is telling them another form of education is best for their family.

I’m not being defensive, just pointing out that some of us truly have considered and RECONSIDERED the statement above. Actually, when I first married, I assumed I would be homeschooling :bigyikes: But it wasn’t too many years into parenting that we prayerfully considered that for the safety of everyone involved (I’m only half-joking! ), we’d need to look into other schooling options.

Some of us actually grew up around homeschooling families, and for us it isn’t a foreign concept at all—however, it’s still quite possible for people like us to discern it’s not an ideal for OUR family.

God bless,
Lauren

 

[rcandap]

I know there are good public school teachers out there, but I don’t think that’s an argument to send kids to public schools when given a choice. That’s not an insult to the good teachers, just acknowledging the reality that public schools are state-run and by and large seriously flawed from a faithful Catholic perspective.

Now, in my opinion that does not mean that all Catholic schools are a great answer. I’ve taught in Catholic schools and one was very secular. Some of the stuff those kids were exposed to–NOT good. I also know of some that are theologically liberal. Another problem I’ve found is that students can become complacent toward religion because it may be presented as an everyday, ho-hum thing, like saying rote prayers before lunch, etc.

That said I am sending my kids to Catholic school after visiting about half the schools in the diocese! And we commute. And if that wasn’t an option, we’d seriously economize and homeschool, as going back to teaching would never be an option. We have to economize pretty seriously for now anyway to cover the tuition.

 

[Beautiful]

We have a very good school system and I feel our children are getting an excellent education, but we worry about protecting our children from this value free culture we have now. But, I have concerns that I just can’t do it. That I will be doing a huge disservice to my children, because I can’t teach them as well. It’s a debate I keep having with myself. I’m praying about it and researching more and we will see what the next school year brings.

I have a good hunch that you can do a very good job teaching your children. I brought my kids through fourth grade and decided that the next best step would be Catholic school until public Jr. High. My sister has brought her oldest of five all of the way up to college level. Her oldest has taken about two years worth of classes at a local reputable private university free of charge. I’m not sure how it works but being home schooled student living within a certain boundary she qualifies to attend for free credit classes….not a bad deal. So my niece is actually 18 and ready for her junior year in college.
Anyway – my sister and I were just average to above average students. With all the resources online and communities of home schoolers around ( and growing in numbers ), I’m sure you can be successful. My children are both honor students and have just about finished 4 and 6 year degrees.
First you and your husband must feel a need and calling to do so. Pray about it.

 

[Cobbfmly]

I would love to have my child in a Catholic school or home schooled.

My daughter has Nonverbal Learning Disability (similar to, if not the same as Asperger’s Syndrome), ADHD and is gifted. We had her in our local Catholic school for 1st grade (preschool and kindergarten was at a Montessori school [yet another story]). The teachers at the school did not know how to handle autistic behavior (i.e. don’t touch an autistic child when they are upset), so she was kicked out of the school at Easter time.

I home schooled her, through the Catholic school, for the rest of the school year. It was the worst experience for both of us. Most days would end up with both of us crying or screaming at each other.

Since 2nd grade she has been in public school (she is now in 8th grade). Through our efforts and those of devoted teachers and staff at the public elementary and middle schools, she has went from being a child that could not make more than a couple of days without behavioral issues that resulted in her going to the office to only a couple of behavioral issues a year that results in her going to the office. For an untrained observer, observing her in the regular education classrooms (she is in a special ed study hall class and special ed math class) she would not come across as being mildly autistic.

She attends catechism at our parish and now attends EDGE. We also talk about our faith extensively with her. She is able to apply her faith to what she hears in school (i.e. evolution vs God’s creation).

I also keep myself informed on my rights as a public school parent and will use them when needed (i.e. opt out of sex education next year).

 

[Cobbfmly]

And Catholic education does so much more with 1/4 the cost.

They can do it for 1/4 the cost because they are not required to education ALL children. They can pick and choose which children to educate. How many Catholic schools have complete programs (education, physical therapy, occupational therapy, speech therapy, etc) for autistic children, developmentally disabled children, severely dyslexic children, deaf children, blind children, wheelchair bound children, etc?

My daughter, who is mildly autistic, was kicked out of Catholic school because the teachers did not know how to handle autistic behavior and they could not afford to send their teachers to training.

 

[Sailor_Kenshin]

Call me selfish then. I will accept it.

Reality says - the government system has thrown so much money at the problems with little to show for it. Now public school parents demanding more money thrown at the problem are selfish and denying competitive choices to everyone.

Amen.

 

[Ame]

I’ll be sending my children to catholic school for sure.

Not because of different views, I’ll be teaching my kids to embrace them, or because of “immortality” as many catholic schools are just as wrong IMO, but because of higher test scores and the fact that their more likely to attend college.

I taught at a Catholic school and I taught at a public school. Let me tell you why the test scores are higher at Catholic school. Believe me, it is not because the education is better, it’s because the parents are more likely to care about education they are paying for. Let’s get real here, if you have enough money to send your kid to Catholic school, you probably have a little something extra about yourself that you are passing along to your kids. Unless you live in a high crime area where it is unsafe to send your kids to public school, you should not believe that Catholic school is “better.” Catholic schools have their own set of problems. Have a little faith in yourself as a parent and stop relying on the schools to give your kids the guidance that only you can truly give.