Getting married outdoors with no ordained minister

[Kelfa28]

A friend recently went through a similar situation. Her son chose to get married outside of the Catholic church and had an outdoor ceremony. The friend attended the wedding, but before the day’s activities began, she went to Mass. She decided if her son was not going to bring God to the wedding ceremony, she would. She received Our Lord in the Blessed Sacrament and carried Him with her in her heart through out the day.

Sometimes, as moms, all we can do is pray for our kids.

Love this!

Perfect idea!

 

[Patavium]

I completely disagree with that approach about “seeing grandkids.” While I know later in the thread you have stated that this is not a form of revenge, refusing to allow people to see their grandkids is a highly emotional and illogical response to an action that is not necessarily “making a big show.” I suppose it depends on the way the non-attendee approaches not attending. If they were to say, “I’m boycotting your wedding, I don’t respect that this couple is a couple, and I am going to make a stink about it to people” then yes, you would have a major respect problem. But if a parent said, “I love you as people and as a couple, but I don’t believe this wedding ceremony will create a valid marriage and therefore I can’t in good conscience attend, smile, clap, cheer, and accept congratulations for something that I believe is not actually occurring. So while I respect your choice to do it this way, I have to stay home that day,” then I believe you would have an obligation to respect their decision, even if it is frustrating. Aren’t we do respect each other’s freedom to follow their conscience?

But what does that have to do with starting a family? I think premarital sex is wrong, but if an unmarried woman has a baby, I acknowledge that she has started a family. Therefore, if an invalidly married couple has children, I would also acknowledge that they have started a family. One doesn’t need the sacrament of marriage to have a family, one needs the sacrament of marriage to be married. The two are not exactly the same thing.

So let’s move on to the day when your child asks you why she doesn’t ever see Grandma. It is a pretty weak answer to say, “well, Grandma didn’t agree with us getting married on the beach and didn’t attend the wedding, so we won’t ever let you see her.” If I were the grandchild, I’d be pretty upset that one disagreement about a wedding would preclude any relationship at all.

Now if Grandma said that she would take any chance she got to teach the grandchildren that the parents were wrong? Or if Grandma didn’t respect you as a person? Or was undermining your relationship with your husband? Then I would understand that need. But if that grandparent is NOT setting out to harm the grandchild (in the form of insulting or undermining or indoctrination etc.), but just couldn’t attend a particular event, then why would there be a need to keep them separate? There isn’t, other than punishment.

Wanting to spend less time with them? Reasonable.
Choosing not to spend tons of money on plane tickets? Understandable.
Actively preventing them from ever seeing their grandchildren? Emotional/Punishment. Actively preventing grandchildren from a connection with the harmless older generation? Big bummer for them and potential for backfire when the kids get old enough to resent it.

I agree with you. I would just go ahead and leave this question there: How can it not be revenge if you are preventing them to see their grandkids presumably for a “long time”?.

 

[bitterhope]

I agree with you. I would just go ahead and leave this question there: How can it not be revenge if you are preventing them to see their grandkids presumably for a “long time”?.

It might be revenge in some circumstances, but usually it is more along the lines of hurting deeply and unable to move past that hurt. It is very difficult to move past hurt and resentment towards forgiveness if the other person is not sorry for what they did to hurt you. If a couple really sees no problem with the choices they make when starting their married life together, boycotting the ceremony will only hurt them and not teach them anything. That pain takes s long time to heal and it may never heal if all parties involved stubbornly stick to their guns.

If someone knowingly hurt me deeply and in no way attempted to reconcile with me (they only continued restating I was the one that’s wrong), I would not feel comfortable bringing my kids around that person. I would worry that they would hurt them as well, or that they would attempt to make my children view me or my spouse negatively, or something like that. Relative or non relative, I would find it difficult to take chances with my kids.

I see no problem choosing not to bring younger children or younger teens to a wedding ceremony. It would not be vengeful not to allow a sibling to participate in the wedding if you felt they were not old enough to handle that. Likewise, the couple may not be seeking revenge but instead be seeking to protect their children from hurt or confusion that visiting relatives who may tell the child the parents never “really” married. Or the couple may simply be deeply hurt as anyone who has had a major life event of theirs boycotted is and doesn’t feel safe placing themselves in the same room with the person/people that hurt them for fear of doing or saying something that would make them look bad in front of their kid. There are many reasons parents could choose to limit or not allow contact with others. Revenge is one reason but only one of many reasons.

 

[theresa]

A friend recently went through a similar situation. Her son chose to get married outside of the Catholic church and had an outdoor ceremony. The friend attended the wedding, but before the day’s activities began, she went to Mass. She decided if her son was not going to bring God to the wedding ceremony, she would. She received Our Lord in the Blessed Sacrament and carried Him with her in her heart through out the day.

Sometimes, as moms, all we can do is pray for our kids.

I love this solution! I might have come up with that on my own, but being in the midst of the busy time before the wedding I might have been too blurry-minded to do this. I will do this. Thanks! Many blessings to all of you who have offered your thoughts and prayers.

 

[ccmcmg]

Well that’s your choice I wish you luck. I have to say though that we do have to answer to people on Earth sometimes though God is important but there are other things that are for me also.

God should always be the most important in our lives. Now, since we are fallen/sinners, that doesn’t always happen. But it is what I strive for. When right or wrong is so clearly spelled out, we should follow it (although, as a sinner, I still fail, often). I have very many important people and things in my life; but when it comes down to it, if I am asked to choose between them, or God, I should/must always choose God. Loving someone doesn’t mean we should condone decisions that are counter to God’s Will. This isn’t something I take lightly, and I don’t see it becoming a lifelong dividing issue. If it does, it will be after much prayer, soul searching with God, and discerning it with our priests. I want what is best for my sister eternally, not just earthly. And that is to follow God’s Will.

Thank you for your post.

It is obviously filled with love without compromise.

This is what our Lord meant when he said “I have come to bring a sword, not peace.” Sometimes there is that sword of division, when we put our Lord on the pedestal. He is the one we answer to.

Thank you so much. I appreciate that. When something I’ve written touches someone like it has you, I know it’s God you are hearing, and I’m so humbled and honored that you could see His Love that way, through me. God bless you.

 

[Dorothy]

ccmcmg,

God bless you too!

 

[SilverLight]

God should always be the most important in our lives. Now, since we are fallen/sinners, that doesn’t always happen. But it is what I strive for. When right or wrong is so clearly spelled out, we should follow it (although, as a sinner, I still fail, often). I have very many important people and things in my life; but when it comes down to it, if I am asked to choose between them, or God, I should/must always choose God. Loving someone doesn’t mean we should condone decisions that are counter to God’s Will. This isn’t something I take lightly, and I don’t see it becoming a lifelong dividing issue. If it does, it will be after much prayer, soul searching with God, and discerning it with our priests. I want what is best for my sister eternally, not just earthly. And that is to follow God’s Will.

Thank you so much. I appreciate that. When something I’ve written touches someone like it has you, I know it’s God you are hearing, and I’m so humbled and honored that you could see His Love that way, through me. God bless you.

I am not telling you not to but I am allowed to live my life the way I see fit. If I am dealing with health issues yes God is important but so is my overall health. Sometimes things can be of equal importance for people and that is fine. I am not telling you how to live your life and I never would.

I have a different way of going about my life as do we all and that is fine I was taught that both God and my family are very important. Not everyone sees things the same way. I’m sorry if that has made you angry or upset its not my intention.

Now good day.

 

[agapewolf]

I am not telling you not to but I am allowed to live my life the way I see fit. If I am dealing with health issues yes God is important but so is my overall health. Sometimes things can be of equal importance for people and that is fine. I am not telling you how to live your life and I never would.

I have a different way of going about my life as do we all and that is fine I was taught that both God and my family are very important. Not everyone sees things the same way. I’m sorry if that has made you angry or upset its not my intention.

Now good day.

First commandment.

 

[SilverLight]

First commandment.

That would be another God but there isn’t another one so I do not see how this is relevant to what I said before sorry.

 

[agapewolf]

That would be another God but there isn’t another one so I do not see how this is relevant to what I said before sorry.

you are putting others equal or above God.

That is making things a “god”. that’s what that commandment means. There are no other “GODS”.

 

[SilverLight]

you are putting others equal or above God.

That is making things a “god”. that’s what that commandment means. There are no other “GODS”.

No I am sorry but I do not believe that is making something a God. A God is an all powerful being and that’s not what family is as an example.

If my family member is about to die I am going to devote as much time as I can to caring for them and making them comfortable. That is my main priority at the time I will of course pray for them but tending to them is also important.

 

[agapewolf]

No I am sorry but I do not believe that is making something a God. A God is an all powerful being and that’s not what family is as an example.

If my family member is about to die I am going to devote as much time as I can to caring for them and making them comfortable. That is my main priority at the time I will of course pray for them but tending to them is also important.

You are completely missing the point.

By tending to your family member, you are caring for the sick, which is a work of mercy. This has NOTHING to do with what I’m talking about.

Go back and read it. You said

Sometimes things can be of equal importance for people and that is fine. …

… I was taught that both God and my family are very important.

They are both important, but God is MORE important, and should be put first. If you put your family as more important than God, you are making the family a god. which is what this commandment means.

This doesn’t mean you don’t tend to a sick family member

 

[SilverLight]

You are completely missing the point.

By tending to your family member, you are caring for the sick, which is a work of mercy. This has NOTHING to do with what I’m talking about.

Go back and read it. You said

They are both important, but God is MORE important, and should be put first. If you put your family as more important than God, you are making the family a god. which is what this commandment means.

This doesn’t mean you don’t tend to a sick family member

Can I see where it says that’s how it is interpreted please? My family is important to me and always will be they saved me from a terrible life. I owe them so much.

Of course I put God first as much as I can.

 

[ccmcmg]

I am not telling you not to but I am allowed to live my life the way I see fit. If I am dealing with health issues yes God is important but so is my overall health. Sometimes things can be of equal importance for people and that is fine. I am not telling you how to live your life and I never would.

I have a different way of going about my life as do we all and that is fine I was taught that both God and my family are very important. Not everyone sees things the same way. I’m sorry if that has made you angry or upset its not my intention.

Now good day.

God has given us that free will, to choose how to live. However, He has also given us His Will to follow. You find those expectations in the Bible and in the Catholic Church. You are welcome to go about your life as you see fit, but as a fellow Catholic, I have to point out that God is supposed to be first. I am not able to put Him first all the time either, but I will not brag about it, or teach others to sin, either. I will not accept sin as ‘okay’. We all make mistakes; we all sin. But we still must strive to do His Will.

No I am sorry but I do not believe that is making something a God. A God is an all powerful being and that’s not what family is as an example.

If my family member is about to die I am going to devote as much time as I can to caring for them and making them comfortable. That is my main priority at the time I will of course pray for them but tending to them is also important.

Do you believe that there is any other God but our God? There is not. God is God. We can create false ‘gods’ in many ways, including in relativism that is so freely being followed in the 21st century, even by people proclaiming to be Catholic. Even putting your family first over God is wrong. If my family asked me to steal, would the police let me go because a loved one asked me to do it? No, they would not. God is First, Last, and Everything in between. In truly putting God first, we will treat our families with love and compassion.

Can I see where it says that’s how it is interpreted please? My family is important to me and always will be they saved me from a terrible life. I owe them so much.

Of course I put God first as much as I can.

Your family should be important, and more important than anything else on this earth…except for God. He is the Great I Am. Our love for our family comes through God, when all is going as it should.

I put God first as much as I can, too. The difference is, I know I’m supposed to be put Him first ALWAYS. Yes, I fail, but I continue to strive to it, as we all should.

 

[jtauke]

What kind of really wonderful young woman shacks up? And conversely why does it surprise or hurt you that your so who is “living in sin” doesn’t want a church wedding?

Another poster was right it isn’t a marriage. But you better go if you ever want to see your grandkids…

Classic. Bad mouth the future daughter-in-law. That’s bound to be productive.

 

[jtauke]

I have to disagree with you about attending the wedding. The OP’s son is doing exactly what I did. My family, God bless them, stuck to their guns and did not attend my wedding. How, as Catholics, can we support a wedding that is not really a wedding?

I will say that it was hard not having my family their, but I knew going in that my choice was putting me in that position. But looking back, I could look to parents and siblings and see how firm they were in their faith by not supporting me in my decision. We must stand firm, otherwise we aren’t doing them any good by condoning what they are doing. And yes, by attending and celebrating we are condoning.

Pray your heart out for your son. I know that is what my parents and siblings did, which eventually brought me back to the church.

I’m sorry you are going through this. Sending prayers

Refusing to attend your child’s wedding is probably a death sentence for the relationship with your kid.

If you’re dead to them, how can you hope to bring them back into the fold?

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Classic. Bad mouth the future daughter-in-law. That’s bound to be productive.

I’m just pointing out that we have no evidence that they are the great people the op said. We do have evidence that they are not faithful Catholics.

For the record I have said she should attend.

 

[jtauke]

I’m just pointing out that we have no evidence that they are the great people the op said. We do have evidence that they are not faithful Catholics.

For the record I have said she should attend.

The implication being that the OP doesn’t know the future daughter-in-law? Or worse, lied to us? What possible reason could there be for that…

Also, I don’t see anywhere in the original post that states the fiance is, or ever was, Catholic. So she stating she’s an unfaithful Catholic doesn’t make much sense.

And perhaps the most important thing. Even “unfaithful” Catholics can still be good people, and I think we as a group should ere on that side of things unless we have actual evidence to the contrary. Unfaithful Catholics are not guilty before proven innocent.

 

[Bonnie]

And perhaps the most important thing. Even “unfaithful” Catholics can still be good people, and I think we as a group should err on that side of things unless we have actual evidence to the contrary. Unfaithful Catholics are not guilty before proven innocent.

Amen to that. Both my children and 3 out of 5 of my husband’s siblings left the Church. Still good people, and my sisters-in-law are (were - 2 are deceased) good Christians. It’s just that they preferred to be Protestant Christians.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

The implication being that the OP doesn’t know the future daughter-in-law? Or worse, lied to us? What possible reason could there be for that…

Also, I don’t see anywhere in the original post that states the fiance is, or ever was, Catholic. So she stating she’s an unfaithful Catholic doesn’t make much sense.

And perhaps the most important thing. Even “unfaithful” Catholics can still be good people, and I think we as a group should ere on that side of things unless we have actual evidence to the contrary. Unfaithful Catholics are not guilty before proven innocent.

I have no idea what you are saying.