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JackieMom
Guest
Well of course I’m not talking about participating in a cheating situation. What I’m saying is - maybe she’s close to over with the current guy. Maybe she’s not even that into him. Maybe she’s been waiting and waiting for “Wanderer” to just ask her out! I was dating a guy when I met my husband. My husband asked me out a couple of times, boldly, “I like you and I want to go out with you.” “I’m better for you than Vince.”) I told him I needed to handle my current relationship first. I broke up with my boyfriend so that I was free to date my current husband. Then, I did date him. I’m glad he was persistent and ballsy because he is SO much more amazing than that other guy : ) All I’m saying is that it’s fine to ask a girl out even if she’s dating someone. If she’s offended and not into it, she’ll say no. She’s certainly not obligated to stay with the first guy, though. If you want a girl and she’s not married you are always free to ask for a date, and it’s her call to accept or decline.It would be creepy even over coffee.
“I’ve been looking at you like this for a while now…”
“And…”
“And I’ve been wondering.”
“What have you been wondering about?”
“If you’re available.”
“Drop it, chev. Every single girl in this town knows… yadda yadda.”
Or, worse:
“What if I am?” (Wiggles and twirls a curl. Upon which you should run for dear life.)
Plus, if a girl’s not a keeper as a friend, she’s not a keep as a girlfriend. (Minor exception when she claims to be a friend while acting as a girlfriend, which is sort of okay when she does actually want to be your girlfriend but not when she actually really wants to remain just friends permanently.)
It’s even more fun when the person who didn’t date all sorts of vaguely not bad people like others did actually does achieve the dream and find someone special.(Not talking about super model look really, though.)
Well, if I had a so called girlfriend (“boy” and “girl” doesn’t sound right for adults), I would be pleased if she went on dates with guys. She could do that of course, but without continuing to be my girlfriend. And I’d probably not be interested in further participation in any capacity anyway barring someone who honestly admitted taking a step too far and asked to take it back, maybe.
+1. Besides, don’t destroy something which is working.
Actually, those are the qualities which make a woman think you’d be great in her friend zone.
I take a different perspective—may the woman make her choice. I suppose your perspective is female-centric, while mine is a little in the opposite direction.
Now as for “no vows”, sure, a promise is not a vow, but I wouldn’t marry a woman whom I couldn’t trust with a blank cheque or with Brad Pitt in a dark locked room (or a gun etc.). I’d be understanding if she wanted to make sure (though I’d rather be told that openly), not close herself to meeting someone better etc., that’s all right if I’m afforded the same rights as she claims for herself in this regard (and I’m a bit skeptical as to how you would feel if the tables turned in your example, to be honest, that is if a man did the, “may the best girl win,” kind of thing), but if she actually broke a promise, even an implied one, the prospect would probably be dead even if she decided she were more interested in me than in the other guy. Friends don’t do such things to friends and I wouldn’t cast my lot with a woman who were not a friend I could depend on.
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Xantippe
Guest
“All I’m saying is that it’s fine to ask a girl out even if she’s dating someone. If she’s offended and not into it, she’ll say no. She’s certainly not obligated to stay with the first guy, though. If you want a girl and she’s not married you are always free to ask for a date, and it’s her call to accept or decline.”
Right. If there were no difference between dating, engagement and marriage, we wouldn’t have three different words for them.
Right. If there were no difference between dating, engagement and marriage, we wouldn’t have three different words for them.
I don’t know where you are from but, where I am from, men and women who are just, do not believe it is right to break up a dating couple (in most circumstances).
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Xantippe
Guest
“I don’t know where you are from but, where I am from, men and women who are just, do not believe it is right to break up a dating couple (in most circumstances).”
I’m American and a mother of three that’s been married for nearly 15 years now.
I think it may be a matter of single vs. married perspective. Here are a few thoughts on this:
I’m American and a mother of three that’s been married for nearly 15 years now.
I think it may be a matter of single vs. married perspective. Here are a few thoughts on this:
- I don’t think it’s possible to “break up a dating couple.” If somebody had tried to move in on me when I was head-over-heels crazy about my future husband, I’m not sure I would have even noticed them trying. I only had eyes for my future husband.
- I don’t believe in dating for a million years before marriage.
- If you want a lifelong commitment from somebody, marry them.
This is a heart issue. You only had eyes for your future husband. I would be dishonorable jus the same to try to break you up. That would be uncharitable and sinful in general circumstances.
I agree!
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Kamaduck
Guest
I believe you. What you’re doing doesn’t seem bad, but you do seem a bit clueless. I suppose you wouldn’t be here if you weren’t.
I think that your unique way of phrasing things is the source of a few of your problems on this thread. As long as you’re respectful and interested in her thoughts and feelings, though, you’re doing fine for now.Anyway, conversation can be hard until you get to know someone. Figuring out likes and dislikes is the best way. You can also ask about any hobbies she might have. Sometimes just asking what she’s doing or how she is will lead to a conversation.
There’s no rush… Just keep learning about her and getting comfortable in conversation. You’ll be OK.Actually, I was in the process of doing just this morning! HAHA! Yay!
Stay strong! :knight2:
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JackieMom
Guest
How can someone “break up a dating couple?” If both parties in the dating relationship are happy and satisfied, then they simply do not date other people, even if there is a line of men or women waiting in the wings.
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JackieMom
Guest
On top of that, asking for one or two dates is not “trying to break up a couple.” It’s honestly showing interest in an unmarried person.
The man or woman who desires to break up the couple is at fault.
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chevalier
Guest
Oh, okay, I’m sorry for being on the defensive. You see, in some of these threads we sometimes run into opinions like everything goes before the wedding or engagement (or at least opinions sounding that way), hence I’m perhaps oversensitive to such things.
Only regarding your last sentence, I’d probably not want to date a girl who would be ready to accept without breaking up with her boyfriend first. Actually, scratch probably. I’d have a coffee and a talk with her, I wouldn’t hold myself back from e.g. getting her a bunch of roses, but I wouldn’t be kissed by someone who had a boyfriend at the time. Or even “dated” strictly speaking (like really using the word or engaging in some romantic PDA). This is totally different from how I’d have acted several years ago.
I’d see it more as a charity issue than a justice issue but at any rate one should not do so without prudence or in violation of a promise given to another. When we co-operate in breaking a promise our new date had previously made to somebody else we:
- lead our date to a breach of promise (which is not morally neutral at all, violating a promise is generally morally negative in itself barring an overriding cause);
- ourselves become accomplices in the act of breaking a promise (we aren’t clean just because we didn’t do the breaking–we cannot disown the act).
The difficulty here is caused by the sympathetic portrayal of “poachers” in literature and films, largely in connection with portraying the “cuckold” as an antipathetic individual and/or himself to blame for what happens to him (failure to spot, react etc. because it’s funny how people suffer for their naïvete or ineptness or lack of awareness/mental quickness).
An easy test is to turn the table and put a woman in the man’s situation, since in our culture we’re inclined to protect women and empathise with them more and paying them more respect. If something would be repulsive when done by a man to a woman, there’s a good chance that it would also be less than fair the other way round.
I would say not if he merely declares himself to be interested and willing but refrains from doing anything to harm the relationship between the two. Working to gain the woman’s favour would be a tougher nut to crack but if he had good reasons and never directly sabotaged the existing relationship, I guess he could escape blame.
BUT you don’t want to cause a break-up for a girl who’s with a good guy, and you don’t really want to date a girl who insists on staying with a bluebird or shows some other co-dependent, self-destructive etc. patterns, either.
It’s possible. That’s what flatterers and other wormtongues do, and sometimes good people have to. A wormtongue can manipulate his way like a wedge in between the couple under the guise of friendship or platonic affection or whatever, pushing the boundaries slowly while sowing dissent. Not everybody has the resilience to be immune to that. Even outright seduction sometimes works. This is similar to how cheating in marriage comes about and similarly involves human weakness.
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Xantippe
Guest
“When we co-operate in breaking a promise our new date had previously made to somebody else…”
There may not be any promises at all, beyond “I’ll see you Friday night at 8”.
There may not be any promises at all, beyond “I’ll see you Friday night at 8”.
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nodito
Guest
Yeah, I’m of the opinion that you’re not breaking anyone up or stealing someone’s girlfriend if you ask a girl out on a date. She can say no. There’s no rule that says dating has to be exclusive, unless they’ve agreed to that, in which case, the girl will turn you down anyway.
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Lost_Wanderer
Guest
As expected, you are one of those people.
Like them, you seem to have a thing against men having no romantic interest in women who are more on the noise and a lot less on the nice.Sorry ma’am but it’s a dove I’m looking for and it’s a dove I’m going to get!
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Lost_Wanderer
Guest
In my country, dating IS exclusive. By default. No need for agreements when society draws them out for you already. Besides, if a guy like me is really free to date a lot of women, that would make for an occasion of sin because he’ll look like a playboy (or in our slang “chik boy”).
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Lost_Wanderer
Guest
Oh I’d love to… if my CEO wasn’t such a compulsive gambler and putting on the pressure every time the limit goes up (but that’s another story). T_T
Fair point. I’ll look out for this. (Though I’m kinda also applying the whole ‘positive-thinking-Law-of-Attraction’ mindset just to be safe.) She’s really nice whenever I talk to her.
Whoa, thanks! This really helps me outline my own strategy. I won’t reveal much she gave me a definite time when she’ll be more free (hopefully, I won’t read too much into that
).P.S.
You know, if that were the case, I have ways of finding out just that from being a friend. I may not have dated at all but I am quite sharp when I know something is off. It’s how I learned of my own parents’ marriage problems before a lot of people and before anyone even talked to me of their own suspicions. It’s how I learn that I’m not alone in disliking some people in my life. Finally, it’s how I give a less emotionally charged perspective on relationships.
People think my head’s always lost in space but that’s only cuz I take in so much info all around me (without even ‘thinking’) and I’m like an semi-old PC taking time to process what it can.
So if the girl I’m after really does have that kind of situation. I would know soon enough once I become a good friend.
I just wish I could find the maximum speed to getting there without breaking the speed limit.
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JackieMom
Guest
Be bold, Lost Wanderer. Be bold, but take the hint if she isn’t enthusiasticOh I’d love to… if my CEO wasn’t such a compulsive gambler and putting on the pressure every time the limit goes up (but that’s another story). T_T
Fair point. I’ll look out for this. (Though I’m kinda also applying the whole ‘positive-thinking-Law-of-Attraction’ mindset just to be safe.) She’s really nice whenever I talk to her.
Whoa, thanks! This really helps me outline my own strategy. I won’t reveal much she gave me a definite time when she’ll be more free (hopefully, I won’t read too much into that
P.S.
You know, if that were the case, I have ways of finding out just that from being a friend. I may not have dated at all but I am quite sharp when I know something is off. It’s how I learned of my own parents’ marriage problems before a lot of people and before anyone even talked to me of their own suspicions. It’s how I learn that I’m not alone in disliking some people in my life. Finally, it’s how I give a less emotionally charged perspective on relationships.
People think my head’s always lost in space but that’s only cuz I take in so much info all around me (without even ‘thinking’) and I’m like an semi-old PC taking time to process what it can.
So if the girl I’m after really does have that kind of situation. I would know soon enough once I become a good friend.
I just wish I could find the maximum speed to getting there without breaking the speed limit.
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Crescentinus
Guest
You have two options.
- Ask her out
- Regret the fact that you had not asked her out
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Phil_Marinus
Guest
You sound as though you are myself at age 14 at high school… he said that she said, and that they thought maybe she looked at me…
thats life… just go about your life and just try to improve what you can with your own life… I know that wont work because thats what I tell my 17 year old step daughter…
and she say’s… what would you know about life phil…
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chevalier
Guest
Nope. There’s no relationship when it simply comes down to, “I’ll see you Friday night at 8”. We were explicitly talking about relationships. I’m sorry but your argument is invalid in this light.
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