Girl Scouts under scrutiny from Catholic bishops

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Today, my current copy of America arrived, the excellent journal of the Jesuits. Two articles caught my special attention.
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1. Catholics in the USA favor same-sex marriage by a significant higher percentage (was it 57% in favor?) than the rest of the population. This amazes me.

2. The number of Catholics in the USA has dropped by 5% since 2000, despite a huge increase of Latinos over recent decades.  Catholics now number 59.9 million, or slightly under 20% of the national population. Thousands of Catholic schools have closed, about 30,000,000 have deserted the church, and all sorts of other problems exist, from a continuing sexual crisis to new reports of shananagins in the Vatican.

  Yet, some people waste their time bitterly attacking devoted nuns, one political party, the Girl Scouts, the Masons, and a host of other targets.

   It seems to me that this strategy isn't working. Maybe Catholicism should put forth its kinder, more campassionate face and exude less arrogance and sit less in judgment.
 
Roy5 said:
Today, my current copy of America arrived, the excellent journal of the Jesuits. Two articles caught my special attention.
Code: 
1. Catholics in the USA favor same-sex marriage by a significant higher percentage (was it 57% in favor?) than the rest of the population. This amazes me.

2. The number of Catholics in the USA has dropped by 5% since 2000, despite a huge increase of Latinos over recent decades.  Catholics now number 59.9 million, or slightly under 20% of the national population. Thousands of Catholic schools have closed, about 30,000,000 have deserted the church, and all sorts of other problems exist, from a continuing sexual crisis to new reports of shananagins in the Vatican.

  Yet, some people waste their time bitterly attacking devoted nuns, one political party, the Girl Scouts, the Masons, and a host of other targets.

   It seems to me that this strategy isn't working. Maybe Catholicism should put forth its kinder, more campassionate face and exude less arrogance and sit less in judgment.
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As a sometimes necessary corrective to America magazine, I offer:

Catholic World Report
catholicworldreport.com/

and First Things
firstthings.com/?index=current
 
rlg94086 said:
That’s not the same or even similar argument. 🤷
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Why? In both cases we are dealing with optional material, not core scouting material. Both offer information contrary to the Catholic faith. These are the similarities. These are also the things the Girl Scouts are being accused of. Am I missing something?
 
gilliam said:
NEW YORK Long a lightning rod for conservative criticism, the Girl Scouts of the USA are now facing their highest-level challenge yet: An official inquiry by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops.

At issue are concerns about program materials that some Catholics find offensive, as well as assertions that the Scouts associate with other groups espousing stances that conflict with church teaching. The Scouts, who have numerous parish-sponsored troops, deny many of the claims and defend their alliances.

The inquiry coincides with the Scouts’ 100th anniversary celebrations and follows a chain of other controversies.

Earlier this year, legislators in Indiana and Alaska publicly called the Scouts into question, and the organization was berated in a series aired by a Catholic broadcast network. Last year, the Scouts angered some conservatives by accepting into a Colorado troop a 7-year-old transgender child who was born a boy but was being raised as a girl.

Read more here: charlotteobserver.com/2012/05/10/3231745/girl-scouts-under-scrutiny-from.html#storylink=cpy

The new inquiry will be conducted by the bishops’ Committee on Laity, Marriage, Family Life and Youth. It will look into the Scouts’ “possible problematic relationships with other organizations” and various “problematic” program materials, according to a letter sent by the committee chairman, Bishop Kevin Rhoades of Fort Wayne, Ind., to his fellow bishops.

The bishops’ conference provided a copy of the letter to The Associated Press, but otherwise declined comment.

Read more here: charlotteobserver.com/2012/05/10/3231745/girl-scouts-under-scrutiny-from.html#storylink=cpy
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Thanks for the links!🙂
 
American Catholics have to avoid the trap of expecting everything in society to conform to traditional Caholicism. The Girl Scouts and Boys Scouts, for example, attract girls and boys of many different faiths. That makes it possible to ‘accuse’ them of promoting the Koran or whatever, but to do this is to warp the truth.
Why do so many Catholics, at least here on CAF, seem to be infected with a small or large dose of paranoia? Catholicism has done very well in the USA. The majority on the Supreme Court now are Catholic - for example - while there used to be one 'Catholic seat' there. There is serious danger that Catholicism will shoot itself in the foot (or head?) if people like Bill Donohue serve as an example. I saw him this weekend on EWTN's "World Over" and he reminded me of Trump - loud and irresponsible.
 
Roy5 said:
American Catholics have to avoid the trap of expecting everything in society to conform to traditional Caholicism. The Girl Scouts and Boys Scouts, for example, attract girls and boys of many different faiths. That makes it possible to ‘accuse’ them of promoting the Koran or whatever, but to do this is to warp the truth.
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 Why do so many Catholics, at least here on CAF, seem to be infected with a small or large dose of paranoia? Catholicism has done very well in the USA. The majority on the Supreme Court now are Catholic - for example - while there used to be one 'Catholic seat' there. There is serious danger that Catholicism will shoot itself in the foot (or head?) if people like Bill Donohue serve as an example. I saw him this weekend on EWTN's "World Over" and he reminded me of Trump - loud and irresponsible.
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I have heard reported that the second largest religious group in America, after Catholics, are ex-Catholics. That says something.
 
pnewton said:
Why? In both cases we are dealing with optional material, not core scouting material. Both offer information contrary to the Catholic faith. These are the similarities. These are also the things the Girl Scouts are being accused of. Am I missing something?
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If you review my previous post, you will see that the awards you mentioned are not part of Scouting, nor are they given or managed by the BSA, but by outside organizations.

The same cannot be said for the problematic Journey books. Those are produced and published by GSUSA itself and are part of the advancement.

A girl entering Girl Scouts cannot get to Gold rank without going throught the Journey program. Can you honestly state that a new Tiger Cub cannot get to Eagle rank without having to study the Koran?
 
Brendan said:
A girl entering Girl Scouts cannot get to Gold rank without going throught the Journey program. Can you honestly state that a new Tiger Cub cannot get to Eagle rank without having to study the Koran?
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Yes, just like a Girls Scout can advance without reading “Simply Maria” or any pro-abortion material. The publishing issue is a legitimate difference. Do you think if the GSA allowed a different group to publish their materials and did not directly publish it this would be better?

Yes, I have read your posts am familiar with the two arguments that keep popping up. I find the “Simply Maria” connection tenuous guilt by association and the PP connection possible, but only a reflection of individuals, not a GSA policy. The one thing I have seen only once that I might consider serious is whether they promote a secular spiritualism, in the way that Masons do officially and AA does often on an individual level.

I am glad it is being examined by a bishop and await that result.
 
pnewton said:
Why? In both cases we are dealing with optional material, not core scouting material. Both offer information contrary to the Catholic faith. These are the similarities. These are also the things the Girl Scouts are being accused of. Am I missing something?
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Brendan said:
If you review my previous post, you will see that the awards you mentioned are not part of Scouting, nor are they given or managed by the BSA, but by outside organizations.

The same cannot be said for the problematic Journey books. Those are produced and published by GSUSA itself and are part of the advancement.

A girl entering Girl Scouts cannot get to Gold rank without going throught the Journey program. Can you honestly state that a new Tiger Cub cannot get to Eagle rank without having to study the Koran?
Click to expand...
pnewton said:
Yes, just like a Girls Scout can advance without reading “Simply Maria” or any pro-abortion material. The publishing issue is a legitimate difference. Do you think if the GSA allowed a different group to publish their materials and did not directly publish it this would be better?

Yes, I have read your posts am familiar with the two arguments that keep popping up. I find the “Simply Maria” connection tenuous guilt by association and the PP connection possible, but only a reflection of individuals, not a GSA policy. The one thing I have seen only once that I might consider serious is whether they promote a secular spiritualism, in the way that Masons do officially and AA does often on an individual level.

I am glad it is being examined by a bishop and await that result.
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The fact that “Simply Maria” is GSA published material and recommended reading, make it a completely different situation than the Koran. Only Muslim scouts interested in completing their religious emblems and satisfying faith requirements would be exposed to the Koran. I dont have any particular problems with Muslims reading the Koran. 😛

It is certainly more than “guilt by association,” when you publish and recommend something. You seem to be going out of your way to dismiss legitimate concerns.
 
rlg94086 said:
It is certainly more than “guilt by association,” when you publish and recommend something. You seem to be going out of your way to dismiss legitimate concerns.
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No, I just do not agree. It was a book review. It was not a statement of policy. Also, I do not dismiss any concern. I just do not accept it and will not pre-judge. I have noticed all the internet materials are cut and pasted from the same sources and recycled. An investigation needs to be impartial and open-minded least it become a witch hunt.
 
My Goddaughter this year will ask me to buy her Girl Scout cookies. Have the bishops responded to their inquiry?
 
gilliam said:
NEW YORK Long a lightning rod for conservative criticism, the Girl Scouts of the USA are now facing their highest-level challenge yet: An official inquiry by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops.

At issue are concerns about program materials that some Catholics find offensive, as well as assertions that the Scouts associate with other groups espousing stances that conflict with church teaching. The Scouts, who have numerous parish-sponsored troops, deny many of the claims and defend their alliances.

The inquiry coincides with the Scouts’ 100th anniversary celebrations and follows a chain of other controversies.

Earlier this year, legislators in Indiana and Alaska publicly called the Scouts into question, and the organization was berated in a series aired by a Catholic broadcast network. Last year, the Scouts angered some conservatives by accepting into a Colorado troop a 7-year-old transgender child who was born a boy but was being raised as a girl.

Read more here: charlotteobserver.com/2012/05/10/3231745/girl-scouts-under-scrutiny-from.html#storylink=cpy

The new inquiry will be conducted by the bishops’ Committee on Laity, Marriage, Family Life and Youth. It will look into the Scouts’ “possible problematic relationships with other organizations” and various “problematic” program materials, according to a letter sent by the committee chairman, Bishop Kevin Rhoades of Fort Wayne, Ind., to his fellow bishops.

The bishops’ conference provided a copy of the letter to The Associated Press, but otherwise declined comment.

Read more here: charlotteobserver.com/2012/05/10/3231745/girl-scouts-under-scrutiny-from.html#storylink=cpy
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I’m glad they are investigating this.
 
Tigg said:
I feel I’m in the twilight zone at times. On Saturdays, I stand in front of PP with a sign that reads, “abortion kills children.” (Sometimes our very own pastor joins us.) Then, the very next day I enter my church and there in the narthex are the GS selling their cookies. I understand a portion of these proceeds go to the national level - the very ones complicit in the undermining of church teaching.

I’m with Abby Johnson when she asks, “is the Catholic Church truly pro-life or not?”
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:highprayer::gopray2::signofcross::
 
TowardTruth said:
My Goddaughter this year will ask me to buy her Girl Scout cookies. Have the bishops responded to their inquiry?
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I’d like to know that too. But I almost feel bad posting in that this awful headline shows up again.

On post #20 and #23 of this thread (not knowing the rules then) I was asking CAF to consider changing this (rather misleading and suspicious sounding) headline to something that referenced its the GSAs grown up leadership and aspects that contradict Catholic teaching (sometimes on parish grounds or with Catholic troops) that is under scrutiny.

*Regarding how important headlines are in perception - and how misleading they can be (like this one) - I repasted this initial article (the one in post one no longer works) below. Note how different the story is from the headline.
*

Here is a pretty fairly written and interesting article with a horribly misleading headline IMO - still being discussed on this site.

news.yahoo.com/girl-scouts-under-scrutiny-catholic-bishops-181843252.html

If one reads JUST the headline (and some will) … there’s almost less clarity about what is going on than not knowing anything. Similar to my observations per the Dublin March … here are some of possible launch points a reader might proceed from the Girl Scout/Bishops headline:

– “Why are the Bishops scrutinizing Girl Scouts of all people?” :confused:🤷

Here is where the half-truth headline would have been better clarified with, say:

Bishops Scrutinize Girl Scout Leadership
ties to Abortion Clinics, Radical Groups – closer to the truth yet but an aspect of the story.

Leadership would be grown ups. Dubious ties (that contradict church teaching) is what is really being scrutinized.

Or is that “too far the other way”? In that the scrutiny is not a conclusion yet … and a headline making such possible links public works to the end that some will pull their
kids out of the group while the issue is in doubt.

Bishops To Meet With Girl Scout Leaders,
Discuss Sex Ed. materals on Parish Grounds

This one would be so neutral as to play it as not a controversy, but a common plan!

Writing headlines is not easy. It is important. It can be misleading. Deliberately so or accidentally. And it’s something that, as a journalist, I notice and want to call people’s attention to.

As this threads’ headline lent itself perfectly to a radical recasting of the whole event with just a little change … I didn’t think pondering the headline was off-topic, but very germane.

:hmmm:

Meanwhile, like Toward Truth here, I’ll be on the lookout for what has been done on this since June.

This isn’t “new” technically but was “new” to me and on topic (from the National Catholic Register) – with a “neutral” … because it’s a question … yet direction-giving headline (because of what the “question” asks). In the SUBHEADLINE … boys as girls?! :eek::confused:

ncregister.com/daily-news/is-the-girl-scouts-safe-for-catholic-girls-part-2

Some complaints about the Girl Scouts from ex-member girl and her mom on YouTube
that speak to why the “scrutiny” might be happening per the Church and its affiliation with the group.

youtube.com/watch?v=qqxLIcmmTZQ&feature=player_embedded#t=510s (there are three parts, this is part 1)

And a news story on that series (for background).

theblaze.com/stories/2012/07/13/shocking-anti-girl-scouts-video-series-exposes-alleged-ties-to-leftist-groups/
 
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