Girls as Altar Servers

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Brendan said:
But even then, the priest never left the sanctuary, and the girls never entered it.
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That is my understanding as well.

AFAIK, the only exceptions to this were the members of a wedding party.
 
I find all the talk of altar boys discerning the priesthood amusing.

When I was in school, the boys would clamor to become altar servers because it meant they would be asked to serve at funerals during the week and get out of class.

They also usually got about $15-$20 for doing a funeral or a wedding.

It had nothing to do with the priesthood.
 
PhiloMed said:
When I was in school, the boys would clamor to become altar servers because it meant they would be asked to serve at funerals during the week and get out of class.
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True, but it took extensive training after school to have to serve at a Solemn High Funeral Mass as well. That in itself was part of an educational process.

And that didn’t mean getting out of homework assignments and tests.
 
PhiloMed said:
I find all the talk of altar boys discerning the priesthood amusing.

It had nothing to do with the priesthood.
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Correct, not every boy is given a call to the priesthood. Only God can issue the call. What behoves a pastor is to create an environment for boys and young men to be fertile ground for that seed to fall upon.

And since the priest cannot know which boy will actually receive the call, would it not be prudent for a pastor to look at making that soil fertile in as many boys as possible

That is what the Vatican meant when it issued the following statement
Indeed, the obligation to support groups of altar boys will always remain, not least of all due to the well known assistance that such programs have provided since time immemorial in encouraging future priestly vocations
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I will presume that you do not disagree with the Vatican’s assessment of the impact of altar service fostering priestly vocations.
 
Brendan said:
Correct, not every boy is given a call to the priesthood. Only God can issue the call. What behoves a pastor is to create an environment for boys and young men to be fertile ground for that seed to fall upon.

And since the priest cannot know which boy will actually receive the call, would it not be prudent for a pastor to look at making that soil fertile in as many boys as possible

That is what the Vatican meant when it issued the following statement

I will presume that you do not disagree with the Vatican’s assessment of the impact of altar service fostering priestly vocations.
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I simply meant that the theme of the thread was giving me a chuckle when reflecting on my classmates. None of them became priests, but they always had new sports equipment 🙂
 
Since the Church permits girls to become altar servers, I accept it. When my parish began to allow altar girls, I was in high school. I wasn’t too crazy about the change and made a comment about it. A few of the old ladies (Well, they looked “old” to me. They were probably only in their 60s, but they looked like they were in their 80s back then.) in the parish choir I belonged to, jumped all me. They made it into something political… equal rights for girls and women. I was told that I should be ashamed for not being happy that girls finally had the right to be an altar server rather than just leaving it to the boys. I should support changing the Church from a male-dominant hierarchy. I did not respond and let them have their say because I was raised to be respectful to my elders. In addition, we were in the church for choir practice and it wasn’t the place for raised voices and such, but their reasons didn’t seem to be the right reasons to have altar girls.

The change in our parish was fairly quick. To give you an idea, only boys from 3rd to 8th grades served the parish. In my 8th grade class of 80 kids with about 30 boys, almost all of the boys were altar servers. (This was before the change.) It was very healthy in terms of the number of altar boys. After the change, the parish went from having numerous altar boys for every mass on the weekend, to mostly all altar girls for every mass. Were the boys scared away by the girls? Maybe. Maybe not. It might have been the way it was implemented in the parish. Perhaps those who implemented it had similar beliefs with the old choir ladies who berated me. The political and feminist outlook on it could have chased the boys away, making them feel unwelcomed and unwanted.

Today, at one of the parishes where I work, the number of female to male altar servers are about equal and they seem to have a more healthy outlook on it rather than the idea of giving girls equal rights to boys and getting rid of male-dominated church hierarchy. A lot of times siblings will serve together.
 
PhiloMed said:
I find all the talk of altar boys discerning the priesthood amusing.

When I was in school, the boys would clamor to become altar servers because it meant they would be asked to serve at funerals during the week and get out of class.

They also usually got about $15-$20 for doing a funeral or a wedding.

It had nothing to do with the priesthood.
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Haha yes I remember this too though I only recall doing a handful of them. Never remembered being paid but at any rate I still thought (think) of the priesthood.
 
GPGT said:
Haha yes I remember this too though I only recall doing a handful of them. Never remembered being paid but at any rate I still thought (think) of the priesthood.
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I remember getting paid for weddings, never funerals.

Being on funeral duty was not a task that we looked forward too. The way it worked in our parish was the altar boy team that was assigned to 7:00 Mass that week was also the ones who had to work any funerals that came up that week.

Yes, it meant that you got out of class for a few hours, but it also meant that you had to be up and at the parish by 6:30am all that week.
 
Brendan said:
Yes, it meant that you got out of class for a few hours, but it also meant that you had to be up and at the parish by 6:30am all that week.
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Here too. And that was the nuns’ Mass to boot. :signofcross:
 
ProVobis said:
Here too. And that was the nuns’ Mass to boot. :signofcross:
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Yep 🙂

And since funerals were known about at least a day in advance ( usually 2), it’s not like we got out of any tests. In fact, we were generally given any assignments and homework ahead of time and still expected to have them done.
 
For all of those who say that it would be good to have only boys as altar serves because it will encourage them to become priests, can you back that up? This point assumes that boys who were altar servers are more likely to become priests than boys who weren’t, but does anyone have statistics to prove that? If no one actually knows, then the point is invalid.

Other other most common argument on this thread, “boys won’t do things that girls do,” is also invalid simply because of how blatantly silly it is. Would a boy refuse to join the soccer team if he knew that his school also had a girls’ soccer team? Would a boy refuse to be in the school play because he knows that girls will also be participating? Would a boy give up his dreams of becoming doctors simply because he found out that there are also female doctors? The theory is silly and unreasonable in every other aspect of life and it is silly and unreasonable here.
 
While I agree with you overall, I do have to say with school sports, many boys I knew growing up never liked the idea of girls playing on the team WITH them. They didn’t care if there was a separate team for the girls or if they were playing at home or in gym class, but whenever the idea of putting boys and girls together on the same school soccer team came up, for example, there would be a lot of pushback mostly from the boys and their parents.

I have no idea if people are thinking the same thing when it comes to altar servers. I think every parish is different with the dynamic of how those things work out. For the one parish I work for the number of girl and boy servers are fairly equal and they seem to have a healthy way of looking at it. I see no problems there. In the parish where I grew up, there was an obvious drop of participation in the boys serving once the girls were allowed in. I think part of it was due to what I mentioned in my earlier post - a lot of politicizing and making it into a feminist and equal rights issue. The boys probably felt the disdain some of these people had (I know I felt it from those older women who berated me and I am a female) and no longer wanted to be a part of it when in the past it was very healthy in terms of many boys in the grade school participating as an altar server.
 
Gia_B said:
For all of those who say that it would be good to have only boys as altar serves because it will encourage them to become priests, can you back that up? This point assumes that boys who were altar servers are more likely to become priests than boys who weren’t, but does anyone have statistics to prove that? If no one actually knows, then the point is invalid…
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The Vatican says that there is a connection, and I would consider them to be the best source of information on priestly vocations
Indeed, the obligation to support groups of altar boys will always remain, not least of all due to the well known assistance that such programs have provided since time immemorial in encouraging future priestly vocations
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adoremus.org/CDW-AltarServers.html

This statement was part of the Vatican document that allowed altar girls in the first place

This is, of course, not a requirement that altar girls be prohibited, (the whole point of the document was the opposite).

What it DOES mean is that each parish has a Vatican directed obligation "to support groups of altar boys "

The question then becomes, how well are parishes fulfilling that obligation?
 
I find the part about keeping the girls separate from the sanctuary just stupid. If you are going to allow them to serve then they should be allowed the same places as the boy altar servers. Otherwise do it yourself… If a priest only wants male altar servers…then fine but they should deal with it if there are none…not create a half way of allowing the girls to do part.
 
Annabelle_Marie said:
I find the part about keeping the girls separate from the sanctuary just stupid. .
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I suppose you can take it up with Pope St. Pius X when you get to Heaven. If you have any questions, he can probably explain it to you…
 
Brendan said:
I suppose you can take it up with Pope St. Pius X when you get to Heaven. If you have any questions, he can probably explain it to you…
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Assuming he was right? Just because he was Pope doesn’t make him infallible on everything.

This is an aside from having girl altar servers. If you don’t want them fine…but to half way allow them is just dumb. I have not heard a good theological argument for allowing them to serve but not enter the sanctuary…
 
Annabelle_Marie said:
Assuming he was right? Just because he was Pope doesn’t make him infallible on everything.

This is an aside from having girl altar servers. If you don’t want them fine…but to half way allow them is just dumb. I have not heard a good theological argument for allowing them to serve but not enter the sanctuary…
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I think quite the reverse. The reason why girls can’t serve is because they cannot receive an ordination - the entire point of an ordination is that it’s an undeserved conferral to serve God, which reflects the celestial hierarchy on Earth (i.e. 9 ranks of ordination). Sadly, in the post-conciliar era of the Latin Church the concept of [minor] ordinations is lost, as is deeper value of ordinations. I would argue that because minor ordinations have been discontinued not even male servers should enter the sanctuary. It’s not the gender that matters but rather the fact that they’re assuming something that isn’t theirs for the service of God (i.e. ordination is a divinely sanctioned call to service). Comparable to when Aaron’s sons offer unauthorized fire and are smote for it.
 
Annabelle_Marie said:
I find the part about keeping the girls separate from the sanctuary just stupid. If you are going to allow them to serve then they should be allowed the same places as the boy altar servers. Otherwise do it yourself… If a priest only wants male altar servers…then fine but they should deal with it if there are none…not create a half way of allowing the girls to do part.
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This wasn’t done at the parish I went to. There were two girl altar servers, and they assisted Father just as a boy altar server would. He didn’t see a problem with it. He was so happy to see young men and women wanting to participate that gender didn’t faze him.
 
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