"Gnashing of Teeth"

[dang71]

It quickly became apparent that I should definitely not under any circumstances engage in discussion with these wailers, for their minds are not open to truth, not even to defend the persons whom I saw being chewed up like raw meat. In God’s way, He will bring them this message and anoint their spirits with wisdom.

Joysong,
i was involved in a contentious discussion in which you came to my aid, and i was very thankful for the support. i think maybe you could still give support to those being 'thrashed", but not engage the “thrashers”. a bit of a thin line, but coming to the aid of those in need (as you have done on many occasions) is certainly a worthwhile practice. maybe that aid could come in the form of private messages, if possible, so as not to engage the “wailers”.

i do find it interesting how easy it is to get dragged down by the “wailers”, and think your discernment to avoid engaging them is quite wise. hopefully i can learn from this also

God bless,
D

 

[Joysong]

Good morning, Dang, good to see you again!

I will truly take your words under my wing and ask God to give me discernment as to the best way to offer support without getting my fleece torn in the process. Maybe torn fleece isn’t so bad if the sheep is saved through it. Funny, but being a woman, I don’t see myself as a shepherd, but I do care very much when I see others in situations of peril. No, I cannot simply stand by, to be honest.

It has given me much joy in the Lord to see that you received aid from my efforts. Thank you for sharing, Dang.

Carole

 

[beckycmarie]

Hi Dang,

It is good to have backup, but one thing I’m learning from this thread is when to walk away, responding with silence. Sometimes it is best just to put the person on ignore rather than to engage in a fruitless debate.

I think of the example Christ set when he was silent in the face of accusations. I also think of Proverbs 26:4 -

“Answer not the fool according to his folly, lest you too become like him.”

 

[Joysong]

As a young boy walked the beach at dawn, he noticed an old man ahead of him picking up starfish and tossing them into the sea. Catching up with the man, the boy asked why he was doing this. The old man explained to the boy that the stranded starfish would die if left in the morning sun.

“But the beach goes on for miles and there are millions of starfish,” exclaimed the boy. “How can your effort make any difference?”

The old man looked at the starfish in his hand and then threw it safely into the waves. He turned to the boy and said, “It made a difference to that one.”

Dang, you are that starfish, I believe.

Becky, Your point about Jesus remaining silent in his hour of trial is a good one to keep in mind. There were other times when He was very vocal with some of His accusers. I suppose the bottom line is the old proverbial “knowing when to hold 'em and when to fold 'em.” Too often, I have discovered that jumping into the fray with certain folks has been for naught and I paid a spiritual price in losing peace and lots of sleep.

But if we let the Lord lead us and are certain He is behind the inspiration, like Sunday’s first reading teaches about God’s word, *“It will not return to Me void, but achieve the end for which I sent it.” *

 

[ncjohn]

Ridgerunner, I wouldn’t condemn you in any way for what you do. Quite frankly there are indeed times to pick up the sword and times that the debate must be engaged. I think Joysong and I both fully recognize this. I think we’re addressing more those who seem to delight in humiliating others.

To me at least, what counts is one’s intent when doing so and the manner in which it is done. One truly intending the good of the one being engaged will usually engage them in a manner that will address the issue without condemning the person, or even seeming to condemn the person.

It is not the debate that is the gnashing of teeth. It is the joy with which so many engage the debate for the person of “winning” and bringing the other side into submission rather than truly lifting them up. There are indeed times when “tough love” is called for, but one has to know that they are called to it AND that they have the credibility with the person being addressed that they will be able to receive it. In some ways it becomes like the requirements for “just war”. There must be a reasonable expectation of success and a minimizing of collateral damage.

Of course all of us have our failures in this. We all have our times when the frustrations lead us to sarcasm and less than fruitful tactics. That is one of the tests I use myself for knowing when my ego has taken over and I need to withdraw, though even then I sometimes overstay my welcome and just can’t turn loose of things, like a dog with the smell of raw meat.

It can be overcome though also, Ridgerunner. I was a very argumentative person for years and the “armchair lawyer” in me loved to debate just for the thrill of making myself look smart and someone else crumble before me. It took some good humiliations of my own to even consider the harm I was doing to others.

The one other test I will often use is to re-read something I’ve written and ask how I would feel if someone said it to my wife or one of my children. It’s amazing how quickly one will alter the tone of something in that context.

Peace be with you!

 

[Joysong]

Well said, John. :clapping: All of it!

 

[Joysong]

For some reason, this true story that I saw on TV Sunday night has stuck with me and maybe it’s meant to be shared.

In the southern states, cotton was the main industry for this region for many, many years. Suddenly, there appeared a little insect called a Boll Weevil that was slowing spreading, devastating the crops and bringing the plantations to a severe halt. Nothing the owners tried was able to rid the plants of the insect, and things had reached panic state.

One perceptive person suggested that they “let it go” and plant peanuts instead. The boll weevil did not like peanuts and wouldn’t go near them. So the cotton plantations were replaced with crops of peanuts, and the area flourished with more abundant income and growth than ever before. Each time I drive through Georgia, I find signs for pecans on the highway, and of course the recent outbreak of peanut butter ecoli came from the peanut factories in Georgia.

The point I heard on Sunday was to believe that in the face of certain ruin and inability to find a way out of a predicament, God always has another and better plan. It is possible to transform our circumstances and find in the process that the boll weevil has no power to stop us - he hates and avoids peanuts. Yes, transformation from a devastating circumstance to a better “something else” is truly possible.

May it bless whomever this was meant for. I certainly have enjoyed the lesson, personally.

Carole