God and Amputees..Please help

[WaltLove]

Brothers and sisters,

I know this has been touched upon before but I was looking for some fresh perspectives on this question. It is, I am afraid, hurting my faith a little. Why doesn’t God cure amputees? (ie regenerating a limb) Any help would be greatly appreciated. You guys always seem to help when I question. God bless!

Walt

 

[puzzleannie]

if it was necessary for the person’s salvation, God would heal them, that goes for an amputee or for anyone suffering in any way

if God in his wisdom wishes to use the suffering for the person’s salvation, he will do so

God does not plan or will suffering, but he always wills that it either be a source of benefit for the person, or that he can heal them to demonstrate his power.

God always answers prayers for healing, but he heals what he deems the damage to be, not what the individual defines as the damage.

 

[strngrnrth]

I have read accounts of God healing amputees. I believe that is less common now than it used to be because it used to mean starvation to lose a limb, or being a beggar all one’s life, while now it means far less hardship and we can even get prosthetic limbs.

 

[knightbvm]

Brothers and sisters,

I know this has been touched upon before but I was looking for some fresh perspectives on this question. It is, I am afraid, hurting my faith a little. Why doesn’t God cure amputees? (ie regenerating a limb) Any help would be greatly appreciated. You guys always seem to help when I question. God bless!

Walt

WHEN you think about it it could be better to be an amputee–u can offer your sufferings up. in union with Our Lord’s, and destroy tons of time in purgaotory.–when in heaven you will have the greatest limbs you could imagine----OUR LADY IS FIGHTING FOR US—STAY CLOSE TO HER!!!

 

[love4mary]

I met a very nice Catholic man in another forum about 3 years ago. We chatted for almost a year in that forum before meeting in person (ALL safety measures in place). We dated for a year and on our anniversary of our meeting, we became engaged. This coming May, after 15 months of engagement, we are to be married:thumbsup:

He was a fallen away Catholic and a rebel in his younger years as he tells it. Following his own path in life without giving God even a seconds notice. Thankfully, by the time I met him, he had settled down and completely came Back to God with incredible zeal.

Oh, and one more thing…His Right arm was severed just below the elbow in a sawing accident.

God takes a tragedy in our life and makes a positive happen IF we allow Him to work within us. My fiancée could have fallen into the mode of “Why Me?..I feel so sorry for myself and my life is over”, but he didn’t.! He physically and emotionally healed from this accident due in large part to his incredible faith in God. He holds down a full time Regular job, makes prosthetics and talks to other amputees and tells them that life did NOT stop for them, just changed a bit. What an Awesome role model he is.

One day at work, a Baptist preacher friend of his asked him, “Won’t you be excited that when you get to heaven God will make you perfect again and give you back your arm?” to this my fiancée replied,“What makes you think that God does not think I am perfect just the way I am?”

Sorry this was so long winded, but when I look at my intended, I see a Whole and Complete man, a man who loves God and who loves me and my children, and my children thinks its cool when he changes out his arm from hand to hook.

God and I think he is perfect just the way he is.

.

 

[awfulthings9]

I’m not sure that most of the responses are really answering the OP’s concern.

His doubt reflects a common argument from athiests (I’m not suggesting that the OP is an athiest) in that we have a number of stories of cures, such as from blindnes, deafness, paralysis, tumors, etc.

The trouble is, these can all be easily faked. Yet, they are promoted as “signs” of God’s power.

To suggest that amputees are “perfect” is a bit of a platitude that sounds nice but could be said about blind people, deaf people, paralyzed people, etc.

And to say that God would cure them if it contributed to their salvation makes the assumption that, universally, there are no cases where being an amputee would contribute to one’s salvation, but there are cases among the blind, deaf, paralyzed, etc.

In truth, missing a limb is a defect. We all have defects. Some of us have physical defects (I have slight hearing loss and am near-sighted), some emotional (bi-polar), intellectual (mental retardation), and sexual (homosexuality). This doesn’t lessen our worth as human beings or make us less equal in the eyes of God. Just a consequence of original sin. While I appreciate the response that love4Mary’s Valentine gave to his Baptist friend, isn’t the implication that God thinks amputees are perfect just the way they are, but all of those who have been cured are less than perfect?

I have three thoughts on this question:

1. Maybe there are some cures, as someone suggested. I don’t know of any. If someone does, I’d love to have the documentation in case ever posed with this objection.
2. There is something metaphoric in many of the cures we do see. Blindness is cured in the Bible and stands as a metaphor for our eyes of faith. Deafness is aluded to in Scripture as a metaphor for not “hearing” God’s word. The paralyzed man is given the power to walk as a metaphor for our walk with God. Tumors disappearing metaphorically represent the removal of sin from within us. So, it isn’t that God is ignoring amputees, but that he is chosing cures that have a metaphoric application to our spiritual journey, so as we contemplate them, we might gain insight into our spiritual imperfections.
3. Curing an amputee is too much of a sign. To suddenly see an arm pop out of someone’s side would be similar to having God’s face appear in the sky. It would be basically undeniable. God perhaps wants to give us signs, but signs that are not so conclusive that we aren’t left with the spiritual struggle that leads to spiritual maturity. If I hear of a blind man being cured, it encourages my search for God, but because of the “iffiness” of it, I am driven to look more deeply in other places - to search other things, such as the historicity of Jesus’s death and resurrection. Granted, the problem here is that God has done “great signs” (a dancing sun), but generally, his signs are those that intrigue us, but do not rob us of the spiritual hard work we must do to most fully come to him.

 

[deb1]

If the atheists don’t believe accounts of miracles that include, in some cases, medical reports then why would they believe a limb growing back? They would explain it away as some freakish but natural occurence. For all I know they might begin to say,"Well, yeah the arm grew back, now lets see God put someone’s head back.’ It will never be enough for them.

No amount of miracles will make a person believe unless they want to believe.

 

[davidv]

1. Maybe there are some cures, as someone suggested. I don’t know of any. If someone does, I’d love to have the documentation in case ever posed with this objection.

If you are willing to do a little research, every saint cannonized in the past several centuries has at least two miracles ascribed to their intercession. Many of these are physical cures.

1. There is something metaphoric in many of the cures we do see. Blindness is cured in the Bible and stands as a metaphor for our eyes of faith. Deafness is aluded to in Scripture as a metaphor for not “hearing” God’s word. The paralyzed man is given the power to walk as a metaphor for our walk with God. Tumors disappearing metaphorically represent the removal of sin from within us. So, it isn’t that God is ignoring amputees, but that he is chosing cures that have a metaphoric application to our spiritual journey, so as we contemplate them, we might gain insight into our spiritual imperfections.

By using the term “metaphoric” are you imply these stories are purely fiction, with a moral? This view of scripture is totally off base for a Catholic to hold. Why can they not be both, an actual physical healing and also have spiritual meaning.

1. Curing an amputee is too much of a sign.

Why? Is God not big enough?

To suddenly see an arm pop out of someone’s side would be similar to having God’s face appear in the sky. It would be basically undeniable. God perhaps wants to give us signs, but signs that are not so conclusive that we aren’t left with the spiritual struggle that leads to spiritual maturity. If I hear of a blind man being cured, it encourages my search for God, but because of the “iffiness” of it, I am driven to look more deeply in other places - to search other things, such as the historicity of Jesus’s death and resurrection. Granted, the problem here is that God has done “great signs” (a dancing sun), but generally, his signs are those that intrigue us, but do not rob us of the spiritual hard work we must do to most fully come to him.

Really? If it actual did happen there would still be those who would not believe it, just as those who were in Jesus’ midst did not believe.

 

[awfulthings9]

If the atheists don’t believe accounts of miracles that include, in some cases, medical reports then why would they believe a limb growing back? They would explain it away as some freakish but natural occurence. For all I know they might begin to say,"Well, yeah the arm grew back, now lets see God put someone’s head back.’ It will never be enough for them.

No amount of miracles will make a person believe unless they want to believe.

You are assuming all atheists are hard-headed and dead set against the faith. They aren’t. I wasn’t, which is why I’m no longer an athiest. Sometimes athiests are just “testing the spirits”.

 

[awfulthings9]

If you are willing to do a little research, every saint cannonized in the past several centuries has at least two miracles ascribed to their intercession. Many of these are physical cures.

I’m not sure what you are implying here, because your line that “many of these are physical cures” suggests I’ve said that physical cures never happen. I believe they do. I simply said that I’m not aware of any cures of amputees. And I have done a “little research” into it. Perhaps you are aware of a cure of an amputee and can point me to where my research didn’t lead.

By using the term “metaphoric” are you imply these stories are purely fiction, with a moral? This view of scripture is totally off base for a Catholic to hold. Why can they not be both, an actual physical healing and also have spiritual meaning.

I think you are assuming something of my post that isn’t true. Did I say they were purely fictional? If so, please quote that part. As you said, they can “be both”. Why do you assume automatically I do not have the same view? After all, the story of the flood can have actually occured and still be a metaphor to foreshadow baptism.

Please don’t read into my words to make me a heretic.

Why? Is God not big enough?

Please, you are adding things to my words again. You separated one line from my entire explanation to make it look like I was challenging God. Upon reading the entire point #3, it should be clear that I’m not suggesting that God isn’t big enough, but that he desires for us to mature spiritually, which can come through the struggle that might be absent were the sign too obvious.

I mean, seriously, I’m simply adding my thoughts here to help the OP, and twice you’ve twisted what I’ve said to make it sound as if I am insulting God and Scripture.

Please stop.

Really? If it actual did happen there would still be those who would not believe it, just as those who were in Jesus’ midst did not believe.

Sure there would. But there would be others, as well. I am one of them. Had I witnessed an amputee, I would have re-verted on the spot, but I can assure you that I wouldn’t have done the spiritual searching and study that brought me to where I am today. Anyway, within my own post I admitted the limits to this theory.

So … after completely attacking my post and making me look like a heretic, perhaps you have the real answer for the OP? I take it from your post that you are aware of some evidence from the lives of saints, so maybe you could point me in that direction. And after tearing apart my ideas without presenting any of your own to help the OP, maybe you could share the alternates to my view.

 

[davidv]

I’m not sure what you are implying here, because your line that “many of these are physical cures” suggests I’ve said that physical cures never happen. I believe they do. I simply said that I’m not aware of any cures of amputees. And I have done a “little research” into it. Perhaps you are aware of a cure of an amputee and can point me to where my research didn’t lead.

I think you are assuming something of my post that isn’t true. Did I say they were purely fictional? If so, please quote that part. As you said, they can “be both”. Why do you assume automatically I do not have the same view? After all, the story of the flood can have actually occured and still be a metaphor to foreshadow baptism.

Please don’t read into my words to make me a heretic.

Please, you are adding things to my words again. You separated one line from my entire explanation to make it look like I was challenging God. Upon reading the entire point #3, it should be clear that I’m not suggesting that God isn’t big enough, but that he desires for us to mature spiritually, which can come through the struggle that might be absent were the sign too obvious.

I mean, seriously, I’m simply adding my thoughts here to help the OP, and twice you’ve twisted what I’ve said to make it sound as if I am insulting God and Scripture.

Please stop.

Sure there would. But there would be others, as well. I am one of them. Had I witnessed an amputee, I would have re-verted on the spot, but I can assure you that I wouldn’t have done the spiritual searching and study that brought me to where I am today. Anyway, within my own post I admitted the limits to this theory.

So … after completely attacking my post and making me look like a heretic, perhaps you have the real answer for the OP? I take it from your post that you are aware of some evidence from the lives of saints, so maybe you could point me in that direction. And after tearing apart my ideas without presenting any of your own to help the OP, maybe you could share the alternates to my view.

I am sorry I made you feel like I was attacking your post. I was not. I make none of the assumptions you accuse me of. Specifically in the case of the “metaphor” point, I asked for clarification.

And no, I have no knowledge of any amputees limbs being restored.

 

[deb1]

You are assuming all atheists are hard-headed and dead set against the faith. They aren’t. I wasn’t, which is why I’m no longer an athiest. Sometimes athiests are just “testing the spirits”.

That is why I said that they have to want to believe.

 

[awfulthings9]

I am sorry I made you feel like I was attacking your post. I was not. I make none of the assumptions you accuse me of. Specifically in the case of the “metaphor” point, I asked for clarification.

And no, I have no knowledge of any amputees limbs being restored.

No problem, David. Text makes for frequent miscommunications.

Take care, brother.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Brothers and sisters,

I know this has been touched upon before but I was looking for some fresh perspectives on this question. It is, I am afraid, hurting my faith a little. Why doesn’t God cure amputees? (ie regenerating a limb) Any help would be greatly appreciated. You guys always seem to help when I question. God bless!
Walt

Sorry to hear that this is being a problem for you ​

Having a disability is to some extent what one makes of it - so is having “perfect” health. ISTM that what we do with our bodies, is more important than whether we have perfect bodily health.

At the risk of sounding very corny, ISTM that what we see as a problem is not so seen by those with the problem. Obviously it would be ridiculous, because false, to say that everybody with some kind of problem has a strong faith; that would certainly be untrue. But a lot of people whom one might assume would not have faith, because of their circumstances, do have a strong faith.

There was a documentary on TV about the conditions in which many Coptic Christians live in Cairo - one of them had given up a (relatively) comfortable job to move to the slums & filth in which his fellow-Christians lived. Not only do they live in filthy conditions, without hope of better; they suffer great unjustices because they are Christians. Yet they remain Christian: Unreported World

If Christians living in very adverse circumstances don’t see their circumstances as a reason to disbelieve, I don’t see why we should. That does not mean that there is not a problem - only that it is not felt as a reason for disbelief. Poverty & oppression & sickness & disease are not trivial; but for many people, they are not final either. Outward circumstances are not “the main thing” - what we make of them (& for Christians, this means living in dependence on the God we cannot see) is far more important.

A lot of people who have every good thing one could imagine are very unhappy - even if they have their health, money, a roof overhead, food, drink. The real problem is not lack of health, but unhappiness of heart. And that God alone can fix.

 

[theunforgiven]

Brothers and sisters,

I know this has been touched upon before but I was looking for some fresh perspectives on this question. It is, I am afraid, hurting my faith a little. Why doesn’t God cure amputees? (ie regenerating a limb) Any help would be greatly appreciated. You guys always seem to help when I question. God bless!

Walt

I have thought about this before–I have seen people with both arms amputated, and thought it could be an advantage in one sense–especially if they are male—they wouldnt be able to physically masturbate–which seems to be a very strong temptations for males–granted they could still sin in their minds, but the temptation to actually masturbate would be there, but couldnt be done—

 

[PhilVaz]

Some answers in two long MP3 files…

The Problem of Pain COMPLETE by C.S. Lewis

Craig vs. Sinnott-Armstrong on evil and human suffering

Phil P

 

[larry85704]

Brothers and sisters,

I know this has been touched upon before but I was looking for some fresh perspectives on this question. It is, I am afraid, hurting my faith a little. Why doesn’t God cure amputees? (ie regenerating a limb) Any help would be greatly appreciated. You guys always seem to help when I question. God bless!

Walt

I am not an amputee, but I cannot use my right arm. So, with that as my credentials, if you could call them that, here is what I think.

First off, I consider myself a Catholic. I am not an atheist.

Sometimes I am in great pain. Methadone is the only thing that works to relieve the pain.

But honestly, I do not feel disabled or in any way handicapped by my injury. Tell you a story, it illustrates my point, I think.

My wife died in 1990. I went to see her brother. He was trying to cheer me up, I guess, by telling me about his exploits with ladies. Specifically, he commented on how he would get his date in the hot tub wearing only a tee shirt. I have a hot tub at my house. I told him I couldn’t remember the last time I’d been in the hot tub wearing anything. My wife was nude as well.

Who is disabled?

Don’t worry, nobody saw us and we were alone.

My brother in law does not appear to be disabled. What is his problem? Why did he need a tee shirt?

I guess God cured me because I’ve had a life filled with great joy and great sorrow. I expect to have more joy and more sorrow in my life. I know many people like my brother in law, who do their own thing, and miss out on so much.

Injury is an obvious excuse for not doing stuff, not living, but it is just an excuse. When God cures you, you have no excuses, you don’t need any. I feel I’ve been cured, I cannot move my arm, but I am cured. At least from the injury to my arm.

 

[theunforgiven]

I am not an amputee, but I cannot use my right arm. So, with that as my credentials, if you could call them that, here is what I think.

First off, I consider myself a Catholic. I am not an atheist.

Sometimes I am in great pain. Methadone is the only thing that works to relieve the pain.

But honestly, I do not feel disabled or in any way handicapped by my injury. Tell you a story, it illustrates my point, I think.

My wife died in 1990. I went to see her brother. He was trying to cheer me up, I guess, by telling me about his exploits with ladies. Specifically, he commented on how he would get his date in the hot tub wearing only a tee shirt. I have a hot tub at my house. I told him I couldn’t remember the last time I’d been in the hot tub wearing anything. My wife was nude as well.

Who is disabled?

Don’t worry, nobody saw us and we were alone.

My brother in law does not appear to be disabled. What is his problem? Why did he need a tee shirt?

I guess God cured me because I’ve had a life filled with great joy and great sorrow. I expect to have more joy and more sorrow in my life. I know many people like my brother in law, who do their own thing, and miss out on so much.

Injury is an obvious excuse for not doing stuff, not living, but it is just an excuse. When God cures you, you have no excuses, you don’t need any. I feel I’ve been cured, I cannot move my arm, but I am cured. At least from the injury to my arm.

Curious are you right handed? if so can you masturbate? If not dont you think that could be an advantage in the fact you cant sin in this regard?

 

[larry85704]

I was right handed. Obviously not any more.

Lets me just say that most people do not think of me as handicapped in anyway. I find it interesting that you would ask about masturbation. I guess masturbation gets into everything. From my post, about having me and my wife is the hot tub nude what makes you think I had any interest in masturbation? Or any energy for it?

 

[knightbvm]

I was right handed. Obviously not any more.

Lets me just say that most people do not think of me as handicapped in anyway. I find it interesting that you would ask about masturbation. I guess masturbation gets into everything. From my post, about having me and my wife is the hot tub nude what makes you think I had any interest in masturbation? Or any energy for it?

I mean since your wife passed away? I was wondering because it would seem to be an advantage (without getting to graphic) at least from that stand point–I think every male struggles with masturbation—