God Loves Homosexuals

[Fidelis]

Homophobia
Increasingly over the years anyone who does not agree that homosexuality is not perfectly normal are met with denouncements as a homophobe. The homophobe tag is now thrown along quite freely at anyone who dares to accept accept homosexuality or even worse saying it is sinful. Say anything negative about homosexuality and you are instantly branded a homophobe. This is an annoying trend, but even worse is the trend to try to litigate if you do not accept gay orthodoxy. The misnamed Human Rights Council in Canada has been doing just that in regards to commits against homosexuality and the same types of things are now happening in England.

I think though that we can take a page out of the homosexual activists play book and defend ourselves against charges of homophobia. They are not going to accept natural law arguments or arguments from scripture so lets use their own arguments.

**Here is what you do. ** If accused of homophobia simply say that you were born with it and that you did not choose to be a homophobe and that you find the term itself to be hateful and judgmental. If they bring up the fact that their is no medical evidence of the genetic origin of homophobia, you say that there is just as much evidence of it than for the genetic origin of homosexuality. If they say that twins aren’t always both homophobes, you remind them the same is true in the cases of twins and homosexuality.

Now their next line of attack might be that even if you are born with a genetic preposition towards homophobia, it does not mean you should act on it. After all there might be a genetic preposition towards alcoholism, but that does not mean the person has to become an alcoholic. You then remind them that the same would be true if there was an actual genetic preposition towards homosexuality.

You could say that even if homophobia has no genetic origin that you identify yourself as being in opposition to homosexual acts and that this opposition is just another lifestyle choice in a pluralistic society. Why should you give into their demand for you to change when they should just be tolerant instead. Shouldn’t young people in our public schools who oppose homosexual acts be allowed to express their view in a tolerant environment instead of being told to shut up and to hide their views in a closet?

They might tell you that the diagnosis of homosexuality as a psychological disorder is no longer made by the American Psychiatric Association, you can tell them that there is no diagnosis of homophobia either.

Tell them not be be a hater or a homophobephobe.
splendoroftruth.com/curtjester/archives/008632.php

 

[fix]

Physical deformaties?? You think being gay is an abnormality?

I think one who believes they are a third gender does have a disability. Mental and/or physical. Why is it incorrect to think medical problems occur in nature?

That gays are deformed? God knew one to be deformed, yet He loved Him anyway.

Those with a homosexual inclination are not deformed. Those who you claim are a third gender would have some type of deformation or why are you using the term “third gender”? Is there a third gender now? If so is that consistent with health?

I am not talking about pedophelia either. That is someone who knows better. I am talking about children who think they are outcasts from God and that’s a real problem b/c they are not. I knew a friend’s son was suicidal at 15 years old b/c some Baptist told him he was going to hell in a hand basket b/c of this.

Oh boy, here we go with all the stories now.

Which by the way brings me to say the Catholic church is the most tolerant of this.
You think phychiatry can help? No, being gay is not a choice.

Acting on sexual urges is a choice. To claim otherwise is to make humans machines.

 

[Righteousone]

I just think people are ignorant and hateful.

 

[fix]

I just think people are ignorant and hateful.

Because they do not assent to your dogma?

 

[Righteousone]

Ya know Fix, if to tell a story is the only way someone as yourself will understand, so be it.
You can be hateful all you want. I am compassionate toward gays and people who are outcasts in this screwed-up world and so was Jesus. I will walk with Jesus and do exactly as He would do. Love these people.

Furthermore, are you a medical professional? And here you go yourself comparing humans to science.

Point being, no one knows what Jesus would do, I just don’t think there are millions of teenagers burning in hell right now.

 

[HannahLisa]

People do NOT choose to have homosexual “inclinations” or whatever you want to call them. They do NOT choose to be attracted to members of the same sex instead of members of the opposite sex.

They DO choose to act on those attractions. Lust is a sin regardless of the object, and so on and so forth. The sin comes from acting on the attractions, and that is a choice.

The sin is NOT the actual attraction, and they do not choose it.

 

[fix]

Ya know Fix, if to tell a story is the only way someone as yourself will understand, so be it.

Sorry, I have no idea what your point is?

You can be hateful all you want.

Why do you throw around these words hate and ignorant? Do you think everyone who refuses to accept your view is hateful?

I am compassionate toward gays and people who are outcasts in this screwed-up world and so was Jesus.

OK, but you lack compassion for those who you call haters? Which “haters” did Jesus hate?

I will walk with Jesus and do exactly as He would do. Love these people.

Can you point out one sentence where I said anyone person should be hated?

Furthermore, are you a medical professional? And here you go yourself comparing humans to science.

Again, no idea what you are saying?

Point being, no one knows what Jesus would do, I just don’t think there are millions of teenagers burning in hell right now.

What?

 

[Righteousone]

Sorry, I have no idea what your point is?

Why do you throw around these words hate and ignorant? Do you think everyone who refuses to accept your view is hateful?

OK, but you lack compassion for those who you call haters? Which “haters” did Jesus hate?

Can you point out one sentence where I said anyone person should be hated?

Again, no idea what you are saying?

What?

What is it you don’t understand…pretty clear to everyone else.

 

[fix]

What is it you don’t understand…pretty clear to everyone else.

It is?

 

[fix]

You think God created three sexes. You think anyone arguing that acting on the homosexual inclination is wrong is full of hate. You think psychological counseling for confused young people is hate. You think humans are the sum total of their sexual urges.

Now, have I got all that right?

 

[Righteousone]

It is?

Whatever fix, I said what I needed to say. Be kind to everyone. After all, you too will be judged one day.

 

[Righteousone]

You think God created three sexes. You think anyone arguing that acting on the homosexual inclination is wrong is full of hate. You think psychological counseling for confused young people is hate. You think humans are the sum total of their sexual urges.

Now, have I got all that right?

No, you are wrong, but I figured that anyway…Do you know if God did not create three sexes? I think people have their own views and opinions, and I respect that. Listen carefully now:
I JUST DON’T THINK GOD CONDEMNS TEENAGERS TO ETERNAL HELL AND DAMNATION BECAUSE THAT IS WHEN YOU FIND OUT YOU ARE GAY. WHEN YOU ARE 11,12,13 YEARS OLD…phew…:banghead: get it?

 

[fix]

No, you are wrong, but I figured that anyway…Do you know if God did not create three sexes?

Well, it is Church doctrine we all came from 2 parents. I assume when God made male and female He meant that. If there are some variations from that it may be from His permissive will but are you claiming God ordained more than male and female? I mean why stop at three. Could He have ordained 27 sexes? Or 50?

I think people have their own views and opinions, and I respect that. Listen carefully now:
I JUST DON’T THINK GOD CONDEMNS TEENAGERS TO ETERNAL HELL AND DAMNATION BECAUSE THAT IS WHEN YOU FIND OUT YOU ARE GAY. WHEN YOU ARE 11,12,13 YEARS OLD…phew…:banghead: get it?

I must have missed someone in this thread claiming teenagers are all in hell if they suffer from same sex attraction. I have not read that.

 

[fix]

Fidelis.

Thanks for the link.

 

[buffalo]

No of course not…a red herring of a question.

Why is it a red herring?

 

[Publisher]

Why is it a red herring?

Because one is comparing apples to oranges…one has nothing whatsoever to do with the other…two separate issues, it’s like comparing "gay marriage’ to “marrying one’s dog”…it has nothing to do with each other…it’s like saying…“Well if one allows gay marriage, next thing we know we’ll have to allow dogs getting drivers license!!!”

The arguements were used decades ago when interracial marriage was against the law. “If we allow blacks to marry whites next thing you know we’ll have to make pedophilia lawful.”

HUH???

 

[rpp]

These threads always seem to degenerate into name-calling.

The whole topic of homosexuality and homosexual acts has been discussed and rediscussed so many time that I am surprised that this still happens.

We all know what the Church teaches. We all know what the Bible actually says. We know that some people do not agree with Church teachings. We know that some people try to monkey with the Bible. This is true for many different issues.

Please stop yelling at each other. It makes me sad to see people do this.

Let us increase the charity level on this thread. If you stop yelling and start listening, perhaps you can hear what the other person is actually saying.

 

[Pete_1]

Quote from a forum on the net:

Genesis 19: 1-28 - The ancient story of Sodom and Gomorrah
Lot was going to send out his two daughters to be gang raped by an angry mob, and nobody has a problem with this??? anyways, i digress…

There a few errors in the translation from the hebrew scriptures to the english version we have now that i feel are pretty major to the interpretation… the word that has been translated as intercourse is ‘yada’, which means ‘get to know’. had the author of this scripture wanted to say that the mob wanted to have sexual intercourse with lots visitors, he probably would have used the word ‘shakab’. this word denotes sexual activity. the word ‘yada’ appears in the hebrew scriptures over 900 times, and in every other context is used as meaning to get acquainted with someone. yet, in this particular passage, it somehow was changed to mean ‘intercourse’.

Therefore, that entire passage should read something more like this… ‘where are the mortals who came here tonight?? bring them out here so that we may get acquainted with them.’

Now, if you look at it again, there are a few other problems as well… for the story to be a condemnation of homosexuality, the ENTIRE CITY must have been homosexual. this is impossible, but even if it were true, why on earth would lot have sent his DAUGHTERS out to a homosexual male mob??? it states that lots daughters were virgins, and we know that sacrificing virgins was something very common in pagan idol worship. and we also know that lot lived in a pagan city.

Elsewhere in the bible, sodom is refered to again, in ezekiel 16…
“Look! This is what proved to be the error of Sodom your sister: Pride, sufficiency of bread and the carefreeness of keeping undisturbed were what happened to belong to her and her dependent towns, and the hand of the afflicted one and the poor one she did not strengthen. And they continued to be haughty and to carry on a detestable thing before me, and I finally removed them, just as I saw fit”

The hebrew word that was translated as ‘detestable thing’ is towebah, and this word literally translates out as ‘to commit idol worship’.

Therefore, the problem of sodom and gamorrah isn’t homosexuality at all. the sin commited here is idol worship.

Leviticus 18:22, Leviticus 20:13

Leviticus is an interesting book. if you look at the context of the time it was writeen, the isrealites were living in a real ‘get out there and multiply’ kind of time… they were the chosen ones, so they had a duty to be really fertile. therefore, even masturbation was a HUGE sin.
leviticus is also part of the ‘mosaic law’, which also forbade haircuts, shaving, and wearing clothing with blended fibres, among other things. the law was such that if you broke one law, then you were guilty of breaking them all.

So, for us to use the leviticus passages to condemn homosexuality, we would also be equally condemning people who shave and get their hair cut.

We allow people who shave and get their hair cut to get married, accept sacraments, and share equally in our church, so it doesn’t make ANY sense whatsoever to forbid equality to homosexuals based on the levitical text.

Romans 1:26-27
1 Cor. 6: 9-11
1 Tim. 1:9-11

Basically, the words that translated out as homosexual or ‘men who lie with men’ in these texts were ‘arsenokoites’ and ‘malakos’.

Arsenokoites litterally means ‘lift bed’, but bible scholars now believe that at the time, it was used to denote a male temple prostitute. malakos litterally translates out as ‘spineless’, or coward.

Now, in my ‘new american bible for catholics’, there is an asterisk by the term ‘homosexual’ in these particular passages, which states…

‘The term translated as ‘practicing homosexuals’ refers to adult males who indulged in homosexual practices with boy prostitutes, i.e.boys or young men who were kept for the purposes of prostitution, a practice not uncommon in the greco-roman world.’

Therefore, i’d suggest that the texts above are a condemnation of pedophilia, prostitution, promiscuity, and idolatry, and not at all a condemnation of a consensual, committed homosexual relationship.

Thus, as far as i’m concerned, the bible is not a condemnation of homosexuality.

I left the catholic church after 30 years of trying to fit in.end of quote.

Do you have a credible source for these translations?

 

[stbruno]

Quoted from OP
*It is proven that people are born being homosexual. It is not a choice just as being hetrosexual is not a choice. *

While I agree with you that God loves all of us, and we are created in in His own image & likeness…and hatred is never in the equation in regard to our fellow man…

I don’t think this statement is true yet…one scientist has claimed to find a gay gene, but no one else has. The discussion still exists between nature and nurture. narth.com/docs/istheregene.html

 

[Publisher]

Also in these threads we tend to dismiss anyone who disagrees with our understanding of scripture as “monkeying”…as far as “name calling” goes…“beam in eye” vs “splinter in brother’s”. Accusing others of willfully misusing scripture is on par with “name calling.” IMO