Gospel of Thomas...

[patrick457]

This is the Sethian story in brief.

Once, there was an unknown God, who is both hidden and insivible. This original God went through a series of emanations, during which its essence is seen as spontaneously expanding into many successive ‘generations’ of paired male and female beings, called ‘aeons’, the first of which was the androgynous (though referred to as a ‘she’) Barbelo. Together, God and the aeons comprise the Pleroma (‘Fullness’).

The latest aeon in the chain, Sophia, pondered how to get back to the center of divine nature closest to God (the repeated act of emanation had brought a sort of imbalance to the spiritual world). She finally decided to imitate God’s original action of emanating, asking no permission. The experiment ends in a disaster: she produces a freaky lion-headed snake called Yaldabaoth (yalda bahut ‘daughter of chaos’). Ashamed, she tries to hide Yaldabaoth in a bright cloud with a throne in it. Yaldabaoth grew up in isolation, not aware of the Pleroma, and came to the conclusion that he was God.

When the time came, Yaldabaoth finally managed to break free of his confinement, stealing his mother’s divine power in the process. Together with his ‘angelic’ henchmen, the archons, Yaldabaoth creates the material universe, not knowing that he is making a flawed, imperfect copy of the Pleroma. At the creation of man, God tricked Yaldabaoth into unwittingly passing onto Adam the stolen divine power by making him blow the breath of life to Adam. This made humans more superior to all other created beings - because they had spark inside them.

 

[FaithInTheSon]

Now this is whese things get more confusing.

The Manicheans believed that there were two realms. One was the World of Light, ruled by the Father of Greatness together with his five Shekhinas (divine attributes of light), and the other war the World of Darkness, ruled by the King of Darkness. The King of Darkness notices the presence of the World of Light, becomes greedy for it and attacks it. In response, the Father of Greatness calls upon the Mother of Life. The Mother of Life sends her son, Original Man, off to war, armed with five shields of light - the light of the five Shekinas. Eventually, however, Original Man is defeated and becomes trapped, the shields having been used as bait for the light-hungry inhabitants of the World of Darkness.

The Father then calls upon the Living Spirit, who calls upon his five sons. He also sends a Call to the Original Man; in response, the Original Man sends back an Answer to the Father. (Call and Answer thus become two deities in the Manichean pantheon.) The Mother of Life, the Living Spirit and his five sons begin creating the universe out of the bodies of the evil beings of the World of Darkness, together with the light that they have swallowed. All in all, ten heavens and eight earths are created, all consisting of various mixtures of the evil material beings from the World of Darkness and the swallowed light. The sun, moon, and the stars are considered to be remnants of the stolen light, which gradually make their way back to the World of Light as time passes.

The Father of Greatness then begins the third phase of creation: light is recovered from out of the material bodies of the male and female evil beings and demons, by causing them to become sexually aroused in greed, towards beautiful images of the beings of light, such as the Third Messenger and the Virgins of Light. The plan somewhat backfires though, because as soon as the light came out of them and fell down to Earth, the demons tried to eat them back. (Some of the tainted light which were not eaten again became fallen angels known as the ‘Abortions’.) After consuming huge quantities of light, the demons then gave in to lust. Their unions produced Adam and Eve, who both had the light within them.

The Father then sent Radiant Jesus to earth to awaken Adam and to enlighten the couple about the source of the light within them, but Radiant Jesus’ teaching fell on deaf ears. Adam and Eve had children, and the light they had was divided and became trapped into more bodies. Which is where Mani comes in: he claims to be a prophet sent by the World of Light to reveal the true source of the spiritual light imprisoned within material bodies.

I’ll post about a few other creation myths later.

OK. So we are offspring of demons, and this “god” they speak of can’t do absolutely anything he wants?

They must believe in a completely different lord than me. My Lord told me we were made in His image. He told me we are His offspring. He also told me to watch out for crazy people eating mushrooms and pretending to be or thinking they are prophets (extreme paraphrase warning).

Interesting story though, it is right up there with Paul Bunyon. Or starship troopers! that is saying something.

It was no where near as good as the Matrix though.

Interestingly enough some believe that movie was based on gnostic ideas. I disagree.
Either way, it isn’t as funny if you consider how many people the demons may have tricked with such an elaborate story.

Reminds me of the so-called gospel of mary. Great story… evil intentions in it though. In that gospel it implies that Jesus had to give in to demons to get here.

OK so I’m still wondering if they think people too stupid to achieve this “gnosis” are all going to burn? Oh yeah they just keep being reincarnated until they find the super secret hidden knowledge power-up. You answered that one I will give you that. But where is yoshi?

 

[patrick457]

OK. So we are offspring of demons, and this “god” they speak of can’t do absolutely anything he wants?

They must believe in a completely different lord than me. My Lord told me we were made in His image. He told me we are His offspring. He also told me to watch out for crazy people eating mushrooms and pretending to be or thinking they are prophets (extreme paraphrase warning).

Think of it in Zoroastrian terms. Ahura Mazda was the good god and Angra Mainyu was the evil god. Ahura Mazda created the lesser deities such as the Amesha Spentas and the yazatas, after which he created the spiritual and physical universe in order to trap evil. All the while, Angra Mainyu created all the bad stuff to counter the good ones Ahura Mazda had made. When Ahura Mazda created Gayō Marətan (aka Gayōmard), the archetypical perfect man, and the first bull, Angra Mainyu found that he could not duplicate this creation. So what he did was that he invaded the universe through the base of the sky (it was because of this attack that the once perfectly flat world became rough and crooked), inflicting the two creatures with suffering and death. The evil forces, however, were trapped in the universe and could not retreat. As they were dying, Gayōmard and the bull spilled their seed, bringing into being the first human couple and all the plants and animals.

Out of all the gnostic groups, Manichaeism is probably the least ‘Christian’, right up there with the Mandaeans. The Zoroastrian influence is no surprise since Mani was born in what is now Iraq, although he was from an Elcesaite family.

Interesting story though, it is right up there with Paul Bunyon. Or starship troopers! that is saying something.

You know what I was think when I was writing that? “Gosh, this would probably make a nice fantasy B-movie.”

OK so I’m still wondering if they think people too stupid to achieve this “gnosis” are all going to burn? Oh yeah they just keep being reincarnated until they find the super secret hidden knowledge power-up. You answered that one I will give you that. But where is yoshi?

 

[patrick457]

This is the Sethian story in brief.

Once, there was an unknown God, who is both hidden and insivible. This original God went through a series of emanations, during which its essence is seen as spontaneously expanding into many successive ‘generations’ of paired male and female beings, called ‘aeons’, the first of which was the androgynous (though referred to as a ‘she’) Barbelo. Together, God and the aeons comprise the Pleroma (‘Fullness’).

The latest aeon in the chain, Sophia, pondered how to get back to the center of divine nature closest to God (the repeated act of emanation had brought a sort of imbalance to the spiritual world). She finally decided to imitate God’s original action of emanating, asking no permission. The experiment ends in a disaster: she produces a freaky lion-headed snake called Yaldabaoth (yalda bahut ‘daughter of chaos’). Ashamed, she tries to hide Yaldabaoth in a bright cloud with a throne in it. Yaldabaoth grew up in isolation, not aware of the Pleroma, and came to the conclusion that he was God.

When the time came, Yaldabaoth finally managed to break free of his confinement, stealing his mother’s divine power in the process. Together with his ‘angelic’ henchmen, the archons, Yaldabaoth creates the material universe, not knowing that he is making a flawed, imperfect copy of the Pleroma. At the creation of man, God tricked Yaldabaoth into unwittingly passing onto Adam the stolen divine power by making him blow the breath of life to Adam. This made humans more superior to all other created beings - because they had spark inside them.

To elaborate on this further.

This is how the Sethian creation myth is recounted in the Apocryphon of John.

When God emanated Barbelo, she asked Him persmission to grant the creation of the other aeons. Eventually, the Pleroma came to be filled with 365 aeons and their respective angels. As mentioned, when Sophia, the last aeon, attempted to emanate without the permission of her consort, nor God, it ended with the birth of Yaldabaoth.

"And the Sophia of the Epinoia, being an aeon, conceived a thought from herself and the conception of the invisible Spirit and foreknowledge. She wanted to bring forth a likeness out of herself without the consent of the Spirit, - he had not approved - and without her consort, and without his consideration. And though the person of her maleness had not approved, and she had not found her agreement, and she had thought without the consent of the Spirit and the knowledge of her agreement, (yet) she brought forth. And because of the invincible power which is in her, her thought did not remain idle, and something came out of her which was imperfect and different from her appearance, because she had created it without her consort. And it was dissimilar to the likeness of its mother, for it has another form.

"And when she saw (the consequences of) her desire, it changed into a form of a lion-faced serpent. And its eyes were like lightning fires which flash. She cast it away from her, outside that place, that no one of the immortal ones might see it, for she had created it in ignorance. And she surrounded it with a luminous cloud, and she placed a throne in the middle of the cloud that no one might see it except the holy Spirit who is called the mother of the living. And she called his name Yaltabaoth.

“This is the first archon who took a great power from his mother. And he removed himself from her and moved away from the places in which he was born. He became strong and created for himself other aeons with a flame of luminous fire which (still) exists now.”

Yaldabaoth then creates the archons - also numbering 365 - and begins creating the world.

"And having created …] everything, he organized according to the model of the first aeons which had come into being, so that he might create them like the indestructible ones. Not because he had seen the indestructible ones, but the power in him, which he had taken from his mother, produced in him the likeness of the cosmos. And when he saw the creation which surrounds him, and the multitude of the angels around him which had come forth from him, he said to them, ‘I am a jealous God, and there is no other God beside me.’ But by announcing this he indicated to the angels who attended him that there exists another God. For if there were no other one, of whom would he be jealous?

“Then the mother began to move to and fro. She became aware of the deficiency when the brightness of her light diminished. And she became dark because her consort had not agreed with her.”

(…) "And the arrogant one took a power from his mother. For he was ignorant, thinking that there existed no other except his mother alone. And when he saw the multitude of the angels which he had created, then he exalted himself above them.

"And when the mother recognized that the garment of darkness was imperfect, then she knew that her consort had not agreed with her. She repented with much weeping. And the whole pleroma heard the prayer of her repentance, and they praised on her behalf the invisible, virginal Spirit. And he consented; and when the invisible Spirit had consented, the holy Spirit poured over her from their whole pleroma. For it was not her consort who came to her, but he came to her through the pleroma in order that he might correct her deficiency. And she was taken up not to her own aeon but above her son, that she might be in the ninth until she has corrected her deficiency.

 

[patrick457]

"And a voice came forth from the exalted aeon-heaven: ‘The Man exists and the son of Man.’ And the chief archon, Yaltabaoth, heard (it) and thought that the voice had come from his mother. And he did not know from where it came. And he taught them, the holy and perfect Mother-Father, the complete foreknowledge, the image of the invisible one who is the Father of the all (and) through whom everything came into being, the first Man. For he revealed his likeness in a human form.

"And the whole aeon of the chief archon trembled, and the foundations of the abyss shook. And of the waters which are above matter, the underside was illuminated by the appearance of his image which had been revealed. And when all the authorities and the chief archon looked, they saw the whole region of the underside which was illuminated. And through the light they saw the form of the image in the water.

“And he said to the authorities which attend him, ‘Come, let us create a man according to the image of God and according to our likeness, that his image may become a light for us.’ And they created by means of their respective powers in correspondence with the characteristics which were given. And each authority supplied a characteristic in the form of the image which he had seen in its natural (form). He created a being according to the likeness of the first, perfect Man. And they said, ‘Let us call him Adam, that his name may become a power of light for us.’”

 

[patrick457]

Before this gets out of hand, let me continue what I was doing. A slight erratum BTW: this should be P. Oxy. 1.

Nag Hammadi (Codex II):

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(29) Jesus said, “If the flesh came into being because of the spirit, it is a wonder. But if the spirit (came into being) because of the body, it is a wonder of wonders. But as for me, I wonder at how this great wealth has come to dwell in this poverty.”

P. Oxy. 1:

[29 …κε]ῖ̣ ταύτ]η̣ν̣ τ]ὴν πτωχία{ν}.

(29) “…[dwell]s in this poverty].”

Nag Hammadi (Codex II):

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(30) Jesus said, “Where there are three gods, they are gods; where there are two or one, I am with him.”

((77) Jesus said this, “I am the light that is over them all. I am the all; the all came forth from me, and the all has come (pōh ‘break through, split’) to me. Split (pōh) the wood, I am there; raise up the stone and you will find me there.”)

P. Oxy. 1:

*Λέγ]ει Ἰ{ησοῦ}ς ὅπ]ου ἐὰν ὦσιν
τρ]ε̣ῖς] εἰσὶ]ν̣ ἄ̣θεοι καὶ
ὅ]που εἷς] ἐστιν μόνος
λέ]γω ἐγώ εἰμι μετ᾿ αὐ-
τοῦ] ἔγειρ]*ον τὸν λίθο{ν}
κἀκεῖ εὑρήσεις με
σχίσον τὸ ξύλον κἀγὼ
ἐκεῖ εἰμι

(30+77) Jesus says, “Where there are three, they are without God (atheoi, lit. ‘God-less’), and where there is only one, I say, I am with him. Raise up the stone and there you will find me; split the wood and I am there.”

 

[farpinho]

Funny thing is that some of the attributed sayings seem to contradict other previously mentioned ones…

 

[FaithInTheSon]

Patrick thank you for the posts.

side note - Zoroastrianism is what atheists think Christianity started as. One thing atheists refuse to consider is that demons have copied God in the religions they have started with the intention of leading people astray.

 

[patrick457]

Funny thing is that some of the attributed sayings seem to contradict other previously mentioned ones…

Such as?

 

[patrick457]

To continue:

Nag Hammadi (Codex II)

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(31) Jesus said, “No prophet is accepted in his (own) village; no physician heals those who know him.”

P. Oxy. 1

Λέγει Ἰ{ησοῦ}ς· Οὐ
κ ἔστιν δεκτὸς προ
φήτης ἐν τῇ π{ατ}ρίδι αὐ
το]ῦ, οὐδὲ ἰατρὸς ποιεῖ
θεραπείας εἰς τοὺς
γ{ε}ινώσκοντας αὐτό{ν}.

(31) Jesus says, “A prophet is not acceptable in his fatherland, nor does a physican perform healings for those who know him.”

Nag Hammadi (Codex II)

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(32) Jesus said this, “A city built upon a high mountain and fortified cannot fall, nor can it be hidden.”

P. Oxy. 1

Λέγει Ἰ{ησοῦ}ς· Πόλις {ᾠ}κοδο
μημένη ἐπ᾿ ἄκρον
ὄ]ρους ὑψηλοῦ{ς} καὶ ἐσ
τηριγμένη οὔτε πε
σ]εῖν δύναται οὔτε κρυ
β]ῆναι.

(32) Jesus says, “A city built on the summit of a high mountain and established can neither fall, nor be hidden.”

Nag Hammadi (Codex II)

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(33) Jesus said, “What you hear with your ear (and) with the other ear, proclaim it on your housetops. [Or: “proclaim it on your housetops with the other ear.”] For no one lights a lamp to set it under a bushel, or to put it in a hidden place. Rather, he sets it on the lampstand that all who go in and come out may see its light.”

P. Oxy. 1

Λέγει Ἰ{ησοῦ}ς· {Ὃ} ἀκούεις
ε]ἰς τὸ ἓν ὠ]τίον σου …]

(33) Jesus says, “What you hear in your one ear …]”

 

[patrick457]

Now for the real P.Oxy. 655.

Nag Hammadi (Codex II)

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(36) Jesus said, “Do not worry from morning to evening and from evening to morning about what you will put on upon yourselves.”

P. Oxy. 655

…ἀπ]ὸ πρωὶ ἕως ὀψὲ]
μήτ]ε ἀφ᾿] ἑσπέρας]
ἕως π]ρωὶ, μήτε τῇ]
τροφῇ ὑμῶ]ν τί φά
γητε, μήτε] τῇ στο]
λῇ ὑμῶν τ]ί ἐνδύ
ση]σ̣θ̣ε̣. πολ]λῷ κρε̣ί̣σ]
σον]έ̣ς̣ ἐστε] τῶν κρί-]
νων ἅτινα ο]ὐ ξα̣ί]
νει οὐδ]ὲ ν̣ήθ]ει. μηδ]
ὲν ἔχοντες ἔ]ν̣δυ]
μα τί ἐνδύεσθε] καὶ
ὑμεῖς; τίς ἂν προσθ{εί}η
ἐπὶ τὴν {ἡ}λικίαν
ὑμῶν; αὐτὸς δ]ώσει
ὑμ{ε}ῖν τὸ ἔνδυμα ὑ
μῶν.

(36) [Jesus says, “Do not worry f]rom early until late nor from evening until morning, nor for your food that you will eat, nor for your clothing that you will wear. You are much greater than the lilies which neither card nor spin. When you have no clothing, what do you wear? Who can add to your lifespan (hēlikian, lit. ‘stature’)? He it is who will give you your clothing.”

Nag Hammadi (Codex II)

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(37) His disciples said, “Which day will you be shown forth to us? And which day will we see you?” Jesus said, “When you strip yourselves naked without being ashamed, and take your garments and put them under your feet like little children and trample on them, then [you] will see the son of the Living One, and you will not be afraid.”

P. Oxy. 655

Λέγουσιν αὐ
τῷ οἱ μαθηταὶ αὐτοῦ
πότε ἡμ{ε}ῖν ἐμφα
νὴς ἔσει καὶ πότε
σε ὀψόμεθα λέγει
ὅταν ἐκδύσησθε καὶ]
μὴ αἰσχύνθητε

(37) His disciples say to him, “When will you become manifest to us? And when will we see you?” He says, “When you undress an[d] are not ashamed.”

Nag Hammadi (Codex II)

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(39) Jesus said this, “The Pharisees and the scribes took the keys of knowledge. They hid them. They did not go in, and those who wanted to go in they did not allow. But you, be wise as serpents and innocent as doves.”

P. Oxy. 655

… Λέγει]
Ἰ{ησοῦ}ς· Οἱ Φαρισαῖοι]
καὶ οἱ γραμματεῖς]
ἔλαβον τὰς κλεῖδας]
τῆς γνώσεως· αὐτοὶ ἔ…]
… (redux) Λέγει]
Ἰ{ησοῦ}ς· Οἱ Φαρισαῖοι]
καὶ οἱ γραμματεῖς]
ἔλαβον τὰς κλεῖδας]
τῆς γνώσεως αὐτοὶ ἔ]
μοι ὡς ὄφεις καὶ ἀ]
κέραιοι ὡς περιστε]
ρ̣α̣ί]

(39) Jesus says, “The Pharisees and the scribes took the keys of knowledge. They hid them; neither have they entered, nor did they allow those entering in to enter. You, however, be wise as serpents and innocent as doves.”

 

[patrick457]

Some pictures:

http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/5773/poxy1low.jpg
Papyrus Oxyrhynchus 1 (Greek, late 2nd/early 3rd century): preserves most of sayings 26-30+77b, 31-33

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/5295/thomasgosplg.jpg
Papyrus Oxyrhynchus 654 (Greek, mid-to-late 3rd century): preserves parts of sayings 1-7

http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/1505/poxy655low.jpg
Papyrus Oxyrhynchus 655 (Greek, mid-to-late 3rd century): preserves parts of sayings 24, 36-39


Nag Hammadi Codex II (Coptic, 4th century), showing the end of the Apocryphon of John and the beginning of Thomas

http://img853.imageshack.us/img853/3093/ajaxhelper.jpg
Linen strip (Greek, 5th century)

 

[JK8619]

Personally, I think the Gospel of Thomas is worth a read. I have read most of the gnostic gospels and this is the only one that seems like it could maybe fit with Christianity. Most of the verses are similar or identical to those found in our four gospels. The one problem I see is that there does seem to be one full translation without mistakes. I have read English translations of the Greek and Coptic versions. A couple verses or sayings seem to be complete gibberish like this one that someone else quoted already:

Logion 28
(30) Jesus says: “Where there are three gods, they are gods. Where there are two or one, I am with him.”
​

​

 

[jerry_joseph]

Last night, my roommate was looking this particular Gospel up and intends on memorizing it. I say good for him, but I’d like to know why this Gospel was taken out of the Bible and why does it predate the other four gospels?

All churches which holds East Syriac (Chaldean)Tradition is believed to be established St Thomas. It is also known as Church of East or Church of Babylon. It is Asian branch of Catholicism. My church (Syro Malabar) is believed to be established by Apostle St Thomas. St Thomas established church in Babylonia (Chaldea) ,handed over its rule to Apostle Bartholomew and Apostle Jude Thaddeus and gone to India for preaching Christianity.

We are not using any Gospel written by St Thomas. It is a heretic Gospel of Gnostic Christians , written in 4th century in the name of St Thomas ( That means no connection with him).

But there is another text named Acts of Thomas written between AD 200- 225. It is not part of bible (Only Pope of Rome , have the ultimate authority to decide whether it should be part of bible or not) . But it provides us great source of information about mission of St Thomas in India

ftf-rsa.co.za/downloads/The_Acts_of_Thomas.pdf

List of patriarchs in East syriac church from Apostole St thomas.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Patriarchs_of_the_Church_of_the_East

 

[jerry_joseph]

“Let none read the gospel according to Thomas, for it is the work, not of one of the twelve apostles, but of one of Mani’s three wicked disciples.”
—Cyril of Jerusalem, Cathechesis V (4th century)

 

[jerry_joseph]

Tomb of St Thomas , in Mylapore , near Chennai, India, where Apostole St Thomas is believed to be where St Thomas attained martyrdom. It is now a Latin Rite church.



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Relic with a piece of Saint Thomas’ bone
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St. Thomas footprint in the rock with his blood stains

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[jerry_joseph]

mukti4u2.dk/thomas_little_mount_chennai.htm

mukti4u2.dk/thomas_big_mount_chennai.htm