Graphic abortion pics while side walk counselling?

[estesbob]

Your right. Children don’t usually go into abortion clinics. However, they may still see the pictures/billboards.
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Actually children are go into abortion clinics all the time. The problem is they don’t come out.

I am agnostic about graphic pictures. I spent several years counseling in a CPC and always declined to use the graphic abortion takes we had instead relying on a rather matter-of-fact presentation by a reformed abortion who showed the tools of the trade and described what they’re used for. However I have a world respect respect for the sidewalk counselors and defer to them to take whatever actions they think is best. They are on the frontline- the last chance these children have to be saved.

 

[Whitacre_Girl]

Thanks for the reply. Hello Whitacre girl! It’s been a while! Indeed you have a point.
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Hello!! It has been a while! I’ve been up to my ears in schoolwork lately. I NEED A BREAK!!! LOL

The last few quarters have been brutal.

 

[FaustinaClare]

Well I can see why it wouldn’t be a good idea to show those pictures out in public or exploit them, however, those pictures helped me finally make up my mind.

I was in RCIA and really struggling with the whole abortion/contraceptive issue. I guess I didn’t feel like telling a mom who was told she was going to die unless she got an abortion that she couldn’t get one.

I was doing some archiving for a politician in our state and I ran across some records from the 70s/80s in which a pro life group sent him information. There were medical pictures of babies cut up and aborted due to partial birth abortions, etc.

I almost vomited in the archives. It took everything I could to not. I couldn’t stop crying. That’s when I decided 100% Pro life no matter what. And even if I was the mom who was told she would die I wouldn’t get one. There is always that possibility given my family history too.

 

[turtle18]

I can’t believe this is even an issue.

Jesus, why don’t you come down off that cross?

 

[TheRealJuliane]

People ask questions that really trouble them. Why are you so scornful of something that affects a lot of people very deeply. It is an issue, for those of us who care and wonder how we can affect women who are abortion-minded.

 

[estesbob]

People ask questions that really trouble them. Why are you so scornful of something that affects a lot of people very deeply. It is an issue, for those of us who care and wonder how we can affect women who are abortion-minded.

It is an issue that is discussed widely in the pro-life movement. We all want to do the best we can save the lives of the unborn. Tough issues make for tough decisions.

 

[MoonChild02]

Yes, it is. Children should be kept innocent for as long as possible, within reason. Showing them repulsive pictures of both the holocaust and of aborted children is wrong.

Oh, and I suppose you keep the Crucifix hiding in a closet as well. The fact is that Jesus, an innocent, was tortured and died for our sins, and we have that Crucifix to remind us every day of the sacrifice He made for us.

We have those graphic photos to show us what horror goes on in those clinics.

It wasn’t until someone showed a picture in the newspaper of what went on in the slave trade, that people started fighting against it. It wasn’t until someone brought a picture of what was going on in the concentration camps in World War II, over to the US, that we finally sent our troops to fight the war in Europe (the US would have just been fighting against the Japanese for what they did to Pearl Harbor).

Remember: a photo uses a thousand words. There’s no evidence more compelling to show the humanity of the unborn than to show the picture of a slaughtered infant. If the infant weren’t human, then the pictures would not gross us out so much. It’s the fact that the pictures do depict a human that makes us so upset, and rightly so.

The pictures should not be used all the time, as they are very off-putting, and tend to incite violence - again, because they reveal the humanity of the unborn, and we react to that image. However, to use it in proving that the unborn are human, those pictures go a long way in persuading one of the truth.

Those who are part of Priests for Life are fond of saying, “America will not reject abortion until America sees abortion,” and that is very true!

 

[thirdworld]

I am for showing graphic abortion pictures.

The pictures of aborted children and the videos of abortions being performed are real. They represent what is going on inside the abortion clinic, the result of an abortion which is a dead innocent child. Most people do not know the truth of abortion and what it really looks like. Abortion (which is responsible for the deaths of 50,000,000 children since Roe v Wade) is the most important issue in America right now. What could be more important than stopping the murder of innocent people?

We absolutely MUST show people the reality of abortion. We must make them face what they support or are about to have done. I think the images are effective and they don’t infringe upon anyone else’s rights. There’s nothing wrong with showing the reality. If children happen to see it, that’s unfortunate but they’re living in a world where a woman has the “right” to kill her child if he/she inconveniences her. What’s worse?

Even Naomi Wolf said anyone who supports abortion should be able to face the gruesome reality that abortion DOES kill a human being.

I would also like to point out that Christ didn’t censor Himself and say “don’t tell the children I was crucified on the cross.” and likewise we shouldn’t censor ourselves about the evil that takes thousands of innocent lives everyday in the US alone.

By the way, the Holocaust pictures are a good thing, especially for newer generations so they can understand the absolute evils of genocide and so they can learn from history and not allow something like that to happen again.

 

[colmcille1]

I personally think that we owe the victims of this horrible crime the dignity to rest in peace, rather than have their mutilated corpses plastered on picket boards and buses for the world to see.

There are better ways to stop this atrocity than to further dehumanize these innocent children.

Hi Whitacre Girl,
While your heart (rightly) tears at you, do you not see that the ultimate dehumanizing process has already been visited upon these innocents?
God Bless,
Colmcille.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

It is an issue that is discussed widely in the pro-life movement. We all want to do the best we can save the lives of the unborn. Tough issues make for tough decisions.

My question was directed at the poster just above me, who derisively asked why this was even being discussed.

I know it is widely discussed because I do sidewalk counseling myself and have also participated in the Genocide Awareness Project which travels to college campuses with the display of what genocide is. The graphic posters are HUGE and do grab students’ attention.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Oh, and I suppose you keep the Crucifix hiding in a closet as well. The fact is that Jesus, an innocent, was tortured and died for our sins, and we have that Crucifix to remind us every day of the sacrifice He made for us.

We have those graphic photos to show us what horror goes on in those clinics.

It wasn’t until someone showed a picture in the newspaper of what went on in the slave trade, that people started fighting against it. It wasn’t until someone brought a picture of what was going on in the concentration camps in World War II, over to the US, that we finally sent our troops to fight the war in Europe (the US would have just been fighting against the Japanese for what they did to Pearl Harbor).

Remember: a photo uses a thousand words. There’s no evidence more compelling to show the humanity of the unborn than to show the picture of a slaughtered infant. If the infant weren’t human, then the pictures would not gross us out so much. It’s the fact that the pictures do depict a human that makes us so upset, and rightly so.

The pictures should not be used all the time, as they are very off-putting, and tend to incite violence - again, because they reveal the humanity of the unborn, and we react to that image. However, to use it in proving that the unborn are human, those pictures go a long way in persuading one of the truth.

Those who are part of Priests for Life are fond of saying, “America will not reject abortion until America sees abortion,” and that is very true!

That is why I believe that the place for those pictures is NOT at the abortion clinic. The women steel their hearts and minds against us, because the death-scorts tell them lies, so if we seem at all off-balance or aggressive, it plays right into the hands of the abortion supporters. If we are peacefully praying, offering literature, or, as we are about to do in Houston, pointing them toward a free ultrasound clinic on wheels, then we can win them over.

The pictures do need to be shown, but the place for them is on college campuses and on the trucks that roam the streets. I agree with you that average people who have never been through an abortion do not want to think about what is happening, and do not understand the numbers of babies being killed each day, which is at least 3,500. Planned Parenthood likes to put their clinics in poor neighborhoods and near college campuses so it’s very important that we show these young people what is really happening there.

 

[beafedor]

Thanks all for your replies. I appreciate the wide range of opinions.
As for everything we do, I suppose that we could ask ourselves: am I doing this out of love? to save babies lives and mothers souls? out of pride? because I know better and they should know better?

Personally, I believe that graphic pictures undermine the sidewalk counseling and they can traumatize young children and sensitive persons to whom they were not intended. (and yes I often see some kids in the mother’s cars at the clinic+in cars passing by). They can also make post abortive women feel judged not loved by the person who hold these pictures. Again, what is our intention? Visually exposing the sin in its most ugly (yet truthful) form in that particular place and time might not be the best idea.

Abortion minded women need material and emotional support. Planned parenthood and other abortuaries are not going to give that to them. It’s up to us followers of Christ to extend His love and compassion to our sisters. Also, those hurting because of abortion need help, not judgment.

This being said, I agree that there is a time and place to educate people and show these pictures/videos. It has to be done in a controlled environment though.

 

[estesbob]

Thanks all for your replies. I appreciate the wide range of opinions.
As for everything we do, I suppose that we could ask ourselves: am I doing this out of love? to save babies lives and mothers souls? out of pride? because I know better and they should know better?

Personally, I believe that graphic pictures undermine the sidewalk counseling and they can traumatize young children and sensitive persons to whom they were not intended. (and yes I often see some kids in the mother’s cars at the clinic+in cars passing by). They can also make post abortive women feel judged not loved by the person who hold these pictures. Again, what is our intention? Visually exposing the sin in its most ugly (yet truthful) form in that particular place and time might not be the best idea.

Abortion minded women need material and emotional support. Planned parenthood and other abortuaries are not going to give that to them. It’s up to us followers of Christ to extend His love and compassion to our sisters. Also, those hurting because of abortion need help, not judgment.

This being said, I agree that there is a time and place to educate people and show these pictures/videos. It has to be done in a controlled environment though.

The problem is that the time these women reach the door the abortion clinic the time for emotional and material support is long gone. And they most certainly will not get it once they get inside. Perhaps they do need a jolt to remind them of exactly what it is they are doing. I am all for love and compassion and understanding but let’s not make victims out of women who are walking through a door to kill their child.

 

[VetA]

Hello,
To those who active in the pro-life movement, are you for or against the use of graphic abortion pictures in front of abortion clinics while praying and doing side walk counseling?

Do you think that it helps opening the mother’s eyes as some people say or on the contrary undermines the work of side walk counselors as others say?

We are having much debate about this in my community and I’m curious about my brothers and sisters online perspective.
Thanks!

for it, i think if women know what they are going to do with the life growing inside them they may think twice about scrambling the kid

 

[beafedor]

The problem is that the time these women reach the door the abortion clinic the time for emotional and material support is long gone. And they most certainly will not get it once they get inside. Perhaps they do need a jolt to remind them of exactly what it is they are doing. I am all for love and compassion and understanding but let’s not make victims out of women who are walking through a door to kill their child.

Estesbob, I have always appreciated and often shared your opinion on other threads. However, as a woman who has been through abortion and who knows many other who have been through it, I have to disagree here. We shouldn’t assume that they are not victims of others and fully responsible for their actions. There is a lot of coercion, intimidation and violence involved. Not to mention political agendas and greed on the doctors side. Yesterday I read on Abby Johnson’s Facebook page a story of a teenage girl whose mother was pulling by her hair into the clinic because she was talking to side walk counselors. She was kicked out of the house and is now staying with a prolifer (she is keeping the baby).

Who wants to have an abortion? I was 18 and I never wanted to have one. I had never seen graphic pictures but I knew in my heart that it was wrong. My boyfriend however, didn’t give me a choice. The doctor knew that he was going to take a life and make money and didn’t provide alternatives. How often does this happen?

These women at the clinics are not political “pro-choice” activists or greedy doctors. At best, they are victims of those who push radical liberal ideas in our schools and in the media.

Jesus said to the woman caught in adultery: “Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more”. He didn’t say: “look, I’m going to show you the ugliness of your sin.”

 

[portarica]

My question was directed at the poster just above me, who derisively asked why this was even being discussed.

I know it is widely discussed because I do sidewalk counseling myself and have also participated in the Genocide Awareness Project which travels to college campuses with the display of what genocide is. The graphic posters are HUGE and do grab students’ attention.

There seems to be a couple of issues here that are being discussed.

One is whether to show graphic images at all and another is what is the most effective last chance manner of preventing abortion at the final moment outside the abortion clinic.

It is easy for some pro-life people to say that any tactic that prevents abortion is always OK to use. But that type of thinking may be more a reflection of one believing that they have a right to use any tactic to prevent abortion. And that may be the case.

But having a right to do something and having it be effective are two different things.

For any mind changing encounter to be productive , there must be some sort of engagement between the messenger , the recipient and the message. There also must be someway of disengaging the person from their prior beliefs about what they think is true.

I would suggest that most people getting an abortion are not doing so in a willy nilly manner and are not looking forward to the abortion as a positive happy experience, but as some sort of a solution for a perceived problem.

Showing graphic pictures probably doesn’t solve the problem they are dealing with at the moment. I would find it hard to believe that anybody getting an abortion thinks it is some graceful, respectful, medical procedure that is somehow done in a kind and gentle manner to the innocent unborn.

At the last minute before entering the clinic, will the graphic images change the minds of people about what is going to be happening?

The aborter is more likely looking for a way out that deals with the problems they are trying to solve by getting an abortion. They know they are about to sin, they don’t need confirmation of that, they need a way out of their predicament.

But on a college campus or some other venue where it is an adult to adult interchange, there is something to be said for doing some shocking things that may prevent somebody from believing the story that abortion is a legitimate answer to problems that may arise in their future.

And it is probably good to let those that enable abortions to see what they are enabling.

But to save lives on the sidewalk at the last minute it is probably more effective to be focussed on loving the sinner and making her problems seem solvable .

Peace

 

[beafedor]

Portarica, I agree with what you said. The original question was about using or not using these pictures at an abortion clinic but it brings other questions about using them at all.

I wanted to further answer Estebob’s point about the emergency of the moment.
In my opinion, what the women need to see is signs such as a developmental picture, a cute baby picture, messages such as: “We care about you and about your baby”, “women need support not abortion”, “I regret my abortion”… There are many good materials out here.

A friend of mine has a pro-life billboard company and he has one with the picture of a real young woman holding her baby with the message: “I refused abortion and you can too.” This to me is the best sign I have ever seen. Gives me goose bumps just writing about it. Back in the day, I could have found the strength to stand up to my boyfriend and the doctor and fight for my baby had I seen it.

 

[andyandely1997]

I just joined this forum and the first place I went, I found this post, which is a subject I wrestle with all the time. I do sidewalk counseling and I pray in front of Planned Parenthood, so I have direct experience on both sides. I have stood with a man who does use the signs and it’s harder for him to get a client to even consider talking to him.

From my experience: The graphic photos do not belong in front of an abortion clinic. It is not that I think young children should be protected, I think children should understand what is happening there. It is that the clients of abortion clinics tend to harden their hearts to accomplish the deed, and seeing those photographs does not soften their hearts, but makes them harden even more, against the knowledge that the picture they are seeing could be their baby.

The death-scorts at Planned Parenthood tell the clients that we are “protesters.” If we are out there with no signs, just our rosaries, perhaps a 40 Days for Life banner or a sign that simply says “Abortion hurts women” or something, then it looks like the death-scorts might just be lying…if we do have the signs and we shout at them, then Planned Parenthood’s propaganda seems true. If we are out there peacefully praying, sometimes passers-by are curious, not repulsed.

On the other hand…I get so very angry and frustrated with people’s denial of what is really happening in our country and the world! I want them to understand what abortion really means, what happens to the baby (NOT a blob of tissue!) so that they can no longer consider abortion as any sort of option. Prayer seems not to have any effect at all, since the clients go in and have abortions every day, day in and day out. I understand how Jesus felt at the temple, filled with righteous anger and indignation. I know that is how the Operation Rescue people felt, and why they locked themselves to the doors of abortion clinics and to the exam tables. But they got arrested, and the clinic just rescheduled the abortions for the next day.

I do think the graphics have their place, and that is why I helped with the GAP, the Genocide Awareness Program, on a local college campus. That to me is the place for educating young adults, hopefully opening a few eyes to the injustice that is abortion. We had a few protesters but a lot more people looking at the displays with curiosity, you could see they were processing what the signs showed. I am adding the link here, and they have a video on their website that is VERY graphic, so don’t go there if you haven’t seen such things. abortionno.org/

I know that I personally cannot reach a client’s heart if I hold a graphic sign, but if I have my Bible, prayer book, rosary, and brochures, I might have success. I hope that helps.

I agree with your post, women walking into a clinic for an abortion, need to see compassion & the love Christ has for them. Although, I also agree America needs to see these photos, which can open their eyes & hearts to the true violence of abortion. People in the dark do not want to see the light of the truth. The devil does not want the darkness of abortion to be seen in the light of truth. Plus, Father Frank Pavone from Priest for Life states, “America will not reject abortion until America sees abortion!”

 

[portarica]

Portarica, I agree with what you said. The original question was about using or not using these pictures at an abortion clinic but it brings other questions about using them at all.

I wanted to further answer Estebob’s point about the emergency of the moment.
In my opinion, what the women need to see is signs such as a developmental picture, a cute baby picture, messages such as: “We care about you and about your baby”, “women need support not abortion”, “I regret my abortion”… There are many good materials out here.

A friend of mine has a pro-life billboard company and he has one with the picture of a real young woman holding her baby with the message: “I refused abortion and you can too.” This to me is the best sign I have ever seen. Gives me goose bumps just writing about it. Back in the day, I could have found the strength to stand up to my boyfriend and the doctor and fight for my baby had I seen it.

Many of our day to day issues are all about having the courage to do what is right. There is a great deal of courage evident in your post. While we live with the regret for things we did in the past,remember Jesus’ message is some much about the great possibilities His teachings have for all of us in the future.

Peace

 

[estesbob]

Estesbob, I have always appreciated and often shared your opinion on other threads. However, as a woman who has been through abortion and who knows many other who have been through it, I have to disagree here. We shouldn’t assume that they are not victims of others and fully responsible for their actions. There is a lot of coercion, intimidation and violence involved. Not to mention political agendas and greed on the doctors side. Yesterday I read on Abby Johnson’s Facebook page a story of a teenage girl whose mother was pulling by her hair into the clinic because she was talking to side walk counselors. She was kicked out of the house and is now staying with a prolifer (she is keeping the baby).

Who wants to have an abortion? I was 18 and I never wanted to have one. I had never seen graphic pictures but I knew in my heart that it was wrong. My boyfriend however, didn’t give me a choice. The doctor knew that he was going to take a life and make money and didn’t provide alternatives. How often does this happen?

These women at the clinics are not political “pro-choice” activists or greedy doctors. At best, they are victims of those who push radical liberal ideas in our schools and in the media.

Jesus said to the woman caught in adultery: “Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more”. He didn’t say: “look, I’m going to show you the ugliness of your sin.”

You are, of course, correct. I lost my common sense in the heat of the moment. Sorry.