Graphic abortion pics while side walk counselling?

[RosaryFan]

As many others have stated in this thread, yes, there is a place for the pictures, but it is NOT at the abortion clinic.

Then where?

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Then where?

Where the Genocide Awareness Project takes them, onto college campuses nationwide, as I stated before. Their trucks also circulate in the cities where they are doing the display, mainly to generate publicity and educate people as to what abortion really is.

abortionno.org/index.php/the_genocide_awareness_project_gap/

Trust me, this display generates a LOT of controversy, a LOT of debate, and some counter-protests. I helped with a local display and the campus pro-choice group brought out their collection of wire coat hangers as a counter-protest.

Since Planned Parenthood frequently locates their clinics near college campuses, it is very appropriate to take the photos there. The students really study the pictures and you can almost see their thoughts. Some do look away and avoid it, but more of them really do give it their full attention.

Have you ever taken a graphic sign to an abortion clinic? What is the response that you get from the women and men going in? I agree that the horror of abortion cries out for effective protest. But pro-lifers don’t chain themselves to clinic doors any more either.

What would really help the most would be to have HUGE NUMBERS of people at the clinics in prayer. If there were even 100 people every day, we’d have more saves. 2 or 3 people can be dismissed as “kooks,” but get 100 out there, including priests and ministers, and hearts would be pierced. Are you participating in 40 Days for Life?

40daysforlife.com/index.cfm

 

[forest1970]

well if you are asking so you can have a better idea of how to prevent abortions, graphic pictures and yelling at the mothers that they are murders don’t help. I know, I have had an abortion before and all those screaming people made me do was get inside faster. I know it’s expensive but I really wish pro-lifers would have vans with ultrasound machines and offer ultrasounds for free to show the mother what life is like and what’s going on with her and her child. It would be a LOT more effective than pictures they dont’ want to see and words they don’t want to hear. I bet you at least half of those women who are conflicted on what they are about to do, if they saw their baby on the u/s screen, they would get back in their cars and go home. I think it should be the law that women are showed the ultrasound they take at the clinic or else it is NOT an informed decision on their part because most of them know nothing about the baby in them and what it looks like and what it’s doing. Of course at 6 weeks it still does not look like a baby but you can still see the beating heart and that alone is enough to change a lot of women’s minds - especially those that didn’t even know the baby had a heartbeat when they go in for the abortion. I think it’s unfair what clinics hide from women who go in for abortions. How can they make an informed decision when these clinic people lie to them and keep them from seeing their baby on the screen? That is not informed consent.

 

[forest1970]

I think it’s safe to assume most women entering the abortuaries are not 5 years old. I’m just saying with all the gore that shoved down our throats on TV, why are so many people afraid of the truth of the violence of abortion? In a courtroom, graphic photos are shown all the time to the jury in order to stress the level of violence committed against the victims. I think we owe the tiny victims of abortion at least that much. Why on earth wouldn’t you want the violence of abortion made public knowledge. It may not change the woman’s mind every time, but it does on some occasions (I’ve seen it). So isn’t it worth it if you save one baby?

Additionally, the passers-by (yourself excluded) may have a change of heart once they see the reality. We live in a society where violence is the norm, especially in the entertainment field. I think the pro-life movement has the right to show the truth of that particular violent act. People need to know.

Well would you want to save one baby through the use of these pictures (which by the way are of more like 15 or so week old babies not 6-8 week old babies when most abortions happen) or would you rather save 7 or 8 through the use of more positive information like free ultrasounds and a printout of what their baby is doing at that time - like how big it is, what it’s heabeat is, what it’s brain is doing and the fact that it already has fingernails or whatnot at however far along they are? Personally I’d rather save more babie through the latter than just one through the use of those pictures no one really wants to see. I assure you as someone who has been through an abortion, these women do not have a change of heart when they see those pictures. They want to get out of there and thus they get inside the clinic faster where they are greeted with a “counselor” who tells them what you are showing out side is a bunch of hooey and then they go on to tell you that at that point your baby is just a clump of cells and NOTHING like those pictures. They are very good at emphasizing that and in the end, they think you are the ones spreading falsehoods and they go through with the abortion.

 

[sojo]

OK, I haven’t read all the posts here, but I’d like to add my view.

I have a 14 year old son with Down syndrome. The doctors, my family (including my own mother), and my friends put fierce pressure on me to abort him as I knew “in time” to do so.

I would love to take him to a pro-choice rally or prayer vigil outside a clinic. He understands that he has DS, a disability, and he understands in a limited way about the murder of children in the womb for reasons including disability. But I would NEVER do so on the possibility of him being exposed to those graphic photos.

Its a shame, because my son’s beautiful face, his charismatic personality and his gifts are so apparent to everyone he meets. He has turned more than one person to reconsider their pro-choice stance. But it is enough for him to bear that his life is considered a horror and a burden by much of society. I will NOT expose him to the pictures that is pretty common in the abortion clinic protests I’ve witnessed.

And yes, if I see one up ahead, I will drive out of our way to protect his eyes.

I say this as a converted Jew who was forced to view holocaust atrocities as “education” as a Jew. Important to have these available, yes. But too young is traumatizing. And not necessary. And the constant parading of dead on photographs is disrespectful of life.

How would anyone feel if their dead child was photographed and blown up poster sized and exposed to the public for anyone and everyone to ogle? Shame.

 

[forest1970]

The problem is that the time these women reach the door the abortion clinic the time for emotional and material support is long gone. And they most certainly will not get it once they get inside. Perhaps they do need a jolt to remind them of exactly what it is they are doing. I am all for love and compassion and understanding but let’s not make victims out of women who are walking through a door to kill their child.

Don’t forget that a lot of women going through those doors ARE victims as well who are forced or blackmailed by parents and partners and that these women are looking for loving support and someone to tell them they can have that baby - they can do it. Their loved ones are forcing them there and telling them it’s best and when pro-lifers have a chance to show compassion and love towards them to get them to change their mind, theys shove those pictures in their face and tell them they are murders. You can’t win - until you get inside and the nice lady shows up and gives you some comfort and tells you the “truth” about abortion and that THEY are the ones there for you. It’s twisted and it’s sad that a lot of pro-lifers don’t see that.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Don’t forget that a lot of women going through those doors ARE victims as well who are forced or blackmailed by parents and partners and that these women are looking for loving support and someone to tell them they can have that baby - they can do it. Their loved ones are forcing them there and telling them it’s best and when pro-lifers have a chance to show compassion and love towards them to get them to change their mind, theys shove those pictures in their face and tell them they are murders. You can’t win - until you get inside and the nice lady shows up and gives you some comfort and tells you the “truth” about abortion and that THEY are the ones there for you. It’s twisted and it’s sad that a lot of pro-lifers don’t see that.

Thank you for sharing the personal experience, that is exactly what I have seen in the few times I have witnessed the protest approach. No one wants to be assaulted and the volunteers have all the ammunition they need when pro-lifers do a protest instead of sidewalk counseling. Just one ugly sign can cause a world of turmoil. The people who use the signs seem to prefer the turmoil - they usually identify with the older model of anti-abortion protests, a la Operation Rescue. Those of us who came in later are more open to other approaches since we reach more clients with sweetness than with ugliness. The one good thing is if you have one person with a sign, they will draw the flak away to their location and then I can get to more of the clients on the other corner! This was in a location where the clients had to cross a public road and sidewalk to get into PP, now they drive into a gate and onto a large parking lot. That’s a lot more challenging and it’s more tempting to use the signs, since we are not able to walk alongside the woman as she approaches the clinic and offer her alternatives.

Regionally, there are almost no pro-lifers who do these protests and I repeat, the photos are within the right context on college campuses.

 

[Adam1986]

Hello,
To those who active in the pro-life movement, are you for or against the use of graphic abortion pictures in front of abortion clinics while praying and doing side walk counseling?

Do you think that it helps opening the mother’s eyes as some people say or on the contrary undermines the work of side walk counselors as others say?

We are having much debate about this in my community and I’m curious about my brothers and sisters online perspective.
Thanks!

I too am VERY much against it. No little child riding in a car or being pushed in a stroller or walking on the sidewalk needs to see such horrific images.

 

[nilofc]

Now…the image of the truth is reprehensible??

Maybe we should be reminded of what they are doing to God’s Children to make them wake up that we are doing nothing while babies end up that way.

The truth will hurt… but it will set you free… John 8:31-32

Or it might encourage you to say a little prayer for the unborn tonight.

You guys talk about how despicable the images are… it shows how you don’t read the Leveticus.

 

[nilofc]

As much as I understand the feeling of horror and injustice that you (and I) have, (especially when I see a rosary in the car), we must always have compassion in our heart. I will repeat it again and again, these women are not a Hillary Clinton or a Cecile Richards (president of Planned Parenthood) or a Leroy Carhart (3rd trimester abortion doc). They are not animated by a political agenda nor by the money they are going to make. They are not cold blood murderers. They are scared, they feel trapped; some were raped, they have violent boyfriends or parents, they are coerced, they are lied to… They deserve our compassion and at least the benefit of the doubt.

It is hard to get over the sin to love the sinner but if Jesus can, why can’t we?

Sure they deserve compassion, but unless they repent… hmmmm
God is merciful but He is also JUST.

These women who murdered their babies, unless they repent, will have eternity to pay for their mortal sins.

Look at what you have written…“They are scared, they feel trapped; some were raped, they have violent boyfriends or parents, they are coerced, they are lied to…”

…and that’s enough reason to murder a child?

Just because the father is a rapist…so the child must be killed? Listen to yourself you liberal catholic.

 

[nilofc]

Here’s a thought experiment…

A child is being strangled by an adult on the street… and while you seeing the situation…you just say…“oh we must feel compassion to that person because she must be trapped…or lied to… or raped…”

While an abortion maybe done in the secret confines of a slaughter house called a clinic, its impact must be shown to the world because unless people are reminded that this horrible crime has taken place, then they just conveniently look away.

Nice. Be a passive catholic all you want. Look away and pretend that life is a bed of roses and refuse to see the sin and injustice being done to God’s children.

How many of us… wouldn’t watch the Passion of the Christ because of the graphic images?

Exactly.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

Have you ever made a decision that at the time, you sort of knew was wrong, but still you did it? Have you ever done something totally sanctioned by society, but which you know in your soul was wrong? Have you known someone who did something sanctioned by society, who DID NOT recognize it was wrong?

You are talking with no experience, AS IF every woman going into the abortion center is one certain kind or type, and as if YOU know her heart and mind, and as if she only deserves to be visually assaulted until she repents and does not have the abortion.

Who are you, that you can decide when these women repent and recognize what they have done? Did you read the account of the woman just above who has had an abortion and those photos merely caused her to rush INTO the clinic, because those people were seen as being kinder than the protesters (NOT sidewalk counselors).

There is theory, and then there is reality. There are ideals, and then there is what is merciful and kind. Of course every single woman deserves God’s mercy and He offers it to them as soon as they cry out to him. Some probably never reach that point, and my heart aches for them.

Ii think it’s sad that you would rather be right than successful. A baby saved is a baby saved. There have been 3000 babies known to have been saved during the prayer campaign of 40 Days for Life, and many, many staff members have quit their jobs, including the CLINIC DIRECTOR OF PLANNED PARENTHOOD in Bryan Texas.

abcnews.go.com/Health/MindMoodNews/planned-parenthood-clinic-director-joins-anti-abortion-group/story?id=8999720

**“I looked out the window and saw a couple of women praying and I thought, ‘That’s where I need to go,’” Johnson said.

She walked down the street and into the welcoming arms of the Coalition for Life."**

Do you not have any faith in prayer? Do you believe that Abby would have been able to literally walk out the door of Planned Parenthood where she held the position of DIRECTOR of the clinic, and go seek out protesters with graphic images of aborted babies? She would never have quit her job in the first place, our minds are wonderfully equipped to provide us with defense mechanisms in order to shut off pain. She probably would have ended up staying there and even growing bitter and angry over time.

Norma McCorvey did not convert because of Flip Benham She converted because GOD reached her heart through a young child, and also because He sent her visions and audio hallucinations (she heard babies and children in and around the abortion clinic where she worked). It is always God, working through the Holy Spirit, who does the work. Norma had had countless discussions with Benham over years, but it was the young daughter of one of the protesters who reached her heart with innocence. That little girl wasn’t holding any posters at all, she just loved “Miss Norma” and showed that love. leaderu.com/norma/nmtestimony.html

Please read my posts above. There is a place for these images, you should get involved with the Genocide Awareness Project. You can help at a local college, they always need volunteers, and the signs are actually larger than any a protester could hold. They are as shocking as you would ever want, and they open up discussions and even counter-protests. Yes the photos show the truth, I don’t recall anyone disputing that, but over the years, we’ve heard from enough women and staff members who say they love it when we show the pictures because they get ALL the clients and even more volunteers. I would rather undermine their operation one prayer at a time, one baby at a time. trust me, it is more of a threat when women see people praying and petitioning Heaven outside the clinic.

abortionno.org/index.php/the_genocide_awareness_project_gap/ Please to and look at the photos scrolling through on this page. You will like what they show.

I have been at both kinds of events and from my experience, the signs are not helpful at the clinics. People do not want to see it and until their denial is broken, they will ignore the signs and harden their hearts. A hardened heart is harder to prick with information and truth.

 

[TheRealJuliane]

One more link: Please read this blog to hear the results of simple and heartfelt prayer. The images are particularly moving.

http://40daysforlife.com/blog/?

Do you see how the press covers events such as the one in Fort Wayne IN? They have no reason to fear or to present the prayer warriors in a negative light. Can you understand how different this coverage would have been, if this had been a protest with graphic and disturbing signs?

Again, I am not telling anyone that the graphic signs are reprehensible. We all understand that ABORTION ITSELF is reprehensible. But treating women as Christ would treat them does not mean assaulting them with their sin.

 

[pnewton]

I think that strategy was one of the main reasons that the early RTL movement started losing the battle of public opinion.

I am against the use of protest signs with graphic images of aborted fetuses for this very reason. In case no one has noticed, we still have legalized abortion. The Republicans are not going to change this, nor will the Democrats. Indeed, I see no real end in sight to legalized abortion. If there ever is a change, it will be far off. Therefore there are only two ways to save lives. The first, is to limit* some* abortions by bans on certain practices and some funding. This will never affect many situations. The better solution, given the current political reality, is to work toward affecting public opinion. For this, the offensive approach will be much less effective than the caring approach. Someone said earlier that these women are not victims. Really? They are people whom are loved by Christ and to whom are the ambassadors of his love. Many have been victimized by Satan and his message of convenience and false compassion. Our only true enemy is the One Enemy.

If gory images worked well I would be all over it. I do not see where they have. I think the far better solution would be to dwell on the loving images of babies, both in and out of the womb, and the joy that comes from making courageous decisions.

 

[estesbob]

Don’t forget that a lot of women going through those doors ARE victims as well who are forced or blackmailed by parents and partners and that these women are looking for loving support and someone to tell them they can have that baby - they can do it. Their loved ones are forcing them there and telling them it’s best and when pro-lifers have a chance to show compassion and love towards them to get them to change their mind, theys shove those pictures in their face and tell them they are murders. You can’t win - until you get inside and the nice lady shows up and gives you some comfort and tells you the “truth” about abortion and that THEY are the ones there for you. It’s twisted and it’s sad that a lot of pro-lifers don’t see that.

Please read post #40

 

[TheRealJuliane]

well if you are asking so you can have a better idea of how to prevent abortions, graphic pictures and yelling at the mothers that they are murders don’t help. I know, I have had an abortion before and all those screaming people made me do was get inside faster. ** I know it’s expensive but I really wish pro-lifers would have vans with ultrasound machines and offer ultrasounds for free to show the mother what life is like and what’s going on with her and her child. ** It would be a LOT more effective than pictures they dont’ want to see and words they don’t want to hear. I bet you at least half of those women who are conflicted on what they are about to do, if they saw their baby on the u/s screen, they would get back in their cars and go home. I think it should be the law that women are showed the ultrasound they take at the clinic or else it is NOT an informed decision on their part because most of them know nothing about the baby in them and what it looks like and what it’s doing. Of course at 6 weeks it still does not look like a baby but you can still see the beating heart and that alone is enough to change a lot of women’s minds - especially those that didn’t even know the baby had a heartbeat when they go in for the abortion. I think it’s unfair what clinics hide from women who go in for abortions. How can they make an informed decision when these clinic people lie to them and keep them from seeing their baby on the screen? That is not informed consent.

That is exactly what we are in the process of doing here in Houston as I mentioned in another post. Yes, it is expensive, and there are health laws to consider, etc. But when we really have very limited access to the clients (this new death center has a large parking lot ON THEIR OWN PROPERTY so we cannot sidewalk counsel as we used to, this is what we turn to next. The Houston Coalition for Life has bought a van and is in the process of getting it ready to park on the street in front of the clinic. I have no doubt that we will be harassed and intimidated by the city authorities - we have a professing lesbian as mayor and her “partner” is on the board of PP, so…they might go so far as to pass a city ordinance against us. I put nothing past the abortion industry.

There is also legislation proposed in Texas that would REQUIRE a clinic to show a woman her ultrasound before she makes the decision to abort. Of course PP is lobbying against this. It would be great if they had to use their own resources to undermine their business! We’ll see.

The portable ultrasound machines are going to be a big advantage for pro-lifers. Every time it seems as if the pro-abort side is winning, God sends us another tool to use in the battle.

 

[beth40n2]

Showing graphic picture to the lady who is about to have the abortion may work. But certainly do not show them to children.

 

[colmcille1]

One more link: Please read this blog to hear the results of simple and heartfelt prayer. The images are particularly moving.

http://40daysforlife.com/blog/?

Do you see how the press covers events such as the one in Fort Wayne IN? They have no reason to fear or to present the prayer warriors in a negative light. Can you understand how different this coverage would have been, if this had been a protest with graphic and disturbing signs?

Again, I am not telling anyone that the graphic signs are reprehensible. We all understand that ABORTION ITSELF is reprehensible. But treating women as Christ would treat them does not mean assaulting them with their sin.

Hi Juliane,
As a man who has seen those graphic pictures and thought long and hard about all of this, I am convinced that we must use everything in our power to stop abortion.
A lot of posters here seem to be protesting how such images affect their sensibilities. This, to my mind, is simply being blind to the real horror of abortion. Abortion is murder.
No matter how the operators of this vile industry dress it up, it is murder; are we more concerned with offending a few squeamish people or are we really concerned with saving lives? The only reason this debate seems to generate a lot of protest is because the aforesaid operators want us to believe that it is not murder; that “it” is merely a clump of cells and it’s a routine thing like having a wart removed. They will use all the dead language of a clinician to blind people to the reality.
I say: use these pictures, use them with silence if needs be but use them.
One poster complains that it dehumanizes and strips the child of it’s identity. What identity? What humanity? The child has been murdered: he/she is now another statistic.
He/she could have had a beautiful place in this world. But no, dollars and cents took that child’s place.
Let us use every image, every payer, every ultrasound, every understanding. But let us never back away from this fight for life.
God Bless,
Colmcille.

 

[Grace_Angel]

Thanks for the reply. Hello Whitacre girl! It’s been a while! Indeed you have a point.
I’m also opposed to it but I know many people who say they have saved babies using these pictures. I’m not convinced that stigmatizing the sin will stop the sinner though, I’m thinking they would feel judged.

I’ve also heard pro-abort people say that they believe they are false Photoshop pictures, that abortion can’t be that bad? leaves me wondering.

Abortion cant be that bad?
well for goodness sake how bad is abortion?
Abortion dismembers and suctions out a child in the womb.
Yes it is that bad. That is how a child that has been aborted looks. There is nothing aesthetic about abortion. It is the violant dismemberment of a child that had previously lain safe in its mother’s womb.
This is false compassion. What else can pro abortionists say?
The images outside the abortion clinic are the truth of abortion and the truth always remains the truth. And these images are the last effort made to save both the life of the child and the “life” of the mother. You see after the abortion all the supporters of abortion and the sanitising of abortion sleep peacefully in their beds at night whilst the mother of the aborted child is left to “hear” her baby calling out to her. Is left to “see” her baby every night so she cant sleep. Is left to her lifelong regret over her decision. Is left to grieve for her infant.
So if the images help a mother not enter the human abattoirs, then they are important.
As for the respect for the baby being aborted, more respect is shown to its life if he/she can be helped to live rather than be dismembered.
GraceAngel.

 

[RosaryFan]

Hi Juliane,
As a man who has seen those graphic pictures and thought long and hard about all of this, I am convinced that we must use everything in our power to stop abortion.
A lot of posters here seem to be protesting how such images affect their sensibilities. This, to my mind, is simply being blind to the real horror of abortion. Abortion is murder.
No matter how the operators of this vile industry dress it up, it is murder; are we more concerned with offending a few squeamish people or are we really concerned with saving lives? The only reason this debate seems to generate a lot of protest is because the aforesaid operators want us to believe that it is not murder; that “it” is merely a clump of cells and it’s a routine thing like having a wart removed. They will use all the dead language of a clinician to blind people to the reality.
I say: use these pictures, use them with silence if needs be but use them.
One poster complains that it dehumanizes and strips the child of it’s identity. What identity? What humanity? The child has been murdered: he/she is now another statistic.
He/she could have had a beautiful place in this world. But no, dollars and cents took that child’s place.
Let us use every image, every payer, every ultrasound, every understanding. But let us never back away from this fight for life.
God Bless,
Colmcille.

I, for one, agree with you. Besides, since when should the truth be hidden? It is the truth.